Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

[mkultra]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Here's what I want. I want Susano to release the companion book to Kazai 5. I want that book to include all the Mecha goodness that has been discussed in this thread. This would make me happy.

[RexMundi]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I just want, the good old indestructible binding and coarse paper in one book set of rules like 5th ed was. Glossy Paper and Piles of random art *shrug*? Paper I can use a Highlighter on and attach tabs too, and one book to flip through. I'd buy it.

 

Companion Book for Kazei 5 would be nice. A collected Mecha Book would be worth paging through and a possible buy as well.

 

~Rex

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

So what kind of adjustments need to be made to the base HERO combat/task resolution system to simulate mecha action more accurately? There are certainly some minor adjustments that could be made that would make it more streamlined or that would help gm's simulate the hyperactive dogfights and battles seen in anime like Macross Frontier, Neon Genesis Evangelion and Zone of Enders.

 

I have some adjustments in mind but I would also like to hear from others on this subject. I will be posting much more on this subject in the following weeks as I am currently finishing up law enforcement training but will then be on vacation for two weeks (an at home vaca) so I will have plenty of time to post once my kids have gone to bed.

 

Let's just say I'm working on a way to smoothly integrate turn-by-turn doghfighting system in with phased turns and a way to seemlessly swith between them during mecha combats. This will help simulate anime like macross where mecha can go from dogfighting each other vy transforming into warrior mode and instanly entering hand to hand combat, then break from that going back to dogfighting. I hope to playtest it soon (not sure when though). In the meantime I want to hear your ideas!

[Michael Hopcroft]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

You want to find a way to have higher-SPD characters keep the advantage, to reward players of hotdog pilots to buy it up. SPD can represent reaction time quite nicely. A SPD 4 pilot will get off four shots or maneuvers in the time it takes a SPD 3 pilot to get off three. And a SPD 2 pilot would be so slow that he's an active liability in the cockpit. You want to encourage your players to pur some points into SPD.

 

You have to build into the system the ability for mecha to accommodate the SPD of their pilots. If the player decides to go for broke and put 30 points into SPD to give him a SPD 5, he'd want to be able to act at SPD 5 -- which he might not be able to do if the mecha itself can only handle SPD 3 or 4 at most. But many mecha designs are quite literally extensions of their pilots -- complete with thought or even psionic control systems, or controls which mimic the motions of the pilot and apply them to the mecha's actions (you throw a punch, the mecha throws exactly that punch), so applying a SPD limit would be pointless.

 

In the source material, transforms from one form to another generally take two forms. The first is as an action that takes place completely before a combat turn and takes an entire turn to complete during which you can do nothing else. This is things like turning five large robots into one enormous one, which must be carefully choreographed and practiced to work precisely. IF you're going to do this in the middle of a battle you'd better be darn sure that nobody's shooting directly at you in the interim or that your defenses are really good.

 

The other is the Macross effect of a single vehicle that has many forms. Macross's Veritech fighters had three forms -- jet/space fighter, human-like robot for hand-to-hand combat, and an intermediate mode known as Guardian Mode. It takes effectively a single phase to switch between those forms and you can do it with a simple set of controls on the cockpit. It is simple enough for an experienced pilot that they can do it in the middle of a battle, when people are shooting at them, with no penalty. The pilot, of course, would need to be trained in controlling and fighting in all three modes, knowing which works best in which situation, and so on.

 

Likewise, a Transformer -- which has no pilot to concern itself with -- can go from one mode to the other as a single-phase action, but still takes a little bit longer to combine multiple smaller Transformers into one large one. It still takes a short time -- a turn at most -- but the combining requires more precision and requires that all the component mecha be relatively intact. IF the mecha that forms the right arm just got disintegrated, you can't combine without ending up at best missing an arm. You probably can't combine at all.

[gojira]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

And a few sample mecha and settings

 

 

Personally, and without having read the thread, primarily this. Mostly, I think I'd like a decently developed setting that I can just grab and go. If there's other mini-settings, great, but mostly I just want at least one good mecha setting.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

In the original Macross, trransformations were exceedingly efficient. It would only be a half-phase action to transform from fighter or battroid mode to Gerwalk mode (gaurdian mode in Robotech. In Macross, GERWALK stands for Ground Effects With Locamotive Knee joint) or from Gerwalk to fighter or battroid. To transform from fighter all the way to battroid and vice versa would be a full phase action, though I would allow a pilot to make a control roll at -3 to turn it into a half-phase action. It is not umcommon for VF pilots to perform evasive maneuvers or fire off missiles while in the middle of a transformation (see the Max Genius vs Miria Quadrano battle in Macross: Do You Remember Love)

In later Macross series such as Macross Plus and Macross Frontier, the technology has progressed to the point to where a transformation to any mode is only a 1/2 phase action and an argument could be made for it being 0 phase. Variable Fighters are VERY agile and it is the action in these later Macross series (as well as a few other anime) that is my primary motivation for re-working the dogfighting system (not really re-working, mostly just expanding and integration into the standard combat turn)

 

As far as combining mecha are concerned, a full phase to complete the combination is reasonable, but I have seen some anime that show incredibly fast combinations that could be a half phase action. I have also seen de-combination sequences that would be considered zero phase!

