Barnstormer, flying speedster

[Pattern Ghost]

Here's an update. (Click on the view post button.)

 

Ok, I usually don't do speedsters, so I'm posting this guy for feedback. He's 5th Edition.

 

I'm a little concerned about having low defenses and END usage with this build, but squeezing out an impressive amount of flight plus some speedster tricks ate up a lot of points fast. The speed tricks are from, or adapted from, Ultimate Speedster.

 

Barnstormer

 

Val Char Cost

20 STR 10

26 DEX 48

20 CON 20

15 BODY 10

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

10 COM 0

 

10 PD 6

10 ED 6

6 SPD 24

8 REC 0

40 END 0

35 STUN 0

 

6" RUN 0

2" SWIM 0

4" LEAP 0

 

Characteristics Cost: 134

 

Cost Power

 

105 Born to Fly: Flight 30", Position Shift, x4 Noncombat, Variable Advantage (+1/4 Advantages; Limited Group of Advantages; Only for: Megascale 1"=1km, Half END, Combat Acceleration/Deceleration, Rapid Non-Combat Movement; +1/2) (105 Active Points)

 

46 Air Superiority: Multipower, 46-point reserve

3u 1) Ouch!: Hand-To-Hand Attack +9d6, Only When Moving ((Must make a Half Move up to or Past target to attack); +0) (45 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)

3u 2) Cleaning House: Hand-To-Hand Attack +4d6, Area Of Effect (Trailing; +1), Selective (+1/4) (45 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)

2u 3) Backdraft: Telekinesis (30 STR) (45 Active Points); Only to Drag Target (-1), Affects Whole Object (-1/4), Only When Moving (-1/4)

3u 4) Clear the Air: Dispel Gas/Mist/Smoke Powers 12d6, any Gas/Mist/Smoke power one at a time (+1/4) (45 Active Points); No Range (-1/2)

2u 5) Downdraft: Telekinesis (30 STR) (45 Active Points); Only to Pull Flying Characters Down (-1 1/4), Affects Whole Object (-1/4), Must Pass Through Intervening Space (-1/4)

2u 6) Eat My Dust: Change Environment 128" radius, -3 to Sight Group PER Rolls (46 Active Points); OIF (Appropriate Dust or Powder of Opportunity; -1/2), Easy to Dispel (-1/4), Must Pass Through Intervening Space (-1/4)

 

Eagle Eyes

2 1) +2 PER with Normal Sight

3 2) Rapid ( x10) with Normal Sight

3 3) +6 versus Range Modifier for Normal Sight

12 Crash Suit: Armor (6 PD/6 ED) (18 Active Points); OIF (-1/2)

2 Brave Lad: +5 PRE (5 Active Points); Defensive Only (-1)

Powers Cost: 188

 

 

Cost Skill

7 +2 with DCV (10 Active Points); Only When Flying (-1/2)

3 Acrobatics 14-

3 Combat Piloting 14-

3 PS: Stunt Pilot 12-

3 Teamwork 14-

7 Power 16-

2 KS: Aviation History 11-

 

Skills Cost: 28

 

 

 

Total Character Cost: 350

 

Pts. Disadvantage

15 Social Limitation: Public ID (Frequently, Major)

15 Psychological Limitation: Code vs. Killing (Common, Strong)

15 Psychological Limitation: Loves Aircraft and Flying (Common, Strong) [Notes: James is easily distracted by all things aeronautical.]

20 Psychological Limitation: Overconfident with flying and piloting abilities (Very Common, Strong)

15 Psychological Limitation: Claustrophobic (Uncommon, Total)

20 Dependent NPC: Mama O'Mally and Her Flying Circus 8- (Normal; Group DNPC: x4 DNPCs)

20 Hunted: International Law Enforcement Agency 11- (Mo Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Watching)

25 Hunted: Unknown Organization 8- (Mo Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Capture)

5 Money: Poor

 

Disadvantage Points: 150

Base Points: 200

 

Background: James O'Mally grew up in O'Mally's Flying Circus, the youngest of three brothers. He always dreamed of flying, and one day, discovered he could! (Work in progress.)

[phoenix240]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

If you don't mind optional rules the Trailing Area of effect might handle the "Cleaning House" power a bit more neatly than the current build.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Hmm, trailing with selective might work. Too bad Hero Designer doesn't have Trailing. It has stuff from some of the other supplements, but not that one.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

No idea what the game is like, so with that in mind:

 

In combat movement terms, I find he's kinda slow for a speedster. He's only zipping around at about 67 mph in normal combat.

 

That's not too terrible until you contrast it with his mega-movement, which lets him travel at almost Mach 9 out of combat.

 

With that kind of speed, he could fly virtually anywhere on earth in about a half hour, but in practice he'll never actually be able to do that since he burns WAY too much END in the process.

