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It's possible that the full barrel recoil system was put in because a muzzle brake is less practical on a bullpup weapon.  .50BMG small arms must have practical military uses since they are employed by the military on a semi-regular basis.

 

@mega: Technically the Carl Gustav is a shoulder fired 84mm recoilless weapon whose rounds sometimes have a rocket booster.  RPGs also work on the same principle.

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It's possible that the full barrel recoil system was put in because a muzzle brake is less practical on a bullpup weapon.  .50BMG small arms must have practical military uses since they are employed by the military on a semi-regular basis.

It is highly improbable that the full barrel recoil system was put on the GM6 Lynx platform due to the impracticality of a muzzle brake on a bullpup weapon.  Why?  Because the GM6 Lynx platform in that video had a muzzle brake on it... and I sincerely doubt anyone put that recoil system on the platform due to a muzzle brake being a problem ... and then slapped a muzzle brake on it, anyway.  But hey, it's possible ... just not very probable.

 

.50BMG small arms absolutely have practical military uses ... but man-shoulderable, man-fireable .50 BMG's with goofy full barrel recoil systems to render them man-shoulderable and man-fireable probably don't.  i.e. The ones the military fields are all intended to be shot from a supported position, not a standing, shouldered/unsupported position.

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Is that an actual muzzle brake or just a flash hider?

 

Anyway from the Sero website:

 

 


Purpose of the rifle

 

Highly-efficient, special, multi-purpose weapon for land-, air-, territorial and independent armed forces. Its task is to destroy – with its shell, which delivers significantly (5-8 times) greater energy comparing with the ammunition of the conventionally used small arms – the enemy’s important pinpoint targets, armoured rifle troops, light shelters and buildings, radio- electronic constructions, missile launchers and hovering helicopters within a 600-800m shooting range.

 

In case of urban warfare/conflict it can be used for demolishing the enemy’s firing positions in buildings, weapons under cover and armoured rifle troops, which are manoeuvring on the streets. It is suitable both for squads and independent units. Due to its small arm categorisation, its weight and portability, make it an ideal heavy weapon for the parachute, airmobile and territorial troops. It is also a highly effective small arm in repelling terrorist action. As this type of action is common in the field today, we believe it would play a key role according to the new North-Atlantic strategy, considering its significant destructive force, combined with formidable accuracy. Important hostile targets can be neutralised safely within a 1500m range.

 

It is also a highly efficiency, bodyguard-weapon for protection of important target personnel, which can extend significantly the firing range of the safe-zone around the target person, as an attack by a light armoured combat vehicle can be repulsed – by quick fire – within 300m. It is also suitable to repulse the so-called, “self-propelled (suicide) bombs,” which are installed in vehicles, with even one shot to the power of the vehicle outside the effect of the (non-nuclear) bomb.

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Here's the MCX Rattler -- the latest from Sig Sauer which it's billing as 'the world's smallest rifle'.  Currently available chambered in .300 BLK, which it will readily cycle whether suppressed or unsuppressed.  There's a 5.56 NATO version coming, but I think they got their default chambering right the first time on this one. :)

 

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Ok, so this isn't actually a gun/firearm ... but the X15 flamethrower has a trigger, destroys things, is theoretically 48-state legal (note: I am not an attorney; consult your own for legal questions you have), and Internet orderable.  Recommended fuel mixture appears to be 90% diesel and 10% gasoline. It holds 3 gallons of fuel and uses a 20oz refillable/changeable CO2 tank to propel the fuel from the nozzle.  3 gallons will net the user about 1 minute of flamethrowing time ... slightly more if using their napalm mix (additive) -- which supposedly yields tighter and longer flame streams.

 

Price point is USD$1600-$1750.  Outfit your mooks today!

 

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It's visually impressive, and would certainly make a fun toy, but in terms of actually setting things on fire, it doesn't seem to perform very well. An old-fashioned Molotov cocktail would work better (although it might be hard to get it to break on leaf litter and twigs).

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Well, the person in the video appears to be less focused on igniting things and more focused on looking impressive while conserving fuel.  A longer burn in one place (using more fuel) is all that's necessary for improved ignition. 3-4 seconds is likely enough...

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At a MSRP of US$2,200 per unit for the 7.62 NATO version of the Desert Tech MDR, they are a VERY spendy option compared to the Kel-Tec RFB (which is quite a machine if you can get your hands on one).  The RFB also has an easy to reach (no tools or teardown required) adjustable gas valve -- which has led many an idiot (who didn't bother to tune it) to complain that the RFB won't cycle when, in fact, one can (and must) tune it to cycle for the specific ammo one is running (and/or for suppressor use).  If memory serves, the RFB has 10 tuning positions.  By comparison, IIRC the MDR has a 3-position adjustable gas valve -- and the handguard must be removed to adjust it.  This means you'll be soaking more recoil than you must on the MDR ... since you can't tune it quite as precisely as the RFB.  It also means if you switch up ammo in the MDR from something that cycles reliably to something underpowered that doesn't, you need to break out the tools and remove the handguard to make your adjustment.