[Kaeto]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I wonder how you would do the mechs from Super Beastial Machine God Dancouga.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Personally' date=' and without having read the thread, primarily this. Mostly, I think I'd like a decently developed setting that I can just grab and go. If there's other mini-settings, great, but mostly I just want at least one good mecha setting.[/quote']

 

Absolutely. I think a strong case could be made for setting an official Hero Mecha campaign setting somewhere within the Terran Empire. It could support mecha from the human sized battlesuits all the way to super mecha used to battle ridiculously powerful interdimensional horrors. Frankly it wouldn't require all that much effort to make it work.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I wonder how you would do the mechs from Super Beastial Machine God Dancouga.

 

Dancouga is on my list of classics to download. From what little I've seen, it looks like it could prove to be the best of the mid 80's super robot shows. If it is as good as Go-Lion I'll be happy.

 

Hopefully sometime I'll know enough about it to write it up. Super mecha hold a special place in my heart and I'm always thinking about how to simulate them.

[Kaeto]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I have it complete and subbed. Would you like me to send it to you? I also have all 75 episodes of Fang of the sun Dougram. I'll gin up a list of what I have and you can let me know what you would like out of that list.

 

In Dancouga each mech has three forms , Vehicle, Beast, and Humanoid. Then they combine to form the Machine God Dancouga

[Michael Hopcroft]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

In the original Macross, trransformations were exceedingly efficient. It would only be a half-phase action to transform from fighter or battroid mode to Gerwalk mode (gaurdian mode in Robotech. In Macross, GERWALK stands for Ground Effects With Locamotive Knee joint) or from Gerwalk to fighter or battroid. To transform from fighter all the way to battroid and vice versa would be a full phase action, though I would allow a pilot to make a control roll at -3 to turn it into a half-phase action. It is not umcommon for VF pilots to perform evasive maneuvers or fire off missiles while in the middle of a transformation (see the Max Genius vs Miria Quadrano battle in Macross: Do You Remember Love)

In later Macross series such as Macross Plus and Macross Frontier, the technology has progressed to the point to where a transformation to any mode is only a 1/2 phase action and an argument could be made for it being 0 phase. Variable Fighters are VERY agile and it is the action in these later Macross series (as well as a few other anime) that is my primary motivation for re-working the dogfighting system (not really re-working, mostly just expanding and integration into the standard combat turn)

 

As far as combining mecha are concerned, a full phase to complete the combination is reasonable, but I have seen some anime that show incredibly fast combinations that could be a half phase action. I have also seen de-combination sequences that would be considered zero phase!

 

Our perception is colored somewhat by these transformations or combinations never being interrupted in the source material. People always notice the super-robot assembling, but nobody bothers to try and stop it. You would think that while in the act of combining the components of the supermecha would be at their most vulnerable (because you have to put all your effort into combining, not fighting). It's not like the archetypical magical girl transformation, which goes through thirty seconds of stock footage but takes zero real time in the adventure (just say the words and you're the heroine form).

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Our perception is colored somewhat by these transformations or combinations never being interrupted in the source material. People always notice the super-robot assembling' date=' but nobody bothers to try and stop it. You would think that while in the act of combining the components of the supermecha would be at their most vulnerable (because you have to put all your effort into combining, not fighting). It's not like the archetypical magical girl transformation, which goes through thirty seconds of stock footage but takes zero real time in the adventure (just say the words and you're the heroine form).[/quote']

 

Many of these mecha generate energy fields to protect them while they are in the midst of combining. I know for sure that Gravion does this (you can see the energy field around them as they combine). Also there are anime where I have seen mech de-combine to dodge an attack aimed for the center of their mass only to have the mecha re-combine and attack and the amount of time this took to animate was only a few seconds...such a maneuver could be implemented in single phase depending on the speed scores involved. Let's not forget that like american superheroes, Japanese super robots don't exactly conform to the laws of physics.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Here is some inspiration for prospective Mecha Hero Gm's and for fans of Macross. Can you spot the Easter Eggs? List them for me if you can!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnOws0VLg6k

 

This anime is the primary inspiration for my re-working of the dogfighting rules in Hero. Hopefully I will be able to post them soon, but for now, I have some other stuff I've worked on in my next post...

[Kaeto]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I love the transforming Monster from Frontier

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Size Mod:

On the vehicle size chart, the column that says “DCV” changes to “Size Mod”. This is because the size of the mecha will affect much more than just the potential DCV of the vehicle itself. As Size Mod, it is used to adjust the range penalty to “detect” the vehicle at range. This affects nearly all sensory groups including sight, hearing, radar, sonar, vibration/geo sensors, Thermographic, Magnetic, Gravitic etc.

