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Weldun

.50 cal Longarm

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ROBOTECHLOGO.png

 

Here's the deal. I am currently running a Robotech campaign, set in the year 2015, Robotech Timeline. My problem is that I want a locally produced longarm for the South American micronian (human-sized) population, and I know next to nothing about gun-smithing as opposed to gun design. I was thinking about going with a large-bore (.50 cal), hammerless semi-automatic rifle. Any thoughts?

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

ROBOTECHLOGO.png

 

Here's the deal. I am currently running a Robotech campaign, set in the year 2015, Robotech Timeline. My problem is that I want a locally produced longarm for the South American micronian (human-sized) population, and I know next to nothing about gun-smithing as opposed to gun design. I was thinking about going with a large-bore (.50 cal), hammerless semi-automatic rifle. Any thoughts?

I don't know anything about roboteck game, but I have fired a .50 cal.

the gun is very heavy, and kicks like a mule on steroids. each belt fed shell caseing is about 5 inches long and 3/4" in diameter so the ammo is heavy. if you are thinking about one man user automatic weapon, forget it. it needs at least 3 people to carry and fire. it has to be mounted on a tripod. but there is a .50 cal sniper rifle. it's a 5 shot bolt action.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

ROBOTECHLOGO.png

 

Here's the deal. I am currently running a Robotech campaign, set in the year 2015, Robotech Timeline. My problem is that I want a locally produced longarm for the South American micronian (human-sized) population, and I know next to nothing about gun-smithing as opposed to gun design. I was thinking about going with a large-bore (.50 cal), hammerless semi-automatic rifle. Any thoughts?

 

It would be easier if you explained what you wanted from the gun. Sniper rifle, battle rifle, assault rifle, smg, hunting rifle?

 

The .50 caliber sniper rifles are long, heavy and bulky weapons not much use for anything except killing things a long long way away, or for putting holes in vehicles and lightly armored targets. There are actually better (more accurate) weapons for killing things a very long way off.

 

There have been smaller .50 rifles using the AR-15 (M16) and a much smaller cartridge, these are more appropriate as a general use personal weapon than the sniper rifles.

 

So what do you want it to do.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I'll echo the above; you can call it whatever you want, but what does this weapon achieve? Is it anti-personnel? There are many lighter, cheaper weapons for that. Is it anti-materiel? Those get pricey, and the odds of outfitting people en masse with such a fragile weapon (fragile: odds of a non proficient user maintaining it, and using it effectively past 'average' rifle range is nearly nil) are very low.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

As far as game stats go:

 

The .50 BMG (12.7x99) fired by the M2 Heavy Machine Gun and the Barret M-82 siper rifles is listed in Dark Champions at 3d6 RKA, +1 ISM. There are no stats for the 'light .50' (approxamately 12.5x44) rounds that are being developed, but since the NATO 7.62x51 is rated at 2d6+1 RKA, +1 ISM I would place the 125x44 at 2&1/2d6, +1 ISM.

 

That of course assumes you are using Dark Champions stats for guns in your game! :D

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Ah, yes. My usual problem of not providing enough details.:doi:

 

I need it as a general infantry rifle, similar to No.4 Lee-Enfield, but I need the heavy round as this needs to be able to harm 50-60ft. giants! As I am using Mekton-Ζ, this means it needs to inflict 5d10 hits, or 1 kill worth of damage or it's going to have no more effect than mosquito. But yeah, I'm worried about the recoil basically pulverizing the user's shoulder, if not shattering the clavicle.

 

Unfortunately, the South America Quadrant in mostly dominated by Zentraedi renegades, both full-sized and mirconized, and the prevalent tech-level is equal to Europe/America in the 1940's.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Oh, so your problem is one of scale. The rules don't account for that, although there is a house rule... somewhere... of every two size steps over the base size of the thing being fired grants a -1 DC. In which case, you're talking about something 25m in height, or roughly 12x the size of a human (2m).

