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Full Metal Alchemist


Super Squirrel

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

I had totally forgotten about this thread and had thought it had run off on its own when I saw it resurface.

 

Good shot at Alchemy as you have addressed several of my issues but at the same time there are some slight issues with it. I'm going to take what you have done and go with it and then you can correspond from there.

 

1. Extra Time (5 Minutes; Can Perform More Quickly; -1)

Doing it this way makes Alchemy restrictive and cheaper and yet allows more skilled alchemists (such as Ed or Mustang) perform quick maneuvers in combat. This is what is used in Valdorian Age and having seen it in effect, let me say it is definitely a good system. I'll want to come up with special rules for what happens when you fail a skill roll for this, but I can worry about that later.

 

2. Laws of Alchemy (-1/2)

I'm replacing Diagram with Laws of Alchemy. The reason for this is kind of complicated. First, Physical Manifestation is that a power, when used, creates a sort of physical focus that goes with it that can be attacked or taken away. I can only think of a couple of examples when this would be appropriate. First, there is the alchemist symbol when a human is bound to Armor or some other device. This is either a method of healing a Transform or the counter to the Reincarnation from Death power that is Inherent with those individuals. Then there are the times when the diagram is being actively used such as a seal on a homonculus. Instant effects such as Mustang's fire don't have an appearance.

 

Laws of Alchemy is a sort of catch all for the miscelleneous rules of Alchemy that do not fit in a particular limitation. This includes, amongst them, the side effect of attempting to perform a human transmutation and the law of equivalent exchange.

 

3. Gestures (Throughout; -1/2)

I debated this one a lot in my head. This is good and this is correct. If someone uses Alchemy as a 1/2 Phase action they are going from an (AP/10 Penalty) to (AP/10 + 12). So a 60 AP Alchemy Ability is giving them a -18 to their Skill Roll. I think they can get away with "throughout" even though snapping a finger or punching stone normally wouldn't qualify. :D

 

The Focus Problem and Solution

Their is a problem with a focus is that it is so darn flexable. Mustang can snap his fingers with a glove on but that glove only allows him to do fire. Armstrong can reshape stone with his fist because of the symbol he wears but only can reshape stone. You can draw a symbol in the dirt but it only takes a strong wind to blow it away. You also don't need both hands but sometimes you do. Well lets take a look at this.

 

3a. OIF (-1/2) & [Alchemy] Only (-1/2) Total: -1

3b. IIF (Difficult to Replace; -1) & [Alchemy] Only (-1/2) Total -1

3c. IAF "Writing Implement of Opportunity" (Arrangability; -1 1/2) Total: -1

 

As all three ways of doing the focus are -1 that means we have a perfect use of Variable Limitation. I don't have my book so I can't remember if it is a -3/4 or a -1/2 but there we go.

 

The Tattoo Alternative

It is possible to tattoo yourself so that you have a permenant Alchemy circle on you. For this, we have a simple solution. It is much like the above but we either have a restriction to a single type of Alchemy or the more expensive focus limitations above. You have to go with the lowest value for a limitation for Variable Limitation so we are looking at:

Alternative 3 #1. Variable Limitation ([Alchemy] Only or appropriate focus limitation; -1/4)

 

The Gate Alternative

Ed, or anyone else, who has performed a Human Transmutation has a hunted does not need the limitation above. Instead he has only to touch his hands together to perform Alchemy. This is restrainable, yet at the same time, isn't as he can touch or write an alchemy circle if one hand is somehow disabled. For this, it is the following limitation:

Alternative 3 #2. Seen the Gateway (-1/4)

 

4. Requires an Alchemy Skill Roll (-1/2)

 

So here are the final total limitation costs for an Alchemy VPP:

 

Traditional Alchemist: Either -3 or -3 1/4 depending on a rules check.

Alchemist with an Alternative system: -2 3/4

 

I estimate Ed has a 120 pool meaning his control cost is 60 base and after limitations is 16 points. Making his total VPP cost 136 points.