 

At full speed, this character eats through 60 END per turn. Hard to say what he'll be like in combat, because I don't know you will have him fight, but he can potentially burn through over 60 END per turn when he goes all out on the offense.

 

Of course, with only 40 END and 8 REC, he's going to spend a lot of time sucking wind or performing way below his real potential.

 

If you are looking to skimp some points, Position Shift and NCM can probably be shelved, which would save you 15 points.

 

Position Shift is pretty useful, but probably not critical for the concept. You can always pick it up with some XP in a session or two.

 

NCM is probably a bad idea though. The Megascale advantage cannot be applied to any movement power with increased NCM and vice versa, so pick one or the other. This is why many 5E speedsters have their movement in a MP.

 

Also, in 5E terms, megascale movement generally requires Megascale Sight so that you don't go splat! Many people I know ruled this as unnecessary, so check with the GM on that one...

 

His potential damage is rather high: 13d6, 19d6 and 23d6 for his three most common modes of attack.

 

By contrast, his OCV is probably just a bit too low. 9, 7 and 3 for those same three attacks.

 

Of course this is not an issue if he mainly uses his highly accurate but much lower damage Cleaning House power...

 

DCV of 11 while flying isn't too bad, but his defenses are still rather low. It's only going to take one average 14d6 hit or 2 average 10d6 AoE's to knock him out of a fight. Less if he get's knocked back into something sturdy, which tends to happen quyite a bit to flyers. Of course, you also have to factor that if he is KOed on the move he will then plummet to the ground, take even more damage and be out even longer .

 

Anyhow, if the GM lets the speedster do an 19d6 with a Move By, I'm guessing that a similarly powered blaster type will tear this guy up in seconds.

 

Of course, that big 23d6 attack I mentioned above is on a move through. With on OCV of 3, he'll never hit anything except the broad side of a barn, which is probably a good thing since he'll almost certainly get Stunned or KOed every time he does hit...

 

I'd probably get him some Flash Defense to protect those Eagle Eyes of his. Of course, that won't help with his Eat My Dust power, which he's not actually immune to, but then I'd probably also buy Personal Immunity on this power so he could melee opponents in the safety of his own dust cloud.

 

Might even go with OIF flight Goggles to save points and because I like the visual

 

Breakfall would probably be a good and background appropriate skill to have. Also, some ability to use a parachute couldn't hurt based on his apparent background as a circus stunt pilot.

 

You may want to check out Movement Skill levels with flight on p369 of 5ER. Versatile, useful, background appropriate and fairly inexpensive... but ultimately might not be worth it the way you have the characters variable advantage set up.

 

Frankly, I would change the build considerably. For example, I'd reduce the points spent in the characters basic moment power and then leverage the MP that you already have. I'd probably have a slot with additional inches of combat movement (which can of course increase his damage via move by and move through, reducing the need for hand attack dice), add another slot for mega-movement (it's not like you will ever use combat stunts in the same phase as mega-movement anyhow) and if there were points left over possibly add a few more speedster stunts for added fun and versatility.

 

Also, not sure that the Money disadvantage is appropriate in a superheroic game where you probably aren't paying for equipment and such...

[Shadow Hawk]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

The name "Barnstormer" shows up in Teen Champions (he's a flying speedster with the North Detroit Defenders), complete with character write up. His fate is described in D.E.M.O.N. Servants of Darkness, which I would write here but it needs a spoiler tag.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

No idea what the game is like, so with that in mind:

 

In combat movement terms, I find he's kinda slow for a speedster. He's only zipping around at about 67 mph in normal combat.

 

I think 30" per phase is plenty for this guy. His SPD score is keeping his combat speed down compared to some speedsters in MPH terms, but I'm OK with that. This is the speed where he has the most control for now.

 

That's not too terrible until you contrast it with his mega-movement, which lets him travel at almost Mach 9 out of combat.

 

With that kind of speed, he could fly virtually anywhere on earth in about a half hour, but in practice he'll never actually be able to do that since he burns WAY too much END in the process.

 

The idea is that he loses control as he goes faster. For his speed stunt multi, he'd be pouring on a short burst of speed to create the effect. OTOH, the concept doesn't really require the Megascale. The main thing I wanted is high maneuverability, and Megascale is kind of counter to that conceptually anyway.

 

At full speed, this character eats through 60 END per turn. Hard to say what he'll be like in combat, because I don't know you will have him fight, but he can potentially burn through over 60 END per turn when he goes all out on the offense.

 

Of course, with only 40 END and 8 REC, he's going to spend a lot of time sucking wind or performing way below his real potential.

 

If you are looking to skimp some points, Position Shift and NCM can probably be shelved, which would save you 15 points.

 

Position Shift is pretty useful, but probably not critical for the concept. You can always pick it up with some XP in a session or two.

