Bubble gum crises to hero

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Actually - it was a rewrite so he could finish the story - since the original was canceled. Bubblegum Crash! was a mostly hurried production to add an ending to the series. Toshimichi Suzuki created all of them' date=' and when given an opportunity to realzie the full story jumped on it.[/quote']

 

Yes, we are aware of all of that. Crash was quite obviously rushed (in the story department, especially. It simply did not have the same feel as the rest of the BGC series with the possible exception of the 2cnd Crash episode with the Boomer "Adama") to provide the series with a coherent ending. It worked, but just barely.

 

I believe that 2040 was not only an attempt by Suzuki to finally get his story told, it was modified to appeal to a new generation of anime viewers. However when people do a "Reinvention" of a beloved series, one always runs the risk of alienating the original fans. See the new Battlestar Galactica for a perfect example of this (I don't know very many fans of the original who like it, but I know lots of people who never watched the original who love it). 2040 had this problem. They changed so much (and I'm not just talking about the Character Designs...we all understood that Sonada was no longer available) that they alienated a lot of the fans of the original...in fact your the first I've ever discussed this with who seems to like 2040 as much as the original.

 

The biggest difference in 2040 from the original is that Sonoda did not do character design, and thus the characters are radically different people.

 

Well, I'll agree that this is the most obvious difference. A character designers specific designs go a long way toward differentiating a series from similar offerings. Sonada, being one of the most unique designers in the 80's was one of the big reasons for BGC's success (in generating hardcore fans, since it wasn't very financially successful) and the absence of his unique character designs and freaking awsome boomers was enough to turn away many hardcore fans. Masami Oobari also cut his teeth on BGC designing such monstrocities as the "D.D." and the Doberman boomers (they have his signature design aesthetics) and their absence is almost painful for many of us.

 

Either way it still wasn't "just a rewrite to bring it back into public view" it was a rewrite to tell the full story without looking rushed.

 

I'll have to disagree here. While the themes are similar (what is human? What is artificial? When the lines are blurred, is there really a difference?) the "meat" of the story was heavily modified, even changed completely in many areas. Where was Largo? Replaced by Galatea? Largo was a much better villian, by a long shot. One of the best anime villians ever, IMO. I loved how Mason became Largo in order to usher in the next stage in human and Boomer evolution. No Daily? A minor character to be sure, but a great parter for Leon to play off of Leon's cheuvanistic masculinity. And the boomers in 2040 seemed to simply be fodder. There were no memorable Boomer characters like Anri and Sylvia from Crisis and Adama from Crash.

In fact I saw nothing in 2040 on the level of the Adama episode of Bugglegum Crash. A very powerful episode which explored the depth of Priss's predjudice against Boomers and her struggling with her own bigotry when presented with a Boomer who was noble and good. Lets not even talk about the most excellent episodes of Crisis..Moonlight Ramber and Red Eyes. Some of the most powerful storytelling I've ever seen in any media format were from those two episodes. No single episode of 2040 gave anywhere near half the emotional stimulus those episodes gave me. And that I believe was 2040's biggest failing. It didn't connect with our emotions like Crisis did.

 

That said - it is both the same story and a different story. A lot of the themes brough up in the original look dated, so it needed a bit up modernizing. And seriously - it would have sucked hard if it were just the same thing re-animated.

 

I beg to differ. I think it would've been great to see a version of BGC with better animation with a greatly expanded story (but still essentially the same), but then again, I'm old school. 2040 wasn't meant to appeal to me, but to new anime fans.

 

There are things I like about both series and things I dislike... needless to say I'm a huge fan of the series and own the a set of pre-production copies of the Original BGC Series DVDs mode>.

 

There's very little about the original BGC that I dislike, other than the fact that it went unfinished. I have problems with Crash, but only because the same powerful storytelling found in Crisis seemed to be missing (with the exception of episode 2). 2040 simply didn't "do it" for me I guess. I'd love to watch it again, as I've only watched it all the way through once. I barely even remember it...but I remember just about everything from Crisis and Crash, and that is the mark of a truely great anime series..if even the small details remain even when its been years since the last time you watched it...