 

Where as someone like Armstrong or Mustang is maybe a 60 pool and a 7 point control cost.

 

This gives characters like Havoc or Hughes a lot of extra points at their disposal as they didn't get into Alchemy. :D

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Cool, nice to get responce so quickly. I'll go over the logic I used, I realise mine wasn't perfect, but I tend to be hardheaded.

Extra Time: That one is pretty simple, have you ever tried drawing complex sombolism on an average span of 3-6 feet, and do so accuratly? it takes forever. much longer then 5 minutes, you can easily spend an hour on it depending on how complex it is and how much of a stickler to detail you are. the reason I set ti to 5 minutes as a base was I'm assuming that an alchemist probably has lots of little tricks to speed up the process, from there taking extra time will make it easier. Typically alchemists who bypass the extra time lim are also bypassing the entire drawing stage. (See below)

Diagram/Array

I was using the whole Diagram thing because if you look at the actual effects, most of the Stuf in Alchemy seems to be either "Instant" with long-lasting effects, like Entangles, Summons, and Transforms, in which case the Phys Mani would only be active while the power activated. Or sometimes powers were Bindings, seals, or general Animation effects which would be built as continous or persistant (probably at 0 END and Uncontrolled with the caveat that they end when the array is broken).

Also you can tell what the general effects of an Alchemy are going to be if you know the lingo. One could postulate that if sombody were to destroy or damage the array while the alchemy was still "active" that it would cause all kinda of problems.

However, your are right that the core Diagram isn't nessessary. the recognizability aspect could simply be handeled by having the characters take Analyze: Alchemic Heraldry or somthing.

For Arrays, the Surface Diagram (a modifier on the origional limitation) is still appropiate since that effecitvly states that the "Manifestation" must be attached to a solid surface, or what its modifying, and that its Def cannot exceed the Def of the surface it's placed on. without the other aspects of the Diagram limitation it would become -3/4.

Skill Roll I actually think thats appropiate. keeping the Skill Roll even when you arn'tdrawing the symbol, because all the "Bypass" methods still require an Array after a fashion, which is often more generalized then ones you draw yourself, so using those might even impose a penalty on your roll.

VVP Pool/Alternative Arrays:

Aditionally if you really wanna model their abilities Alchemists would use a Cosmic pool IMO. You could also state that because Alchemy suffers from the Requires a Skill Roll lim in normal usage that they shouldn't have to take "No Skill Roll to Change Powers" as a +1 limitation, perhaps they could take that as a +1/4 or +1/2 Instead. the 0-pahse to change though is highly approipate considering that in one of the first three episods I've actually seen Ed raises an Iron Wall as an Aborted Action, then transforms a Wall into a door so that they can excape.

Ed, Mustang, and Scar seem to be three primary examples of what we'll call Exceptions to the Array rules. As such their abilities should be modeled as Naked Power Advantages which modify the Control cost. That way they arn't actually eliminating the normal laws, they just have very specific means of bypassing those laws. For Instance, without a specially inscribed glove mustang would be pretty much incapable of using Alchemy if the OIF was taken on his Pool. where-as if you build the Array Rules as default, and treat methods of bypassing said rules as seperate powers when the character dosn't have access to said power for whatever reason, they can still do it the "old fashioned way". That way there also isn't any problems inherent in the SFX limitations of any given characters Alchemy, and no need for the GM to make any arbitrary overrides of normal game mechanics in order to keep the system sensible (Other then allowing Naked Power Advantaged to Off set Limitations that is...)

[rant]Note: that happens to be one of my soap boxes; using what is effectivly an infinitly moddable system, then copping out and jsut making arbitrary rules due to lack of creativity.[/rant]

[digging self out of hole]not that that is what your doing, of course[/digging self out of hole]

 

PS: Thanks for the Rep ya'll

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Totally unrelated to the above post. After I posted last night I starting writing up some Flavor info based heavily on what I know about the Alchemy system. I say heavily based because its not a straight conversion, Its jsut the best explanation I could design for why Alchemy has the limitations it has.

