Ndreare Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter No. However, we are discussing ways to let people who've already pledged at the $200 or higher level pay a little extra and get the $150 "help Steve create a character" benefit. Hero can't just give that away for free (since it has to pay me to create the characters, pay someone to lay them out, etc.), but since some people have already pledged generously Hero wants to find a way to let them take advantage of this for not too much more money. However, there are logistical difficulties. We indicated a limit of 10, and that limit may be one thing inspiring someone to pledge at that level. As far as I can tell there's no way for us to "artificially" indicate that one of the ten slots was taken up by a "higher level pledger getting the $150 benefit." OTOH, if we don't count those higher level pledgers, then the people who pledge at $150 expecting to get one of the limited number of benefits may be upset. We're discussing the best way to approach this and will hopefully find a solution that will satisfy everyone. I'll report back on that as soon as I have more info, hopefully later today. It was worth asking. "Win many, lose some" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Well, actually, I have some good news on that front, Ndreare. The main benefit of the new reward -- helping to create a character -- will be extended for free to all backers who pledge at the $1,000 or $2,000 level. Backers who've already pledged at the $200 level and would like to add "create a character" from the $150 tier to their reward can do so for an additional pledge of $50. Characters created by backers from above the $150 tier will be in addition to the 10 allocated for that tier -- so this means more cool characters for all backers to enjoy! Woot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjandreano Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter This is working well, how about Mythic Hero next? Could the Empress cross over to that genera? She becomes a goddess perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter This is working well, how about Mythic Hero next? My plan is to launch the MH Kickstarter after the BotE one ends, probably to run something like Feb. 1 to March 4. But we'll see how long it takes me to get my ducks in a row. (I only have PS: Duck Herding 8-, after all.) Could the Empress cross over to that genera? Anything's possible. But I'll leave that, as they say, as an exercise for the student; I don't at present intend to discuss "deifying existing characters" in MH. I've got enough to cover as it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ako Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Just placed my pledge, really pleased this is going ahead . I've pledged the $150+ because I really would love to create a character for the Champions Universe, stupid question from me, but how/when do you want the character input? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter stupid question from me, but how/when do you want the character input? Not stupid at all, that's a perfectly reasonable inquiry. Once the Kickstarter closes I'll contact all the $150+-level backers individually and start discussing their character with each of them. I figure it's best to wait until the whole thing wraps in case two or more people want to pledge the level and "combine" their input to make twin heroes or something. However, I expect to have a little time next week, so I may go ahead and start contacting people. If someone already knows what they want I can save some time by getting it done in advance. That way we can get the PDF of all the characters out to backers quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balabanto Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Well, actually, I have some good news on that front, Ndreare. The main benefit of the new reward -- helping to create a character -- will be extended for free to all backers who pledge at the $1,000 or $2,000 level. Backers who've already pledged at the $200 level and would like to add "create a character" from the $150 tier to their reward can do so for an additional pledge of $50. Characters created by backers from above the $150 tier will be in addition to the 10 allocated for that tier -- so this means more cool characters for all backers to enjoy! Woot! Do we have the option of building it ourselves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Do we have the option of building it ourselves? No. You provide the basic ideas -- a power set, a background, maybe a name -- but the rest of the work is done by me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I just added an update to the Kickstarter with some another piece of interior art from the book. Go check it out if you get the chance, and please join us as a backer if you haven't already! And in other news, I've already gotten feedback from three of the $150+ donors and have written up two of the characters (I'm doing one per day). So far I've been really impressed with the creativity of the ideas, and better yet none of the characters that have been suggested are anything like stuff that's already in the book. This PDF is definitely going to add something awesome to the book! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirge93 Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Not trying to bring a lot of negativity to this but two questions: *) Could future Kickstarters have a "cheapskate that just wants a physical copy" option? $50 for a print and PDF option on a 220ish page B&W document is pretty high. But if you remove $10 from the cost for no PDF, and another $5 for not getting entered in the thank you list, it's a much more affordable (for me anyway) $35. Yes, it reduces the chances of getting the full funds for the Kickstarter, but it also entices cheapskates like me to contribute, hopefully resulting in a net gain actually (there are a lot of gamers on a tight budget these days). Heck, if you put in a $35 print-only option for BotE I'll sign up now! *) Any word on a print or POD option for people who didn't contribute to the Kickstarter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Not trying to bring a lot of negativity to this but two questions: *) Could future Kickstarters have a "cheapskate that just wants a physical copy" option? $50 for a print and PDF option on a 220ish page B&W document is pretty high. But if you remove $10 from the cost for no PDF, and another $5 for not getting entered in the thank you list, it's a much more affordable (for me