Matrix Hero

[Herolover]

Okay. I gotta ask. With the new Matrix movies coming out I am wondering if anyone is going to be doing a Matrix Hero? If you are or plan to do a Matrix Hero how are you going to do it?

 

In the "real world" (ie not the Matrix) I would say make the characters up as 150 point characters with NCM or, if you assume that things "loaded into you" stay with you than you could base it on more points, but I have no idea how many you would need. You could run that part of the campaign as your basic sci-fi, post apocolypse campaign.

 

The Matrix would be easy to run since it is basically extra dimensional movement where the characters are basically built as 350-400 point characters.

 

What does everyone else think?

[MarkusDark]

Re: Matrix Hero

 

Originally posted by Herolover

Okay. I gotta ask. With the new Matrix movies coming out I am wondering if anyone is going to be doing a Matrix Hero? If you are or plan to do a Matrix Hero how are you going to do it?

 

In the "real world" (ie not the Matrix) I would say make the characters up as 150 point characters with NCM or, if you assume that things "loaded into you" stay with you than you could base it on more points, but I have no idea how many you would need. You could run that part of the campaign as your basic sci-fi, post apocolypse campaign.

 

The Matrix would be easy to run since it is basically extra dimensional movement where the characters are basically built as 350-400 point characters.

 

What does everyone else think?

 

I might do things as follows:

 

Have a VPP in the Matrix mode, for skills only, for the upload. From what it looked like in reality, they didn't have the skills. At least, I didn't see anything looking like H-T-H mastery/dodging while the weasel was about to be shot. I think that maybe the skills only stay in the Matrix. Although Neo did open his eyes and say "I know Kung Fu!" Maybe this will be shown a bit better in Reloaded.

 

I might make the character have a multiform/duplication ability - with the limitation of 'only works in the Matrix'. Although the original multiform might be expensive, you can load up whoppers of limitations on it (must be unconcious and plugged into the Matrix. Does not affect the 'real world', etc.)

[Intrope]

I kind of assumed that the skills are 'real' but not necessarily useful outside. For one thing, the real bodies of the hackers aren't all that fit (hey, they spend all day laying on their backs!) Also, I suspect that they derived their kung-fu program from Hong Kong action theater (which isn't known for usable real-world techniques).

 

Along the same lines, Trinity probably really could fly a V212 helicopter--if she had one.

 

Actually, that makes me think: why do they have programs for all these different things (like vehicles)? Maybe the technology was originally developed by the military to reduce training costs/time?

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Intrope

Actually, that makes me think: why do they have programs for all these different things (like vehicles)? Maybe the technology was originally developed by the military to reduce training costs/time?

 

I sort of assumed it was a combination of hacking the matrix (taking the appropriate skill packages out of the digital recreations of pilots and formatting them for easy upload) and copious file sharing (if one hacker team scores a good program, they distribute it to everyone from Zion.)

[Heroman]

Definately seems like a Duplication, probably alot along the lines of Astral Projection with the duplicate tied to the Matrix dimension.

If the 'true' form could retain learned skills, he would probably need a VPP for skills only. I am guessing that 90% of the new character would be a VPP since they seem to be reconfigurable, though I do not see them being able to augment Int or Ego. One thing which is curious is if the Matrix form's non-skill abilities (superleap, DR, etc) are fixed or can be augmented. While MA packages and skills could be picked up, it was not clear if they durability and agility were fixed (so non VPP powers/chars in the duplicate).

[SuperBlue]

Cyber Hero

 

Just make a skilled normal as the "Real World" PC, and then use Cyber Hero's rules for Net Running. This allows you to have a character with an infinite number of skills/powers/whatever existing in a computer program.

[Armitage]

Re: Matrix Hero

 

Originally posted by Herolover

Okay. I gotta ask. With the new Matrix movies coming out I am wondering if anyone is going to be doing a Matrix Hero? If you are or plan to do a Matrix Hero how are you going to do it?

 

Or in a different vein, a combination of The Matrix and an episode of Red Dwarf that I can't remember the title of (usable for Champions).

The heroes are defeated by a vilain and apparently killed. They then wake up in advanced VR pods and discover that the entire campaign has actually been an advanced computer game and they have now lost. Unfortunately, due to a glitch in the neural interface, the PCs can't remember their real lives. They begin to investigate their world and discover that each is a person that their character would absolutely loath.