[ghost-angel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

in fact your the first I've ever discussed this with who seems to like 2040 as much as the original.

I know plenty of people who like both equally well. But most of those people don't attempt to compare the stories - they like each story for what it is.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

One of the biggest differences in the two is in the 80s when BGC was written the economic bubble had not burst and corporate excess (which Genom embodied) was the talk of the day. The intrusion of machines into daily life both in Japan and America had just started to get momentum and that was a main focal point for the series.

 

2040 is written almost 10 years after the bubble burst in Japan, mechanization and computers are so ingrained in basic life people simply don't see it as much anymore - especially in Japan where electronic gadgets come and go with each sunrise almost. The original BGC story would have almost no impact anymore ... it had to focus more on the idea of going too far with it all - human excess instead of corporate excess, humanity is blurred in both, even moreso in 2040.

 

and 2040 is not just a retelling, it's a completely different story. You can't compare the two.

 

Oh and Daly was in 2040 - but like others he had a radically different character design.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I know plenty of people who like both equally well. But most of those people don't attempt to compare the stories - they like each story for what it is.

 

I understand where you are coming from, because I've done the same thing with the new Battlestar Galactica series...I loved the old series and I really like the new series...I consider them totally different. My old roomate hates the new series because he can't seperate it from the old.

 

I normally have no problem with this sort of thing, but for some reason, I have a harder time doing this for anime. I couldn't seperate the original BGC from 2040, thus I didn't enjoy 2040 very much. The same thing happened with Record of the Lodoss War and Crystania (I didn't mind the Lodoss War Tv series very much because it was more of a "Lodoss: The Next Generation" type story) and the original Dangaio vs Great Dangaio.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I think a lot of disenchated BGC fans were expecting the old series and old story and thus failed to look into the intent of 2040 - which is, was and intended to be a completely seperate universe and story.

 

Which is too bad because it's a very good story.

[Edsel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I was pretty heart-broken when the original series ended so early. I agree that the Bubblegum Crash stuff just didn't live up to the original. I like the 2040 series as well. The analogy to Battlestar Galactia works for me. I have enjoyed both series I like the original best but I am still happy I own the later stuff as well.

[TheRavenIs]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I played around with this once long ago (pre 5th Edition). The most I ever did was write a set-up for the Mk I suit worn by Priss. It is attached as a Word document. This is only a very rough work-up and I didn't get any further than this but perhaps it can act as a starting point.

 

If anyone has done anything else, I too would love to see it.

 

 

Now that was a good way of doing that. REPPED!!!

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Wow, SZ. The damage on those Knuckle Bombers are a bit high don't you think? They're made to destroy boomers, not Zaku's!

 

I would go with a 3D6 HKA (30) with Pen x2 (+1/2) and X Charges (I forget how many charges it had...3? 6?) and STR does not add (-1/2)

 

I'd make the Leg Bombers 4D6 HKA (there are 5 shaped charges on the leg vs only 3 on the Knuckle) Pen x2 and Double Knockback (its an explosive kick after all) Str does not add of course.

 

The reason Str would not add is because its a shaped charge. The damage all comes from the explosive and has nothing to do with Str. The Vibroblades on the other hand, do get the benefit of added Str.

Oh, and I believe I have all the BGC Rpg books here somewhere if you want to borrow them for more writeups...

 

This could be a fun project.

 

I'm all about those Motoslaves.

 

the reason I made thoes knucle bombers that heavy is because. I think I remember they used it on a hevy combat boomer. As for useing str. i just did that for extra oomph. so its optional

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

ok I found my old Bgc art book and the first R.talisorin Bgc game book.

Looks like my memorie is not that good. I made part of the mark 2 Hard suite.

I will be redoing the mk1 and mk2 and i will also be adding the Bu-55c combat boomer.

