Steve Long Posted February 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero In the past, major PDF projects (like SoB in its first incarnation) have not done well for us; they don't come close to earning back the money to cover the time, effort, and sometimes art required. We can make money on PDFs such as the HPAs that don't require much work, but anything other than that really isn't worth it. We may try again at some point, just to see if the waters have changed, but for now original PDFs will have to remain small and simple things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Admiral C Posted February 5, 2009 Report Share Posted February 5, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Err' date=' yeah, 200 -- I looked at the wrong book. But the point of "signatures" (as they're called in the industry) still holds. Fortunately PDFs provide a good backup plan. [/quote'] So UFH is 200 then? That's a lot better than 144 and much more in line with what I expected. I didn't expect another FH or PH but 200 is a nice middle ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akiva Posted February 5, 2009 Report Share Posted February 5, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero We may try again at some point' date=' just to see if the waters have changed, but for now original PDFs will have to remain small and simple things.[/quote'] Well, if you do decide to give it another shot, you can bank on my money for a weird/conspiracy/surrealist Hero book or PDF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapsedgamer Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero I don't regard "weird conspiracy' date='" UFOs, and paranormal stuff like you tend to see on many episodes of The X-Files as "urban fantasy." (This is discussed in the book, but I don't have a copy yet so I can't give you a page cite.) That's a separate genre, which I usually refer to simply as "Weird Conspiracy." If there were enough interest it would justify a book itself, but in the polls we've run Weird Conspiracy Hero has typically not fared well.[/quote'] Which saves you from the mistake TSR made with their Dark Matter setting for Alternity. They shoehorned everything into one setting, and it just became a mess. Good call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akiva Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Which saves you from the mistake TSR made with their Dark Matter setting for Alternity. They shoehorned everything into one setting' date=' and it just became a mess. Good call.[/quote'] The major difference here is that HERO genre books are toolkits to build the setting you want whereas TSR's settings are presented 'complete' and ready-to-run. So it's not technically possible to shoehorn too much into a HERO genre book. The only accusation one could make is that some things are covered in greater detail than others in a HERO genre book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero I think we may be getting off-topic here, but it's definitely possible to shoehorn too much into one of our genre books. A book needs to have focus and limits, or else the customer won't know what he's getting, or will end up spending money for stuff he doesn't want. I think this is a good example, in fact -- Weird Conspiracy is not Urban Fantasy IMO, and putting them into one book would cause difficulties. I'd rather present them separately, and let people mish-mash 'em together (as, in fact, I plan to do in the campaign I'm working up right now ) if they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero And yes, in response to someone's question, the book is 200 pages long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mserabian Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Folks who have the book: Can you guys give a brief run down on the 4 fleshed out settings included in the book and how long they are? thanks! MAL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akiva Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero I think we may be getting off-topic here' date=' but it's definitely possible to shoehorn too much into one of our genre books.[/quote'] I meant within scope, of course. I understand that Weird Conspiracy might not fit into Urban Fantasy (only I seem to think so because I take 'fantasy' as meaning 'fantastical' and not 'fantasy' in the sense of magic and dragons) but as long as one stays within a few reasonable boundaries, including page count, and furthermore doesn't sacrifice too much depth for breadth, the word 'shoehorn' should be the furthest from everyone's minds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero I realize the gears of Hero are in full grind, but I was wondering if a PDF of the book will be available. My Hobby store (for the 4th consecutive hero book) has fallen down on the job, and I figured I'd get the PDF. Whcih would make it the first Hero System book for which I didn't buy a physical copy also. But they just tick me off with their WoCism I soooo miss my old store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Why not buy direct from Hero? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dronf Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Akiva and others--like Weird Conspiracy? Well, find a copy of 4th edition Horror Hero. The "Modern Horror Campaign" section is a Weird Conspiracy, complete with magic and monsters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapsedgamer Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero The major difference here is that HERO genre books are toolkits to build the setting you want whereas TSR's settings are presented 'complete' and ready-to-run. So it's not technically possible to shoehorn too much into a HERO genre book. The only accusation one could make is that some things are covered in greater detail than others in a HERO genre book. That's a good point, but I was specifically referring to the distinction that Mr. long sees between the two genres. Dark Matter tried to make an overarching set of ground rules that would cover UFOs, magic and conspiracy theory all at the same time. They made sort of a D & D meets the X Files, with a little Call of Cthulhu mixed in, setting. To me, it was just a mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero If someone would be interested in a HERO campaign setting mixing Weird Conspiracy with Urban Fantasy, I highly recommend Michael "Susano" Surbrook's quality web sourcebook, The Phenomena Department. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Why not buy direct from Hero? Issues with receiving mail at my current address. (No one to sign for it, it would likely get returned) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Issues with receiving mail at my current address. (No one to sign for it' date=' it would likely get returned)[/quote'] Hero doesn't send signature required, and UPS usually just leaves it at the door. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Also, it's a very public area. Anyone walking by gets a free book. Regardless, don't worry, I've covered the angles. I'd love a hardcopy, but I'll settle for the PDF if one happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dronf Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero If someone would be interested in a HERO campaign setting mixing Weird Conspiracy with Urban Fantasy' date=' I highly recommend Michael "Susano" Surbrook's quality web sourcebook, The Phenomena Department. Oh wow! Cool! Thanks for the link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zane_Marlowe Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Folks who have the book: Can you guys give a brief run down on the 4 fleshed out settings included in the book and how long they are? thanks! MAL I am very interested to know this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Gimme another day, I'll have some full blown info. I'm halfway through it and just need to sit down and write out reviews of the books I've got on my stack this weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero The picture introducing Chapter 4, that's an awesome awesome image. . . it evokes so much in such a small dark space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero Got a new game store and a new physical copy of UFH. Yay! On first glance, my first thought is the character illustrations are top notch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted March 3, 2009 Report Share Posted March 3, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero The Upside: Urban Fantasy is not a new sub-genre of Fantasy, at least in a literary sense of it. From a gaming perspective it's not been a thoroughly explored as other genres and with the recent surge in pop culture it's good to see a full source book dedicated to the genre. Urban Fantasy is a sub-genre that mixes the Modern World with Fantasy elements; faeries, vampires, werewolves and magic. Chapter One - The Urban Fantasy Genre. Starting with a full explanation of the genre, and the sub-elements that exist within the genre. Most importantly it starts with a short section of what Isn't part of the genre. Which is a key element, as with many sub-genres they really cover a specific subset of circumstances and moving too far from them moves one back into the larger genre they're a part of, or into a mixed genre scenario. Once what isn't part of the genre is covered the books goes over the many elements that are encompassed within the scope of Urban Fantasy - Changes In Perspectives, Bookstores, Bars, Dreams, Hidden Worlds, Music, and more elements are each gone over and how they fit within the genre. Like any genre there are elements that appear contradictory, which gives birth to sub-genres that bring forth different elements to the front. Urban Fantasy is no exception, and these differing takes on the genre are covered next. Going over Hidden Histories, Low Urban Fantasy, Monster Hunters, Monster Warfare, and Open Magic are covered. Each one has a specific viewpoint on magic, supernatural elements, and how they interact with the world, as well as the specific main focus of a possible campaign. Mixing Genres is another important piece covered, how to bring in meta-elements like Comedy, Romance and especially the very closely related Horror genre elements. You get an excellent overview of the entire genre with this chapter, covering common and uncommon elements. Anyone not familiar with the source material of Urban Fantasy can get a very solid idea what goes into a game using this genre. Chapter Two - Urban Fantasy Character Creation. Every genre has an identifiable set of archetypical roles, jumping right in this chapter identifies each one, their general guidelines and provides Package Deals in Hero System terms. There are fourteen Package Deals defined, from some you see in a most fantasy related genres; Anachronism and Scholar, Shaman and Wizard, and Cleric. To a few definitely unique to this genre; Musician, Mystic or Occult Detective, Sensitive, and Animal-Men (which are not lycanthropes and their related family of shapeshifters). Along with several other types to round out the offerings. There aren't many overtly combat oriented archetypes covered (like a Monster Hunter), the book points you towards adapting the large number of these from the Dark Champions source book. Game Elements goes over how to use the various aspects of the Hero System to best effect when playing an Urban Fantasy Genre. Going over basic set up, and dealing with Characteristics Ranges (from keeping them from becoming too similar amongst the characters, to adjusting Characteristic Maximum). Skills covers which skills are not only most appropriate but how to modify Skill to get a specifically Urban Fantasy flavor out of them. Two interesting elements are Spell Research (along with rules for time) and Inconspicuous, alterations on Inventor and Concealment respectively. Perks and Talents covers which of these are appropriate and which aren't for the genre, in brief. Instead of repeating each Talent there's a list of which are most appropriate (some are from the Fantasy Hero genre book). The Powers section spends most of it's space discussing Clairsentience and various ways to handle this common effect in the genre. Including guidelines for 'scanning' objects, locations, through time, in dreams, and psychometry (emotional clairsentience). Disadvantages covers common drawbacks and complications that the genre utilizes, including the popular Technology Interference that plagues mages. Lastly the chapter covers Equipment, looking at balancing Magic and Gear as well as Enchanted Items. Chapter Three - Gamemastering Urban Fantasy. The last of the System Crunch chapters looks at the genre from a GMs perspective, giving advice on how to run it and questions to ask when setting up the world. First, and quite possibly most importantly, Magic is covered. Looking at types of magic, sources of magic, power level, interaction with technology, commonality of it, history, and magical races. All of these are given space with