Clever Future Weapons

[CorpCommander]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

I for one am opposed to fighting on a battlefield where the use of weapons designed to shoot through friendlies is in effect!

 

signed,

Private Mancini,

Red Shirt, Engineering Section

[Old Man]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

The one with the rifle shoots!

 

One out of two gets a rifle.

 

The one without follows him!

 

When the one with the rifle gets killed,

 

the one who is following picks up the rifle and shoots!

 

The one with the rifle shoots!

[sinanju]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

"Realistic" space combat can look really weird. My understanding of the current state of affairs is that it's a lot like really fragile submarine warfare--it's next to impossible to detect an opponent unless they do something active' date=' but it's really easy to take out an opponent with lasers or what amounts to BBs. And then if all this is happening in orbit, instead of deep space, and it matters what part of the planet is underneath the combatants, it gets stranger.[/quote']

 

Yeah, and dumping waste heat is apparently a major problem. The reason the space shuttle is always seen with the bay doors open is that that's how it gets rid of waste heat. If they couldn't do that, they'd soon be in big trouble. And that's when the shuttle is mostly just coasting and keeping the pilots alive.

 

Now imagine big-*** warships racing around, crewmen breathing and radiating body heat, and all that machinery working furiously, and weapons generating huge amounts of power, and...

 

Space travel sounds less and less fun the more we learn about it.

[sinanju]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

I for one am opposed to fighting on a battlefield where the use of weapons designed to shoot through friendlies is in effect!

 

signed,

Private Mancini,

Red Shirt, Engineering Section

 

Private Mancini,

 

The UTDF (Unified Terran Defense Forces) Office of Personnel Health and Safety (OPHS) has validated the Gamma Knife Defense Array (GKDA) as perfectly safe for friendly troops. It is recognized as safe and effective by all allied nations.

 

Furthermore, it is the only truly effective anti-personnel weapon with such a low "friendly fire" rating in our arsenal, until the MBGA (Magic Bad Guy Annihilator) is perfected. Not using it on the battlefield is not an option.

 

Finally, spreading malicious rumors that the UTDF would even consider employing a weapon that might harm our own troops when used properly is offensive to me personally. It is also against regulations and could, if repeated, result in charges of treason. Please bear this in mind in all future correspondence.

 

However, given your feelings on the matter, I have taken the liberty of looking over your jacket. In accordance with your stated preferences, I am removing you from your current front line unit. You will be reassigned to the Collective Landing Division, where you will participate in "proving" new worlds for habitation. This is a glorious opportunity to serve your nation, your world, and your species. Let me be the first to congratulate you on your reassignment to the The Expendables.

 

Sincerely,

Maj. Gen. Richard Gobbler

UTDF Commander

[Old Man]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

I for one am opposed to fighting on a battlefield where the use of weapons designed to shoot through friendlies is in effect!

 

signed,

Private Mancini,

Red Shirt, Engineering Section

 

Private Mancini,

 

You have been transferred. Please report to the power generation office for training in your new capacity as reactor shielding. Thank you.

 

Sincerely,

The Computer

[Foxiekins]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Private Mancini,

 

You have been transferred. Please report to the power generation office for training in your new capacity as reactor shielding. Thank you.

 

Sincerely,

The Computer

 

The Computer is your Friend...!!!

[gewing]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Private Mancini,

 

The UTDF (Unified Terran Defense Forces) Office of Personnel Health and Safety (OPHS) has validated the Gamma Knife Defense Array (GKDA) as perfectly safe for friendly troops. It is recognized as safe and effective by all allied nations.

 

Furthermore, it is the only truly effective anti-personnel weapon with such a low "friendly fire" rating in our arsenal, until the MBGA (Magic Bad Guy Annihilator) is perfected. Not using it on the battlefield is not an option.

 

Finally, spreading malicious rumors that the UTDF would even consider employing a weapon that might harm our own troops when used properly is offensive to me personally. It is also against regulations and could, if repeated, result in charges of treason. Please bear this in mind in all future correspondence.