 

thank you all for your input, and I would like to see some of the stuff you have done.

[Edsel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

By all means post anything that you do. I'll be looking for it.

[Black Omega]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I really need to sit down and watch BGC 2040 through, I keep getting distracted. I remember liking the characters, though Sylia was definitely...creepy. Yep, creepy is a good word.

 

BGC was the first anime I watched. I was in a supers game playing a female martial artist named Pris, character rode a motorcycle, played in a rock band. A friend getting into anime said I had to watch Bubble Gum Crisis. He was right.

[Herolover]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I love the original BGC and have seen some of the 2040.

 

I have the Fuzion version of BGC and have looked at doing some kind of conversion, but everytime I start I run into problems with things completely out of whack. I have came to the conclusion that doing a straight Fuzion-Hero conversion (even though they say you can) is a mistake. Instead, I use it purely for resource material.

 

Now, so I have really looked into doing a game based upon it and let me tell you some things that I have found.....

 

1) Get Kazei 5. It has some great information on cybernetics and combat suits that is easily usable. I highly recommend it.

 

2) Buy the Gadgets and Gear book. This might not make sense, but it has some great writeups on battlesuits and "rules of thumb" for making battlesuits. It even has some random tables for "rolling up" a random suit that could easily be modified to create a "hardsuit."

 

When/if I ever get around to creating my own BGC writeup those are the two places I am going to start. I also highly recommend that you post what you create on the boards. A lot of fans can work together to create a very good writeup.

[Susano]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I love the original BGC and have seen some of the 2040.

 

I have the Fuzion version of BGC and have looked at doing some kind of conversion, but everytime I start I run into problems with things completely out of whack. I have came to the conclusion that doing a straight Fuzion-Hero conversion (even though they say you can) is a mistake. Instead, I use it purely for resource material.

 

Now, so I have really looked into doing a game based upon it and let me tell you some things that I have found.....

 

1) Get Kazei 5. It has some great information on cybernetics and combat suits that is easily usable. I highly recommend it.

 

If you like K5, write me and let me know. Also, write Steve Long and let him know. I'm hoping to work up Kazei 5 2.0, a 5th Edition update (possibly to be published if/when Cyber Hero is written), and have started on various campaign elements.

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Priss`s hard suite Type 1 first season

 

 

All are part of OAF-1/2

 

 

Targeting computer: 3 over all combat skill levels 27pts mines limm. = 18pts

Optics:

Ultraviolet Perception: 10pts =5pts

Infrared Perception: 10pts = 5pts

Night vision: 5pts +5 to perception, =2.5

Flash defiance: 5pts =2.5

Telescopic 6pts: =3pts +4 for Rmod sight group

Radio perception: 10 pts = 5pts

Increased arc of perception: 240 5pts

Built in skill find weakness Boomers only: 10pts for 11- + another 25pts for a +5 = 18pts

Str : + 15 for 15 pts =5pts

Body: +5 for 10pts = 5pts

Spd: +1 10pts =5pts

Dex: +5 =15pts =8pts

Armor: 14pd 14ed = 42pts Hardened +1/2 for pd and Ed =53pts

Damage reduction: 50% resistant 30pts physical and energy =60pts =30pts

Run : 36pts + 18” = 18pts

Leap: 30pts +30” = 10pts

 

Power: 6pts for 60end = 3pts

Rec: 15 for 15pts = 8pts

 

 

Weapons pool 70pts active: oaf -1/2 35pts

Arm needlers : 2d6k 30pts + ap + ½ penetrating + 1/2 auto fire (3) +1/4 charges (12) -1/4 = 68pts= 7pts fixed slot

 

Impact cannon: 2d6+1k 35pts +ap+1/2, penatrating+1/2 charges(12)-1/4 = 40pts = 4pts fixed slot

 

laser beam weapon: 2d6rka 30pts +ap +1/2 , penatrateing=1/2 60pts 3pts fixed slot end (6)

 

Pulse laser: 1d6+1K 20pts+1ocv=2pts =22pts +ap+1/2 autofire(5)+1/2 =44pts =22pts 4pts veribale End (4) (20)

 

Total points: 262

 

Here is the revamp for the Mk1

I used bothe the Bgc art book I have for the first season, and I also got the Bgc rpg game from R.Talasorian games. I used for refrance on the suit

So what do you think?