In addition to this, the Size Mod affects the Range Modifier to hit the vehicle with a ranged attack. For playability purposes in the Mecha genre of Roleplaying, it DOES NOT AFFECT THE ACTUAL DCV OF THE MECHA. Whether or not a vehicle is easy to hit will be determined by its Dexterity (which determines base Combat Value) and other modifiers to its DCV such as speed, maneuverability, combat maneuvering and pilot’s skill.

However, when Mecha engage in hand-to-hand/melee combat, smaller Mecha gain a DCV advantage against larger one’s. Find the difference in the Size-mod of the Mecha and the unit with the smaller Size-mod will gain a bonus to it’s DCV equal to the difference between their respective Size modifiers. Thus, significantly larger units will have a hard time hitting very small units (such as Powered Armor or Landmates) in melee combat. They are better off using ranged weaponry or smaller scale attack methods.

The Size-Mod also affects the Turn Mode of a Mecha/vehicle. The Size-Mod of the Mecha should be added to it’s full movement amount before dividing by 5 to obtain the Turn Mode. This is to simulate the fact that larger and heavier vehicles cannot turn as sharply as smaller and lighter ones. Vehicles with a smaller Turn Mode will have an advantage in Dogfights.

 

MANUEVERABILITY:

All Mecha (vehicles) should have a “characteristic” known as Maneuverability. A Mecha’s maneuverability consists of the sum total of it’s available (inherent) Movement Skill Levels in that particular Mode of movement. For example, the YF-21 Variable Fighter gains +2MSL’s for having morphing air-frame technology, another +2 MSL’s for mounting 3-dimensional thrust vectoring, +1 MSL for incorporating a modified version of the Inertial Drive System adapted from the Quendalen Rau Zentraedi mecha, and yet another +2 MSL’s from the Brain Direct System when the pilot is Mind Linked to the YF-21 through its electro-encephalo helmet. This gives it a total of +7 Movement Skill Levels to bring to bear to affect it’s maneuverability in one way or another. (this is an extreme case, yes, but this IS the YF-21 we are talking about here!). What does this do for a Mecha? The pilot can use these in any way that Movement Skill Levels are allowed to be used. This means they can be used to add to the pilots Control Rolls for performing maneuvers, they can be used to reduce the Turn Mode of the vehicle (as much as -7”!), add to the pilots roll to land the mecha and add to DCV when performing evasive maneuvers in a dogfight. (note that they can add to the pilot’s Control Rolls for the purposes of dogfighting as well. The vehicle with the higher “maneuverability” will have the advantage…AS IT SHOULD!). Please note that in The Ultimate Vehicle it mentions that vehicles should not be able to use their Movement Skill Levels to affect acceleration or deceleration, but in the case of Mecha the GM should consider allowing this. Also note that like other Skill Levels, Movement Skill Levels can be shifted around from phase to phase and split up. Thus the YF-21 above could use 3 of it’s MSL’s to reduce its Turn mode by 3”, use 2 of its MSL’s to add to the pilot’s Control Roll during a dogfight and save the other +2 to add to it’s DCV while maneuvering. The typical Mecha probably has +1 to +2 Maneuverability for ground movement and +2 to +3 for flight (if it can fly). Only highly maneuverable mecha (such as the ridiculous YF-21 detailed above) posses much more than this amount. Also note that Pilots can also posses their own personal MSL’s that they can use with Mecha in general or with a specific model of Mecha or mode of movement. (for example, Hikaru Ichijo of Macross fame probably only has +1 or so MSL’s that he can apply for ground movement, but has at least +3 MSL’s that he can apply for flight) and these are FULLY CUMULATIVE WITH THE MANEUVERABILITY OF A MECHA UNIT. Utilizing this methodology, an Ace Mecha pilot with at least +5 Movement Skill Levels when coupled with a top-of-the-line Mecha unit with a high Maneuverability will absolutely fly circles around less maneuverable units with less experienced pilots. This is exactly how things stand in most mecha anime.

 

Advantages:

Most Mecha should have the Advantages No Turn Mode (+1/4) and possibly Sideways Maneuverability (+1/4) as well. This adds (+1/2) to the cost of Mecha Ground movment. For flight movement, one must consider that most Mecha (especially humanoid configured mecha) use V-TOL flight capability so while they still have a Turn Mode, they should at least take Sideways Maneuverability (+1/4) and some mecha should take Full Reverse (+1/4) and Sideways Maneuverability (+1/2). Vehicles that can move sideways without having to change facing will gain a bonus to Control Rolls when engaging in Dogfighting. The same goes for vehicles with the Full Reverse advantage. The same goes for Mecha that hover (not true flight) above a surface using low thrusters or a Ground Effect. They should at least take Sideways Maneuverability at the (+1/4) level but many will have it at the (+1/2) level of effect.

