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Common superhero types you've never seen in play


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A random thought to spark discussion. What are common things you see in superhero comics that you've never (or almost never) seen in play in your Champions games? Primarily on the PC side, though missing villain concepts is fine too.

 

1. Telepaths who are not also telekinetics. They're fairly common in comics (Prof. X and Psylocke probably being the most prominent), but I've never seen a telepath without a TK shield and flight. Related ...

 

2. Energy projectors who don't fly and/or have forcefields. I don't ever recall seeing a grounded energy projector in any games I've been in for the last 20 years or so. No Havok or Cyclops, always Green Lantern or Human Torch ...

 

3. Stretchy characters. I've only seen one.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

1. Bricks, without Insane levels of Resistant Defenses. Some of the best Bricks in comics have little to none in that regard.

 

2. Stretchy Characters, mostly because HERO has always been week on stretching compared to other Super Hero games..... When you do see it, it's often just for a Brick with Stretchy Arms or such.....

 

3. OAF characters.

 

4. Characters with basically, 1 Power. IE: Angel ....I got Wings I fly......

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

That's not all. He also has eyes like an eagle. He said so.

 

And there's the "I bleed all over you and you heal" schtick.

 

A smidge of + to Visual Perception and some telescopic Sight Group And Wings, I'd say, He's Still the guy with Wings that Flies. The Healing Stuff, Apocalypse Horseman Archangel Stuff is all Worked in Crappy Iron Age Schlock, because, "A Guy with Wings that Flies isn't Cool, Gritty, and Edgy, and I know what Let's give him RAZOR WINGS and Blue Skin that would be AWESOME!!" *Makes the Iron Age Squee of Approval noise*........

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

I define Stretching Characters as such: Mr. Fantastic, The Elongated Man, Plastic Man, Jimmy Olsen on the Gingold Formula, Monkey D. Luffy, Mrs. Incredible aka Elasti-Girl, and then the Doom Patrols Elastigirl, and her enemy Madam Rouge, Rubber Duck, Casanova Wannabe, All of the Metal Men, The Albino, Mr. Abnormal, Morph, Xavin, Shape, Rubbermaid, Longfellow, Snapback, Dr. Incredible (from Top Ten), Protoplasman, Monster Clown Mortimer Strick (sort of the opposite of Skin, just his BONES stretch, The Thin Man, Flatman, Rubberman, Lastic, Lastikman, Polly Mer, Rubernecker, Possibly one of the new members of the Titans in September, Ping the Elastic Man, The Martian Manhunter (and any DC Martian), Jemm Son of Saturn, Super Skrull (the real one not the copies and wannabe's), Skin (with a limitation that's still stretchy, Not just Reach)....

 

If you are just a limb stretcher, like say Machine Man, you don't count......which brings me to my next hardly seen type of PC.....

 

Machine Man. Like the comic, with the same sorta hangups....same to be said for The Original Human Torch, The Red Tornado, The Metal Men and others here and there.

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Aqua Man types: No one ever wants to be an ocean-going water-boy in the game.

Never seen anyone with telepathic control over marine life, or a 3D6 HKA fish slap. or the dependance: drink water every hour.

 

Never even seen a Prince Namor type.

 

You would think this would be a magnet draw for gamers...

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Small people. I've never gamed with heroes who could get small like the Atom or Ant Man.

 

and no one has ever used the power to control insects like ants...or bees. The Red Bee had no powers other than the ability to control bees. He even had one pet bee that lived in his belt buckle for emergencies. Bad guys are really scared of bees. That's a 12D6 mind-control, only one command: "Fear!" attack right there. "Oh noes! A BEE! Ruuuuun!"

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

A straight Shapeshifter, that is someone who just changes their appearance but can't ape others powers or develop new ones when they change something like Mystique. Not in a "standard" superhero game anyway but I have seen it in super agents or "people with powers" style gamer. I guess this would fall under the general lack of "One trick pony" PCs.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Intangible/ghost types, whose powers are based around desolidification and invisibility. Phantom Girl, or Phantom Lady. Now, I've seen these powers combined with the ability to become a cloud of some gas, or in combination with Density Increase and Light Control, but never as the base of their own character.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

I love these types of topics because I love to hear about what types of characters others are playing. I have seen many of the examples above in play because my players are weird:

 

Acid Man (a Tunneling/ Clinging Energy Projector), Brainstorm (was a non-telekinetic mentalist), Matador (Desolidification, Invisibility, Telportation, and Images all with the same SFX, you never knew if he was really there or not), Doppelganger (Shape Shifting infiltrator without power mimicry), Quark (Shrinking plus Density Increase, he was brutal), and tons of Stretchy guys

 