And of course they eventually discover that the "real world" is actually a computer simulation that the villain placed them in when he defeated them and they have to find a way to escape.

[AnotherSkip]

It was the Red Dwarf episode with the Psychadelic Squid as the villian if that helps at all..........

 

the cutscenes were hilarious.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Heroman

One thing which is curious is if the Matrix form's non-skill abilities (superleap, DR, etc) are fixed or can be augmented. While MA packages and skills could be picked up, it was not clear if they durability and agility were fixed (so non VPP powers/chars in the duplicate).

 

Durability and Agility seemed to have alot to do with the individual. If you could just upload superleap then the rest of the team wouldn't have been as interested in whether or not Neo could make the just across the street on the first try or not.

 

A duplicate with some powers and a VPP is probably the way to go. You might also look at extra dimensional movement, leaves body behind. It is the most direct, but then you have to deal with all the powers that are limited to not work outside the Matrix. That would get messy real quick.

 

It seemed like equipment and sensory powers couldn't be simulated, you had to bring them with you and if you lost one it was gone, so you probably want to limit the VPP to skills only. It seemed like training (ie XP) could improve your jumping and durability and that you still needed to know how to apply your uploaded skills even after you had them. Therefore, you may also want to force people to buy CSLs outside the VPP as well.

[TheDude2371]

The title of the Red Dwarf ep was Back to Reality , from series V. (If you get the videotapes, the episode is actually supposed to be the last one of the series, not the first.)

 

However, the "reality" was an illusion brought on by a toxin in the ink of a Suicide Squid.

[Chris Goodwin]

I don't think Hero is the best choice for a Matrix game.

 

You can treat the Matrix as another dimension if you want, with different properties that allow characters to do different things, or you can build every ability ever demonstrated by someone in the Matrix and give the PCs VPPs to allow them to do those things....

 

But that's a lot of work.

 

It could be done, sure, but there are other systems in which you wouldn't have to do nearly as much work to get it to feel right.

[Blue]

"BLUE" is a hacker, one of only a few in the champions campaign. She's normal in this world and a superhero in the net. Most of the beings she encounters on the net are programs or "avatars" of real life hackers, wheras in her case her consciosness is actually uploaded to the web, thereby giving her incredible speed and strength denied other programs on the web. There, she's basically a Goddess, unlike the real world. So naturally, she's addicted to jacking-in.

 

Among the campaigns I proposed to my players when I decided to run a Hero Games system was the following rejected campaign:

 

The characters are "agent level" normals with cyberpunk skills and abilities, but on the net they are all heroes. Players build two characters: One for real life at agent level and one at super-powered level for when they are plugged in. Essentially this would give me the chance to shift gears, switching between superheroic and dark-champions level characters during the same campaign. One day you're shooting it out on a street (and not instantly dying like in Cyberpunk) and the next minute you're an avenging angel, dragon, toad, etc. on the net duking it out with sysops and black-ice. Would have been fun. I think it finished 3rd in the 4 campaign settings I suggested.

[Heroman]

Really, I think Hero is one of the better systems to run a Matrix style game in. The whole EDM and alternate Matrix world is not complex; heck the real world is where you probably have virtually (ha!) no work in creation since people are so isolated.

As far as VPPs and scale, I do not see huge VPPs. One thing which has not been mentioned is 'how much can 1 person know at once anyways'?

Yeah, they can learn MA, insta-pick up helicopter piloting, but how many skills can they concurrently know? I am guessing not alot and they have probably never pressed themselves too hard, being able to DL skills on the fly.

 

Actually, this style of game would be perfect for 'over the net' gaming, using something like IRC, OpenRPG, or WebRPG. Maybe the team actually is not all on a 'ship', but scattered around different human cities. Makes it easier to 'logout' people who cannot attend sessions.

 

I do also like the 'rejected' game idea; I think it could have good versitility.

 

I would probably make some changes from the movie. It should not be as easy for agents to pick up on you (give the players a wee bit more flexibility) and maybe add in a middle level force; something between normal human and agent, for the players to womp on.

