Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

[Sweeper]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Ah, SFB. Bought a lot of the stuff in the 90s. Read that TFG went under and foolishly sold all my stuff. Got back into it at the turn of the millenium with SFBOL and played too many Tourny Style games.

 

Was on one of the Playtest teams for GURPS 3e: Prime Directive and we fought hard to get ADB to take the focus off Spec Ops teams as RPGers wont always play Prime Teams (which kind of limited the original PD in a big way.) Got in trouble with ADB over a misunderstanding (but that's another story )

 

Got into Fed Com as it filled two good niches, simplified combat at the squadron (3 ships or less on a side), and became the Fleet Scale combat system, filling the niche between SFB and F&E.

 

They have a FCOL, but it suffered due to the fact that you can get a game of Fed Com going FTF waay easier than SFB these days.

 

I got out of it due to burnout. Still enjoy Star Trek and occasionally reading on the new stuff ADB puts out. Still have my SFB and F&E stuff so who knows if I'll ever get back into it, though.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

I do recommend you guys try out Attack Vector: Tactical (or Squadron Strike, or Saganami Island) though - it has the plotted movement/fuel consumption rather than energy allocation - but with added physics so you can actually comprehend how it works

And of course - 3D

 

It reminds me of early 60's scifi, like X-Minus 1 - the crew in ships in space behaving in a similar manner as any dramatic scene of a submarine crew.

 

I have SITS. Great game and the improved v2 movement is much much better for HH style combat. SS is a generic build system like Full Thrust or Starmada, only using 3d movement. I have it but have never been able to play. It looks like it can deliver what it promises though.

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

If we're going to go into other ship combat systems, I liked B5 Wars a great deal. Almost as crunchy as SFB without the excruciatingly slow parts. Really interesting damage allocation.

 

I also have Silent Death, but never really learned the system.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

If we're going to go into other ship combat systems, I liked B5 Wars a great deal. Almost as crunchy as SFB without the excruciatingly slow parts. Really interesting damage allocation.

 

I also have Silent Death, but never really learned the system.

 

 

Hmmm... I could just say ditto, but that would be too easy

 

I went on a hunt and procured all the B5 Wars compendiums when AoG went down. I really miss a manufacturer that understood the value of small mini's. I loved their fleet scale ships.

 

I played in a few SD games, but it didn't grab me. Can't say it was a bad game, just not my game.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Anyone remember TFG's Starfire?

[RexMundi]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Never cared for SD. B5 Wars was Great, SFB is still my favorite, not really thrilled with the "replacement", The StarBlazers miniature game though, is a lot of fun to play as well.

 

~Rex

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

I was dying to try that one too, never got the chance though.

[RexMundi]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Starfire was good. I'd still dig out the Captains Rules though for a good SFB game. Lot of Pretenders....but only One SFB.

 

~Rex

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Anyone remember TFG's Starfire?

 

I do! Played a little of it when the first couple of books came out. Probably the best system around for large fleets. I found that it got too complicated after III though, which I thought was a feat considering how simple the game was when it came out.

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

I went on a hunt and procured all the B5 Wars compendiums when AoG went down. I really miss a manufacturer that understood the value of small mini's. I loved their fleet scale ships.

 

I have most of them, I think. I'm actually not sure how many books they put out. Narns were my favorite, especially later-year ones--good power and great handling. I liked Earthforce ships too, though, tough as bricks and about as nimble.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

I do! Played a little of it when the first couple of books came out. Probably the best system around for large fleets. I found that it got too complicated after III though' date=' which I thought was a feat considering how simple the game was when it came out.[/quote']

 

I know what you mean. I stuck with 3rd Ed Tactical and 2nd Ed Strategic rules. The later stuff was overly complicated and then they decided to stop selling it. Well there is (was?) a subscription version, but it was pricey for a product that didn't live up to the original game.

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Starfire is still about the only system in that niche that I can think of. Where two dozen ships per player was reasonable.

 

Anyone played any of the Star Wars ship combat games?

[RexMundi]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Yeah that wasn't bad. Empire Wins all the time though. Sort of like Klingon Cheese in the Fast Drone years......

 

~Rex

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Starfire is still about the only system in that niche that I can think of. Where two dozen ships per player was reasonable.

 

Anyone played any of the Star Wars ship combat games?

 

Starfire can actually handle a lot more and still stay reasonable. We played out some of the ISW4 and other campaigns and had engagements where each task group commander (player) had a couple dozen SD's, DN's and BC's. Not to mention shoals of CA's and DD's. That was one of the reasons I liked that game. You could actually have a scifi fleet engagement where the fleets were actually fleets, not glorified flotillas.

 

ah... the memories

 

Never played the Star Wars games. IIRC they were collectible right? I never liked to spend money on blind collectible games. I wargame to wargame. Not gamble I'll get the 'cool wiz bang' booster.