Mecha with Sideways Maneuverability and the ability to fly in reverse are incredibly agile vehicles and are capable of performing maneuvers that prove impossible for other vehicles. Such a vehicle could change its direction of travel without changing it’s facing, which makes it possible for such vehicles to target enemies to their flank and even to their rear. A successful Control Roll by a mecha pilot in such a unit could completely turn the mecha around to engage opponents to the rear with no penalty while flying in the same heading at full reverse! (note that not only Mecha are capable of such maneuvers. Helicopters and Hovercraft with the same advantages can perform similar maneuvers) This is why vehicles with the aforementioned advantages will gain special bonuses in dogfighting when engaged with units without those same advantages.

 

Types of Propulsion:

Legs:

Pretty much all mecha have this type of propulsion system. It’s part of what defines them as Mecha. Legged movement has No Turn Mode (+1/4) and probably Sideways Maneuverability (+1/4) as well. Typical speeds of legged mecha can vary greatly, but in general giving them the movement bonus from page 105 of The Ultimate Vehicle is a good place to start. As for Non-combat movement, in general a two-legged, humanoid type mecha should have the standard X2 noncombat multiplier…two legged movement generally isn’t all that fast. 4 legged mecha on the other hand should increase the non-combat multiplier to X4 where applicable and also include an enhancement to combat movement as well.

Even though The Ultimate Vehicle states that no vehicle starts with any leaping derived from their STR scores, because they have legs, Mecha should defy this ruling. GM’s who desire leaping mecha should give all Mecha leaping distance based upon their STR characteristic for free. Those GM’s who want to it more difficult for heavier mecha to jump should reduces this amount by the Mecha’s Size-Mod. For example: The VF-11 is a Size 8 mecha with a STR of 50. Ordinarily this would give it 10” of leaping for “free”, but the GM decides to use the Size-Mod to reduce leaping distances. With a Size-Mod of -5, this drops the “Free” leaping from 10” to 5” (10 meters. Not bad). Non-combat multiplier is unchanged (X2 to start. Double NCBT multiplier for every +5 points) The pilot of a Leaping Mecha must make a successful Combat Piloting roll to land in the desired hex (and remain standing). For every point the roll was failed by, the target hex was missed (usually shorted) by 1”. Missing the Control Roll by more than 4pts means the Mecha falls over upon landing and the pilot must make another Control Roll on his next available phase to stand the mecha on its feet (costs ½ phase).

 

Flight:

Most mecha with flight systems operate as Vertical Take Off and Landing type vehicles, capable of taking off and landing with zero runway, needing only as much space as they take to stand upon. VTOL craft while oftentimes not nearly as fast as winged aircraft that operating with a lifting body shape, are oftentimes incredibly maneuverable due to their ability to fly in any direction (forward, reverse or sideways), turn on a dime and perform maneuvers impossible for winged aircraft.

Because true VTOL craft that do not use wings and a lifting body shape must use a majority of their Motive Thrust to defeat gravity, they are limited in speed compared to winged craft that only require forward momentum to allow their lifting body shape to enable them to remain aloft. Non-aerodynamic mecha (those without wings or lift) limit their non-combat multipliers to X4. Mecha that mount wings or a lifting body shape to generate lift can increase that non-combat multiplier to X8 (they however cannot match with aerodynamic fighter planes which can have non-combat multipliers of X16 or even X32! This is the reason why many “Air Superiority Mecha” transform into a sleek fighter configuration…the increase in speed can be absolutely invaluable)

Of course, such “rules” only apply to those mecha that attempt to adhere to the laws of physics to some degree, no matter how slight. More advanced or fantastic mecha can ignore these limitations altogether. Supermecha routinely do so, being able to travel at supersonic speeds even though their design aesthetics are oftentimes the very antithesis of aerodynamic.

Mecha capable of VTOL Flight take the Flight power with the Sideways Maneuverability (+1/4) advantage. As mentioned earlier, many take Full Reverse (+1/4) and Sideways Maneuverability (+1/2) to implement supreme maneuverability.

Most mecha fly via Jets or Thrusters. Thrusters are necessary if the mecha is to be used in space as well as an atmosphere. See The Ultimate Vehicle page 72 for types of Jet engines and page 88 for various types of rocket thrusters.

Some more advanced mecha fly via anti-gravity or some other Reactionless drive system (the Quendalen Rau of Macross fame has this type of drive to augment its fusion thrusters) which tend to make for incredibly agile flight. Such a vehicle should gain at least a +2 Maneuverability bonus for having such a drive. These drives don’t use fuel as jets and thrusters do, they utilize power from the mecha’s power plant and thus will cost End. An especially efficient Reactionless drive can be bought as 0 End to represent the ability to flit about effortlessly.