[Susano]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Priss`s hard suite Type 1 first season

All are part of OAF-1/2

 

How can a Hardsuit be OAF? Or is it OIF and you made a mistake typing?

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

How can a Hardsuit be OAF? Or is it OIF and you made a mistake typing?

 

oops my bad It was supose to be OIF. Thanx for the catch on that Susano:thumbup:

[ShinDangaioh]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I understand where you are coming from, because I've done the same thing with the new Battlestar Galactica series...I loved the old series and I really like the new series...I consider them totally different. My old roomate hates the new series because he can't seperate it from the old.

 

I normally have no problem with this sort of thing, but for some reason, I have a harder time doing this for anime. I couldn't seperate the original BGC from 2040, thus I didn't enjoy 2040 very much. The same thing happened with Record of the Lodoss War and Crystania (I didn't mind the Lodoss War Tv series very much because it was more of a "Lodoss: The Next Generation" type story) and the original Dangaio vs Great Dangaio.

 

Great Dangaioh is actually the sequel to Star Giant Dangaioh. I've gotten used to the oddities of multiple universes with anime/manga. I had to with Dangaioh and Iczer-1. One of my favorite manga is the Dangaioh: DOLL manga. Then there is Slayers.

 

As to the two BGC stories. I think part of the reason for some of the dislike is the new BGC didn't play up Priss' singing with her songs playing in the background. Music was a very big part of the original BGC. I have all of BGC 2040's cds and I enjoy the music on them, but there should have been more.

 

As to Largo? IF a sequel to BGC comes about, who do you think they'll use? Recall what happened to Brian J. Mason. We have no idea if he died by the end of BGC 2040.

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Linnas hard suite Type 1 first season

 

 

All are part of OIF-1/2

 

 

Targeting computer: 3 over all combat skill levels 27pts mines limm. = 18pts

Optics:

Ultraviolet Perception: 10pts =5pts

Infrared Perception: 10pts = 5pts

Night vision: 5pts +5 to perception, =2.5

Flash defiance: 5pts =2.5

Telescopic 6pts: =3pts +4 for Rmod sight group

Radio perception: 10 pts = 5pts

Increased arc of perception: 240 5pts

Built in skill find weakness Boomers only: 10pts for 11- + another 25pts for a +5 = 18pts

 

Str : + 15 for 15 pts =5pts

Body: +5 for 10pts = 5pts

Spd: +1 10pts =5pts

Dex: +6 =18pts =9pts

 

Armor: 14pd 14ed = 42pts Hardened +1/2 for pd and Ed =53pts

Damage reduction: 50% resistant 30pts physical and energy =60pts =30pts

 

Run : 36pts + 18” = 18pts

Leap: 30pts +30” = 10pts

 

Power: 6pts for 60end = 3pts

Rec: 15 for 15pts = 8pts

 

Weapons pool 75pts active: OIF -1/2 38ptss

 

laser beam weapon: 2d6rka 30pts +ap +1/2 , penatrateing=1/2 60pts 3pts fixed slot end (6)

 

Pulse laser: 1d6+1K 20pts+1ocv=2pts =22pts +ap+1/2 autofire(5)+1/2 =44pts =22pts 4pts veribale End (4) (20)

 

Knucle bombers: hka 3d6 45pts ap+1/2, charges(4) -1 =34pts 3pts fixed slot

 

Razor ribon:hka 2d6 30pts ap+1, autofire(2) +1/4, 68pts =34pts 3pts fixed slot

end 8

 

TTcost 261

[Edsel]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Excellent, more cool stuff.

 

I'd be almost tempted to make those ribbon cutters double AP since I can't recall seeing anything that seemed able to resist them.