...but after thinking about it for awhile (and this blows my mind), I have never played in a game that I can remember where someone had only fire powers, like the Human Torch or Firebird. This wouldn't be considered common but I have also never seen anyone play a possessor, like Jericho or Nocturne. I tried once but the character was quickly bounced out of the game.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

A random thought to spark discussion. What are common things you see in superhero comics that you've never (or almost never) seen in play in your Champions games? Primarily on the PC side' date=' though missing villain concepts is fine too.[/quote']

 

OK, I'm going to lump a lot of these under the broad umbrella of "one trick ponies" who are not balanced for game play. That is, characters who do not have powers granting attacks and defenses which allow them to compete in traditional Hero Games combat. This would include:

 

1. Telepaths who are not also telekinetics.

 

Except those with Mental Attack, and I have seen several non-flying non TK characters of this variety.

 

4. Characters with basically, 1 Power. IE: Angel ....I got Wings I fly......[/quote[

 

Small people. I've never gamed with heroes who could get small like the Atom or Ant Man.

 

I've seen energy projectors (that DCV is powerful) but not characters like the Atom who need to attack HTH. Having "the full strength of a grown man" doesn't do a lot of damage against characters with 20 - 25 defenses.

 

A straight Shapeshifter' date=' that is someone who just changes their appearance but can't ape others powers or develop new ones when they change something like Mystique. Not in a "standard" superhero game anyway but I have seen it in super agents or "people with powers" style gamer. I guess this would fall under the general lack of "One trick pony" PCs.[/quote]

 

Intangible/ghost types' date=' whose powers are based around desolidification and invisibility. Phantom Girl, or Phantom Lady. Now, I've seen these powers combined with the ability to become a cloud of some gas, or in combination with Density Increase and Light Control, but never as the base of their own character.[/quote']

 

A lot of these, like the two above, are characters with no obvious attack powers. So you either bulk them up with other powers, or buy high levels of martial arts (which are normally already the schtick of the ubiquitous standard Martial Artist in the group). How many of the X-Men have a power suite that naturally lends itself to typical Champions levels of Damage Classes and Defenses, including rDEF?

 

Others are discouraged by game mechanics to some extent, whether because they aren't point efficient or just because they aren't easy to build:

 

2. Energy projectors who don't fly and/or have forcefields. I don't ever recall seeing a grounded energy projector in any games I've been in for the last 20 years or so. No Havok or Cyclops' date=' always Green Lantern or Human Torch ...[/quote']

 

Because they don't have/can't justify the defenses needed to be competitive in combat (and because, prior to 6e, they want the EC discount and now they want the Unified Power discount).

 

3. Stretchy characters. I've only seen one.

 

2. Stretchy Characters' date=' mostly because HERO has always been week on stretching compared to other Super Hero games..... When you do see it, it's often just for a Brick with Stretchy Arms or such.....[/quote']

 

I'd say because Hero does not have a simplistic "Stretchy Character" power - you have to build a power suite around the SFX of "Stretchy" that gets you damage and versatility in the style needed for Hero combat success.

 

3. OAF characters.

 

I've seen lots of Archers alone.

 

1. Bricks' date=' without Insane levels of Resistant Defenses. Some of the best Bricks in comics have little to none in that regard.[/quote']

 

I've seen a few characters without high rDEF (Bricks and others), but they nearly always have high Regeneration (otherwise they have insane DCV). Because, in Hero, no rDEF = no more character once they come up against killing attacks.

 

Aqua Man types: No one ever wants to be an ocean-going water-boy in the game.

Never seen anyone with telepathic control over marine life, or a 3D6 HKA fish slap. or the dependance: drink water every hour.

 

There's only one in the comics, isn't there?

 

Never even seen a Prince Namor type.

 

I played one. He's just a Flying Brick with a few background powers. He worked quite well.

 

and no one has ever used the power to control insects like ants...or bees. The Red Bee had no powers other than the ability to control bees. He even had one pet bee that lived in his belt buckle for emergencies. Bad guys are really scared of bees. That's a 12D6 mind-control' date=' only one command: "Fear!" attack right there. "Oh noes! A BEE! Ruuuuun!"[/quote']

 

Another that's a tough build - how do you "control insects"? What abilities do they provide? And how useful are bees against Champions villains, who typically have 20 - 25 defenses, and decent rDEF?

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

How many of the X-Men have a power suite that naturally lends itself to typical Champions levels of Damage Classes and Defenses' date=' including rDEF?[/quote']

 

To follow this up, of the original X-Men:

 

Cyclops - no defensive powers

Angel - no defensive or attack powers (move by/through is the only option)

Beast - close, but no rDEF

Iceman - OK, he had ice armor and attack powers so that's one

Marvel Girl - she had TK, but no defensive powers

 

Add Havok (no defense, like Cyclops)

Lorna Dane (well rounded magnetic character)

 

and we have two of seven characters with a balanced power suite like you need in Champions.