anyway) $35. Yes, it reduces the chances of getting the full funds for the Kickstarter, but it also entices cheapskates like me to contribute, hopefully resulting in a net gain actually (there are a lot of gamers on a tight budget these days). Heck, if you put in a $35 print-only option for BotE I'll sign up now! *) Any word on a print or POD option for people who didn't contribute to the Kickstarter? Maybe you can find someone like me who just wants the PDF and go halfsies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter *) Could future Kickstarters have a "cheapskate that just wants a physical copy" option? $50 for a print and PDF option on a 220ish page B&W document is pretty high. But if you remove $10 from the cost for no PDF, and another $5 for not getting entered in the thank you list, it's a much more affordable (for me anyway) $35. Yes, it reduces the chances of getting the full funds for the Kickstarter, but it also entices cheapskates like me to contribute, hopefully resulting in a net gain actually (there are a lot of gamers on a tight budget these days). Heck, if you put in a $35 print-only option for BotE I'll sign up now! I can't speak officially for Hero Games, but probably not, for a couple reasons: 1. There's an issue of providing too many options/reward tiers. It creates an effect called "choice paralysis," which is something you generally want to avoid. In particular, you want to avoid having a lot of tiers that are basically the same, but with one minor variation -- each tier should be distinct in some notable way. 2. The cost isn't calculated by Hero saying, "Hmmm, a thank you is worth five bucks." The thank you has no effect on the cost to produce the book or its ultimate value. That's simply a way to do something nice for people who want the project to succeed but can only afford a small pledge. 3. In this particular case, BotE has a cover price of $39.99, so the company's certainly not going to sell it to you for $35. If Hero were selling it to you for $40, shipping wouldn't be free, so your overall cost in the US would end up somewhere in the $43-45 dollar range most likely. Thus, the $50 book+PDF with free shipping really isn't that much more. I'm sorry that you think the cost is high, but with all due respect, I think your expectations of what an RPG supplement should cost are low. RPG companies, Hero included, have historically charged less (often significantly less) than what should be charged for supplements under good business practices.* They do this partly because of consumer perception and partly because supplements are to some extent "loss leaders" designed to encourage sales of core rulebooks. When you shift to a Kickstarter model, that simply isn't feasible anymore. The costs charged for books have to be more realistic, and have to be fully accounted for in the money you raise, or else you'll lose money on the project. *) Any word on a print or POD option for people who didn't contribute to the Kickstarter? Again, I can't speak for the company officially, but since the project has succeeded it's likely that Hero will be able to print enough copies to have some to put in the Online Store after the Kickstarter backers get their copies. How many copies that will be, I can't say; could be enough to cover demand for months, or it could be just a few dozen copies. I am unaware of any plans for a PoD option. As I've said before, the one sure way to guarantee you get a copy is to back the Kickstarter. That also gets you things like copies of the $150 characters that are only available to Kickstarter backers. *: To be fair, you'll find people in the RPG industry who disagree with this premise. But Hero's not among them, and I personally definitely am not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter RPG companies, Hero included, have historically charged less (often significantly less) than what should be charged for supplements under good business practices.* They do this partly because of consumer perception and partly because supplements are to some extent "loss leaders" designed to encourage sales of core rulebooks. *[footnote omitted] Strange, having never been in that industry I would have guessed the other way around, core rules at or slightly below cost to get the player interested, then make the money on the supplements. Live and learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I just finished the third of the $150 characters, and like the first two I think it turned out great. For those of you who are big fans of seeing "old favorites" from past editions of Champions return in a new form, you're going to get a big kick out of this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Strange, having never been in that industry I would have guessed the other way around, core rules at or slightly below cost to get the player interested, then make the money on the supplements. Live and learn. Let me see if I can shed some light. The difference is, even if you price the core RPG book at something below its actual smart-business-cost-of-production, it tends to sell quickly and in relatively large numbers, and thus is likely to pay for itself pretty soon (assuming any reasonable degree of success and proper planning). After that, barring reprint costs, every sale of the core book is almost pure profit. So while supplements should at least pay for themselves, and perhaps even make a profit on their own, to some extent their real purpose is to encourage sales of the high-profit core book(s). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ndreare Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I think people forget what they are getting and the cost involved in a book. It is more than simply paying for printing and mailing a book or printing it and putting it out to distributors. You have to pay the people who do the creative work artist and writers. Which has to be enough money to compensate for their time at least competitively enough for them to keep doing it rather than going back to corporate life. I personally think it would take a lot more than $10,000 for me to spend a couple months writing a book. Not even considering the printing and distribution cost. In general I think Gamers have gotten used to getting a lot for their money, the problem is only writers & artist who love the game are going to stick around and write books for less than they can do other jobs and in most cases not receive any of the benefits normally associated with work such as pensions, 401K, medical, dental and employment insurance. I would think as is the case in