points, counterpoints and suggestions, essentially giving the GM a whole host of things to think over, which elements they want to include and which they don't. Overall, some excellent information for any campaign involving Magic of some kind, not just Urban Fantasy. Character Guidelines looks at how powerful the PCs are compared to the world at large, power levels, and character growth. Campaign Tone and Campaign Theme cover the aspects one can hi-light within the genre and how to go about it. Campaign Types looks at the various Sub-Genre that one can focus on and how to set up, present, and run them. Running The Game and Villains And NPCs are a general look at how to set up and run any campaign. Covering adventure structure, villain types and the like. It does give specifics to the genre however, looking at such noble Master Villains as the Ancient Vampire, Cult Leader, Evil Wizard, and Unseelie Queen. The final part looks at two NPC Archetypes that are common to Urban Fantasy, the Familiar and the Spirit Guide. Chapter Four - Magic In The Streets: An Urban Fantasy Source book. The last chapter is the meat of the book, taking up just over half the pages. Included are four separate Campaigns, ranigng from open flashy magic, to hidden magic, and monster hunting. Hudson City Shadows takes the Hudson City source book and overlays a veneer of mysticism and occult onto it, allowing you to create an Urban Fantasy setting with that book, reducing your workload. The setting is an Open Magic setting, where Magic was recently reintroduced to the world after centuries of dormancy and hiding. A history of magic, as well as a complete magic system with several dozen spell examples. The Mystic World section covers several factions of mystic beings in the world. First, a group of five NPCs to use generally. The Vampyri are this settings version of the vampire, The Fae Folk covers how the faery work in the setting, and last are Haunts (various kinds of ghosts). Three campaign ideas and five adventure seeds finish off the setting. Invasive Species is a complete setting set in Reno, Nevada. It approaches the setting from three very different angles, and does an excellent job of setting up both a Monster Hunter and Hidden War style campaign - depending on which side the PCs want to take. The setting contains a secret conspiracy history, five different warring factions of mythological creatures, and one group determined to hunt them all down. The campaign is set up so you can choose to run as the monsters in a secret war for survival, renegade monsters out to repent from their wicked ways and stop their brethren, or the hunters gunning for them all. The Mythologies include some Native American, Werewolves, Vampires, Indian monsters, and Mexican creatures. Magic in the setting is very low key, focusing more on the creatures than that flash. The Sixth Sun is a take on Aztec Mythology. Magic is introduced into the world by the Aztec Gods, who have set up the Sixth Sun - or sixth world - in order to test mankind. Magic is prevalent, flashy, and common in almost everyone's lives. Like with Hudson City Shadows a full magic system is introduced and dozens of spells are detailed that one can use as models for more, or keep the extensive list as is for any campaign. Three campaign ideas and three adventure plot seeds finish off this setting. Lines Of Contention is both a setting, and a fully detailed adventure. The setting is a variant on Hudson City Shadows where magic is even more low key and "realistic" - realistic meaning while magic is real, an ordinary man can come up with a non-magical explanation to "write it off" as something else. Magic is a background to the setting rather than something overt everyone knows about. It also introduces Ley Lines for Hudson City, giving a map of where they are and what effects they have on magic in general. Which is where the Adventure comes in. I won't give away any details though. The adventure is divided into three acts, and can be played either over one session quickly, or dispersed over a long period of time in between other adventures in a longer running campaign. The magic system in this campaign is an excellent example of how to create a Step-Based (or level based) magic system. A mage can only advance to the next level when they've mastered the current level (i.e. purchased all the abilities); though you can learn a spell from any level casting above your knowledge is dangerous. Only a dozen example spells are provided but they are a wide enough variety to provide examples of most effects. All four settings are widely different, and should provide either a solid base to start from, or a good enough example to create your own setting from without missing any important factors. If you're into the Urban Fantasy genre this book is definitely worth picking up. The book ends with a short but extremely useful bibliography of source material of all kinds (books, comics, movies, television, and other RPGs). The downside: In the Package Deals section I would have liked to see a dedicated Monster Hunter archetype covered, given the prevalence in gaming of that sub-genre. While it's not completely within the scope of Urban Fantasy as a whole, Weird Conspiracy often touches the genre, and is a close enough cousin, that even a brief mention of how to combine the two - or at least the differences between the two - would have been a welcome addition. But it's not really 'missing' as such. The Otherside: Whether you're new to the genre or old hat and looking for more ideas this book is an excellent resource. Well organized, covers just about everything that touches on Urban Fantasy as a whole, and provides a great deal of information on using the Hero System to implement the ideas. And the cover has a very modern little red riding hood ready to gun down some werewolves. . . how could you possible go wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba smith Posted March 3, 2009 Report Share Posted March 3, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero dedicated monster hunter archtype i think the sons of daniel from invasive species fill that roll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted March 3, 2009 Report Share Posted March 3, 2009 Re: Urban Fantasy Hero they do, perfectly, but they're setting specific - and while they can be adapted, I was hoping to see something more general. It's a minor point at best though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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