 

 

Yeah, the END is an issue. I may try doing it as a pre-Megascale stlye multipower with one slot for combat speed and one slot for a higher NCM speed, and see if that will save enough pts to put some in END. He does have half END as an option on the variable advantage, but that's still 30 END per Turn just for movement. Multipower may be the way to go to get the total AP down to lower the END cost.

 

NCM is probably a bad idea though. The Megascale advantage cannot be applied to any movement power with increased NCM and vice versa, so pick one or the other. This is why many 5E speedsters have their movement in a MP.

 

Thanks for catching that. I haven't used the Megascale rules for movement much.

 

Also, in 5E terms, megascale movement generally requires Megascale Sight so that you don't go splat! Many people I know ruled this as unnecessary, so check with the GM on that one...

 

Wasn't aware of that, either.

 

His potential damage is rather high: 13d6, 19d6 and 23d6 for his three most common modes of attack.

 

Hmm. The intent isn't to allow the HA damage to apply to his move-by and move-through maneuvers (or any standard maneuvers). I was using the build for it from Ultimate Speedster:

 

Controlled Collisions

Effect: HA +6d6 and +10d6, Only When Moving

Target: One character

Duration: Instant

Range: Touch

END Cost: 3/5

Speedster Tricks Roll Penalty: -3/-5

 

Description: The speedster’s so skilled at running

into or past people as a form of attack that he can

do so accurately and without hurting himself.

In effect, this power is a form of Move By/

Through the character pays for so he doesn’t suffer

the difficulties associated with those Combat

Maneuvers — no CV penalties, no taking partial

damage. The damage should be bought to the same

level the character would ordinarily do with those

maneuvers; this example assumes the character has

30” of movement.

 

Game Information:

 

Cost Power

29 Controlled Collisions: Multipower, 50-point

reserve; all slots Hand-To-Hand Attack (-½),

Only When Moving (-¼)

2u 1) Controlled Sideswipe: HA +6d6; Hand-

To-Hand Attack (-½), Only When Moving

(character must make a Half Move up to or

past target to use attack; -¼)

3u 2) Controlled Ramming: HA +10d6; Hand-

To-Hand Attack (-½), Only When Moving

(character must make a Half Move up to or

past target to use attack; -¼)

Total cost: 34 points.

 

That's definitely a problem with the write up, though. The idea in the text is that it replaces the standard maneuvers, not augments them, but nothing in the build really prevents the powers from adding to the maneuver damage.

 

By contrast, his OCV is probably just a bit too low. 9, 7 and 3 for those same three attacks.

 

I think that CVs aren't too high in the game in general. Conceptually, he's a guy who likes to fly who's pushed to heroics by circumstance, so initially using just his raw agility. I figure I can buy up his OCV over time if needed.

 

Of course this is not an issue if he mainly uses his highly accurate but much lower damage Cleaning House power...

 

Yeah, that's his Mook clean up power. He'd probably mostly use it and his non-damaging powers, and let the heavy hitters deal with more dangerous targets, and use his bigger single target attack when needed.

 

DCV of 11 while flying isn't too bad, but his defenses are still rather low. It's only going to take one average 14d6 hit or 2 average 10d6 AoE's to knock him out of a fight. Less if he get's knocked back into something sturdy, which tends to happen quyite a bit to flyers. Of course, you also have to factor that if he is KOed on the move he will then plummet to the ground, take even more damage and be out even longer .

 

Yeah, his defenses are like tissue paper. I have two problems there: Finding the points for them, and finding an SFX that's in concept. I'm thinking of light armor (crash suit) plus "body adapted to flying" to just buy up base PD/ED and stats.

 

Anyhow, if the GM lets the speedster do an 19d6 with a Move By, I'm guessing that a similarly powered blaster type will tear this guy up in seconds.

 

Of course, that big 23d6 attack I mentioned above is on a move through. With on OCV of 3, he'll never hit anything except the broad side of a barn, which is probably a good thing since he'll almost certainly get Stunned or KOed every time he does hit...

 

Well, let's say 13d6-14d6 after limiting the HA appropriately. Anyone hitting him that hard would crush him anyway, though. One average 13d6 hit and he's out of the fight. It'd be good if he at least took two hits to fold.

 

I'd probably get him some Flash Defense to protect those Eagle Eyes of his. Of course, that won't help with his Eat My Dust power, which he's not actually immune to, but then I'd probably also buy Personal Immunity on this power so he could melee opponents in the safety of his own dust cloud.

 

I was thinking of buying a little Flash Defense with OIF Goggles, but ran out of points with my poor build. =)

 

I don't see him needing (or conceptually qualifying for) personal immunity on the dust cloud. It's just there to create a zone of control. Thinking of using the Trailing AE with it as well, actually. That's if the GM allows Trailing, since it's optional.

