Worst. Hero. Ever.

[Catacomb]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Why follow a series so ungodly lame that I threw up in my mouth a little trying to?

 

I used to work in a comic book shop(I use the word work, loosely) and one of the owners used to come in every few days and say "Hey, you need to check out *blank*." and usually it worked out very well. He pointed me to The Watchmen, Alien Legion(Jugger Grimrod is GOD!"), and even Captain America who I always had felt was a little lame prior to being given some choice issues to read.

 

Then he had me sit down and read Superman.

 

Wow, what a steaming pile.

 

Even with the best writers, great art, and all of the bells and whistles Supes is just LAME. Horribly, terribly, lame. I read issues with Darkseid that were just pathetic, ones with Mongul that made me question the sanity of DC, and then there were the issues with lamo villains like Toyman.

 

Yeah. Good stuff.

 

The guy has EVERYTHING. He is god in yellow, red, and blue. He is a walking, breathing, plot device that can do anything that is ever needed at any time and it is just pathetic. You guys choose to like him? Fine, but this thread is asking the opinion of who you think the lamest hero ever is and I truly believe it is Superman.

 

He was cool when I was 6 and got lame about the same time I started cheering when the ewok in Jedi got duffed.

 

So again, Superman. Lamest. Hero. Ever.

[AdamLeisemann]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Ask, and you shall recieve.

 

Tell me, is that a photo-manipulation, or did the comic really advertise, "100% total stupidity in every panel"?

[assault]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Then he had me sit down and read Superman.

 

May I ask when the stuff you read dated from?

 

That's out of curiousity, of course, since there is no point in me trying to change your mind. I personally find your attitude incomprehensible, since your criteria make no sense whatsoever when evaluating stories like The Girl In Superman's Past! (the introduction of Lori Lemaris), or Superboy's Big Brother! (the introduction of Mon-El).

[assault]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Tell me' date=' is that a photo-manipulation,[/quote']

 

Yes, it's a photo-manipulation. I posted a link to the original cover on the first page of the thread.

[Catacomb]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

May I ask when the stuff you read dated from?

 

That's out of curiousity, of course, since there is no point in me trying to change your mind. I personally find your attitude incomprehensible, since your criteria make no sense whatsoever when evaluating stories like The Girl In Superman's Past! (the introduction of Lori Lemaris), or Superboy's Big Brother! (the introduction of Mon-El).

 

 

My criteria make no sense?

 

Superman can do anything, can be defeated by nothing, and if something just happens to get the upper hand he has a bigger gadget pool than Reed Richards.

 

Its something a six year old kid would create when he and his buddies were running around playing in the backyard. He's just bad...so very, very, bad.

 

Honestly, 100% seriousness to all of the Superman apologists.

 

If he didn't exist before now, if there was no 'Superman' template even, and he came along today, would he even make it into a comic book?

[Vestnik]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

 

Its something a six year old kid would create when he and his buddies were running around playing in the backyard. He's just bad...so very, very, bad.

 

This is exactly right; or, more precisely, he's what someone marketing to 6 (or maybe 8) year-olds would like. He can do anything, he's got a cool fort, he's got a loyal dog (what kid doesn't want a dog?), neat-o superman robots, an oddly distant love interest (is Lois Lane mom? I have to think about that). He's a kid's fantasy.

[wylodmayer]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

I'm not going to question your criteria, or your conclusion, even, since I assumed this was a thread where we could all vent out spleens about various heroes in comics. However...

 

Superman can do anything' date=' can be defeated by nothing...[/quote']

 

Factually incorrect. Counterexamples are legion.

 

If he didn't exist before now, if there was no 'Superman' template even, and he came along today, would he even make it into a comic book?

 

Hard to judge the counterfactual and - given the state of current comics - not sure what it proves.

 

I've stated before my opinions about why I think Superman is a great character, and anyone who's read them knows that to focus on the fact that he is powerful as a reason NOT to like him misses the point of those arguments rather completely.

 

Not that I think they are decisive or even widely persuasive, just to say that pointing out the fact that "Superman is powerful" is probably talking past all of his fans. They can read. The know he's powerful. Clearly, they have some other reason for liking him, one which his being so powerful does not overthrow.

 

Obviously, you're free to consider Superman lame. I just wanted to note that purusing that line of argument probably won't convince anyone who doesn't already agree with you.

[assault]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Not that I think they are decisive or even widely persuasive' date=' just to say that pointing out the fact that "Superman is powerful" is probably talking [i']past[/i] all of his fans. They can read. The know he's powerful. Clearly, they have some other reason for liking him, one which his being so powerful does not overthrow.

 

Incidentally, Superman is nothing like the most powerful character out there. Furthermore, there are several other characters at exactly the same power level and with the exact same power sets.

 

Presumably they are lame too.