 

All-New X-Men?

 

Cyclops again

Thunderbird - no rDEF (created to die anyway)

Banshee - no defensive powers (we'd give him a force field)

Wolverine - at least he has his insane Regen/recovery

Sunfire - no defensive powers (we'd give him a force field)

Nightcrawler - no attack or defense powers

Colossus - balanced brick with rDEF

Storm - no defensive powers (we'd probably give her a force field too)

Phoenix - with all the add-on's probably a balanced/practical Hero character - but that's a major upgrade from Marvel Girl

 

Kitty Pryde - just her Phasing power (no attacks)

 

We could go on, of course, but the fact is that Champions as it has developed practically requires a character to have fairly high attacks, fairly high defenses and some level of resistant defenses to be competitive, and that requires a lot of modification and/or rationalization (like giving many X-Men a bulletproof costume and/or high levels of Martial Arts training) to shoehorn them into the model.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

The character that I have played the most as a PC is Rick Davies the Resilient Rubber-Man, a classic stretching character in the Mr. Fantastic/Elongated Man vein.

 

I have also played both Brainstorm and Forethought who were telepaths without TK.

 

Swift Kick (formerly Madame Morph), who I have never played but have used as a PC in my convention games for the past 10 years, is a classic shapeshifter with minor size powers (a little Growth, DI, and Shrinking) and Martial Arts. She was loosely based on a friend's PC who had a much loonier personality and the possibility of getting stuck in an adopted personna.

 

Lady Luck in my SuperSquad America: The Originals convention game is a blaster without flight. Friction Lass, who was a former PC of mine as well as a convention character, is a blaster who doesn't technically fly, but she can use her friction powers to glide (in appropriate circumstances) so she probably doesn't count.

 

Spook, in my Remarkable Wrong-Righters convention game, is a dead secret agent who has failed to pass on to the Realms of the Dead. He has the classic ghost powers plus the skills of a secret agent.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Cyclops - no defensive powers

Really? I've seen The old Blue and Yellow team take blows that sent him flying dozens of meters and get right up. I've seen h

Angel - no defensive or attack powers (move by/through is the only option)

Beast - close, but no rDEF

Iceman - OK, he had ice armor and attack powers so that's one

Marvel Girl - she had TK, but no defensive powers

Add Havok (no defense, like Cyclops)

Lorna Dane (well rounded magnetic character)

 

and we have two of seven characters with a balanced power suite like you need in Champions.[/Quote]

 

No defensive powers? I've seen the old Blue and Yellow team take blows that sent them flying dozens of meters and get right up. I've seen Angel crash-land from multiple stories high and survive (despite the fact that the old Angel was described as having hollow bones I believe) and the beast blown through brick walls. True, these guys don't have traditional HERO armor or force fields but you have to agree their PD is pretty darn high.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

No defensive powers? I've seen the old Blue and Yellow team take blows that sent them flying dozens of meters and get right up. I've seen Angel crash-land from multiple stories high and survive (despite the fact that the old Angel was described as having hollow bones I believe)

 

He is supposed to have hollow bones. I'd attribute all of these to "action movie syndrome". Plus, a PD of 10 will handle an awful lot of damage without taking BOD. Shake off being Stunned and get back up. And I seem to recall a number of issues where Angel may have been out of the fight, but could still use his wings to slow a fall.

 

the beast blown through brick walls. True' date=' these guys don't have traditional HERO armor or force fields but you have to agree their PD is pretty darn high.[/quote']

 

The Beast would have Brick level defenses - he's only really lacking resistant defenses to match the "Champions template".

 

For the most part, their defenses have the SFX "writer's fiat". That doesn't work as well in a game.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Yeah, the lack of true "One Trick Ponies" is most likely due to the fact that they don't function well in an rpg context. In fiction, the wrter has total control, an rpg things more random so players tend to get some other abilities to cover obvious weaknesses that fit the character concept (like a force feild for Blasters). You can simulate Writer's Fiat or Action movei touchness with Hero though through things like Combat Luck and DR so taking those types of builds into account some "One Trick Ponies" might actually be more common if you allow for meta game and utility Powers.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

We played a game long ago (the progenitor of EPIC CITY actually) called Time Fore a Change, wherein the lead PCs were limited to a single power and each power had to come with logical drawbacks.

 

We had…

- Zephyr: A super-speedster who could only run fast but had to wear an exoskeleton and breathing apparatus to survive his high-speed movements.

- The Voice: A guy who had a sonic vocal attack but no lower jaw (and mostly mute) because it had been blown away when his powers appeared.