 

According to the text, we're probably dealing with Gigantic creatures, over 8x human size (easily) and up to 15x human size. Groovy. Since the weapon itself is human held, I'll say that the weapon is the base level, and thus, at three steps, the opponent gets an automatic -3 DCs against whatever human weapon he faces. That in turn gives you a stronger mechanical reason, since by canon, the size is just an SFX at that point.

 

You can also give them Armor, Only Against Human Sized Weaponry (-1/2, since they probably get hit with it quite a bit) or something similar.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Here you go, Winchester Model 70 chambered in .458 magnum, the rifle has been around since 1936, the cartridge since 1956 so should fit well within your tech level. The .458 was developed to provide a bolt action rifle comparable in power to the larger double rifles. It is for hunting African big game (elephant, rhino, cape buffalo) so giants should feel it. The rifle only holds 3 rounds, but a combat rifle could probably be designed with a box magazine holding 5-10 rounds.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_Model_70

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.458_Winchester_Magnum

 

In Hero terms I'd go with 2 1/2d6 +1 stnmod

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Here you go, Winchester Model 70 chambered in .458 magnum, the rifle has been around since 1936, the cartridge since 1956 so should fit well within your tech level. The .458 was developed to provide a bolt action rifle comparable in power to the larger double rifles. It is for hunting African big game (elephant, rhino, cape buffalo) so giants should feel it. The rifle only holds 3 rounds, but a combat rifle could probably be designed with a box magazine holding 5-10 rounds.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_Model_70

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.458_Winchester_Magnum

 

In Hero terms I'd go with 2 1/2d6 +1 stnmod

Rep to you, Toadmaster. The Model 70 is just what I was looking for as a base. I'm thinking a 5 round, detachable box magazine.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I would poinr out the obvious here - that we are talking aboiut a background with giant-sized humanoid aliens, transforming mecha, practical laser weapnry, more weird-ass technology than one can shake a good-sized stick at, and so on.

 

With that in mind, there is no reason why your weapon should be an exact correlation with an existing design. It might resemble any of the stuff already listed, possibly very closely. It may even BE one of the designs already listed, but it doesn't have to be. Absolutely none of them were designed for taking down 50 foot aliens so, if/when the need arises, I would expect some design changes.

 

So take whichever design you really like, alter the image / description to suit yourself, then do likewise with the capabilities.

 

Here is another thought, have one of the above re-bored / rechambered for Elephant Gun ammo(!). The good ol' .600 Nitro Express comes readily to mind - that should at least make a Zentraedi think twice. On a similar note, maybe have a big-bore weapon in an "over-under" arrangement on a standard infantry piece (M-16 with grenade launcher is the obvious example).

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I would poinr out the obvious here - that we are talking aboiut a background with giant-sized humanoid aliens, transforming mecha, practical laser weapnry, more weird-ass technology than one can shake a good-sized stick at, and so on.

 

With that in mind, there is no reason why your weapon should be an exact correlation with an existing design. It might resemble any of the stuff already listed, possibly very closely. It may even BE one of the designs already listed, but it doesn't have to be. Absolutely none of them were designed for taking down 50 foot aliens so, if/when the need arises, I would expect some design changes.

 

So take whichever design you really like, alter the image / description to suit yourself, then do likewise with the capabilities.

 

Here is another thought, have one of the above re-bored / rechambered for Elephant Gun ammo(!). The good ol' .666 Nitro Express comes readily to mind - that should at least make a Zentraedi think twice. On a similar note, maybe have a big-bore weapon in an "over-under" arrangement on a standard infantry piece (M-16 with grenade launcher is the obvious example).

 

Speaking of .600 Nitro Express rounds...

Time to repost the most overmuscled revolver, eveah!

the Pfeifer Zeliska

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Speaking of .600 Nitro Express rounds...