 

There goes the Spectre, Mon-El, Supergirl, Power Girl, Dr Fate, Captain Marvel... The Flash should probably go too... Johnny Thunder...

 

The "powerful=lame" argument is, at best, highly selective.

 

Especially when it rules out Power Girl. Remember: she's a Kryptonian too!

[Clonus]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Incidentally, Superman is nothing like the most powerful character out there. Furthermore, there are several other characters at exactly the same power level and with the exact same power sets.

 

Presumably they are lame too.

 

There goes the Spectre, Mon-El, Supergirl, Power Girl, Dr Fate, Captain Marvel... The Flash should probably go too... Johnny Thunder...

 

 

Well no, not Power Girl. She only has a tiny fraction of Superman's power. She's lame because her breasts have turned into a silly joke.

[OddHat]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

This is exactly right; or' date=' more precisely, he's what someone marketing to 6 (or maybe 8) year-olds would like. He can do anything, he's got a cool fort, he's got a loyal dog (what kid doesn't want a dog?), neat-o superman robots, an oddly distant love interest (is Lois Lane mom? I have to think about that). He's a kid's fantasy.[/quote']

 

Yup. And many of the kids that read them in the seventies are the same 30 and over crowd that buy so many comics today. The ones who argue on the Internet about which of two fictional characters would win a fight, and get really passionate about it.

[OddHat]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Honestly, 100% seriousness to all of the Superman apologists.

 

If he didn't exist before now, if there was no 'Superman' template even, and he came along today, would he even make it into a comic book?

 

A flying brick with supplementary powers as the story calls for them, one noted for his commitment to Truth and Justice? Well, Thor's was popular for a while.

[assault]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Well no' date=' not Power Girl. She only has a tiny fraction of Superman's power. She's lame because her breasts have turned into a silly joke.[/quote']

 

They have toned her power down a lot, but back in the day, she was fast enough to race the Flash, and every bit as powerful as her cousin.

 

The breast joke has gotten old, but calling her lame is volunteering for a sack-beating round these parts.

 

Come to think of it, you seem to have called Mon-El lame too. Watch out for Legion fans!

 

Hmm... presumably Ultra Boy would be lame too... Definitely time for a sack beating.

[assault]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Well' date=' Thor's was popular for a while. [/quote']

 

Yes, but Thor was a Superman rip-off.

 

Or worse, a Captain Marvel rip-off, and thus a rip-off of a rip-off!

 

Other memorable Superman rip-offs include: Namor, the Human Torch, Spider-Man, the Hulk, and even Captain America.

[OddHat]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Yes, but Thor was a Superman rip-off.

 

Or worse, a Captain Marvel rip-off, and thus a rip-off of a rip-off!

 

Other memorable Superman rip-offs include: Namor, the Human Torch, Spider-Man, the Hulk, and even Captain America.

 

Yup. Again, without Supes, the genre would look very different.

[Weldun]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

I think my problem with superman was that I never found him particularly compelling. I mean, yeah, there are actually things beyond kryptonite that can trip him up, but, I dunno, he just never grabbed me. I much preferred Spiderman, or the X-men. I think (despite Spiderman's small grab-bag) that over time, I've simply began to equate low power levels or single, high level power as being more conducive to compelling story writing. Okay, I really enjoyed Bloodstone and was more than a little sad with his demise.

 

As for Power-girl, well, when I stopped reading DC, she was still Supergirl. I have to say though, all I've heard about her is how large her breasts are. Well, I've looked up some images on the net, and I've dated girls with bigger, so ).

 

Hell, someone told me recently that a lot of mutants have lost their powers, including Jubilee. To that I say, No Jubilation? What? Never buying comics again. (I'll still read my friend's copies, though. I'm such a comic-slut.)

[wylodmayer]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

I never liked Jubilee, but that could have something to do with the character being introduced at a time in the history of the X-Men that I mostly associate with dry heaves and a desire to stab Claremont to death with a pocket knife.

 

On the other hand, I can honestly say that I think the way her character was written at the time betrayed even the barest loyalty to verisimilitude; the character's "personality" could only be called textured or even plausible in relation to Gambit, a character about as one-note and cardboard as they come. Her backstory was a pastiche of cliches that never seemed to actually impact any of the writing for the character, and she was blatantly introduced as a perky foil for Wolvie. Granted, a lot of characters serve narrative functions for more important characters, but it's actually, you know, good writing when those characters are compelling or at least interesting and believable in their own right. Jubilee, like so many other characters in comics, never seemed to be acting from genuine, authentic internal motivations so much as a meta-awareness of her own place in the title. I'd say I hated the character, but then it almost goes without saying that I've hated virtually everything about the X-Men since about the mid 80s.