Some mecha use a combination of jets or thrusters AND a reactionless drive system. Such mecha are supremely maneuverable, able to use their reactionless drives to perform impossible maneuvers and to provide lift to free up their jet engines or thrusters to efficiently put all of their motive thrust into forward momentum. This makes for mecha capable of incredibly high speeds. (see Macross Plus)

Other, more exotic forms of propulsion are possible for mecha including propellers and rotors, ornithopter wings and magic.

 

Ground Movement:

A Mecha’s main mode of movement is it’s legs, which is of course a form of ground propulsion. However some mecha utilize additional forms of ground movement for various reasons…mostly enhanced speed and mobility in certain types of terrain.

 

Ground Effects: Many mecha have Ground Effects type propulsion built into the bottoms of their feet. This allows the mecha to activate a hovering effect that allows the mecha to “skate” on a cushion of air around a battlefield. This makes a land-bound mecha far more mobile with an enhanced speed. Also, the hovercraft effect allows the mecha to travel over water, sand, snow and other types of terrain that might prove hazardous for a legged vehicle to traverse. Ground Effects are bought as Flight, only within 4” of a surface (-1) and for a typical system, a humanoid mecha would be limited to a Non-combat multiplier of X4. They must adhere to Turn Mode rules, but have the Sideways Maneuverability (+1/4) advantage. Gravitic Hover capability can exist in ultra-tech mecha as well. Build them like Ground Effects systems, but with the capability of going even faster (up to X8, but this should be rare) and also include Sideways Maneuverability at the (+1/2) level and Full Reverse (+1/4) advantages to round things out. Mecha with Flight thrusters can use such systems as a Ground Effect as well. This doesn’t change their cost or anything, but certain Flight systems not built with this effect in mind (such as certain Mobile Suits etc) the pilot will have to make Combat Piloting rolls at -2 (or more) in order to remain upright. A failure means a crash and tumble and potential damage to the mecha. Whether or not a mecha should be able to use it’s flight system as a Ground Effect depends on the campaign and the GM’s whim. Variable Fighters from Macross are most assuredly meant to be used in this way. Early designed Mobile Suits are not (they use their Flight Systems to enhance their leaping ability in a gravity well, but not really as Ground Effects).

 

Zip Rollers: Some mecha mount tracks or wheels on the bottom of their feet sections and can use these to enhance their ground speed on even or paved terrain. Most of these systems are motorized and they “zip” the mecha along the ground a faster speeds than it can normally run. (X4 non combat movement) Those mecha with motorized Zip Rollers will have a second Ground movement rate. However there can be mecha that mount non-motorized wheels on the bottoms of their feet sections. These mecha use their wheels to “skate”. What these do is increase the non-combat movement of their Walking movement rates from X2 to X4. It may also be possible to give the mecha a small bonus to combat movement (up to +10” maybe) when using this form of movement. Whether or not the zip rollers are motorized, a mecha using such a system to move loses the No Turn Mode advantage of using it’s legs to walk.

 

Water propulsion:

It’s pretty rare for Mecha to have water-based propulsion systems, but it’s not unheard of; the Hygog and Zugog of Mobile Suit Gundam are both underwater capable mecha that have propulsion systems designed for use under water. See The Ultimate Vehicle for more information on water born propulsion systems.

Miscellaneous:

This category covers all the other types of movement that aren’t “standard” like Teleportation, tunneling and Extra Dimensional Movement.

Teleportation: Of the unusual movement types, Teleportation is the most common. It can represent a mecha that can perform a classic Teleportation maneuver, a mecha that can easily traverse dimensions or a mecha that moves so fast that it disappears from one area only to suddenly appear in another. Teleportation is normally a feature seen only on Supermecha, or highly advanced mecha and oftentimes only on the most advanced and specialized of units. Very rarely is it standard equipment inside the average mecha, one exception being Mamorou Nagano’s The Five Star Stories.

Faster-Than-Light-Travel: FTL travel is another form of specialized movement that can be found on mecha, though it rarely is. Some Supermecha have this capability. Smaller combat mecha most likely won’t have this ability without benefit of some sort of external attachment like the external Space Fold Generators seen in Macross Plus and Frontier, or the LUNA Space Booster of The Five Star Stories. Since most mecha aren’t big enough or can generate the necessary energy, they are most often assigned to a carrier ship that will taxi them about if the campaign takes place at interstellar distances.

An External FTL booster is built as normal but takes the Obvious, Inaccessible (-1/2) and Bulky (-1/2) Limitations (the FTL boosters are often quite large and encumbering to mecha, requiring them to jettison the booster to regain it’s full combat effectiveness) FTL speeds/times will be dependent upon the campaign’s guidelines.