 

So -- the MDR is pricier, less tunable, and less user friendly (when you need to tune it) -- than a RFB.  On the plus side, the trigger on the MDR is likely a bit more crisp than that of the RFB, even through they are within a half pound of one another.  However, it should be noted that the RFB trigger can be brought down to a nice 3-3.5lb trigger with a crisp break ... for about US$100.  Factor that into the pricing and the MDR is still miles (and years) behind the RFB.  I know people will poo-poo Kel-Tec because they are Kel-Tec, but the fact is, Kel-Tec has some very innovative and reliable rifles ... that are sadly marred by 1) prejudices based on Kel-Tec pistols and 2) availability problems caaused by very low production numbers.

 

All of that said, the MDR in 7.62 NATO looks like quite a gun.  Putting the RFB aside, I'd own a MDR unless I had both staring at me in the gun shop and only one could come home with me (in which case it'd be the RFB).

 

Surreal

 

P.S. Anyone else note lack of BUIS on the MDB (in addition to the ridiculous optic he was running)?  I suspect it arises from the same issue as other .308 bullpups -- lack of suitable rail space.  In general, you can't co-witness on most .308 bullpups due to rail space and eye relief being at odds with one another -- but you often CAN (barely) run low profile BUIS.  The top rail length on the MDB suggests that it -might- actually be able to allow for cowitness if a slightly smaller optic is used -- which would be a win over other .308 bullpups.  (K&N Aerospace used to offer a slightly longer top-rail for the RFB, but Ken stopped making them about 18 months ago as I understand it.  With his aftermarket top-rail on a RFB, one could barely fit BUIS on it with an optic ... and couldn't co-witness, at all.)

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At a MSRP of US$2,200 per unit for the 7.62 NATO version of the Desert Tech MDR, they are a VERY spendy option compared to the Kel-Tec RFB (which is quite a machine if you can get your hands on one). The RFB also has an easy to reach (no tools or teardown required) adjustable gas valve -- which has led many an idiot (who didn't bother to tune it) to complain that the RFB won't cycle when, in fact, one can (and must) tune it to cycle for the specific ammo one is running (and/or for suppressor use). If memory serves, the RFB has 10 tuning positions. By comparison, IIRC the MDR has a 3-position adjustable gas valve -- and the handguard must be removed to adjust it. This means you'll be soaking more recoil than you must on the MDR ... since you can't tune it quite as precisely as the RFB. It also means if you switch up ammo in the MDR from something that cycles reliably to something underpowered that doesn't, you need to break out the tools and remove the handguard to make your adjustment.

 

So -- the MDR is pricier, less tunable, and less user friendly (when you need to tune it) -- than a RFB. On the plus side, the trigger on the MDR is likely a bit more crisp than that of the RFB, even through they are within a half pound of one another. However, it should be noted that the RFB trigger can be brought down to a nice 3-3.5lb trigger with a crisp break ... for about US$100. Factor that into the pricing and the MDR is still miles (and years) behind the RFB. I know people will poo-poo Kel-Tec because they are Kel-Tec, but the fact is, Kel-Tec has some very innovative and reliable rifles ... that are sadly marred by 1) prejudices based on Kel-Tec pistols and 2) availability problems caaused by very low production numbers.

 

All of that said, the MDR in 7.62 NATO looks like quite a gun. Putting the RFB aside, I'd own a MDR unless I had both staring at me in the gun shop and only one could come home with me (in which case it'd be the RFB).

 

Surreal

 

P.S. Anyone else note lack of BUIS on the MDB (in addition to the ridiculous optic he was running)? I suspect it arises from the same issue as other .308 bullpups -- lack of suitable rail space. In general, you can't co-witness on most .308 bullpups due to rail space and eye relief being at odds with one another -- but you often CAN (barely) run low profile BUIS. The top rail length on the MDB suggests that it -might- actually be able to allow for cowitness if a slightly smaller optic is used -- which would be a win over other .308 bullpups. (K&N Aerospace used to offer a slightly longer top-rail for the RFB, but Ken stopped making them about 18 months ago as I understand it. With his aftermarket top-rail on a RFB, one could barely fit BUIS on it with an optic ... and couldn't co-witness, at all.)