[RDU Neil]

Kind of a "been there, done that" with the Matrix, concept. I played a lot of "Cyber Hero" though I changed a lot of the overly complex and downright wrong rule interpretations from that supplement.

 

I had a number of 150 or so point NCM characters in the "real world" who were mercs and drivers and fixers, etc. The problem came up when one person wanted to be a hacker, and the others were street runner types. The hacker got left behind, or went off into their "net world" and it was tough to keep the group heading in the same direction. We did do "hacking and jacking in" type scenarios, but it required the GM to be describing two worlds at once... one the "real world" with guards and cops... and the other the "net world" or "matrix" where the hacker was in avatar form, battling through nodes to simulate hacking into systems to let the real world guys enter a building, or something.

 

We did it with a similar idea as to posted above. Anyone could connect to the "net" with simple electrodes, but you were just a "normal" in that mode. Few skills. If you had paid points for a "headjack" then you could have an avatar that had 10 pts for every 1 you spent on the "headjack" (or something like that). Your avatar could be anything, with any powers/skills/etc. except "computer programming" The idea was that your avatar's "powers and skills" were metaphors for the programs you could access. If you battled a dragon in a security node made out to look like a castle, and were able to raise the portcullis... you had bypassed security and unlocked the back door of a corp building in real life... that kind of thing.

 

We did this all based on William Gibson's Neuromancer trilogy... or Stephenson's Snow Crash... long before the Matrix came out. We were, in fact, done with this campaign when the Matrix came out, and only played one more game, inspired by how much we enjoyed the movie.

 

It was fun, and I'd like to return to that kind of game... but it's kind of outdated now (despite the popularity of the Matrix) and I only have time for one game these days, and that's my supers campaign.

[Heroman]

That, actually, is the single greatest reason why I did not like Punking or introduce cyberpunking into my SH campaign; it splits up the group and story or worse, makes 1 person the focus in punkland and pretty useless outside of it. Bleh. It would work well for a movie, but not a gaming group, IMHO. This is, however, where I could see Matrix Hero excel since *everyone* would be punking and pretty puny outside of it. Plus, with the worlds disjoint, there is no reason for some to punk and others to remain in the real world. (Note: I would NPC people like the guys who monitored people since that would be a rather boring job).

If you were to run real world missions (maybe a roaming ship broke down, needs rescue before tentacled things show up, etc), everyone would pitch in. Missions in the Matrix would include all people, etc. Again, this could be really cool in a Internet based game environment....hrm....maybe I will have to finish up my OpenRPG mods and think about the format for this

Plus, no where near 300 pts, at least not based on the chars in the movie (no, you are not Neo, heh).....

[Chris Goodwin]

Originally posted by Heroman

Really, I think Hero is one of the better systems to run a Matrix style game in. The whole EDM and alternate Matrix world is not complex; heck the real world is where you probably have virtually (ha!) no work in creation since people are so isolated.

 

So you want to stat out agents, coppertops, other free minds, etc., all in Hero terms? That's a lot of work.

 

As far as VPPs and scale, I do not see huge VPPs. One thing which has not been mentioned is 'how much can 1 person know at once anyways'?

Yeah, they can learn MA, insta-pick up helicopter piloting, but how many skills can they concurrently know? I am guessing not alot and they have probably never pressed themselves too hard, being able to DL skills on the fly.

 

Neo spent 10 hours downloading skills and immediately went into a long fight with Morpheus in the Construct. I'd say he was pressing himself pretty hard. We don't have any indication that there is any maximum number of skills one person can download. The next movie might make it clear, then again it might not. I don't know that a VPP is the best mechanic for handling skill downloads.

 

The main reason I say Hero is not appropriate is because Hero goes into way too much detail.

 

The thing is, for as much work as I'd have to do to run a Matrix Hero game, I could write a game from scratch that would do it a lot better. Besides, there are already others out there that could do a lot of what the Matrix would require, and would take a lot less work than Hero.

[Markdoc]

Hmm. Actually, it strikes me as pretty simple to run a game in the Matrix setting.

 

Give everyone 150 point characters. Let them buy a VPP (only usable in the Matrix, +0) into which you can put skills, talents and characteristics (with NCM and a -1/2 limit reflecting the need to download them). You might also want to include Superleap as an available power :-) - but I figure that's just a reflection of increased STR.