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Well, there have been several Star Wars ship-to-ship games, I think. I know there was at least one, and probably two, fighter combat games, plus the collectable miniatures one that IIRC is currently in print.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Well' date=' there have been several Star Wars ship-to-ship games, I think. I know there was at least one, and probably two, fighter combat games, plus the collectible miniatures one that IIRC is currently in print.[/quote']

 

I never saw any of them. Of course they may have come out when I was deploying a lot and had to put gaming on hiatus. Another reason is I was never really interested in Star Wars as a wargame. Unlike most people out there I do not count novels and after market 'lets make thing up' as part of a setting and Star Wars had their capitol ships running around with antiaircraft weapons. It would be like seeing the New Jersey armed only with 40mm Pom Pom's and 5 inchers. Anyway, because of their fighters SW was never that interesting.

 

Of course that attitude may have made me miss out on a good system. I'll need to dig around and see if I can locate any of them. Do you recall any titles?

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

There was a Star Wars version of Silent Death on WOTC's SW website back when they put out free stuff on a regular basis. Ah, Ah, here it is...

 

Silent Death has always been primarily a dogfighting game, so the SW version only has fighters. I presume that's not a problem for you based on your comments about SW capital ships.

[Spence]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

There was a Star Wars version of Silent Death on WOTC's SW website back when they put out free stuff on a regular basis. Ah' date=' Ah, here it is...

 

Silent Death has always been primarily a dogfighting game, so the SW version only has fighters. I presume that's not a problem for you based on your comments about SW capital ships.

 

Thanks,

 

But I'm actually a battleship guy. One of the reasons SW never interested me. They were all zoom zooms and they packed their major ships close enough together that no one could maneuver. Even to the point of colliding. Space is BIG making that ridicules.

 

But I do appreciate the link and I fixed my previous post which was misleading.

[Vulcan]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Well, apparently SW ships have no magnification on their gunsights...

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

That's what the Force is for. I too prefer capital ships to fighters in space, but IIRC the SW games were mostly about the fighters, which is why I never got into them.

 

Before I forget, I also wanted to mention Star Frontiers Knight Hawks, which was a surprisingly good game despite being table driven and having only rudimentary ship design rules.

[Shadow Hawk]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Ah, Star Fleet Battles... "Don't worry, the next revision will fix it!" I bought the original "Deluxe" boxed set, which fixed the problems of the original ziplock version. Then the first expansion, which fixed the problems (cloaking rules, fast drones) in the boxed set, then the second espansion ('refits', improved plasma torpedoes, fighters), third expansion (PFs, more refits, better fighters), and so on. The whole thing became a arms race writ large, with each new ship/refit/expansion unbalancing the game yet again. And then the lovely arguements on which rules were 'optional' and which weren't. To play the game, you needed a game club with consistent opinions on which rules were in use, and heaven help you if you went to a different club and tried to play!

 

I enjoy the 'basic' game. I avoid like the plague any and all expansions.

[RexMundi]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Captains Rules are'nt expansionistic! Heh.......Besides you settle ALL optional rules arguements, simply by playing tournements...... Save the optional rules for later after you have a discussion with the Wynn Player over his constant spazy choice of ships for tourney combat.....usually involves a beat down with all the optional rules.

 

~Rex

[Shadow Hawk]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Captains Rules are'nt expansionistic! Heh.......Besides you settle ALL optional rules arguements, simply by playing tournements...... Save the optional rules for later after you have a discussion with the Wynn Player over his constant spazy choice of ships for tourney combat.....usually involves a beat down with all the optional rules.

 

~Rex

 

Heh. Play under the official tourney rules, "Except Romulans can..." and the arguements start again. Things like

a. Rom won't play unless he can use ECM rules.

b. Gorn won't play if Rom can use ECM unless Plasmas get thier automatic ECCM.

c. Orion now wants his automatic ECM bonus.

d. Somone will point out the tourney rules at GLAScon Northridge, and someone else will counter with the rules at GLAScon Anahiem.

And it never ends until you give up and play something else. Like Risk.

 

Captain's rules? That was 3-4 expansions after I gave up.

[Old Man]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

Heh. Play under the official tourney rules, "Except Romulans can..." and the arguements start again. Things like

a. Rom won't play unless he can use ECM rules.

b. Gorn won't play if Rom can use ECM unless Plasmas get thier automatic ECCM.

c. Orion now wants his automatic ECM bonus.

 

LOL we had this exact progression in our pre-games, tournament or otherwise. Non-tournament games also had debates over what year ships should be available, and whether we were going to let the Fed player customize every drone in his magazines. And then we had to sit around and wait for the Orion player while he agonized over what he was going to put in his option mounts, and then there was the death spiral while he tried to change his weapons after seeing what ships the other players had, then those players tried to change ships...

 

My real problem with the tournament rules was how vanilla the ships were. I understand that they were striving for balance at all costs, but when every ship is exactly the same except for its heavy weapons and maybe firing arcs, it gets pretty old in a hurry.

 

I'd still rather play SFB over Risk though.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Reminiscing About Star Fleet Battles

 

And it never ends until you give up and play something else. Like Risk.

 

 

So, in Risk, do you play that the first set of Risk cards earns 5 armies and each succeeding one earns that plus 5 more, or do you play that the first one earns 4 armies and each succeeding one adds 2? And do you pick countries during set-up, or assign them randomly? And do you use the nuclear option, where any time someone rolls all 6s, one country gets nuked, killing all armies there, and destroying half of all armies that move through there for the rest of the game?