 

However, given your feelings on the matter, I have taken the liberty of looking over your jacket. In accordance with your stated preferences, I am removing you from your current front line unit. You will be reassigned to the Collective Landing Division, where you will participate in "proving" new worlds for habitation. This is a glorious opportunity to serve your nation, your world, and your species. Let me be the first to congratulate you on your reassignment to the The Expendables.

 

Sincerely,

Maj. Gen. Richard Gobbler

UTDF Commander

 

 

I imagine his "Oh #hit" moment would be interesting.

 

"This is what expendable means."

[CorpCommander]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Ok its been a while since my favorite thread has been active. Lets see what new life we can add.

 

So I recently came across some interesting reading on retro-sci-fi weapons that the German's are alleged to have developed. The so called Foo Fighters apparently were radio controled, radar invisible, HiRF weapons meant to bring down fighters by shutting down their engines. It is unclear that any of them actually worked. No example model craft has ever been displayed as an example Foo Fighter. The Feuerball as it was called by the Germans and of course we know of no known weapon system to be later derived from this.

 

Still though it made for interesting reading and neatly ties up pretty much all of the UFO history that's been made since the early 40's through today if one imagines that that branch of technology has been kept secret all this time.

 

Here is an example web site on the technology. Did it really exist? I think at best we have both speculation and one post-war written account. Judge for yourself.

 

http://discaircraft.greyfalcon.us/WNF%20Feuerball.htm

[Sundog]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Time bomb. Small anti-personnel grenade that teleports everything inside the explosion radius backwards in time by a predetermined amount. Used on conventional planets it can project the target area into vacuum - the planet moves forward on its orbital rotation during the time differential

Someone's been reading the Strontium Dog strip from 2000AD, I suspect! Another one, from the Rogue Trooper strip - Bio-Wire. Living barbed wire that attacks and consumes anyone who tries to cross it, and regrows damaged portions in minutes - useful for area denial.

[DusterBoy]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Stunner, the only weapon that really lets you shoot first and ask questions later.

 

Nerve Disrupter: very popular on spaceships and space stations, effective against personell without causing embaressing holes to let the vacuum in.

 

Plasma Rifle: your basic superheated gas gun.

 

Needler: gauss gun that fires hundreds of steel fletchetts.

 

All old standbys, but all useful.

 

Sounds like you've been reading the Vorkosigan saga - only there they call 'em plasma arcs.

 

The Tau Empire in WH40K have fusion blasters built into their XV8 Crisis battlesuits.

 

Has anyone heard of MetalStorm - the technology pioneered by Australian Mike O'Dwyer? Essentially it's an electronic improvement over mechanical firearms wherein the weapon has multiple barrels - say two 9mm and two 15mm in the VLE SmartGun - which have a prepackaged number of rounds which are fired electronically. This means that multiple rounds can be fired at the same target in a very short time before the recoil throws off the aim. Get enough barrels together and you can have a theoretical ROF in excess of 1,000,000rpm.

 

The tech can be used in smallarms, but it also makes a great area denial system. Non lethal rounds can be used - the VLE SmartGun fires 15mm beanbags - making it the "firearm" version of the stunner.

[CorpCommander]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

MetalStorm and iRobot have teamed up. Now all they need to do is team up with a neural-linguistic vendor and pretty much the ultimate Cyberdyne model T-1s will be rolling off the assembly line.

 

I've seen the area defense MSgun in action and it is frightening. It tracks motion and smokes anything in it's field of view. I am sure they will have multiple barrels with various types of ammo to choose from; anti-personnel, anti-tank, anti-aircraft/missile... if protected well they would be better than mine fields at re-directing traffic!

 

Also, imagine the robot version and how that could be use for ambush...

 

Ambush along phase line alpha, fall back after contact to ridgeline beta, smoke the enemy as they crest the ridge in counter attack, move to phase line delta and repeat.

