Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

FreeDice

"Bloodied" in HERO

Recommended Posts

I'd like to incorporate the D&D rules for Bloodied into my campaign. Has anyone tried this? Stories of success or failure?

 

I was thinking powers/talents activating could include the following Limitations:

 

Only When Wounded: -1/4 (Only when character has taken 1 or more Body)

Only When Bloodied: -1 (Only when character is at 1/2 Body or below.)

 

Thoughts?

 

(I tried a search and didn't find anything, but maybe this has been brought up in a previous thread, because I can't believe I'm the first to want to try this.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I've played nothing but Hero and a bit of ShadowRun for the past 15 years. I haven't touch DnD in longer than that, so have no idea what 'Bloodied' means.

 

When asking how to convert something from another system it's a good idea to let us know what it is you want to convert and how it works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Bloodied means the Character is at 50% Health; or half-way to dead.

 

The trick is that in DnD4e once you reach 0 Hit Points, you start to die. Unlike Hero where you need to reach Negative Body.

 

In Hero I've played in games where as long as you have Positive Stun you're awake and can do something other than Bleed Out one you reach negative body. An utterly straight translation to Hero would be that Bloodied occurs at 0 Body, though there are enough considerations on both sides of the fence that a straight conversion isn't workable.

 

So, in Hero Terms; Bloodied simply means 1/2 your Starting Body.

 

In DnD there is not particularly interesting effects that occur, in general, when Bloodied. In fact, all it means is 1/2 Starting Hit Points.

 

Some Abilities take effect when you become Bloodied, so really it's a Limitation on Powers in Hero to rely on a Character reaching 1/2 Body to work. So the solution in the OP is entirely workable.

 

The only catch is that in DnD it is very easy to regain Hit Points and characters tend to yo-yo in and out of Bloodied in prolonged combats, not so much in Hero unless you have copious amounts of Healing and/or Positive Adjustment Powers than come into play often. Otherwise "Only When Bloodied" is likely worth a -1/2 and would be useful for a much longer period of time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I would add some genre considerations, in a champs game it could easily be a -1 or even -2, but in Fantacy I would agree with G-A

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Ghost Angel: My rationale for the -1 for Bloodied is akin to yours - that lack of yoyoing is going to mean there will be many combats where a character is never Bloodied, as opposed to in D&D, where a character likely has a chance to get Bloodied (and then healed) much more easily. The fact that when a character in HERO is "Bloodied," he's in a lot more trouble, was my reasoning for a full -1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I think the value should depend on the character and the genre. My friend's Champions character (75% resistant damage reduction, lots of regeneration, no other resistant defenses) reaches the "bloodied" state pretty often while a more classic brick in the same campaign would almost never reach it. I'd say it would be worth from (-1/2) to (-2) depending on character/genre.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Hmm. If using the optional Bleeding rules, you could also go with it working only while the character is Bleeding from one or more wounds, or only when the average amount bled (according to the Bleeding dice) is greater that the character's Rec. That would both reduce the frequency with which the condition occurs for all characters, and would reduce the temptation for the player to purposefully keep the character in that condition in order to keep the limited powers working.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Ghost Angel: My rationale for the -1 for Bloodied is akin to yours - that lack of yoyoing is going to mean there will be many combats where a character is never Bloodied' date=' as opposed to in D&D, where a character likely has a chance to get Bloodied (and then healed) much more easily. The fact that when a character in HERO is "Bloodied," he's in a lot more trouble, was my reasoning for a full -1.[/quote']

 

Depends entirely on the Genre and Game at hand. I have a Champions character that has yet to go a fight without losing Body, more of often than not 1/2 of it.

 

In a Fantasy Hero Game I'm in if you get hit you will lose Body, and likely get to 'bloodied' rather quickly. Healing time varies from Slow to Really Slow.

 

Meanwhile in a StarHero Game the Characters almost never lost Body, and if they did it was healed quickly.

 

some genres will yo-yo almost as much as DnD, making it worth -1/2 at best. Some won't see it often but when you do it sticks around a while, still likely a -1/2. Some will almost never see that condition, making it -1 or even more of a Limitation.

 

There is no System Wide rule of thumb for how often any given Character loses Body. Also - if it does happen and the Characters are in even more trouble, the Limitation isn't going to be Limiting much, especially if it's a favorable factor and you attempt to get Bloodied (Tiefling abilities for example).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

One option that Hero gives you (that DnD does not) is basing' date=' "Bloodied" off of STUN or END instead of BODY.[/quote']

 

Hadn't thought of that ... excellent idea. Stun bounces in Hero the same way Hit Points bounce in 4E. It'd actually be a better substitute mechanically for the same effect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Hmm...

 

I've read through this thread and it strikes m as this would be trying to add something that pretty much already exists.

 

The addition of Bloodied to D&D4e looks to be their method of trying to deal with the old problem of a D&D PC acting at 100% until he keels over dead. Unless things have dramatically changed, D&D hit points are not remotely the same as Hero Body. Hit points were a cumulative abstract of all the things that made the character tough, from physical ability to withstand damage to the skill to avoid it. An attack wasn't a single sword blow but a roll to determine the odds of applying damage from a flurry of blows or strikes. An abstract damage count applied to an abstract damage total. Yet as we all know as someone take damage their ability to act is slowly (or quickly) impaired.

 

In Hero each attack is one single attack. A PC takes damage, not just body, but also stun. They can also be dazed (stunned). Plus there are many other already existing options hit location, wounding , Impairing, Disabling, KnockDown, Bleeding, Critica Hits and even long term endurance. All these things pretty much seem to do over a range of effect what D&D4e makes an absolute at half hit points.

