Syberdwarf2 Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly You looking to wipe out a whole galactic cluster or supercluster? Geez... naw, just the Local Group. mwahahahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 18, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 The Local Group IS a galactic cluster -- albeit a small one, but a galactic cluster none the less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syberdwarf2 Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly The Local Group IS a galactic cluster -- albeit a small one, but a galactic cluster none the less. I know, I was just tryin to start on somthing small. Then I'll work up to something really big. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlHazred Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 I say, target the local Multiversal Supercluster... I guess by adding Transdimensional on the power... Anyway, on the topic of large starships, I'm considering building Sector Twelve General Hospital from the Sector General series. Not quite that big, but a damn sight bigger than most... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 18, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Sector Twelve General Hospital is more of a BASE than a SHIP, isn't it? I don't recall it having any movement capability at all -- which is why when the war happened, they had to evac the personnel instead of moving the hospital. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Gnome Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 The Ringworld meteor defense can be used as a photon drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 18, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Oh ho! That reminds me! For the ultimate in large-scale constructed objects, what about Cuckoo from Farthest Star and Wall Around A Star ? It was, after all, a vehicle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlHazred Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly Sector Twelve General Hospital is more of a BASE than a SHIP, isn't it? I don't recall it having any movement capability at all -- which is why when the war happened, they had to evac the personnel instead of moving the hospital. Yup. But since vehicles and bases have so many rules in common, I'm interested to see how the big object plays out. If you're going to be a stickler, I'll have to model the Valley Forge from Silent Running. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSenecal Posted February 19, 2003 Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Big as it was, the Skylark of Valeron was mostly just a hollow shell to hold the directional circles to accuratly point at something at vast intergalactic distances. The biggest ship I've ever seen was a short story "Kerplop" in Isaac Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine. That ship was 6000 miles in diameter, and was filled with decks and people. In fact the crew of that ship was roughly equal to the population of the rest of human explored space. But besides being big, it didn't have impresive capabilities. It could accelerate and decelerate from 0 to the speed of light and back to 0 again instantly. It was a generation ship built to explore the magelian clouds, and it was finally comming home. You see, in this world Einstein was right about the the speed of light being the ultimate speed limit, but was wrong about the time dialation effect. It was a fun story. I especially like the part where the inspector of incoming ships is on his way the where the ship is due to apear (it sent word ahead). Actually he was heading 1 mile away from that spot... Which he realizes in time is nowhere near far enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 I know the Valeron had to be that big just to hold the circles -- but I do NOT think it was just a hollow sphere otherwise. Remember the description of when the Chlorans of galaxy DW-4U-whatever are burning her down to size? DuQuesne sees her burned, blasted, and peeled away, layer by layer, like an onion. No "Oh, the outer shell is gone, suddenly we've got the little core." Plus, at the beginning of that book, when the Seaton/Crane party are coming on board, the transit throught the many miles-thick airlock doors is described. At no point does Skylark II transit any empty space between the skin and the inner core. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Originally posted by JSenecal The biggest ship I've ever seen was a short story "Kerplop" in Isaac Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine. That ship was 6000 miles in diameter, and was filled with decks and people. In fact the crew of that ship was roughly equal to the population of the rest of human explored space. The thing I mentioned earlier, Cuckoo (or Object Lambda if you insist) was also a ship -- a sort of 'ark' to escape a galaxy that was blowing itself apart. Cuckoo was around 180 million MILES in diameter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSenecal Posted February 19, 2003 Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 The thing I mentioned earlier, Cuckoo (or Object Lambda if you insist) was also a ship -- a sort of 'ark' to escape a galaxy that was blowing itself apart. Cuckoo was around 180 million MILES in diameter. OK, that's MUCH bigger. But was it inhabited though out it's volume, or was it mostly hollow shell? What story does Cuckoo show up in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Cuckoo is in two novels by Fredrick Pohl and Jack Williamson: Farthest Star and Wall Around A Star. No, it was not inhabited throughout its entire volume. It was, indeed, mostly hollow shell a few tens of km thick, surrounding empty space with a type F sun at the center for power & drive plasma. Basically it was a mobile Dyson sphere but was never intended to be inhabited. The "crew" were in cold sleep, or were stored as templates that could be grown into crystalline forms when necessary. It WAS inhabited, though, on the outer surface -- by the descendants of those from its home galaxy who hadn't been selected to be saved who had managed to latch on to the surface, and descendants of lifeforms from OUR galaxy (its target) which had been sent back by advance scout ships. The surface was habitable because it had a very thick atmosphere built up from eons of gathered cosmic gases & outflow losses from the interior. The surface was warmed by heat leaking through from the inside rather than from an orbiting sun. Light came from continent-sized "clouds" of bioluminescent single-celled organisms. Oh, and it had a surface gravity of 1/1000 g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSenecal Posted February 19, 2003 Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Cuckoo is in two novels by Fredrick Pohl and Jack Williamson: Farthest Star and Wall Around A Star. Thanks! I recognize the authors as ones I like, but somehow missed those stories. I'll try finding them next time I'm in a book store. Kerplop also had a problem with low gravity, due to it's low density. I think it was .2g at the surface, fading down to 0 at the core. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Those books are a number of years old now, so you might have better luck with Amazon, Half.com, or a used book store. The reason Cuckoo has such a low gravity is that 99.99% of the mass of the thing is in the star at the center -- and at a radial distance of about 90 million miles, even the mass of a star only exerts the equivalent of about 1/1000 g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BasilDrag Posted February 19, 2003 Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly Cuckoo is in two novels by Fredrick Pohl and Jack Williamson: Farthest Star and Wall Around A Star. No, it was not inhabited throughout its entire volume. It was, indeed, mostly hollow shell a few tens of km thick, surrounding empty space with a type F sun at the center for power & drive plasma. Basically it was a mobile Dyson sphere but was never intended to be inhabited. The "crew" were in cold sleep, or were stored as templates that could be grown into crystalline forms when necessary. It WAS inhabited, though, on the outer surface -- by the descendants of those from its home galaxy who hadn't been selected to be saved who had managed to latch on to the surface, and descendants of lifeforms from OUR galaxy (its target) which had been sent back by advance scout ships. The surface was habitable because it had a very thick atmosphere built up from eons of gathered cosmic gases & outflow losses from the interior. The surface was warmed by heat leaking through from the inside rather than from an orbiting sun. Light came from continent-sized "clouds" of bioluminescent single-celled organisms. Oh, and it had a surface gravity of 1/1000 g. I remember Wall Around a Star. Not impressed. IIRC, it wasn't really steered, which bring up the question of whether it was a vehicle, or a base that someone sent zooming off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Well, it moved under its own power -- and it was slowing down as it approached our galaxy. There was at each pole what was essentiall a giant rocket thrust outlet. If it's capable of moving itself, I'd say that tends to make it a vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Hmmm...speaking of BIG things...there's the multiply-nested Dyson spheres from Colin Knapp's "Cageworld" series -- though that construct would definitely be a *base*, not a vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Posted February 19, 2003 Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly Hmmm...speaking of BIG things...there's the multiply-nested Dyson spheres from Colin Knapp's "Cageworld" series -- though that construct would definitely be a *base*, not a vehicle. Colin Knapp. I haven't heard that name for a long time. I wonder how you would build the Chaos Weapon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 Oy! That thing had a number of stellar-mass black holes rolling around inside a "cage" to act as the focusing agent, IIRC, and they fed it entire stars as fuel! As for the effect -- a really, Really, REALLY overpowered Change Environment...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BasilDrag Posted February 20, 2003 Report Share Posted February 20, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly Well, it moved under its own power -- and it was slowing down as it approached our galaxy. There was at each pole what was essentiall a giant rocket thrust outlet. If it's capable of moving itself, I'd say that tends to make it a vehicle. Ah. Yeah, that's a vehicle. OK, I'd forgotten it was being moved around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Champsguy Posted February 24, 2003 Report Share Posted February 24, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly Hmmmm... a nice idea, but... 1) The Size of the vehicle will be bought just once 2) The Armor/DEF of the vehicle will be bought just once 3) The Movement of the vehicle only gets bought once for each type of movement So at least a few of the really expensive things gotta be bought "as is." Nah. You can buy each piece with Armor, Movement, and Always On Growth, all Usable By Others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted February 25, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 That won't make it any cheaper, though, points-wise. It will in fact make it more expensive! (The regular way) Vehicle Size + Def = cost (Buy it as you suggested) Vehicle Size + Def for 1 piece = cost Advantages so other parts of vehicle share it = cost * advantages See? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Champsguy Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly That won't make it any cheaper, though, points-wise. It will in fact make it more expensive! (The regular way) Vehicle Size + Def = cost (Buy it as you suggested) Vehicle Size + Def for 1 piece = cost Advantages so other parts of vehicle share it = cost * advantages See? Umm... no. Don't buy 100" of Flight. Have a piece buy 5" of Flight, Usable by Others. Then double the number of pieces by spending 5 points. Do it a bunch of times. Point savings ensue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Originally posted by Champsguy Umm... no. Don't buy 100" of Flight. Have a piece buy 5" of Flight, Usable by Others. Then double the number of pieces by spending 5 points. Do it a bunch of times. Point savings ensue. One problem with this approach is that a tiny area effect drain or suppress is going to zap the entire Death Star unless you buy oodles of power defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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