most things the most talented writers & artist have the option of moving on to better pay and most would take it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCoy Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Let me see if I can shed some light. The difference is, even if you price the core RPG book at something below its actual smart-business-cost-of-production, it tends to sell quickly and in relatively large numbers, and thus is likely to pay for itself pretty soon (assuming any reasonable degree of success and proper planning). After that, barring reprint costs, every sale of the core book is almost pure profit. So while supplements should at least pay for themselves, and perhaps even make a profit on their own, to some extent their real purpose is to encourage sales of the high-profit core book(s). Makes sense. As I said, live and learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Hiemforth Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter The difference is' date=' even if you price the core RPG book at something below its actual smart-business-cost-of-production, it tends to sell quickly and in relatively large numbers, and thus is likely to pay for itself pretty soon (assuming any reasonable degree of success and proper planning). After that, barring reprint costs, [i']every sale of the core book is almost pure profit.[/i] So while supplements should at least pay for themselves, and perhaps even make a profit on their own, to some extent their real purpose is to encourage sales of the high-profit core book(s). Plus, the sales of any given supplement (even one as major as, say, Champions) are virtually certain to be lower than sales of the core book. Because relatively few people would be interested in buying Champions without also buying the core rules for it, but a larger number of people (anyone who doesn't play supers) might buy the core rules, but not Champions. Then as you get get further "downstream" from there, the phenomenon gets even bigger. For example, not everyone who buys Champions will buy Champions Universe. Not everyone who buys Champions Universe will buy Vibora Bay. And so on. Each product down the line has a smaller likely audience, but still has the costs of writing, artwork, editing, production, etc. But almost everyone who buys Champions or Champions Universe or Vibora Bay (or Fantasy Hero, or Star Hero, or...) will buy the core rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Yes, Derek, that generally tends to be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I would think as is the case in most things the most talented writers & artist have the option of moving on to better pay and most would take it. At any given time the gaming industry is fortunate to have a lot of talented, dedicated individuals who create RPG material because of their love of the form/hobby. But it's also true that the hobby has lost a lot of superb talent over the years, mostly to computer game companies, because creating RPGs pays so very little and rarely involves insurance or any other benefits. The benefit, of course, is doing something you love. I've certainly found it to be pretty awesome -- but then again I'm single and have no dependents. I was once briefly involved with an attempt to put together a new RPG company. The primary purpose of the company, long-term, wasn't to produce RPGs, but to generate IP that could be sold into Hollywood (and we had people on board with the connections to do that). This plan could easily have worked because, despite the fact that I was going to be paid over twice as much as I've ever been paid for any other RPG job I've ever held, I could still produce a lot of quality IP for a tiny fraction of what Hollywood creative people would cost. But so it goes. I'd love to live in a world where RPGs were as popular as movies or novels and I could do lunch with Quentin and Uma before before whipping up a few thousand words on evil cults in Vestria. But that ain't the world we live in -- and in any event, getting to talk gaming with, and sometimes even play games with, great folx such as Hero fans is even more rewarding than fancy Hollywood lunches in many ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter Heya Herophiles! We've got less than a week to go and things are lookin' pretty good. But we're still about $1,500 short of our secondary goal, which unlocks a cool new reward for everyone who backs the Kickstarter. So if you haven't become a backer yet, we'd certainly appreciate it if you'd consider joining us and help make The Book Of The Empress a reality! Book Of The Empress Kickstarter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjandreano Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I know how to be sure to make the secondary goal: announce that the interior art of the book will include pictures of Istvatha in lingerie, swimwear, etc! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawksmoorSD Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter So funny story... I don't own a credit card. Haven't for years because I can pay a lot better attention to my funds when I can actually see them. Anyways, I gave my fiancee the cash this morning to put down on my copy of BotE. She grins and gets up and walks away after saying shes done. I start laughing about it and she asked me what was so funny. So I had to explain to my non gaming fiancee that she just put her name into a Hero Games book. Her look was priceless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted January 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter So I had to explain to my non gaming fiancee that she just put her name into a Hero Games book. Her look was priceless. I can't make any promises, but if you'd prefer to get your name in there, PM me here or contact me through the Kickstarter page and we'll see what we can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
name_tamer Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 Re: BOOK OF THE EMPRESS Kickstarter I can't make any promises' date=' but if you'd prefer to get your name in there, PM me here or contact me through the Kickstarter page and we'll see what we can do.[/quote'] I also contributed, and I'd actually prefer not to have my name in the book at all. My Kickstarter "handle" would be fine, but for various reasons I'd prefer not to have my real name in the book. Were you planning on using the credit card information as the source of the names for thanking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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