 

 

Next up: Combat and Adventuring rules expansion for Mecha. And possibly Mecha Dogfighting rules! (give me a few days at least)

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I love the transforming Monster from Frontier

 

Seeing the Variable Monster in action is one of the coolest things ever. A bit of trivia: The Variable Konig Monster was designed for the Playstation Videogame Macross: VFX-2. Kawamori liked it so much, he made it an official part of the Macross Universe.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

More mecha goodness, this time from the Gundam Universe, Gundam Unicorn. An example of what happens when you piss off a pilot who is psychically linked to his mecha. (hint: this is not a good idea)

 

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Mecha Action and Maneuvering

 

The Ultimate Vehicle goes into great detail about vehicle maneuvering and action, but it is strangely silent on the quite obvious special considerations one must take into account when dealing with Mecha. For the most part, Mecha maneuver as most other vehicles do, the main difference being the lack of Turn Mode when using their legs for motion. However Mecha can do things no other vehicle type can do, which forces us to consider their unique capabilities when it comes to maneuvering around obstacles during action scenes.

 

Control Rolls:

The rules concerning Control Rolls on page 169 of The Ultimate Vehicle apply as they are written. Use the bonuses and penalties listed on the Control Rolls Modifier Table on page 170. However there are some additions when it comes to controlling Mecha.

First, Mecha with multiple modes of movement may require multiple skills to control properly. A Mecha with both ground movement and flight capability requires both Combat Driving (for ground control) and Combat Piloting (for flight control). The Transport Familiarity with Mecha only covers the ability to drive it on the ground. In order to operate a flight capable Mecha the pilot needs a Transport Familiarity with VTOL craft (or a single Transport Familiarity for that specific model of Mecha).

When operating a Mecha on the ground, a failed combat piloting roll means the mecha stumbles and travels in a direction the operator didn’t intend. Roll 1D6 and utilize the scattering rules in the 5th Edition rulesbook. If the Control Roll is failed by more than 4 points, then the mecha falls to the ground and the pilot must now make a Control Roll to stand it back on its feet, losing a full phase in the process. If the Control Roll to stand up was a critical success, then it only takes ½ phase for the Mecha to regain its feet. If the pilot of the Mecha possesses the Acrobatics skill, then he can use that to stand the mecha up as a zero phase action during his next phase.

While a Mecha is travelling it is subject to the same kinds of penalties as other ground vehicles for weather and terrain. However Mecha have a much easier time dodging around (and over) obstacles than other types of ground vehicles. Because Mecha ground movement has No Turn Mode, they can easily side step obstacles without having to change facing or slow down. In these cases a simple Control Roll will take the mecha safely around the obstacle. If the obstacle is too big to easily sidestep, then the driver can simply hop over the obstacle. If the height of the obstacle is no greater than half the height of the mecha, a simple Control Roll will allow the mecha to vault over the obstacle without slowing. Although this involves hopping, it is not considered to be Leaping and is not dependant on the Leaping ability of the mecha.

If the mecha encounters an obstacle to big to dodge around and too tall to simply vault over, then the mecha must use its leaping ability if the pilot wishes to continue forward.

 

Leaping: Like with characters, mecha can leap, sometime they can leap great distances. When the pilot of a mecha wants to make his vehicle leap, he must make a Control Roll, adding the bonus or penalty based on weather and terrain. If the Control Roll is successful, the Mecha lands where the pilot intended. If it is failed, the target “hex” is missed by 1 for every point the Control Roll was missed by. Roll 1D6 and check the scatter diagram to see where the Mecha actually landed. If the Control Roll was missed by 4 or more points, the mecha falls over upon landing.

Like characters, when mecha use their non-combat Leaping, it takes a number of Phases to complete the leap as there are doublings of the ncbt multiplier. In the middle of this multi-phase leap, the pilot of the mecha can still use his phases to initiate attacks, activate sensors and equipment etc. He cannot however implement movement other than continuing the leap unless he activates some kind of Flight system, at which point the Leap turns into Flight movement from that point forward.

 

Falling: The opportunities for mecha to suffer from long falls can actually come up quite frequently, especially when the mecha can fly under their own power. However unlike most other types of vehicles, mecha have some small chance of saving themselves in such a situation. A mecha can easily survive falling a distance equal to or less than their inches/meters of Leaping with no damage whatsoever. When a mecha falls further than this distance, the pilot may make a Combat Piloting or Driving roll in order to reduce the damage to 50%. This is treated exactly as Breakfall skill and the skill roll is made at -1 per 1”/2m the mecha falls. When a mecha (or any other vehicle or massive object) falls, it takes a number of dice of normal damage equal to the distance it fell in inches (meters/2) plus an additional number of dice equal to its Size Class. Both the mecha/vehicle plus whatever it falls upon takes this damage. Such an impact can be devastating for the passengers in the mecha, as they will take impact damage from this as well (half the number of dice the mecha took). Restraints and other safety equipment will reduce this damage according to their write-ups.

 

Re-entry: In some genres, mecha may have to dive from orbit to planetside, and in these cases rules regarding re-entry are necessary. Unfortunately, I don’t know all that much about it, and the information that my research has uncovered is so technical that I cannot make heads nor tails of it. However I shall do my best to hammer out some workable guidelines to make such a situation playable.

