Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

[Old Man]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

How do you catalog this mess?

 

I'm late to the thread, but I read this and immediately thought of just a really, really big card catalog.

[Cancer]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Does the act of cataloging a book create an alternate timeline in which the book wasn't successfully cataloged?

 

Yes' date=' of course - but since it wasn't catalogued, you don't need to worry about cataloguing it [/quote']

 

... which brings up a variant Russell's paradox: the library cataloging all libraries which do not catalog the those libraries which have themselves in their catalogs ...

[Beast]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

how about this

 

since info is what is wanted,I figure a contact is in order

pretty much had to buy it to the highest levels but making it a PDA and takes a full phase to send off the info

the uncontrolled is a GM choice on how long it takes the library assistant to find the information

I made it usable as an attack so you can find out info on your target(figure it has a built in camera or data input)

 

you might want to add Eidetic Memory to it so you do not have to call the Library assistant back if you for get the info(might start getting a bit pissy)

 

 

Trans Dewey decimal library card/PDA: Contact (Contact has access to major institutions, Contact has extremely useful Skills or resources, Contact has significant Contacts of his own, Contact is slavishly loyal to character, Contact limited by identity), Usable As Attack (+1), Transdimensional (Any Dimension; +1), Spirit Contact (x2), Organization Contact (x3) (66 Active Points); OAF (-1), No Conscious Control (Only Effects cannot be controlled; -1), Concentration (0 DCV; -1/2), Extra Time (Full Phase, Only to Activate, -1/4) 13-

[IndianaJoe3]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

I just thought of another wrinkle to the problem. This cataloging system has to contain information as to whether a particular book is from a universe that is relevant to the searcher. Is Sherlock Holmes a noted amateur criminologist, fictional character, or police detective that dabbled in writing about the fictional adventures of a London ophthalmologist?

[AlHazred]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Beast may have hit upon the least expensive solution. My current thinking is a really, really good-roll Detect, with Dimensional, MegaScale, and a host of other Adders/Advantages.

 

But of course, the real bone of contention isn't necessarily the power build (after all, you can build anything in Hero) -- it's how to justify it.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

I just thought of another wrinkle to the problem. This cataloging system has to contain information as to whether a particular book is from a universe that is relevant to the searcher. Is Sherlock Holmes a noted amateur criminologist' date=' fictional character, or police detective that dabbled in writing about the fictional adventures of a London ophthalmologist?[/quote']

 

... Or, to use the premise of 'Without A Clue' (one of my favourite Holmesian movies), was it Dr Watson who was the real brains (select one of the above), and Holmes just the front man?

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Shame I didn't see this thread earlier. I've an acronym for you - FRBR

It's the latest hot thing we use in library land

You are basically breaking down an item's relationship to similar items in a hierarchical manner. It's great for expressing different editions, and it gives a reasonable basis for relevance ranking in search results.

 

As a schema, it can also be expanded upon to include subdivisions or even higher divisions (such as the dimension the item is from).

 

It's not a classification system per se - but most of the current existant systems are very inadequate for even today's books, let alone tomorrow's media, or fictional dimensional media. But it can be used as a basis for creating a classification system.

[AlHazred]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

FTFA:

 

FRBR comprises groups of entities:

 

• Group 1 entities are Work, Expression, Manifestation, and Item (WEMI). They represent the products of intellectual or artistic endeavour.
  
• Group 2 entities are person and corporate body, responsible for the custodianship of Group 1’s intellectual or artistic endeavour.
  
• Group 3 entities are subjects of Group 1 or Group 2’s intellectual endeavour, and include concepts, objects, events, places.
  

Group 1 entities are the foundation of the FRBR model:

 

• Work is a "distinct intellectual or artistic creation."
  
• Expression is "the specific intellectual or artistic form that a work takes each time it is 'realized.'"
  
• Manifestation is "the physical embodiment of an expression of a work. As an entity, manifestation represents all the physical objects that bear the same characteristics, in respect to both intellectual content and physical form."
  
• Item is "a single exemplar of a manifestation. The entity defined as item is a concrete entity."
  

So, let me get this straight. Each discrete book in a library (a Group 1 entity), would have four codes of reference: one indicating this specific work (e.g. ALHAZ001 for the Necronomicon), one indicating what kind of book it is (e.g. PYSCROLL for a papyrus scroll), one indicating something to do with this specific form of item (e.g. ALAZIF for the Arabic original text which was called Al Azif), and one indicating this instance of publication (e.g. 738DMALD for a first edition published in Damascus in 738 by Al-Din the bookbinder). Do I have that substantially correct?

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Not really, no.

 

The work would be the Necronomicon.

The Expressions are the various ways it occurs - translations, audio books, editions.

