Best genre to learn HERO system?

[Fredwidge]

Hi folks,

 

I bought the 5edRev rulebook last year but never had the time to commit myself to learn the rules yet. But today is a grand day! I HAVE time!

 

I wanted to know which genre is the best to start up has a rusted GM. I mean start up from scratch... learning the rules, finding players, teaching them how to role-play and rule-play , creating my universe... I say from scratch because most of my friends aren't interested in role-playing and I'm new in town. (Montreal, Canada)

 

The idea I had was to find a "champion" with whom I would learn the rules and try out different things in small non-persistent stories. Once we get a good feel of the game, we'd go out to recruit people. At first glance, it looks like the superheroes in tight pants would be the easiest genre to start with. It seems like it has less optional rules. How does that sound?

 

I also thought about buying that character generator software. I'm convinced it will help to get into the good meat rapidly and then go under the hood only when we are more familiar.

 

Hero system seems very hard to learn by yourself, so I'm trying to make this task less daunting by taking baby steps...

[csyphrett]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

The best genre to learn in is the one you like to play in. If you like superheroes, Champions. If you like mission impossible/dirty dozen style games, Dark Champions. If you just want to be a paladin, Fantasy hero. The rules don't change, just what you use them for.

CES

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Yeah I know that, but sadly I think I haven't expressed myself properly.

 

Considering that I have no group of people to introduce to HERO, which genre recruits people more easily? I don't mind any genre, that's one of the reasons I chose HERO system. I can play anything with only one rulebook. Heck, I plan on playing a good chunk of all the genres. It all depends on the people I come across and what gets people to turn their eye on this system.

 

What I am curious about, is what genre is easier to get people who mostly never played role-playing games or just played D&D. Cyberpunk is fun, but sometimes too obscure. Horror genres are... scary at first. Western spaghetti are lone coyotes in the desert, only dedicated fans will love. You get my drift?

 

Four color superheroes look casual enough and light so that no one will feel out of place when role playing.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

From a certain view there are 2 distinct rule sets for HERO:

 

1. Character Creation
   
2. Combat and Adventuring
   

 

Champions (superheroic) is the best genre for learning #1 but a straightforward heroic level modern game is the best for learning #2. This used to be called Danger International in previous editions but is now covered by Dark Champions in 5th ed. (Even though it has "Champions" in the name, it really doesn't deal with true supers).

 

Learning and experiencing the elegance of #2 is the key to hooking new players imo. And creating characters is far easier when you take the POWERS section out of the equation.

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Learning and experiencing the elegance of #2 is the key to hooking new players imo. And creating characters is far easier when you take the POWERS section out of the equation.

 

Ahhh thanks, exactly what I needed to know. Why get entangled with the billions of power combination when you can have fun right away... It's so brilliant and obvious that I'm ashamed I haven't thought of it... hehe.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Welcome, Fredwidge!

 

Remember that whatever genre you choose to play, the many optional elements of HERO -- combat maneuvers, Hit Location chart, etc. -- are just that, optional. The game will run just fine using the basic elements of the system. As you become more comfortable with those you can add in elements until you get the level of detail and style of play that you and your players are comfortable with.

 

Supers may look like a "light" genre, but in HERO it is in some ways the most involved both in chargen and during actual play, because of all the abilities and options most supers have compared to heroic-level characters, and because with their generally higher Speed stat they can take more actions in a game Turn than heroic characters.

 

I thought you might benefit from these two past threads posted to the forums, which feature detailed tutorials dealing with the most involved elements of HERO, character generation and combat, both heroic and superheroic. This thread features step-by-step chargen examples, while this one provides detailed narrative examples of combat.

 

You may also get some help from this thread offering tips for new Game Masters from experienced GMs here in the community. Although much of the advice is general, a lot of it refers specifically to HERO games.

 

Feel free to post any other questions about the game that occur to you. We all love to show off how much we know.

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Thanks Lord Liaden,

 

Nice readings. It helps slowing down my performances at the office... Oh well, has long has I don't get into trouble!

[ghost-angel]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

For the money, a stock standard Fantasy Game usually attracts the most attention, and since it's a Heroic Game (barring mages) you can get into #2 as outlined above.

 

If you do do Fantasy and want to just get right into it without boggling over Magic I strongly suggest just using a Multipower Pool with Slots for Spells.

[Curufea]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Any genre that isn't street level or realistic would be my recommendation. Hero is more suited to larger-than-life genres.