 

Might even go with OIF flight Goggles to save points and because I like the visual

 

The export template for plain text doesn't include the description and background stuff, but he does have goggles. Whether they provide some Flash Defense is the main question.

 

Breakfall would probably be a good and background appropriate skill to have. Also, some ability to use a parachute couldn't hurt based on his apparent background as a circus stunt pilot.

 

Well, if you fall out of an airplane, you aren't going to break the fall, it's going to break you. =) As for the parachute use, I'm assuming he does know how to use one. It's not a core skill, though. I'm assuming basic parachute use subsumed under the Professional Skill. The parachuting skill from Dark Champions provides for more ability than he'd be expected to have. (Packing a chute, etc.)

 

You may want to check out Movement Skill levels with flight on p369 of 5ER. Versatile, useful, background appropriate and fairly inexpensive... but ultimately might not be worth it the way you have the characters variable advantage set up.

 

I was going to buy a few movement skill levels for background fluff, but ran out of points. Not really needed for his core abilities, though, as no turn mode and combat acceleration/deceleration pretty much cover him there.

 

Frankly, I would change the build considerably.

 

Me too! That's why I posted it here. Not really happy with it.

 

For example, I'd reduce the points spent in the characters basic moment power and then leverage the MP that you already have. I'd probably have a slot with additional inches of combat movement (which can of course increase his damage via move by and move through, reducing the need for hand attack dice), add another slot for mega-movement (it's not like you will ever use combat stunts in the same phase as mega-movement anyhow) and if there were points left over possibly add a few more speedster stunts for added fun and versatility.

 

Definitely going to look at that option.

 

Also, not sure that the Money disadvantage is appropriate in a superheroic game where you probably aren't paying for equipment and such...

 

If the Well Off perk is appropriate, its opposite is too, IMO. It also fits his background and helps define his character. I think the impact it would have on RPing him (for example, can't afford to participate in some social activities) is about right for the 5 pts level of a Disad.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

The name "Barnstormer" shows up in Teen Champions (he's a flying speedster with the North Detroit Defenders)' date=' complete with character write up. His fate is described in D.E.M.O.N. Servants of Darkness, which I would write here but it needs a spoiler tag.[/quote']

 

That's interesting, but doesn't help my build not suck. =)

 

It's hard to avoid name duplication when going for fairly obvious FX-related names, so I usually don't bother worrying about it unless the character may show up in the campaign.

 

I'll look at the build in Teen Champions, may give me some ideas.

 

Edit: I looked at the build. Not much to work with there.

[Shadow Hawk]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

That's interesting, but doesn't help my build not suck. =)

 

It's hard to avoid name duplication when going for fairly obvious FX-related names, so I usually don't bother worrying about it unless the character may show up in the campaign.

 

I'll look at the build in Teen Champions, may give me some ideas.

 

Edit: I looked at the build. Not much to work with there.

 

Going from memory, the build in Teen Champions was designed not only with a 'young hero, new to his powers and potential" but really limited his potential also. I wouldn't use it as the basis for anything.

 

More useful stuff, my opinion, ymmv, etc.

For one of my campaigns, your dexterity seem low.

Your total attack dice (17d6 on a move by, 23d6 on a move through) is high. What's the damage cap? Of course, your PD is too low to be doing move throughs very often, but still.

You've got a lot of points in psych disads (65).

[Cancer]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Make him have to suck sugar water while flying (that's an END reserve with one large continuing charge, a backpack full of energy drink), add some gaudy colors SFX, and change his name to Hummingbird. Or with some Aztec flavor, Huitzilopochtli.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Going from memory' date=' the build in Teen Champions was designed not only with a 'young hero, new to his powers and potential" but really limited his potential also. I wouldn't use it as the basis for anything.[/quote']

 

Yeah, it was pretty limited. Never know if there might be a good idea in there though. (Not so much, though.)

 

More useful stuff, my opinion, ymmv, etc.

For one of my campaigns, your dexterity seem low.

 

It's on the high end of the campaign guidelines for the game I'm looking at.

 

Your total attack dice (17d6 on a move by, 23d6 on a move through) is high. What's the damage cap? Of course, your PD is too low to be doing move throughs very often, but still.

 

I addressed this in my response to Bloodstone. The HA is not intended to add to maneuvers, just wasn't written up that way. That's what I get for using pre-written powers without examining them closely. I'll be putting a limitation on it. He'll be capping at 13d6 for the hand attack OR 14d6 for a move through, but not adding the 9d6 HA to a move through (or move by).

 

You've got a lot of points in psych disads (65).

 

Yep. Sometimes digging up 150 points in disads for a character doesn't really fit the character's concept. It's too high a number, though it's the default, and IMO twists too many character concepts to fit digging for disad points rather than helping define the character. So, if I have to go high in a category to not break the original character concept, I will.