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I hate trying to post for my phone it always glitches on me the RFB is not convertible to multiple calibers and although I actually like kel-tec,( my wife has a p3at that will make headshots of 50 ft and has never missed fired or failed to feed) I think that the MDR is a better overall solution but I could be wrong I'm obviously going to wait quite a while before I could ever think about buying anything right now.

The other day I was thinking about Wildcat for the 308 length actions that would use a short magnum case shortened and blown out to 50 caliber. Shorten it to the point where a variable is Glee efficient bullet like the Amax will fit in the magazine... I don't know whether it would have to be as short as the WSSM cases... but a 750 grain bullet at 1050 ft per second might be interesting. If time and money were free it would also be fun to make a 375 bore Wildcat using the same case I think one could approach the 375 H&H quite closely

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the RFB is not convertible to multiple calibers 

Sure it is -- put it down and pick up another gun of a different caliber!  Think about it: with the RFB coming in ~US$1000 less than the MSRP price of the Desert Tech ... you can actually buy another gun of a different caliber ... and have two different firearms. :)

 

Also, a reminder -- you dial your rifle's scope in at one caliber ... then change calibers ... and have to dial it in for the second caliber.  This is a solid use case for simply having two different rifles ... of two different calibers ... each of which is dialed in -- and just grabbing and going.  (This, by the way, is my personal preference and approach, as well.)

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I believe it's actual modern life where weapon selection while at headquarters, base camp, or at home before a reasonably brief mission is pretty normal -- regardless of whether that mission is a military operation outside of the Green Zone, a SWAT engagement to deal with an active shooter, or a day/weekend's hunt in the wild.  i.e. It's unlikely someone is encumbered by multiple rifles ... just as it's unlikely someone's humping multiple ammunition types meant to be fired through multiple barrels for a single rifle with multi-caliber barrel options for its platform.  (Most likely additional rifles, ammo, and barrels are handled from a logistical supply angle ... i.e. moved by truck or other non-human locomotion ... and swapped/restocked/changed between missions.  Exceptions for edge cases, of course, apply, but I believe this is the norm/rule in most scenarios.)

 

i.e. A 1984 'Red Dawn' scenario would be an outlier/exception ... not the norm, today.  (And even those kids had a sporting good shop as a supply depot, trucks, and a base camp from which they operated...allowing for weapon changes and resupply.)

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Sweet looking gun.... chamber it in 7x43mm and then we can talk seriously.

Well, they seem to offer several options. And if they mean to get millitary customs then I hear that 6.5 is likely to be the next Calliber of choice. :yes:

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Sweet looking gun.... chamber it in 7x43mm and then we can talk seriously.

 

 

Well, they seem to offer several options. And if they mean to get millitary customs then I hear that 6.5 is likely to be the next Calliber of choice. :yes:

.280 British would be great, 6.5 Creedmoor would also I believe the .250 savage or .250 savage improved would be superb.   Both are effectively obsolete mostly because the original guns for the .250 had too slow a rifling twist to reliably stabilize bullets longer than a 100 gr spitzer cup and core bullet.  That and everyone is obsessed with velocity.   a 110 gr spitzer boattail at 2860 would generage about 2000 ft-lbs of energy, which many have long argued is the maximum cutoff for a controllable automatic rifle in a normal weight range.  

 

The new M80a1 load with the 130 gr bullet at iirc 3000fps is said to be very effective.     I wish I had the money to try developing a modern derivative of the Voss copper tubed aluminum bullets.  A steel core inside an aluminum body with a copper jacket for bore contact and weight distribution...   I figure instead of 106-113 grains, about 130 grains, but with a significantly higher BC than a traditional bullet of that weight...

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.280 British would be great, 6.5 Creedmoor would also I believe the .250 savage or .250 savage improved would be superb.   Both are effectively obsolete mostly because the original guns for the .250 had too slow a rifling twist to reliably stabilize bullets longer than a 100 gr spitzer cup and core bullet.  That and everyone is obsessed with velocity.   a 110 gr spitzer boattail at 2860 would generage about 2000 ft-lbs of energy, which many have long argued is the maximum cutoff for a controllable automatic rifle in a normal weight range.  

 

The new M80a1 load with the 130 gr bullet at iirc 3000fps is said to be very effective.     I wish I had the money to try developing a modern derivative of the Voss copper tubed aluminum bullets.  A steel core inside an aluminum body with a copper jacket for bore contact and weight distribution...   I figure instead of 106-113 grains, about 130 grains, but with a significantly higher BC than a traditional bullet of that weight...

Kickstarter?

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Sounds like a fun project. I expect there is a Lot of literature on forging and other industrial techniques, Heck personally I expect Maker Box tech to become the "go to " home loading solution in the next decade.

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