 

I guess I am just missing the point :ugly:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I guess I am just missing the point :ugly:

 

The point is restricting some abilities to only work when you are wounded, and the question is what exact criterion to use for such a Limitation.

 

It's the old movie effect: the worse off the protagonist is, the better/harder he fights. Call it anger, desperation, or simple dramatic effect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

The simplest would be happens when you first take BODY

 

Ooh! Idea! How about getting a Charge each time you take Body damage (possibly having the Charge expire if it isn't used in a certain amount of time)? (Basically a form of Recoverable charges, though the circumstances under which they recover are somewhat restrictive for most characters.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

Hmm...

 

I've read through this thread and it strikes m as this would be trying to add something that pretty much already exists.

 

The addition of Bloodied to D&D4e looks to be their method of trying to deal with the old problem of a D&D PC acting at 100% until he keels over dead. Unless things have dramatically changed, D&D hit points are not remotely the same as Hero Body. Hit points were a cumulative abstract of all the things that made the character tough, from physical ability to withstand damage to the skill to avoid it. An attack wasn't a single sword blow but a roll to determine the odds of applying damage from a flurry of blows or strikes. An abstract damage count applied to an abstract damage total. Yet as we all know as someone take damage their ability to act is slowly (or quickly) impaired.

 

In Hero each attack is one single attack. A PC takes damage, not just body, but also stun. They can also be dazed (stunned). Plus there are many other already existing options hit location, wounding , Impairing, Disabling, KnockDown, Bleeding, Critica Hits and even long term endurance. All these things pretty much seem to do over a range of effect what D&D4e makes an absolute at half hit points.

 

I guess I am just missing the point :ugly:

 

No - Bloodied itself imposes no restrictions on the Characters actions in any way.

 

It is a Condition.

 

Some Monster, Class and Race Abilities only trigger when "Target is Bloodied" or such. For instance a Tiefling gains bonuses to attack when someone in the fight is Bloodied. There are a few monsters that trigger an attack of some kind when they become Bloodied. Our Cleric had an ability that if you were Bloodied and adjacent to him you got a bonus to Defenses.

 

None of this can be covered by Hero's Optional Damage/Wounding Rules in any way because it doesn't mean the same thing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

The point is restricting some abilities to only work when you are wounded, and the question is what exact criterion to use for such a Limitation.

 

It's the old movie effect: the worse off the protagonist is, the better/harder he fights. Call it anger, desperation, or simple dramatic effect.

 

No - Bloodied itself imposes no restrictions on the Characters actions in any way.

 

It is a Condition.

 

Some Monster, Class and Race Abilities only trigger when "Target is Bloodied" or such. For instance a Tiefling gains bonuses to attack when someone in the fight is Bloodied. There are a few monsters that trigger an attack of some kind when they become Bloodied. Our Cleric had an ability that if you were Bloodied and adjacent to him you got a bonus to Defenses.

 

None of this can be covered by Hero's Optional Damage/Wounding Rules in any way because it doesn't mean the same thing.

 

Oh,

 

OK, I must have completely misread the OP.

 

Nevermind my comments...disregard...

 

I will now return to the underside of my rock :doi:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

So in my gaming group, we used the term "Bloodied" to mean 1/2 STUN or less (with the idea that if you knock someone out, you can kick them in the head and keep them down most of the time). This is because in the games we play, BODY damage does occure (and I've seen people knocked to 0 or less BODY), but the fight ends when one side runs out of concious people rather than people alive. So in HERO we think of STUN like D&D HP (when you run to 0 of it, you cannot participate until someone gets you back up).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I think I understand what the term means now. Heck, that's just a Limitation or possibly the concept behind a Power build (or maybe some Accidental Change).

 

Battle Frenzy: +10 STR, Only When < 1/2 STUN.

Berzerker Barrage (yes, from the old Marvel SuperHeroes game): Enraged/Berserk: Only When < 1/2 STUN

Unstoppable: +10 REC, Only When < 1/2 STUN, 4 Charges Lasting 1 Turn.

Can't Keep a Good Man Down: 4d6 AID to STR, CON, END, STUN Simultaneously, Triggered by being < 1/2 STUN

 

Those are even fairly standard/normal kinds of berserker powers and I tend to use them with a fair bit of frequency.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I seem to recall an old 4th edition gladiator type character from Alien Enemies had this exact power. He had extra PD, ED, & Con "Only when under xx Stun" to reflect his amazing fueled-by-determination comeback victories. His name was "The Champ" or something like that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: "Bloodied" in HERO

 

I think I understand what the term means now. Heck, that's just a Limitation or possibly the concept behind a Power build (or maybe some Accidental Change).

 

Battle Frenzy: +10 STR, Only When < 1/2 STUN.

Berzerker Barrage (yes, from the old Marvel SuperHeroes game): Enraged/Berserk: Only When < 1/2 STUN

Unstoppable: +10 REC, Only When < 1/2 STUN, 4 Charges Lasting 1 Turn.

Can't Keep a Good Man Down: 4d6 AID to STR, CON, END, STUN Simultaneously, Triggered by being < 1/2 STUN

 

Those are even fairly standard/normal kinds of berserker powers and I tend to use them with a fair bit of frequency.

 

Well, the interesting side effect of using STUN, is that improving your REC would take you out of the Bloodied phase rather easily.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...