Time to repost the most overmuscled revolver, eveah!

the Pfeifer Zeliska

 

I can see the munchkins slavering over that one. Gotta wonder about the recoil - supposed to be bad enough for the longarm, the mind boggles as regards what it would be for a revolver even with the cartridges "cut down".

 

Actually, this brings to mind one story, which was one of my funniest Traveller GM "moments". Standard selection of PCs, who had taken up employment with a noble. Said noble was into Big Game Hunting - he used a Gauss Rifle (so as to not carve up the target's pelt too badly). Because he wasn't suicidal, he routinely had a back-up team with unreasonably heavy guns, just in case.

 

Emter the PCs, which their employer had equipped with a custom-made weapon from a prestigious firm. Basically, it was a Semi-Automatic (one trigger pull = one shot) Nitro Express (on steroids) with a 20 round clip(!). The PCs were a LITTLE dubious, but not enough - these were high-quality FBGs, after all, so what was there to worry about?

 

So, they are out in the woods on one world, hunting something locals call a 'Dire Wolf' - except that it is bigger than a Siberian Tiger, with an absolutely filthy disposition. They stake out a likely spot. One Character perches up high in a tree, the rest are in an antigrav vehicle circling high overhead. They wait.

 

Time passes. In the wee hours of the morning, the guy in the tree hears something and uses his torch. He spotlights a Dire Wolf under his tree, and uses his gun.

 

BOOM!

 

The PC is dazzled by the muzzle-flash, deafened by the blast, and SLAMMED into the treetrunk by the recoil (no, they hadn't test-fired beforehand, figuring their 'Combat Rifleman' skills would see them through). Miraculously, he doesn't fall off his treebranch. His friends in the grav vehicle start descending to lend a hand.

 

When vision clears, he looks down. There is a six-foot-wide crater in the ground at the foot of that tree. The Dire Wolf is several feet back from that, looking a bit dazed but otherwise unharmed, struggling to its feet and looking VERY p--d off.

 

The PC basically decides, 'OK, this gun has a nasty recoil, but if I brace against the tree trunk before firing, that problem will be solved'. He braces against the treetrunk, and shoots.

 

Quick gun history lesson. When some US police departments in the 1930s began re-equipping with the new Colt .45 Automatic, there was a spate of accidents due to a design flaw. Basically, the weapons were known to unexpectedly go Fully Automatic (one trigger-pull = LOTS of bullets). If you aren't expecting your piece to do this (and are unaware that it even COULD do this), one can see how this could be a serious problem.

 

So, those guns the PCs were using had a similar flaw - and it emerged in particularly dramatic fashion.

 

One trigger pull = BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM .... etc..

 

In the space of a few seconds, the PC had been thoroughly jack-hammered against the treetrunk, breaking several bones via multiple recoils; blasted the Dire Wolf into tiny fragments; added several more craters to the immediate area; blasted a half-dozen trees; AND shot down his teammates (one minute, they are flying in to help, the next there is a dinner-plate-sized hole through the controls).

 

Another miracle. Despite all this, the PC STILL doesn't fall out of the tree. But then the tree groans and tilts (all those recoil-impacts up high plus all the cratering at its base). The guy tries to use Psionic Teleport to extract himself to a safer locale (the ground). Mind you, this is despite his injuries, his disorientation AND not having memorized a suitable location.

 

The GM (me) cackles and rolls some dice. The PC reappears at ground level- and the tree falls on him.

 

Since then, the 'Fully Automatic Elephant Gun' has been a catch-cry in my group for certain hardware - the stuff that may be majorly cool, but "could" have potential for causing serioous havoc.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I can see the munchkins slavering over that one. Gotta wonder about the recoil - supposed to be bad enough for the longarm, the mind boggles as regards what it would be for a revolver even with the cartridges "cut down".