Manifestation is how that expression is produced - e.g. hardcover published by Oxford University Press in 1999, Penguin paperback, audio book read by Neil Gaiman, papyrus scroll.

An Item is the physical thing.

 

All of these objects (descriptive records) are connected to each other, and to the author/s involved. When a user looks up a work, they would be able to see all of the different editions/versions nested together, including the availability of the physical items attached.

 

Example record for At the Mountain of Madness: http://trove.nla.gov.au/work/9640772

 

This site shows relationships for a Harry Potter book-

http://www.frbr.org/eg/hp-goblet-1.html

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

are audio recordings cataloged by the Dewey Decibel System?

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

are audio recordings cataloged by the Dewey Decibel System?

 

No. The Dewey Decimal Classification System does not record media format. However MARC records do. Modern systems use MARC (MAchine Readable Cataloguing) or DC (Dublin Core) for their records. DC is primarily used for non-book items as it has more relevant fields though it isn't as detailed as MARC. DC does have the advantage of being more easily transformed into XML however. And XML = easier machine-to-machine interfaces. Hence why I use it a lot these days (and am even translating a very bad HTML reference page on Doctor Who to XML at the moment)

Anyhow, the holdings area of the MARC or DC for the record is where libraries put the call number (or shelf number) for the item. It can be Dewey, Library of Congress, or any other classification system they like.

 

Call numbers in MARC for the record are in tags 050 to 099 - http://www.nla.gov.au/librariesaustralia/cathelp/bib/ecbdclas.html

Which library holds the item and what that library's call number is (in case it differs from the above, usually with prefixes and suffixes) is stored in the 850 tag - http://www.nla.gov.au/librariesaustralia/cathelp/bib/ecbdhold.html

Physical description of the item is in the 300 tag - http://www.nla.gov.au/librariesaustralia/cathelp/bib/ecbdphys.html

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Here's an example MARC record for an electronic version of "At the Mountains of Madness".

000	 	00780cam a22002293a 4500
001	    	000044735737
003	    	AuCNLKIN
005	    	20091009135052.0
007	    	cr cn|nnn||n|n
008	    	090419s2009 at es 000 f eng d
035	  __  	$a(OCoLC)450681233
040	  __  	$aSUA$beng$cSUA
100	  1_  	$aLovecraft, H. P.$q(Howard Phillips),$d1890-1937.
245	  10  	$aAt the Mountains of Madness$h[electronic resource] /$cH.P. Lovecraft.
260	  __  	$aAdelaide :$bThe University of Adelaide Library,$c2009.
500	  __  	$aThe University of Adelaide Library eBooks @ Adelaide.
506	  __  	$aFreely available.
516	  __  	$aElectronic text.
653	  __  	$aLiterature
830	  _0  	$aeBooks @ Adelaide.
850	  __  	$aSUA$b1353267$cOnline access
856	  40  	$uhttp://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/l/lovecraft/hp/mountains

 

The record that users see is here-

http://trove.nla.gov.au/work/9640772?selectedversion=NBD44735737

 

Sorry, but I am a librarian and this is my work - so apologies for too much information.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

ok, never try to outpun a librarian

[ghost-angel]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Shoot, for a build - unless there's some burning need to make it a major part of the campaign

 

Access Perk; 5pts - information is based on GM needs and Player requests.

 

I wouldn't take it any further than that mechanically.

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

For something as large as a multidimensional library, the simplest answer is to use no classification system at all.

Use accession numbers. Give each item a unique number.

All the "finding of stuff" happens with the records about those numbers.

[The Weapon]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

One thing you need to watch out for is subjects that are classified differently in different universes. For example the "eaters of hashish" are classified as a historical cult in this universe, in others they're classified as a revival movement that brought Islam back to it's proper roots against the brutal resistance of heretics.

[Lucius]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

One thing you need to watch out for is subjects that are classified differently in different universes. For example the "eaters of hashish" are classified as a historical cult in this universe' date=' in others they're classified as a revival movement that brought Islam back to it's proper roots against the brutal resistance of heretics.[/quote']

 

Astrology and Astronomy would have completely different classifications in one world, and in another be basically the same subject.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Classify a palindromedary

[TSandman]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

Ooook*

 

 

 

 

* But how do you catalog an infinite number of documents?

[Curufea]

Re: Library Cataloging System for a Multidimensional Library

 

One thing you need to watch out for is subjects that are classified differently in different universes. For example the "eaters of hashish" are classified as a historical cult in this universe' date=' in others they're classified as a revival movement that brought Islam back to it's proper roots against the brutal resistance of heretics.[/quote']

 

This is basically what authority files are for, subject or title authority - in this case subject. We're currently working on people authorities at my work as well (ie how do we know this John Smith the actor is also this John Smith that wrote this book or this John smith the CEO)

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authority_file