 

See this article for an example iRobot with a 40mm version of the MetalStorm gun: Metal Storm reaches Navy test range

[Michael Hopcroft]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

MetalStorm and iRobot have teamed up. Now all they need to do is team up with a neural-linguistic vendor and pretty much the ultimate Cyberdyne model T-1s will be rolling off the assembly line.

 

I've seen the area defense MSgun in action and it is frightening. It tracks motion and smokes anything in it's field of view. I am sure they will have multiple barrels with various types of ammo to choose from; anti-personnel, anti-tank, anti-aircraft/missile... if protected well they would be better than mine fields at re-directing traffic!

 

Also, imagine the robot version and how that could be use for ambush...

 

Ambush along phase line alpha, fall back after contact to ridgeline beta, smoke the enemy as they crest the ridge in counter attack, move to phase line delta and repeat.

 

See this article for an example iRobot with a 40mm version of the MetalStorm gun: Metal Storm reaches Navy test range

 

Now that is frightening. How does a weapon like that distinguish friend from foe from innocent person trying to go about his business? How do you tell it to stop shooting in such a way that a savvy enemy can't fake the order? How do you stop eemy hackers from using it against your own troops? What if unscupulous regimes use it to break up protests?

[Sundog]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Now that is frightening. How does a weapon like that distinguish friend from foe from innocent person trying to go about his business? How do you tell it to stop shooting in such a way that a savvy enemy can't fake the order? How do you stop eemy hackers from using it against your own troops? What if unscupulous regimes use it to break up protests?

 

 

Robots, at this time, cannot be expected to recognize friendly troops from enemies, let alone noncombatants. Reasonably, current models would not be robots, but drones, under the control of a behind-the-lines operators. Hackers would be a danger, but modern encryption is pretty damn good.

 

As for unscrupulous regimes, how would it be any different from what China did in Tiananmen Square? You don't need high-tech to make an atrocity.

[Nyrath]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

This should be trivial to simulate in Hero terms:

http://technology.newscientist.com/article/dn14372-toy-rocket-inspires-variablespeed-bullets.html?DCMP=ILC-hmts&nsref=news5_head_dn14372

[CorpCommander]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Now that is frightening. How does a weapon like that distinguish friend from foe from innocent person trying to go about his business?

 

Avoid combat in built up areas that have not been evacuated yet. Unless you belong to an organization that doesn't care about collateral damage. In fact if you are an Afghan Warlord who doesn't like the current democratic based government in Kabul you might consider placing babies strategically around your meeting site in full view of the drone with the guns and missiles. I've personally seen that and you can easily find videos of such on the net.

 

How do you tell it to stop shooting in such a way that a savvy enemy can't fake the order? How do you stop eemy hackers from using it against your own troops?

 

Encryption and complex data streams. How many Predator drones have been co-opted by the enemy? None. Could the Chinese or Russians do it? They sure would like to try. The control setup is quite complex with bi-directional information streams with lots of interesting information. You'd need to steal both a drone and the control setup to figure out a way of decoding it. You could probably make some guesses as to what needs to be sent but without knowing the CRC methods you'd be unable to send the right commands.

 

What if unscupulous regimes use it to break up protests?

 

You can end that sentence at "unscrupulous regimes". As soon as you say that it doesn't matter what else is there. Unscrupulous regimes can make their own robots now. Heck the Chinese will have unmanned drones in Quiqdao for the Olympics' security. The Chinese have already tested unmanned ground based security robots in real crowds in the capital of Jinan this past July 4th. The future is now.

 

Check out the Foster-Miller TALON series of robots:

[Old Man]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

You know, one of the things I always hated about Shadowrun was the rigger concept. The idea that you could have a useful PC who did nothing but operate little ROVs seemed completely ridiculous. Suddenly, that's no longer the case.

[Cancer]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

You know' date=' one of the things I always hated about Shadowrun was the rigger concept. The idea that you could have a useful PC who did nothing but operate little ROVs seemed completely ridiculous. Suddenly, that's no longer the case.[/quote']

 

Heh. As a Shadowrun player, it got so that every adventure had to have some bit right at the outset to take away the rigger's toys so that she didn't just shred the opposition at the outset and, other than the guardian spirit (against whom only the mages could do anything) it'd be strictly a walkover. Rigger, mage, face guy, and decker. No one else was needed.