 

Actually, this brings to mind one story, which was one of my funniest Traveller GM "moments". Standard selection of PCs, who had taken up employment with a noble. Said noble was into Big Game Hunting - he used a Gauss Rifle (so as to not carve up the target's pelt too badly). Because he wasn't suicidal, he routinely had a back-up team with unreasonably heavy guns, just in case.

 

Emter the PCs, which their employer had equipped with a custom-made weapon from a prestigious firm. Basically, it was a Semi-Automatic (one trigger pull = one shot) Nitro Express (on steroids) with a 20 round clip(!). The PCs were a LITTLE dubious, but not enough - these were high-quality FBGs, after all, so what was there to worry about?

 

So, they are out in the woods on one world, hunting something locals call a 'Dire Wolf' - except that it is bigger than a Siberian Tiger, with an absolutely filthy disposition. They stake out a likely spot. One Character perches up high in a tree, the rest are in an antigrav vehicle circling high overhead. They wait.

 

Time passes. In the wee hours of the morning, the guy in the tree hears something and uses his torch. He spotlights a Dire Wolf under his tree, and uses his gun.

 

BOOM!

 

The PC is dazzled by the muzzle-flash, deafened by the blast, and SLAMMED into the treetrunk by the recoil (no, they hadn't test-fired beforehand, figuring their 'Combat Rifleman' skills would see them through). Miraculously, he doesn't fall off his treebranch. His friends in the grav vehicle start descending to lend a hand.

 

When vision clears, he looks down. There is a six-foot-wide crater in the ground at the foot of that tree. The Dire Wolf is several feet back from that, looking a bit dazed but otherwise unharmed, struggling to its feet and looking VERY p--d off.

 

The PC basically decides, 'OK, this gun has a nasty recoil, but if I brace against the tree trunk before firing, that problem will be solved'. He braces against the treetrunk, and shoots.

 

Quick gun history lesson. When some US police departments in the 1930s began re-equipping with the new Colt .45 Automatic, there was a spate of accidents due to a design flaw. Basically, the weapons were known to unexpectedly go Fully Automatic (one trigger-pull = LOTS of bullets). If you aren't expecting your piece to do this (and are unaware that it even COULD do this), one can see how this could be a serious problem.

 

So, those guns the PCs were using had a similar flaw - and it emerged in particularly dramatic fashion.

 

One trigger pull = BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM_BOOM .... etc..

 

In the space of a few seconds, the PC had been thoroughly jack-hammered against the treetrunk, breaking several bones via multiple recoils; blasted the Dire Wolf into tiny fragments; added several more craters to the immediate area; blasted a half-dozen trees; AND shot down his teammates (one minute, they are flying in to help, the next there is a dinner-plate-sized hole through the controls).

 

Another miracle. Despite all this, the PC STILL doesn't fall out of the tree. But then the tree groans and tilts (all those recoil-impacts up high plus all the cratering at its base). The guy tries to use Psionic Teleport to extract himself to a safer locale (the ground). Mind you, this is despite his injuries, his disorientation AND not having memorized a suitable location.

 

The GM (me) cackles and rolls some dice. The PC reappears at ground level- and the tree falls on him.

 

Since then, the 'Fully Automatic Elephant Gun' has been a catch-cry in my group for certain hardware - the stuff that may be majorly cool, but "could" have potential for causing serioous havoc.

 

 

and that is precisely why I suggested the .458 Winmag, it is about the biggest cartridge out there that could still be considered a "normal" round that can be safely fired from a standing position repeatedly as would be the case for a combat rifle.

 

Sure there were examples of soldiers firing the .55 Boys and 14.5mm PTRS / PTRD rifles from a standing position, but they didn't usually try that twice. :eg:

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I would point out the obvious here - that we are talking about a background with giant-sized humanoid aliens' date=' transforming mecha, practical laser weaponry, more weird-ass technology than one can shake a good-sized stick at, and so on.[/quote']Yes, but unless we're dealing with Robotechnology itself, I'm trying not to strain the sense of disbelief of my players any more than I need to. I know, I know. The sheer physicality of Full-sized Zentraedi should have thrown it completely out of the window, but I find that the less I strain it on the little things, the more that I can get away with on the big things. Such as when I have them go up against certain NEW Zentraedi mecha. (If you're familiar with the Strike Force supplement, you know the premise).