- Society’s Shield: A powerhouse of Density Increase that was always on – He couldn’t walk up stairs, take standard elevators, walk on wood floors (or the like) or take standard transportation.

- Tinder: A self-immolating hero that burned when he ignited his power (OUCH!).

- Hamatsa: An American Indian boy with wings and hollow (easily broken) bones that had been kept chained in a cave for most of his life out of fear and for worship.

- An Asian girl (can’t remember her name) with Desolidification who immediately began to fall towards the center of the Earth upon activation of her power.

 

And more. ☺

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

I don't believe a single-powered character has to be a "one trick pony." In fact, in my games I prefer to see characters that have a single power focus but that are built for maximum enjoyment and survivability.

 

Let's take Cyclops for example.

Only has an eye beam - Yes. One trick pony - I'm not so sure...

 

What can he do with that eye beam? He can narrow the focus of it down to the point of a welding torch. He can use it at various strengths to blow adversaries away, he can open it up at a wide angle to attack multiple foes, he can bounce his beam from target to target with incredible accuracy, he can use the beam to block incoming attacks. He's slowed his own decent with his beam while falling and has done so for others as well (though it might have hurt a bit). And more.

 

Sounds like a really nice Multipower, a superior Power Skill roll and a lot of great non-combat and combat skills to me. :)

 

Add to that a super suit with some rPD/rED - AWESOME!

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Characters with tissue-paper defenses. Actually fairly common in comics, but uncommon in games. They do occasionally show up as NPC supers or villains, though, sometimes to "teach" trigger-happy PCs about the need for restraint. Variations on this are the Glass Cannon, and the Invulnerable BB Gun(super high defense, minimal offense).

Characters with no offensive powers whatsoever(like a healer, someone with only sensory powers, a teleporter/flier, a telepath with no offensive mental powers, etc.).

I have seen characters with no enhanced movement abilities, and it's kinda funny to hear a player say "My character hails a cab to drop him off near where the action is."

A super-scientist, who ISN'T a gadgeteer. Keep in mind, the Hulk's alter ego is basically this.

I don't recall seeing a writeup for a probability manipulator, though I've seen plenty of characters with several dice of luck.

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

Again, folks can't focus to much on what a PC learns to do with their One SFX power. That's thinking in terms of the system, and not in terms of the character.

 

I like to see builds that have weaknesses as well, and Teams, that are designed as Teams.

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

My second or third PC was very much an homage to Machine Man' date=' including the Pinocchio complex along with the telescopic limbs. :)[/quote']

 

That build I would like. The SFX of Machine Man is played very little. You Might see Cyborgs, but if it's the Pinocchio complex artificial life form, it's often just a walking Gun, or Colossus that talks in a monotone.

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

I don't believe a single-powered character has to be a "one trick pony." In fact, in my games I prefer to see characters that have a single power focus but that are built for maximum enjoyment and survivability.

 

Let's take Cyclops for example.

Only has an eye beam - Yes. One trick pony - I'm not so sure...

 

What can he do with that eye beam? He can narrow the focus of it down to the point of a welding torch. He can use it at various strengths to blow adversaries away, he can open it up at a wide angle to attack multiple foes, he can bounce his beam from target to target with incredible accuracy, he can use the beam to block incoming attacks. He's slowed his own decent with his beam while falling and has done so for others as well (though it might have hurt a bit). And more.

 

Sounds like a really nice Multipower, a superior Power Skill roll and a lot of great non-combat and combat skills to me. :)

 

Add to that a super suit with some rPD/rED - AWESOME!

 

That's a 12d6 Blast vs PD, Slowing a fall is a game effect in the book based on the sfx of his power (even a Pulled "punch"). Blocking attacks with it is just Block. Multiple Foes is just Spreading/ or Multi Attack, or Bouncing. Bouncing is covered in the book as well that just uses up some of his 3 point CSL's with his Blast. He doesn't need a Giant Multipower to pull it all off.

 

He's still just the guy with Force Beams that come out of his eyes, whose single best trick with them, was slicing a birthday cake.

 

~Rex

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Re: Common superhero types you've never seen in play

 

That's a 12d6 Blast vs PD, Slowing a fall is a game effect in the book based on the sfx of his power (even a Pulled "punch"). Blocking attacks with it is just Block. Multiple Foes is just Spreading/ or Multi Attack, or Bouncing. Bouncing is covered in the book as well that just uses up some of his 3 point CSL's with his Blast. He doesn't need a Giant Multipower to pull it all off.

 

He's still just the guy with Force Beams that come out of his eyes, whose single best trick with them, was slicing a birthday cake.

 

~Rex

 

Actually, I think his single best trick with them was blowing a hole THROUGH a mountain! That sounds like more than 12d6 Energy Blast to me.

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