[OzMike]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

"Hate" is such absolute and negative word, and "virtually" is such a vague and indefinite word

 

When considering the X Men, my emotions run more to the "Bleh" side - I stopped caring. Can't get much more damaging than that.

 

Can I change my vote? I just remembered Lobo, especially when they try to portray him as a 'serious' hero, rather than a post-modernistic parody of the badass anti-hero archetype.

 

Note: You can tell the difference between these two portrayals - one has him adventuring in what I like to call the Lobo-verse, the other has him acting the same way but interacting with Superman and so on.

 

Note2: I did like his portayal in LSH v4 Quiet Darkness story arc though.

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

"Hate" is such absolute and negative word...

Jubilee was a gymnast because she grew up in a mall. Hate isn't a strong enough word.

 

I have been told that this was retconned away. I sure as hell hope so.

[Gideon]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

When Lobo first appeared I really liked him. He was a completely different character back when he showed up in Omega Men, JLI, and the begining of L.E.G.I.O.N..

 

He started out as a slim, quiet man who killed with his hands because it more enjoyable who had a very scary noir style about him.

 

But then something happened to the character.

 

And he changed into to a huge miscle-bound raving psycho with a chain and hook who doesn't care how his victim's die as long as it is gory. He also somehow grew about 8 inches talled between his first appearance in 1983 and his first self-titled mini-series in 1990.

 

I think the character died at some point shortly after the intorduction of he started calling himself "The Ultimate Bastich".

[input.jack]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Why follow a series so ungodly lame that I threw up in my mouth a little trying to?

 

Does this mean that you tried to watch the DC animated Superman series? Because thats what I recommended. Not the comics. The animated series.

 

Then he had me sit down and read Superman.

 

Wow, what a steaming pile.

 

Even with the best writers, great art, and all of the bells and whistles Supes is just LAME. Horribly, terribly, lame. I read issues with Darkseid that were just pathetic, ones with Mongul that made me question the sanity of DC, and then there were the issues with lamo villains like Toyman.

 

Yeah. Good stuff.

 

And totally irrelevant to the suggestion I made.

 

The guy has EVERYTHING. He is god in yellow' date=' red, and blue. He is a walking, breathing, plot device that can do anything that is ever needed at any time and it is just pathetic. You guys choose to like him? Fine, but this thread is asking the opinion of who you think the lamest hero ever is and I truly believe it is Superman.[/quote']

 

Except that the Superman you describe there, the one that can push planets out of alignment and fly so fast he can go back in time HASNT EXISTED IN 20 YEARS. Superman has LIMITS to his powers now. Hes still the most powerful member of the Justice League, but he cant do "anything that is ever needed at any time".

 

Also, as was stated earlier in this thread (by me, even. And my favorite superhero is Batman), a great deal of what makes Superman a heroic character isnt his set of powers. Its his coices. His constant struggle to do whats right, and not whats convenient. To use his vast powers for the betterment of everyone, and not just himself.

 

You know, all of those moral choices that make him an admirable person, and not just some schmuck with powers like the way his analogue was written in "The Authority".

 

He was cool when I was 6 and got lame about the same time I started cheering when the ewok in Jedi got duffed.

 

So again, Superman. Lamest. Hero. Ever.

 

I saw Return of the Jedi a couple of years after I graduated high school. I remember a couple of people cheered then, too.

 

I thought they were tremendous jerks.

[The Weapon]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Macarena Man?

 

Heads I have my minions kill you, tales I give you rep...

 

 

Tales! Damn!

[input.jack]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Macarena Man!?!!

 

Thats the FORBIDDEN hero!

 

 

 

 

 

 

(Oops. My mistake. Lambada Man is the FORBIDDEN hero).

 

(Macarena Man just -should- be)

[Vestnik]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

 

There goes the Spectre, Mon-El, Supergirl, Power Girl, Dr Fate, Captain Marvel... The Flash should probably go too... Johnny Thunder...

 

Actually I don't like any of those characters, except when they're in the Legion of Super-Heroes. My LSH standards are quite a bit different from my normal standards. As in, the LSH are just not meant to be taken seriously.

[OddHat]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Actually I don't like any of those characters' date=' except when they're in the Legion of Super-Heroes. My LSH standards are quite a bit different from my normal standards. As in, the LSH are just not meant to be taken seriously.[/quote']

 

It's a genre built around men in tights who fight crime. Taking any of it too seriously is probably a bad call.

[Weldun]

Re: Worst. Hero. Ever.

 

Jubilee was a gymnast because she grew up in a mall. Hate isn't a strong enough word.

 

I have been told that this was retconned away. I sure as hell hope so.

Jubilee is probably my lingering adolenscence, but hey, at least with parkour (free running) these days, the acrobatics isn't as much of a stretch. But then, my hate for ret-cons would kick in. *sigh*