[Sougen]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Pattern_Ghost:

 

You can save 10pts by building the flight power in the following (munchkiny) way.

 

[TABLE]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]Cost [/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD=align: right]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]70[/TD]

[TD]Flight 30", Position Shift, x4 Noncombat[/TD]

[TD]7[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]17[/TD]

[TD]Multipower, 17-point reserve[/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]2u[/TD]

[TD]1) Naked Advantage: Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) for up to 70 Active Points (17 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]2u[/TD]

[TD]2) Naked Advantage: MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4) for up to 70 Active Points (17 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]2[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]2u[/TD]

[TD]3) Naked Advantage: combat acceleration/deceleration (+1/4) for up to 70 Active Points (17 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]2[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]2u[/TD]

[TD]4) Naked Advantage: rapid Noncombat movement (+1/4) for up to 70 Active Points (17 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]2[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

Powers Cost: 95

 

Rather than tacking on all the advantages in a single advantage the way you have it, just build them individually as Naked advantages in a MP.

 

10pts isn't going to give you the world, but it is at least a few percent back.

 

Also, you could save 14 more points by dropping the Flight to 26, and then lowering the cost of the MP to match. That would give you a net of 24pts at the cost of 4inches of light. To be honest, I think that is a great idea. But it is a min-max idea.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Thinking about replacing the Flight power with this multi:

 

75 Born to Fly: Multipower, 75-point reserve

7u 1) Combat Flight: Flight 25", combat acceleration/deceleration (+1/4), No Turn Mode (+1/4) (75 Active Points) 7 END

7u 2) I Never Run Out of Gas: Flight 20", No Turn Mode (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (70 Active Points) 0 END

7u 3) Non-Combat Flight: Flight 5", x128 Noncombat, rapid Noncombat movement (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (70 Active Points) 0 END

 

 

• I can keep the combat acceleration/deceleration and no turn mode if I give up 5" of combat flight. That's a half move of 13" vs 15", so not too big of a loss.
  
• The second slot can be used to conserve END at the expense of acceleration. Depending on the battlefield, it could be useful to accelerate then switch to slot 2 to conserve energy. Would depend on how spread the targets are.
  
• The third slot gives about Mach 2 or a little more speed for traveling longer distances, which isn't too bad. Not looking to be Flash level here anyway.
  
• This build only nets me 9 points, though.
  

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Sougen, nice build. Gets one more point, but doesn't let me use No Turn Mode (the ability I want most on this guy) with Combat Acceleration/Deceleration.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

I think 30" per phase is plenty for this guy. His SPD score is keeping his combat speed down compared to some speedsters in MPH terms' date=' but I'm OK with that. This is the speed where he has the most control for now.[/quote']

 

Yeah, that's totally a personal preference thing, just wanted to make sure you were aware of what the character was capable of in somewhat more relatable terms

 

I've had a several first time speedster players think their character was lighting quick and then get disappointed with how it feels in actual game play.

 

Most bricks, blasters and power armor guys usually have a 5-6 SPD and 20-30" of combat movement. So I generally don't feel that fast in combat unless I have at least one or two more points of SPD and at least twice as much combat movement... but that's me.

 

What's the SFX of this guys flight anyhow?

 

I'm getting a bit more of a Cannonball vibe from this guy than I am a Superman/Flash style speedster anyhow, but not really sure what you're going for...

 

Yeah, the END is an issue. I may try doing it as a pre-Megascale stlye multipower with one slot for combat speed and one slot for a higher NCM speed, and see if that will save enough pts to put some in END. He does have half END as an option on the variable advantage, but that's still 30 END per Turn just for movement. Multipower may be the way to go to get the total AP down to lower the END cost.

 

I'd play with it some more. Otherwise I think it will end up being frustrating.

 

Mind you, as a low defense speedster, he probably burn some phases just Dodging now and then.

 

Hmm. The intent isn't to allow the HA damage to apply to his move-by and move-through maneuvers (or any standard maneuvers). I was using the build for it from Ultimate Speedster:

 

That's definitely a problem with the write up, though. The idea in the text is that it replaces the standard maneuvers, not augments them, but nothing in the build really prevents the powers from adding to the maneuver damage.

 

Gotcha. I'd definitely write those powers up differently if they were intended to be exclusive with Velocity based combat maneuvers.

 

I think that CVs aren't too high in the game in general. Conceptually, he's a guy who likes to fly who's pushed to heroics by circumstance, so initially using just his raw agility. I figure I can buy up his OCV over time if needed.

 

Yeah, nothing in his background screamed trained fighter or anything, but not knowing the game I wasn't sure how playable those CVS would be. It's not uncommon to see bricks straight out of the main Champions books with OCV's in the 10-12 range.