 

Alchemy is the art of utilizing specific esoteric laws in order to manipulate and transform one thing into another. Because Alchemy follows very specific laws the things that can be accomplished, and how they are done is somewhat limited.

Equivalent Exchange: This is the first and most crucial law in Alchemy. The law of equivalent exchange states the following: “In order to gain, something of equal value must be lost”. This is because neither matter nor energy can be created or destroyed; only changed.

The First Corollary; True Conversion: A corollary to the first law, True Conversion states the following: “One element cannot become another”. Thus if you wanted to make a steel wall you’d need the raw material, Iron, handy. Ironically, while the First law remains to this day immutable, skilled alchemists can (and frequently do) defy its corollary. The effects are often much more unpredictable unfortunately. When possible, Alchemists will generally follow this corollary, simply because it makes transmutation much easier.

The Second Corollary; Sympathy: This corollary states the following: “like begets like”. Thus, it is easier to make say; a table if you already have a table at hand. But by no means necessary.

The Third Corollary; Sanctity of Soul: This corollary states the following: “The Soul holds no material before itself in value”. It is unknown exactly why, but by some curse the Soul seems inimical to change by Alchemy, in that it impossible to resurrect those who have died. It is suspected that once the soul has “moved on” it cannot be coaxed by any means to return. Attempts at resurrection often prove fatal to the Alchemist. If done quickly enough it is possible to bind a soul to an object, the soul then possesses said object, much like a ghost, until the object is destroyed, or the binding holding it in place is absolved, even a successful binding however requires great sacrifice from the Alchemist. Due to how the body and soul interact, attempts at transforming living being are often met with severe consequences. It is interesting to note however that this interaction does not seem to interfere with Alchemy when used to heal. Perhaps it is because the soul resists any change which would result in deviating from its natural state, an example of Homeostasis. This raises questions as to why resurrection is impossible. It is said that a legendary object known as the Philosopher’s Stone is capable of bypassing this Corollary. No proof as to the existence of such a stone has ever been found.

The Second Law: Alchemic Heraldry: Also called the Transmutation Circles or simply Heraldries, alchemic heraldry is crucial to utilizing alchemy. The origins of the system remain unknown to this day. However, it is only when the alchemist’s talents are focused through Alchemic Heraldry that matter can be manipulated. The exact effect is dependant upon the heraldry used, but can range anywhere from fixing a broken clock, to raising a stone tower. Because of the complexity inherent in creating the necessary heraldry skilled alchemists sometimes have heraldries stitched into cloth, embossed on medallions, or even tattooed directly into their flesh. These pre-built Heraldries allow alchemists to become much more battlefield capable. The downside is that because these Heraldries are purposely kept generalized to allow a verity of different transmutations to be used through them, it is more difficult to produce the desired effect. It is rumored that some, exceptionally rare alchemists, are able to create Alchemic Heraldry through force of will alone!

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Sure I can do that. I'll go ahead and post my entire conversion, I've been refining the mechanics quite a bit to encoporate the Laws and Corollaries above. I went and did some research on-line, and refined the Laws a bit to, including the whole Gate thing. the main difference is that I'm using a lot of different terminology.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