[Spence]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

 

I also thought about buying that character generator software. I'm convinced it will help to get into the good meat rapidly and then go under the hood only when we are more familiar.

 

I would highly recommend picking up Hero Designer. For a game like Hero where everything (characters, vehicles, computers, bases, etc) uses the same rules set, having a program that tracks and calculates everything for you is one of the best friends you will have. With HD I can whip out a NPC or PC in minutes rather than hours and not worry about screwing up the points or something. For the price it’s a no brainer

[brionl]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

You'll probably also want to get the Sidekick ruleset. It's a lot easier to get people to look at a thin book like that, than the 20lb monstrosity that is the main rulebook.

[CTaylor]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Champions is probably the best one for learning the game. It's simple and goofy and fun and everyone likes playing superheroes and busting stuff. You can use premade bad guys and just throw them at people in easy scenarios: bank robbery, highjacking, someone stealing the pentagon again. Other genres require a lot more preparation and bad guy building.

[Spence]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Champions is probably the best one for learning the game. It's simple and goofy and fun and everyone likes playing superheroes and busting stuff. You can use premade bad guys and just throw them at people in easy scenarios: bank robbery' date=' highjacking, someone stealing the pentagon again. Other genres require a lot more preparation and bad guy building.[/quote']

 

CTaylor makes a good point. Plus the Champions line has the largest support.

 

six books of pre-made Villains

Conquerors, Killers, And Crooks

Arcane Adversaries

Champions Of The North

Champions Worldwide

Crews, Cops, And Cabals

Villains, Vandals, And Vermin

 

two mini-campaigns

Champions Battlegrounds

Sharper Than A Serpent's Tooth

 

a guide book of general scenario's and advice in running them

Villainy Amok

 

two city books

Vibora Bay

Millennium City

 

Plus many more references and sourcebooks.

 

Champions has the greatest range to support fast "off the shelf" play.

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

The sidekick book will have to wait until I get more familliar with the rules, but I'm 100% sure that buying at least one book will pay out in the long run. You never have enough books when the players want to level up. (I know, I know.. i should say skill up ) I'll also encourage new players to have a look at sidekick if they want to buy a book. There is always that over-zealous player that want to buy everythng right away. ^_- It's even easier on the wallet with sidekick and you can go around doing the karate kid's crane move! "HEeeeeyyyyyaaa!" Ouch me leg Mister Meiyagui...! Errr uhmm...Sorry about that..>.>... Also, I'll have Hero Designer for sure just for the sake of easy NPC design.

 

But has Hyper-Man said, removing the powers out of the equation is something to keep in mind. So I was thinking of going for the Star Hero genre, but having the players being on a penal colonie world. Some cheesy cataclism brings it back to a stone/medieval age. The players have to find a way to get out of this mess(think fallout). They can stumble on technologies on their way to the top( introduced at my will, has we get better with the rules.) And then, once they charm/subdue/manipulate/trick/kill the local nobles who own the place... get a transport out of this hellhole and have fun on new adventures or just get stuck up in a postapocaliptic world to my delighted machiavelic pleasures...

 

Still, it's only thoughts and nothing is fixed. If after a couple of pratice runs I get very good with the rules, we'll go for the genre that inspires us the most. But thats far away down the road. I'm far from mastering the rules and having a full group of player that fit together yet. I give myself up to the end of novembre to find a partner with whom I'll hammer down the basics, then ... well it's recruitment time... and x-mas time... Yay presents! :0~

 

Anyways, good ideas guys. It's very motivating, thanks! =D

[brionl]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Sidekick isn't a seperate rule system, it's Hero with the most complicated bits left out.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Sidekick isn't a seperate rule system' date=' it's Hero with the most complicated bits left out.[/quote']

 

But with all the core concepts and most of the mechanics included, just simplified. It was specifically designed to teach the system to newcomers, and also makes a great "player's handbook."

[Toadmaster]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Personally I'd go for a low magic fantasy hero game, something like the Conan setting, powerful magic is out there but very unusual.

 

The advantage of a setting like this is it sticks to the basic rules. People expect durable heroes so you should not get pressure to use the optional (more lethal) combat rules and fantasy is by far the most popular genre to find players for.

 

By allowing for the possibility of magic, but relative rarity you can start to work in the use of powers and magic items as players get more comfortable, but you will not have D&D style parties with multiple magic users.