 

Yeah, his defenses are like tissue paper. I have two problems there: Finding the points for them, and finding an SFX that's in concept. I'm thinking of light armor (crash suit) plus "body adapted to flying" to just buy up base PD/ED and stats.

 

Yeah, speedsters are rarely bulletproof, but they tend to be fairly tough just so they can survive the effect of their own powers.

 

Biological adaptations could account for a higher than normal human PD/ED, or you could buy some OIF/IIF PD/ED via a padded costume that the rDEF armor could stack with it.

 

Could always go with a force field like Cannonball too, in which case you save a few points via the Link to the movement power.

 

Of course, you could probably also justify some extra abilities liek life support's that are useful for fliers (heat for high friction, cold and breathing for the thin air at high altitudes)

 

Well, if you fall out of an airplane, you aren't going to break the fall, it's going to break you. =)

 

Sure, the odds are stacked against you, but that's why they teach you how to fall when your chute doesn't open. Try to minimize the damage and hope for the best

 

Plus he's probably crashed a lot learning his powers at lower altitudes, so he could have learned how to roll with things and not take a header.

 

Of course, it also goes hand and hand with his Acrobatics skill.

 

If need be, you can also justify the skill as a power/physical adaptation for flight.

 

The mechanics of taking reduced damage from falling is mainly what your after for a guy like this. Superman doesn't have to worry about it the same way Angel does...

 

As for the parachute use, I'm assuming he does know how to use one. It's not a core skill, though. I'm assuming basic parachute use subsumed under the Professional Skill. The parachuting skill from Dark Champions provides for more ability than he'd be expected to have. (Packing a chute, etc.)

 

Core rules have Parachute use defined as a Transportation Familiarity. Dark Champions/Ultimate Skill makes it an optional skill.

 

I was going to buy a few movement skill levels for background fluff, but ran out of points. Not really needed for his core abilities, though, as no turn mode and combat acceleration/deceleration pretty much cover him there.

 

The character doesn't actually have No Turn Mode listed as an option for his flight... though you should have room for that option once you make the decision about NCM/Megamovement...

[Sougen]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Here is the cheaper build I mentioned:

 

[TABLE]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]Cost [/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD=align: right]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]62 [/TD]

[TD]Flight 26", Position Shift, x4 Noncombat [/TD]

[TD]6[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]15 [/TD]

[TD]Multipower, 15-point reserve [/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u [/TD]

[TD]1) Naked Advantage: Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points) [/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u [/TD]

[TD]2) Naked Advantage: MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points) [/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u [/TD]

[TD]3) Naked Advantage: combat acceleration/deceleration (+1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points) [/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u [/TD]

[TD]4) Naked Advantage: rapid Noncombat movement (+1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points) [/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

Powers Cost: 81

[Sougen]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Sougen' date=' nice build. Gets one more point, but doesn't let me use No Turn Mode (the ability I want most on this guy) with Combat Acceleration/Deceleration.[/quote']

 

Oops. I didn't see that in your original build so I didn't think to add it in. But it would only cost 2pts in the first build I made and 1pt in the second build I submitted. So, you can have it all. ^^

[Sougen]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Thinking about replacing the Flight power with this multi:

 

75 Born to Fly: Multipower, 75-point reserve

7u 1) Combat Flight: Flight 25", combat acceleration/deceleration (+1/4), No Turn Mode (+1/4) (75 Active Points) 7 END

7u 2) I Never Run Out of Gas: Flight 20", No Turn Mode (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (70 Active Points) 0 END

7u 3) Non-Combat Flight: Flight 5", x128 Noncombat, rapid Noncombat movement (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (70 Active Points) 0 END

• I can keep the combat acceleration/deceleration and no turn mode if I give up 5" of combat flight. That's a half move of 13" vs 15", so not too big of a loss.
  
• The second slot can be used to conserve END at the expense of acceleration. Depending on the battlefield, it could be useful to accelerate then switch to slot 2 to conserve energy. Would depend on how spread the targets are.
  
• The third slot gives about Mach 2 or a little more speed for traveling longer distances, which isn't too bad. Not looking to be Flash level here anyway.
  
• This build only nets me 9 points, though.
  

 

Comparing my MPed Naked advantage to this is that the creation of new slots in my MP nets you much less cost. I can add in a great many 1/4th advantages for only 1-2pts. Downside is that it is geared toward 1/4th advantages. If you want a 1/2, the cost differences start to even out. But there aren't many 1/2 advantages that I can see you needing.