[Maelstrom]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Miniature antigrav robot security attendants.

 

Nanoclouds have all sorts of interesting applications.

 

Personal geosynchronous laser platforms. Be the first on your block to get one.

 

My 50's atomic space opera game has a Vibro-Gun that fires tiny metal shards into a target and then uses a high-powered magentic beam to vibrate it to smithereens.

 

-AA

 

Oh, that's 50's-atomic-coolness right there. Kudos.

[Nyrath]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

There were a few amusing weapons in the novels of Philip E. High ("Invader on my Back", "The Prodigal Sun").

 

One used a force field (a "line-of-force") to throw tiny chemical crystals. If the crystals penetrated a person's skin, it would start a chemical reaction that would cause the person's body to burn like a torch.

 

Some assassin weapons would fire a bullet that would travel a pre-set distance, turn 90 degrees, then continue on to the target. These made it hard to back track the bullet to locate the assassin. It could also fire around the corner of a building.

 

Microscopic missiles would fly really slowly (at about the same speed as a walking person), until they were within ten feet of the target.

[McCoy]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Robots, at this time, cannot be expected to recognize friendly troops from enemies, let alone noncombatants. Reasonably, current models would not be robots, but drones, under the control of a behind-the-lines operators. Hackers would be a danger, but modern encryption is pretty damn good.

 

As for unscrupulous regimes, how would it be any different from what China did in Tiananmen Square? You don't need high-tech to make an atrocity.

I've heard that the current generation of armed drones was withdrawn from combat because they kept locking onto friendlies. Never shot any of them, just thought about it. A lot.

[DusterBoy]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

In Storming Heaven Dale Brown posits "plasma-yield warhead" missiles. Essentially, it's a regular missile but instead of an explosive warhead it generates plasma. The idea is that it would completely vapourise the target instead of blowing it up and strewing burning debris everywhere. It was conceived primarily as an ABM system.

[Vulcan]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

Its lame in the fact that it is so overdone. I doubt coherent light weapons will become useful as personal weapons. I think more interesting weapons will come into play and coherent light will play the part it's played for 3 decades now: range finding and guiding. Some lasers have been useful for ABM and anti-satalite work but overall I don't see people running around with laser weapons anytime soon if ever.

 

As we've seen there has been some pretty good discussion so I am pretty happy with this thread in general.

 

In the Hammer's Slammers series David Drake gives a pretty good explanation of why, barring the invention of a stoooopidly efficient power supply, lasers are not the best choice for personal weapons. The powerguns he writes about in the series may not be any more practical, but they are cool.

[Vulcan]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

How about a Tressor aka Rattler. A tractor-pressor beam that changes direction of movement every .01 second.

 

Sounds a lot like the Klingon's disruptors. Virr'dakassi, literally translated as the 'shake it 'til it falls apart tool.'

 

Of course, the Disruptor worked by alternately supressing and increasing the atomic forces that hold molecules together.

[Nyrath]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

In the Hammer's Slammers series David Drake gives a pretty good explanation of why' date=' barring the invention of a [i']stoooopidly [/i]efficient power supply, lasers are not the best choice for personal weapons.

True.

 

The explanation can be found quoted here (scroll down)

http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/rocket3l.html#lasermagazine

[Vulcan]

Re: Clever Future Weapons

 

I liked the STAR HERO "Fast Neutron Rifle" that went right through people with light or no armor but fried those in heavy armor -- i.e.' date=' rebel scum like on Hoth against fully armoured stormtroopers, so you could fire through your mass of cheap light troops without worrying about "friendly fire" and hit the bad guys easily. (NND vs. <5 DEF Armor)[/quote']

 

I have a Power Armor character who uses a "tacyon burst' with similar effects.