 

Players who enter the Matrix don't need to buy any special skills to do so - that's all handled by the crapload of electronics back at the base/ship, wherever.

 

You end up with your normal body - puny weeds in real life are puny weeds (at least in appearance) in the Matrix - athough they could still kick butt, if they took the appropriate downloads. Neo looks like Neo, whether he wants to or not.

 

For the rest, use Dark Champions. Neo - being the Hero - gets a wider range of powers in his pool and much more points to play with. In fact, most of the people on Morpheus' team were hotshots, so going down to 100 points for the players - they get all their gear for free - might make sense.

 

Agents get essentially the same setup, more points for super-impressive physical stat.s plus the "transform a host" power (I assume surveillance and "altering the world" is handled by the machines in the background). You get agents for top of the line opponents (and there's a limitless supply of them!) cops and thugs for low level opponents and elite military forces for middle of the road opponents.

 

Seems like it would work pretty well for me.

 

cheers, Mark

[RDU Neil]

Originally posted by Markdoc

Hmm. Actually, it strikes me as pretty simple to run a game in the Matrix setting.

 

Give everyone 150 point characters. Let them buy a VPP (only usable in the Matrix, +0) into which you can put skills, talents and characteristics (with NCM and a -1/2 limit reflecting the need to download them). You might also want to include Superleap as an available power :-) - but I figure that's just a reflection of increased STR.

 

Players who enter the Matrix don't need to buy any special skills to do so - that's all handled by the crapload of electronics back at the base/ship, wherever.

 

You end up with your normal body - puny weeds in real life are puny weeds (at least in appearance) in the Matrix - athough they could still kick butt, if they took the appropriate downloads. Neo looks like Neo, whether he wants to or not.

 

For the rest, use Dark Champions. Neo - being the Hero - gets a wider range of powers in his pool and much more points to play with. In fact, most of the people on Morpheus' team were hotshots, so going down to 100 points for the players - they get all their gear for free - might make sense.

 

Agents get essentially the same setup, more points for super-impressive physical stat.s plus the "transform a host" power (I assume surveillance and "altering the world" is handled by the machines in the background). You get agents for top of the line opponents (and there's a limitless supply of them!) cops and thugs for low level opponents and elite military forces for middle of the road opponents.

 

Seems like it would work pretty well for me.

 

cheers, Mark

 

I agree, Mark. The only characters you'd have to "stat out" would be the Agents in whatever special powers they have. All the others are normals, with more or less skill levels and equipment. It's like running a Danger Internation/Spy campaign... or a cyberhero campaign. Most of the flashy stuff is special effects. Most villains work off of one "gun guy" sheet which you tweak in the game as appropriate.

 

Any "Heroic level" NCM game is easy, because all characters are very similar in stats to each other... only skill sets differ. The Matrix gets hinky, because you introduce superpowers, essentially, but that is no worse than any other supers game... in fact easier, because the powers are limited to wild martial arts, for the most part.

 

Piece o' cake. It's all in the telling, not the stats.

[Wyrm Ouroboros]

As for the 'insta-downloading' bit, 'strongly suggest' that they each buy one or three levels of Cramming. If you note, Trinity didn't combat pilot the helicopter all that well; about what you'd expect with an 8-.

 

Other than that, they should buy the appropriate (mostly combat) skills with the -1/4 (-1/2?) limitation 'Only In The Matrix', but any knowledge skills they have, generally any non-combat skills they have -- mechanics, electronics, etc. -- should work in both worlds. If you're going to permit a VPP or a MPow of some type, I recommend the MultiPower -- things the character learns as s/he goes along. Being faster, stronger, leaping from tall building to tall building in a single bound ... you are what you think, but one generally can only think about one (or a few) thing(s) at a time. In ALL cases the GM should have close control of what goes into each pool -- maybe 'purchasing' an ability requires RP and an Ego roll, to 'break free' a bit more.