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Excellent, more cool stuff.

 

I'd be almost tempted to make those ribbon cutters double AP since I can't recall seeing anything that seemed able to resist them.

 

I was thinking about it but I figured it was enough to just one AP for now. I might change them later on.

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

Excellent, more cool stuff.

 

I'd be almost tempted to make those ribbon cutters double AP since I can't recall seeing anything that seemed able to resist them.

 

After a review of the show and the art book and Edsel and my friend NSG. I changed the razor ribons to double ap in stead of one.

 

Thank you both for you input.

[Old Man]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I keep waiting for someone to write up Nene's hardsuit with all that ECM gear. I'd do it myself but it's been a decade or so since I last watched BGC.

[Susano]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

I keep waiting for someone to write up Nene's hardsuit with all that ECM gear. I'd do it myself but it's been a decade or so since I last watched BGC.

 

You asked...

 

Okay, important note -- this is not a meant to be a BGC character sheet. This is something I developed for my Kazei 5 setting. This material is also 4th Edition and (may) be adapted into 5th Edition for K5 2.0. That said, I did try and create various ECM-related powers for her suit.

 

[b]NENE ROMANOVA

Val	CHA	Cost	Roll	Notes[/b]
8 (25)	STR	6	14-	800kg; 5d6
13 (21)	DEX	21	13-	OCV: 7 / DCV: 7
13 (20)	CON	13	13-	
10	BODY	0	11-	
28	INT	26	15-	PER Roll 15-
15	EGO	10	13-	ECV: 6
13 (20)	PRE	10	13-	PRE Attack: 4d6
20	COM	5	13-	
3 (4)	PD	1		Total: 16 PD / 12 PDr
3 (4)	ED	0		Total: 16 ED / 12 EDr
3 (5)	SPD	20		Phases: 3, 5, 8, 10, 12
5	REC	0		
26	END	0		Values in parenthesis are from the Powered Armor
24	STUN	0		suit, No Figured Characteristics.
[b]Total Characteristics Cost: 112

Movement:[/b]	Running: 6" / 12"
Superleap: 14" / 7"
Swimming: 2" / 4"

[b]Cost	Powers & Skills[/b]
Combat Training:
10	Combat Skill Levels: +2 with all Hardsuit systems
Martial Arts: Basic Self Defense
Maneuver	OCV	DCV	Damage
5	Block	+1	+3	Block, Abort
4	Escape	+0	+0	+15 STR vs Grabs
3	Throw	+0	+1	STR +v/5; Target Falls

Implanted Cyerware:
4	Cranial Telephone: Radio Listen and Transmit, Cybersystem (-1/4)
8	Data Jack - Level 3: +3 with all computer related skills, Requires accessible 
datacable (-1/2), Requires DNI capable computer (-0), Cybersystem (-1/4) 

Black Company Hardsuit: Powered Armor (-1/2)
5	Hardsuit: Density Increase, 1 Level, 0 End, Persistent, Always On: +5 STR,
 +1 PD/ED, -1" KB, 200kg

Hardsuit Weapons Systems:
24	Hardsuit Weapons Multipower: 48 Point Pool, Restrainable (weapons built 
into suit left forearm) (-1/2)*
2	u - PN90: RKA 1d6+1, AF5, +2 OCV, +1 Rmod, 25 shots
1	u - Cutting Laser: RKA 1d6 E, Penetrating, No Range*

13	Computer Override Programs Elemental Control: 38 Point Base, 
Only vs computers and Cyberdroids (-1), Requires Computer Programming 
Roll (-1/10pts) (-1/2)
12	1 - Override Program: Mind Control: 15d6, affects INT only (-0)
12	2 - Data Search: Telepathy: 15d6, affects INT only (-0)