 

 

A second choice would be a modern setting, for many of the same reasons, but that has some drawbacks fantasy doesn't. It is a much less popular genre, and you will likely be pressured to use many of the optional rules, rapid fire, explosives, more lethality, vehicles etc.

 

A 4 color Supers game would actually be pretty low on my list, and not just because it is not a genre I get into. The big problem with 4 color supers is you will be biting off the whole game in one bite. Creating super heroes is considerably more complicated than creating heroic level characters.

[BNakagawa]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

IMO, the best genre to learn HERO is superheroes.

 

This is the genre with the largest amount of difference between extremes.

 

I mean, in a fantasy setting, your strong guy is what, maybe 15 STR points stronger than the mage?

 

With superheroes, you have BIG differences in stats, powers, movement, etc.

 

The best way to hook absolute newcomers to the game is to have Pre-Gens that everybody already knows.

 

Back in the day, they used X-Men, Alpha Flight, Teen Titans. Hand out character sheets and start fighting. Don't fixate on plot, gamers already know about plot, you're here to teach a new set of rules.

 

By using iconic characters that are already known, players already know what their character should be doing. (and what they should not be doing)

 

So when you get handed Cyclops, you don't try punching people. When you get handed Colossus, you don't worry about dodging.

 

By using famous or familiar characters, players avoid doing things their character is not good at. They focus on things their character is good at, and hopefully they will enjoy the results and learn to enjoy the game system as well.

 

Also, if you use licensed characters for demo games, you can pick up toys to use as figures, which adds a nice visual element to the game. Superheroes are a visual genre, so you might as well take advantage of the bright colors to attract some attention.

 

Famous characters, toys to use as figures, tons of dice being rolled, what's not to love?

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

The problem I have with a fantasy setting is that it is often synonymous of a dungeon crawl. I think that D&D is responsible of reinforcing that view in new players' mind. I'm not saying that every fantasy settings ARE dungeon crawls; just that it can attract dungeon crawlers. I don't want to generate loot tables and see my players go "Giggity giggity goo!" à-la Quamire in front of a +2 flaming bastard sword.

 

There is nothing wrong with dungeon crawling either, and honestly I do it from time to time, but I want something refreshing. And until I don't have group with the desire to role-play in a fantasy settings, I'm not risking it.

 

Keep in mind that I don't have a group of people to play with yet and that I have to search for role-players. Hitting the next D&D local store with templates of mages, thieves and knights might attract false impressions and create a dungeon crawling expectation" syndrome.

 

@BNakagawa - You're right about Pre-gen chars. I also took a look at templates. Templates are nice for new people too. I'm not ready to create balanced templates yet, but I'm looking forward to using those. I just read the chapter about it last night. Seems to ease the pressure off of players a bit.

[bubba smith]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

try ninja hero

[Susano]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

If you need pregens to work from, try here:

 

http://surbrook.devermore.net/index/

[Curufea]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

i think that d&d is responsible of reinforcing that view in new players' mind. I'm not saying that every fantasy settings are dungeon crawls; just that it can attract dungeon crawlers.

 

qft

[Fredwidge]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

If you need pregens to work from, try here:

 

http://surbrook.devermore.net/index/

 

ton of info...

 

I liked the Hero Comedy section too.

[Susano]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

Thanks!

[Toadmaster]

Re: Best genre to learn HERO system?

 

The problem I have with a fantasy setting is that it is often synonymous of a dungeon crawl. I think that D&D is responsible of reinforcing that view in new players' mind. I'm not saying that every fantasy settings ARE dungeon crawls; just that it can attract dungeon crawlers. I don't want to generate loot tables and see my players go "Giggity giggity goo!" à-la Quamire in front of a +2 flaming bastard sword.

 

There is nothing wrong with dungeon crawling either, and honestly I do it from time to time, but I want something refreshing. And until I don't have group with the desire to role-play in a fantasy settings, I'm not risking it.

 

Keep in mind that I don't have a group of people to play with yet and that I have to search for role-players. Hitting the next D&D local store with templates of mages, thieves and knights might attract false impressions and create a dungeon crawling expectation" syndrome.

 

@BNakagawa - You're right about Pre-gen chars. I also took a look at templates. Templates are nice for new people too. I'm not ready to create balanced templates yet, but I'm looking forward to using those. I just read the chapter about it last night. Seems to ease the pressure off of players a bit.

 

That is a legitimate concern, I was just thinking of the rules and finding players.

 

try ninja hero

 

That would work too. I played a little Bushido in high school and would love to get into a Ninja Hero game someday.