 

Also, I'm not sure how important the x4 non-combat multiplier is to you. I understand that part of the reason is that you can speed up quickly, but if you are willing to settle on it being a bit slower build up, you can take off that advantage, save that 5pts, and place it elsewhere. Then buy 1" of flight in the MP that has the advantage. Alternately, you can keep it as is and build an even higher flight rate (it just can't be used with the advantage). That build is as follows:

 

[TABLE]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]Cost [/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD=align: right]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]62[/TD]

[TD]Flight 26", Position Shift, x4 Noncombat[/TD]

[TD]6[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]17[/TD]

[TD]Multipower, 17-point reserve[/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u[/TD]

[TD]1) Naked Advantage: Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u[/TD]

[TD]2) Naked Advantage: MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u[/TD]

[TD]3) Naked Advantage: combat acceleration/deceleration (+1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]1u[/TD]

[TD]4) Naked Advantage: rapid Noncombat movement (+1/4) for up to 62 Active Points (15 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]1[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=align: right]2u[/TD]

[TD]5) Flight 1", x16 (x32) Noncombat (17 Active Points)[/TD]

[TD]2[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

Powers Cost: 85

The max speed on the character (not counting megascale) is 1861mph.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Yeah, that's totally a personal preference thing, just wanted to make sure you were aware of what the character was capable of in somewhat more relatable terms

 

I've had a several first time speedster players think their character was lighting quick and then get disappointed with how it feels in actual game play.

 

Most bricks, blasters and power armor guys usually have a 5-6 SPD and 20-30" of combat movement. So I generally don't feel that fast in combat unless I have at least one or two more points of SPD and at least twice as much combat movement... but that's me.

 

The campaign is a bit lower DEX/SPD, and looking over the other characters, I'm not seeing high combat movement. So, he should be able to fill the niche of being fast. Even if not, his powers being based off of his flight is enough of a differentiator for me.

 

What's the SFX of this guys flight anyhow?

 

He flies! Highly-focused TK or the like.

 

I'm getting a bit more of a Cannonball vibe from this guy than I am a Superman/Flash style speedster anyhow, but not really sure what you're going for...

 

More of the Cannonball end of things. More of a movement specialist than a relativistic speed type. Being maneuverable and able to do flying tricks (speed stunts, but not the more outrageous ones) are more his thing, like his namesake.

 

 

I'd play with it some more. Otherwise I think it will end up being frustrating.

 

Mind you, as a low defense speedster, he probably burn some phases just Dodging now and then.

 

I just realized I don't really need the combat acceleration/deceleration on him (at least initially), so dropping the MP I posted a couple posts back down to 62 pts nets him a lot more pts to apply to CON and his defenses. Should take care of the END issues, plus with the MP can go into 0 END mode at the cost of lower speed.

 

Gotcha. I'd definitely write those powers up differently if they were intended to be exclusive with Velocity based combat maneuvers.

 

The book write up from US may not be techically wrong. The 5th Edition (non-Revised) write up for HA says it can be used with martial maneuvers... but doesn't mention non-martial maneuvers. That may be hair splitting, but could be the reason for the write up in US. That, or the write up is inconsistent with the description given. Either way, a -1/4 limit not to work with the two maneuvers doesn't change the cost much, so tossing it in there for clarity.

 

Yeah, speedsters are rarely bulletproof, but they tend to be fairly tough just so they can survive the effect of their own powers.

 

Biological adaptations could account for a higher than normal human PD/ED, or you could buy some OIF/IIF PD/ED via a padded costume that the rDEF armor could stack with it.

 

Could always go with a force field like Cannonball too, in which case you save a few points via the Link to the movement power.

 

Force Field wouldn't work with the SFX too well. (Technically, "flight" is his only power.) I'm liking just buying up base PD/ED.

 

Of course, you could probably also justify some extra abilities liek life support's that are useful for fliers (heat for high friction, cold and breathing for the thin air at high altitudes)

 

Was thinking about these, but not being capable of withstanding high altitude flight for too long would fit the barnstorming concept.

 

Sure, the odds are stacked against you, but that's why they teach you how to fall when your chute doesn't open. Try to minimize the damage and hope for the best

 

Plus he's probably crashed a lot learning his powers at lower altitudes, so he could have learned how to roll with things and not take a header.

 

Of course, it also goes hand and hand with his Acrobatics skill.

 

If need be, you can also justify the skill as a power/physical adaptation for flight.

 

The mechanics of taking reduced damage from falling is mainly what your after for a guy like this. Superman doesn't have to worry about it the same way Angel does...

 

All good points. I'll probably add it back in, it was on the pre-trimmed skill list to start with.

 

Core rules have Parachute use defined as a Transportation Familiarity. Dark Champions/Ultimate Skill makes it an optional skill.

 

I was actually going to buy him a few TFs anyway.

 

The character doesn't actually have No Turn Mode listed as an option for his flight... though you should have room for that option once you make the decision about NCM/Megamovement...