With that in mind, there is no reason why your weapon should be an exact correlation with an existing design. It might resemble any of the stuff already listed, possibly very closely. It may even BE one of the designs already listed, but it doesn't have to be. Absolutely none of them were designed for taking down 50 foot aliens so, if/when the need arises, I would expect some design changes.

 

So take whichever design you really like, alter the image / description to suit yourself, then do likewise with the capabilities.

 

 

Here is another thought, have one of the above re-bored / rechambered for Elephant Gun ammo(!). The good ol' .600 Nitro Express comes readily to mind - that should at least make a Zentraedi think twice. On a similar note, maybe have a big-bore weapon in an "over-under" arrangement on a standard infantry piece (M-16 with grenade launcher is the obvious example).

One other idea I had was for a slide-action rifle. Basically a rifled shotgun, modified specifically for deer-slugs.

 

Speaking of .600 Nitro Express rounds...

Time to repost the most overmuscled revolver, eveah!

the Pfeifer Zeliska

:nonp:wow.giffacepalmsmiley1ti3.gif

 

No. Just... ...no.:ugly:

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Yes, but unless we're dealing with Robotechnology itself, I'm trying not to strain the sense of disbelief of my players any more than I need to. I know, I know. The sheer physicality of Full-sized Zentraedi should have thrown it completely out of the window, but I find that the less I strain it on the little things, the more that I can get away with on the big things. Such as when I have them go up against certain NEW Zentraedi mecha. (If you're familiar with the Strike Force supplement, you know the premise).

One other idea I had was for a slide-action rifle. Basically a rifled shotgun, modified specifically for deer-slugs.

 

 

:nonp:wow.giffacepalmsmiley1ti3.gif

 

No. Just... ...no.:ugly:

 

Ya know, I never thought I'd find a situation where I'd seriously consider that monster as a viable weapon, but fighting against the Zentradi with WW2 tech level weapons?

Yeah... I can maybe see it.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Ya know, I never thought I'd find a situation where I'd seriously consider that monster as a viable weapon, but fighting against the Zentradi with WW2 tech level weapons?

Yeah... I can maybe see it.

 

Be vewy vewy quiet. I'm hunting Zentwaedi. Hahahahahahah.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

Be vewy vewy quiet. I'm hunting Zentwaedi. Hahahahahahah.
I'm also trying to follow the cardinal rule of RPG encounter equipment. Never give the antagonists a "shiny" that you are not willing to have the PCs claim as loot.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

I'm also trying to follow the cardinal rule of RPG encounter equipment. Never give the antagonists a "shiny" that you are not willing to have the PCs claim as loot.

 

Oh, absolutely. Sticky-fingered little b#####ds that they are, this is a given, whatever the genre.

 

The follow-on is that any nukes in the game (or any other kind of WMD, or anything that can somehow be altered into a WMD) will somehow be set off by the PCs. Usually by accident.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

The game is tonight and I'm going with a .300 Weatherby Magnum in a bullpup rifle. With a muzzle energy of about 5.7 kJ on a 66cm (26in) barrel, and an introduction date of 1944, it should do quite nicely.

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Re: .50 cal Longarm

 

The game is tonight and I'm going with a .300 Weatherby Magnum in a bullpup rifle. With a muzzle energy of about 5.7 kJ on a 66cm (26in) barrel' date=' and an introduction date of 1944, it should do quite nicely.[/quote']

 

Good luck. It sure SOUNDS scary.

 

In case you need a really cool support weapon on a shoestring budget, here's one possibility:

 

http://www.docsmachine.com/nonPB/mortar.html

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