[Publius]

Just some thoughts on the Matrix Hero concept generally,

 

Short Form:

Generally, I'd set up the Matrix as a dual game world, with each player having both a "Base" and a "Matrix" character. Switching between the Real World and the Matrix does not require any powers, skills, rolls whatever because it is simply an integral part of the setting as Markdoc suggested above (conversely, those born outside of the Matrix in Zion would have the Physical Limitation "Cannot Enter Matrix" at whatever value the GM deems appropriate), save of course for the well-defined limitations set by the world (no leaving the Matrix unless you use a land-line to do so etc.). However, Players have additional points to spend on their Matrix selves for the cool "in the Matrix" powers and heightened "beyond normal ken" abilities. GM's might want to help here by having some set powers to use as examples ("Super-leap", "Advanced Kung Fu" bonuses to OCV/DCV, etc.) and maybe some Matrix-only Characteristic limitations for starting PCs.

 

Specifics:

I would have players make their "base character" with a normal range of characteristics, including the skills they want their characters to have all of the time (whether they were initially downloaded or not as with Neo). I'd set these characters in the 'heroic' point values, whatever you'd like but make sure that they have NCM (which you may want to simply make a default for no points). The characters should have a good number of skills, so you might make them with higher points than you might for what are otherwise 'normal' folks (for example, pushing the point totals from 75/75 'standard' characters to 125/125 'Very powerful' characters having the stipulation that no less than 50 points may be spent in skills). Don’t forget the Kung Fu. Basically, any skill that a player wants their character to have on a more or less consistent basis – from adventure to adventure – should be given to the 'base character'.

 

The players then make their "Matrix character" by starting with their base characters (thanks to "Residual Self Image") and adding a hundred points (or 50, 75, 125, etc. as your GM deems appropriate). These Matrix versions of the characters have added Characteristics for SPD, STR, BOD whatever, up to a Matrix Characteristic Maxima (say 25 or 30 in selected physical stats for starting PCs, more as they get experience) plus the obligatory +2 or more in COM (going from the grungy real world to the idealized I-get-to-wear-whatever-I-like Matrix). You can make all of these purchases with the limitation "Only in the Matrix" for a -1/2, or leave that limitation off entirely since these characters can only operate in the Matrix anyway. Skills would either be VPP's or Cramming with OSL's (with the "Only in the Matrix" limitation slapped on) to increase their values (whatever the GM prefers). I'd not require any points for gear, but that's just me. The Loading Program/Construct allows the characters to get any sort of guns/equipment they seem to need and this nicely offsets the raw power of the Agents.

[Heroman]

Actually, it only looked like skills (including MA) were the only things one could pick up from a download (tho I still have not seen the next movie ); the superleap and their fortitude seemd pretty static (though possible to grow in strength from training). I would set aside a VPP for skills for 'downloadables', but the size depends on how you look at learned skills. It seems ambiguous on how many skills one can learn, if you ever 'flush out' skills to make room for new ones, but from a game mechanics I would suggest this. Maybe have a 12-21 point VPP just for downloadable skills representing a PC's fluxuating skills, with the rest pretty much 'hard wired' into him. The initial download would simply be the expending of his initial CPs for character creation. For more static people, 3-4 Cramming would do, also, but mean his skillset is more locked down.

All non-skill abilities should just be flat out purchased outside a VPP since they do not fluxuate other than improve with experience.

This would definately have the Darm Champions feel and I agree with not purchasing equipment themselves; if eq costs CPs, then I would have them all chip into the base (location in a city or a ship) which provides the items.

I do not know if cops would prove a contestable opponent; they seemed to be chewed thru easily. Agents are pretty indestructable, so there may need to be a new middle level opponent which could challenge the group and overcome.

I would expect people have a ugly big PD, Stun, End but NO matrixed rPD/rED; a bullet hurts em. They take massive pummeling but conventional weapons seemed only to be stopped by equipment.

[Chris Goodwin]

SPOILER AHEAD

 

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Okay. In Hero, how would you write up Neo's ability to fight a hundred Agent Smiths?

[Markdoc]

It looked like fighting 100 agent Smiths was simply like fighting 1 agent Smith just multiple times....

 

But scenes like that one were why I suggested that you could also add CHA into the VPP. Matrix'ers are clearly faster, stronger, better dressed than the average person - as indeed are agents.

[Heroman]

Lol, or as a DF

 

"Say, that guy looks sooooo cool! He must be a Matrixer or agent!"

[Blue]

How to fight 100 Agent Smiths:

 

Area effect attack, small radius around the character, personal immunity. Just apply a different HTH ass-kicking special effect to each of the individuals.