A mecha that begins re-entry may possibly take damage to its body and in some cases to its internal systems. If a mecha is “sealed” against environmental threats and possesses heat resistance (Life Support: immune to heat) then the mecha will take no damage. If the mecha is not heat resistant, then the mecha will take damage based on its decent velocity through the atmosphere. For example, if a mecha is free-falling and reaches terminal velocity (25” per segment or 50 meters per segment) then the vehicle will take 12 1/2D6 normal damage from the heat build up. If the mecha possesses enough armor/defense to weather this damage, it should be fine. If not, it will take damage every segment. This damage is considered Penetrating and this damage will affect the pilot and any other passenger not protected by a spacesuit or other protective gear.

During the descent, the pilot must make Combat Piloting Control Rolls in order to keep the mecha stable during the descent. If the roll fails, then the mecha will begin to fall out of control and the damage taken is increased by +1D6 for every point the Control Roll was failed by.

Once the mecha has descended through the upper atmosphere the pilot must either activate its flight system or deploy a parachute or some other manner of controlling its fall toward the ground or risk taking damage.

A mecha that crashes into the ground takes falling damage based on its velocity plus an additional amount of dice of damage equal to its Size Class. For example, a group of Star Marines are invading the planet which is the headquarters of a rebel faction. They drop Spartan mecha from orbit. While this particular version of the Spartan does not fly, each unit is equipped with a Grav-chute to slow the mecha down during planetfall. However Unit Alpha7’s Grav-chute fails and the hapless mecha plummets at terminal velocity to slam into the planet’s surface at 50 meters per second. The mecha takes 25D6N damage from the fall plus The Spartan is a Size Class 8 mecha, so it takes another 8D6N damage for a total of 33D6N damage! OUCH! The first casualty of many…

 

Flying:

Many mecha can fly, so we need to make sure we cover this subject thoroughly. In general, mecha fly much like other VTOL vehicles do. Unless they are built to have a Stall Speed (which means they fly by means of wings or lift via air pressure) they can hover at 0” or fly at any speeds up to their listed maximums. They accelerate as other flying vehicles do: 5” per hex moved through and a maximum velocity equal to their Combat Movement, per phase up to a maximum velocity of Combat move times Non-combat multiplier. Note that the mecha’s Combat Move equals the mechas acceleration/thrust power. Non-combat movement equals the speed maximum based on atmospheric pressure and aerodynamic streamlining (most mecha being considered either non-streamlined or moderately streamlined, thus the typical non-combat limit of X4)

Flying mecha must adhere to Turn Mode rules. Current velocity divided by 5 equals the number of “hexes” (or if you double that number, the number of meters) it must travel before it can make a turn by a single hex side. A mecha can make 5 of these “turns” per phase (if it performs a full move). This is not a hard or fast number, it can be modified to make a mecha (or other vehicle) more maneuverable. A mecha pilot can use his own Movement Skill Levels with the Mecha or the Mechas own Movement Skill Levels (aka Manueverability) to adjust the Turn Mode by -1”/-2m per +1 Skill Level used. A vehicle’s Turn Mode cannot be reduced below 1” using this method and as a GM’s option, it cannot reduce it below half of its Turn Mode based on its current velocity (if you want to hold to at least some semblance of real physics in your game). In addition to this, a mecha pilot may rely on his combat piloting skills to turn a fast moving mecha in a tight arc. This requires a Combat Piloting roll at -1 per -1”. Don’t forget to include the penalty for current Velocity to the Combat Piloting roll as well. This can be combined with Movement Skill Levels if the pilot desires. Example: Alto is flying in his Armored VF-25 and facing off against three Vajra soldier drones. The drones fall in behind Alto and begin chasing him while attempting to fire plasma blasts up his thrusters. Alto, deciding he’s not quite ready to die yet, leads the drones into a debris field which was created by the destruction of a U.N. Spacey battleship. Alto’s VF-25 is currently moving at a rate of 8320” per turn or 2080” per phase at Alto’s speed of 4 which gives it a Turn Mode of 416”. In order to keep up, the Vajra drones match this speed, so their Turn Mode is the same as Alto’s. Diving into the debris field, Alto decides to head for the carved up husk of the battleship. As the mecha approach the massive husk, Alto performs a sharp turn when he is only 406” away from the main body of the destroyed vessel. Utilizing all +5 of the VF-25’s Movement Skill Levels to remove 5” from his Turn Mode, he now has to make a Combat Piloting roll at -5” to safely make the last 5”. He makes a Combat Piloting skill roll (normally 13 or less, but with his Mecha Piloting Movement Skill Levels of +3 he has a 16 or less) and rolls a 10, making it by 1 point. Alto’s VF-25 makes the sharp turn and rockets along the surface of the dead vessel. The Vajra drones must now mimic Alto’s maneuver or risk crashing into the hull of the ship. They are going far too fast to stop, so they must make the turn. The Vajra have “Aerobatic” skill at 13 or less. They have +3 Movement Skill Levels with flight and thus must make their skill roll at -7! The first Vajra tries it and rolls an 11, missing the roll by 5pts (it needed a 6 or less!) and slams into the hull at 2080” taking 693 dice of damage! Not really. The Vajra can only do Body (24) plus Defense (16) or 40 dice of damage to the hull and to itself. The Vajra takes 44 Body of damage (minus its armor of 16) for a total of 28 Body damage, nearly vaporizing the Vajra and punching a very large hole in that section of the defunct battleship causing it to break up further. The other two Vajra realizing the folly of such a maneuver execute partial deceleration in addition to attempting making the turn. They can decelerate at 120” per phase. They do half of that, dropping their Turn Mode to 404” giving them plenty of room to make the maneuver, but now Alto is gaining ground on them…Note that If I had thrown in the penalties for velocity, Alto and the Vajra would have had an additional maneuver penalty of -5. Flying at breakneck speeds through dense debris fields is not recommended. (okay, it is in Macross, cause that’s how they roll)