I still think, however, that using a VPP and your custom limitation are really one in the same. And as we are looking at the same value in limitation it really makes it moot which it is that is used. This, mind you, has always been the hurdle with the alchemy system.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Not done yet, I still have a few bugs to work out. I need to change the modifier for not having the peoper complementrary skill to -30 at least. as it's suposed to be "Required". effecitly I working off the logic that even a failed roll indicates you managed to come up with some info on what your alchemizing the material into, it just may not be a very workable/effecient design. (ex: failing the comp skill to Alchemize somthing into a gun would indicate a poor design, making the alchemy itself more difficult). of course (for those who havn't red the converion yet) failing the main skill roll dosn't nessarially indicate failure, rather reduced effectivness/minor side effects etc. I felt that fit the special effect of alchemy better. On a side note: made the Extra Time limitation based on the size of the Diagram, (the value didn't change since the default for the default size is still 5 minutes, and you suffer heaty penalties useing smaller diagrams) effectivly the Extra Time now indicates the minimum time required for a diagram of that size. As I go along I'm finding more and more that I wanna distance myself form a true conversion. aside form the fact that some things don't really follow all that well I also want to emphesize different things.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

One thing I was considering was possible Cross-gening the concepts from Generator Gawl into this alchemy based system. it wouldn't be that difficult (Its actually a little scary how easy it would be to explain). and would probably as much or more sense then the whole Chimera angle (I might convert that into more of a "necromatic" thing, crafting dead flesh then reanimating it like a homuculas.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

OK, time for another update, As I've worked on this little project I've read through the manga (Up to vol 8 now I think). and realized that a lot of my Alchemy system was well... jsut plain crap. the skill rolls added an unecessary level of complication to whats already a complicated concept, in that I was trying to mimic realism at the cost of flavor and practicality. so that and all its related and unecessary modifiers are being removed. The limitations based on Diagram size are being nixed as well. anyway I'll post the simplified version when I'm done.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Oh BTW, for those interested, you can actually read a home-translation of the entire Manga series (up to Chapter 54 or somthing) at "www.readmanga.com". Be warned though, the site has enough Pop-ups to be a porn-site so make sure your Blocker is set to max. The site also tends to crash a lot.

That aside one should also note that the Manga and the Series deviate from each other extensivly. so while my system may be perfect for the Manga version, there will likely be stuff in the Anime version that contradicts it.

 

By this point I've pretty much abandonded the origional attempt, so much was wrong that its not even funny. Including the concept of using a VPP. VPPs sound great on paper, but in 90% of cases they are a very bad choice for defining a true system. Plus their a pain in the *** In-Game. Instead I'm now basing it on a Multi-Power because

1#: It's cheeper

2#: it makes the related Science/Knowledge skills more reasonable purchases

3#: It's easier to limit available powers.

And the only downside is the lack of the ingenuity aspect that was the prime reason for using a VPP in the first place. in order toaccount for that, I'm jsut including a Power skill as part of the Alchemist package. they want to try somthing interesting, make a skill roll, if they want to do it regularly they'll have to buy it (big whoop, because its a MP, and its got so many inherent limitations, anything short of a 75 AP power costs 1 point, and thats not counting extra limitations to account for Alchemies general lack of anything even moderatly similar to Range or just SFX.

PS: sombody post... only seeing myself for 5 or 6 posts is kinda monotonous. plus feed back is good, feed back is friend.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

Yeah, ditto. I'm up through whatever is current on Cartoon Network on Saturday nights. That's after they figure out who Dante really is, and Lust and Ed decide they have to hook up to find Al and Shou Tucker. No manga yet, I'll get that after they finish up with the anime.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

No, FMA in this case. I had seen a wallpaper on 4chan that didn't make sense. Afterwards I thought of something I had seen someone post about the series that at the time had made even less sense. At work, Courtney was watching an AMV and commented on it. I put it all together and realized the original post I mentioned had to have been true.

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Re: Full Metal Alchemist

 

No' date=' FMA in this case. I had seen a wallpaper on 4chan that didn't make sense. Afterwards I thought of something I had seen someone post about the series that at the time had made even less sense. At work, Courtney was watching an AMV and commented on it. I put it all together and realized the original post I mentioned had to have been true.[/quote']

 

Sorry, what I meant was, FMA the anime doesn't end like Cowboy Beop did, does it? With a punch to the gut?

 

(I don' think I've seen said wallpaper at 4chan... but i have seen some "XXX dies" pics, that make me wonder....)

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