35	ECM: Darkness vs Radio Sense Group, 7"r, Requires Systems Ops roll (-1/2)
35	Target Scanning: Find Weakness: Usable by others (Hardsuit Weapons only), 
All can use, Up to 4 others, Ranged, Persistant, Only usable on Cyberdroids, 
Cyborgs, Hardsuits and Mecha (-1/2), Only usable on targets that Nene 
has scanned (-1)

Hardsuit Defenses: 
24	Armor: 12 DEF
3	Flash Defense: 5 DEF, Sight Group
7	Life Support: Sealed Systems

7	Flight Pack: Superleap +10"*

Sensor and Communications Suite:
17	High Range Radio Hearing: Discriminatory, Targeting, Requires a Systems 
Ops roll (-1/2), 
3	IR Vision
23	Radar, 360°, +6 Range Mod
12	Telescopic Vision/Hearing: +6 Range Mod
5	Tracking Scent: Radio Sense Group, Requires a Systems Ops roll (-1/2), 
3	UV Vision, Battlesuit
13	Coded Transmitter: Mind Link: Related Group (members of the Black 
Company), 4 other minds, Only with Black Company members (-1)*
48	Internal Computer System (see seperate write up)

17	Hardsuit Power Supply: End Reserve: 100 END, 15 REC/Turn, Feeds all 
powers marked with an *

[b]Background Skills:[/b] 
1	Perk: Weapon Permit
5	Perk: Wealth
3	Talent: Lighting Calculator
3	Talent: Speed Reading 
3	AK: The Matrix 15-
3	Breakfall 13-
3	Bugging 15-
15	Computer Programming 21-
3	Cryptography 15-
9	Electronics 14-
0	English
7	Forgery 13-
3	French
3	Japanese
3	Security Systems 15-
9	Systems Operations 18-
1	WF: Pistols
3	Scientist
2	SC: Computer Science 15-
2	SC: Electrical Engineering 15-
2	SC: Electronic Warfare Systems 15-
2	SC: Mathmatics 15-
3	Scholar
2	KS: Computer ICE 15-
2	KS: Computer Programming & Software 15-
2	KS: Computers & Computer Systems 15-
2	KS: Cyberdroids 15-
2	KS: The Matrix 15-
[b]460	Total Powers & Skills Cost
572	Total Character Cost

100+	Disadvantages[/b]
15	Distinctive Features: Black Company Hardsuit
10	Hunted: Red Commandos (aspow) 8-
20	Normal Characteristic Maxima
10	Physical LImitation: Suit susceptible to EMP pulse damage
Psychological Limitation:
15	Absent Minded
15	To smart for her own good
20	Overconfident concerning computer skills
15	Reputation: Black Company (ext) 11-
15	Secret ID: (members names are classified)
15	Watched: Current Employer (Mopow, NCI) 14-
322	[b]Experience
572	Total Disadvantage Points[/b]

 

[b]NENE'S CRANIAL COMPUTER

Val	CHA	Cost	Roll	Notes[/b]
20	DEX	30	13-	System has Powered Armor Limitation (-1/2)
20	INT	10	13-	
4	SPD	10		Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12
[b]Total Characteristics Cost: 50

Programs[/b]
3	Cryptography 13-
3	KS: Cyberdroids 13-
3	KS: Hardsuits 13-
3	KS: LandMates 13-
3	Systems Operations 13-
3	Tactics 
1	Identify Opponet (search KS Files) 
1	Break Coded Tranmission (Cryptography)
1	Combat Advice (Tactics) 
1	Run ECM & ECCM (Systems Operations & related Hardsuit Powers) 
[b]Total Programs Cost: 22 
Total Character Cost: 72[/b]

[Scion Zane]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

That's a cool write up Susano. I like the way you did ECM. Nsg. was telling me he used environmental control for ECM:thumbup:

[Susano]

Re: Bubble gum crises to hero

 

That's a cool write up Susano. I like the way you did ECM. Nsg. was telling me he used environmental control for ECM:thumbup:

 

5th Edition would have more options, what with the ECM/ECCM rules in the Ultimate Vehicle, and some of the fun to be had with CE and Images.