Even though they are limited by the Turn Mode like all other flying vehicles, Mecha (and other VTOL craft) can make use of some specialized maneuvers that can give them an edge in battle.

First, VTOL Mecha can fly sideways and backward, giving them the ability to begin changing direction without changing their facing. Typical Side or Reverse movement is at half normal acceleration (1/2 Combat move) but units with enhanced versions can use their full combat move to accelerate in any direction. Mecha can also use their VTOL flight systems to turn on a dime and thus, can turn to face an opponent from any direction while still maintaining forward momentum and acceleration. The Mecha pilot only has to make a successful Combat Piloting roll to turn toward an opponent to his flank. Or a Combat Pilot roll at -2 to turn toward an opponent to his rear and maintain full forward momentum. (note: if the Mecha does not have the Full Reverse option on it’s flight system, the unit will begin to slow down if its new acceleration cannot maintain its current speed) This type of maneuver will negate any bonus an enemy will obtain by attacking from the flank or rear.

 

More to come...

[dmjalund]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

could the mecha's inbuilt computer buy breakfall skill?

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

could the mecha's inbuilt computer buy breakfall skill?

 

Yes. There's absolutely no reason why the computer couldn't use breakfall skill for the mecha. In fact there should be a Program where the mecha detects an impact, activates systems to protect the pilot (airbags or crash foam etc) then activates the breakfall skill to try and salvage the mecha.

[cutsleeve]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

Mecha Superheroes

 

 

Military/Covert Ops Mecha

 

 

Dystopian Mecha

 

Neon Genesis Evangelion

 

Dystopian Mecha Sports

 

 

Steam Punk Mecha

 

 

Fantasy Mecha

 

 

Who Hasn't Wanted To Play This

 

[megaplayboy]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I think I'd like to see a Mecha book have a section on tanks--maneuvering tracked vehicles, "hull down" partial concealment, assumptions about turret traverse speed, division of labor(driver/gunner/loader/commander), differential armoring---and also a section on sci-fi tanks--Ogres, Bolos, Hammer's Slammers, hover and grav tanks--as well. While the overall focus of the book should be on anthropomorphic mecha, it would be a shame to waste an opportunity to elaborate a bit more on armored fighting vehicles in general.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I think I'd like to see a Mecha book have a section on tanks--maneuvering tracked vehicles' date=' "hull down" partial concealment, assumptions about turret traverse speed, division of labor(driver/gunner/loader/commander), differential armoring---and also a section on sci-fi tanks--Ogres, Bolos, Hammer's Slammers, hover and grav tanks--as well. While the overall focus of the book should be on anthropomorphic mecha, it would be a shame to waste an opportunity to elaborate a bit more on armored fighting vehicles in general.[/quote']

 

Agreed. Such information would be invaluable, even if it is mostly used to highlight the operational differences between tanks and mecha.

[Kaeto]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

And don't forget the Vertically Oriented Tank for Offense and Maneuverability

[Michael Hopcroft]

Re: Hypothetically and unofficially, what would you like to see in a Mecha Hero book?

 

I don't recall ever seeing Dangaioh. I have seen many of the shows cited by cutsleeve. Dystopian only begins to describe how depressing I found Evangelion.

 

I'm surprised you didn't mention CLAMP's Magic Knight Rayearth, the manga that propelled them to superstardom among manga artists. A large part of the quest is for the heroines to awaken and bond to "machin" -- magically powered mecha. In the second storyarc they run into a technologically advanced civilization with powerful mecha of their own in addition to all their other problems.

 

As far as gaming goes, the Emerald Knights of S. John Ross' Uresia: Grave of Heaven setting used fantasy mecha. He originally wrote it for BESM, which was the go-to anime game of the time.