 

Der, I edited it so many times that when I decided to leave it to the variable advantage I forgot to re-write it. No matter now, that iteration's dead.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Ok, here's an update:

 

Barnstormer

 

Val Char Cost

25 STR 15

26 DEX 48

23 CON 26

15 BODY 10

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

10 COM 0

 

15/21 PD 10

15/21 ED 10

6 SPD 24

10 REC 0

46 END 0

40 STUN 0

 

6" RUN 0

2" SWIM 0

5" LEAP 0

Characteristics Cost: 153

 

Cost Power

62 Born to Fly: Multipower, 62-point reserve

6u 1) Combat Flight: Flight 25", No Turn Mode (+1/4) (62 Active Points)

6u 2) I Never Run Out of Gas: Flight 20", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (60 Active Points)

6u 3) Non-Combat Flight: Flight 5", x128 Noncombat, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (60 Active Points)

46 Air Superiority: Multipower, 46-point reserve

3u 1) Ouch!: Hand-To-Hand Attack +9d6, Only When Moving ((Must make a Half Move up to or Past target to attack); +0) (45 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2), Cannot Be Used With Move By or Move Through (-1/4)

3u 2) Cleaning House: Hand-To-Hand Attack +4d6, Area of Effect: Trailing, Selective (+1 1/4) (45 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2), Cannot Be Used With Move By or Move Through (-1/4)

2u 3) Backdraft: Telekinesis (30 STR) (45 Active Points); Only to Drag Target (-1), Affects Whole Object (-1/4), Only When Moving (-1/4)

3u 4) Clear the Air: Dispel Gas/Mist/Smoke Powers 12d6, any Gas/Mist/Smoke power one at a time (+1/4) (45 Active Points); No Range (-1/2)

2u 5) Downdraft: Telekinesis (30 STR) (45 Active Points); Only to Pull Flying Characters Down (-1 1/4), Affects Whole Object (-1/4), Must Pass Through Intervening Space (-1/4)

2u 6) Eat My Dust: Change Environment 32" radius, -3 to Sight Group PER Rolls, Hole In The Middle (+1/4) (45 Active Points); OIF (Appropriate Dust or Powder of Opportunity; -1/2), Easy to Dispel (-1/4), Must Pass Through Intervening Space (-1/4)

Eagle Eyes

2 1) +2 PER with Normal Sight

3 2) Rapid ( x10) with Normal Sight

3 3) +6 versus Range Modifier for Normal Sight

12 Crash Suit: Armor (6 PD/6 ED) (18 Active Points); OIF (-1/2)

2 Brave Lad: +5 PRE (5 Active Points); Defensive Only (-1)

Powers Cost: 163

 

 

Cost Skill

7 +2 with DCV (10 Active Points); Only When Flying (-1/2)

3 Aerobatics 14-

5 Combat Piloting 15-

3 PS: Stunt Pilot 12-

3 Teamwork 14-

9 Power 17-

2 KS: Aviation History 11-

2 TF: Helicopters, Parachuting, Basic, Small Planes

Skills Cost: 34

 

 

 

Total Character Cost: 350

 

Pts. Disadvantage

15 Social Limitation: Public ID (Frequently, Major)

15 Psychological Limitation: Code vs. Killing (Common, Strong)

15 Psychological Limitation: Loves Aircraft and Flying (Common, Strong) [Notes: James is easily distracted by all things aeronautical.]

20 Psychological Limitation: Overconfident with flying and piloting abilities (Very Common, Strong)

15 Psychological Limitation: Claustrophobic (Uncommon, Total)

20 Dependent NPC: Mama O'Mally and Her Flying Circus 8- (Normal; Group DNPC: x4 DNPCs)

20 Hunted: International Law Enforcement Agency 11- (Mo Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Watching)

25 Hunted: Unknown Organization 8- (Mo Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Capture)

5 Money: Poor

 

 

Disadvantage Points: 150

Base Points: 200

[Christopher]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

One idea for the "Ouch" Power:

HSMA 110 introduces the "Velocity Damage Only (-½ for v/10, -¼ for v/6)" Limitation.

 

Another variant to do it would be Speedster Martial Arts, wich allows (among others) to built a Move By/Through that does not causes Damage to the user.

 

What I also thought about was building speedster with Naked Advantages for STR (inlcuding one Area of Effect). The bonus from Speed could be done with STR, 0 END, Velocity Based.

[Ice9]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

One idea for defense that might be suitable is Combat Luck, defined as the result of his extraordinarily quick reactions - although being inherent tough makes sense as well, if he flies around at jet speed unshielded.

If you need a few more points, it should be noted that since you have 6 SPD, you could drop your Running down to 3" (and Swimming to 1") and still have a faster running speed than a normal person.

 

Minor note - why is Air Superiority 46 points when nothing in it exceeds 45?

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Minor note - why is Air Superiority 46 points when nothing in it exceeds 45?

 

The last slot used to be 46.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: Barnstormer, flying speedster

 

Ok, here's a final-ish version. I'll be picking up some more skills with XP, and may change one of the psych limits to a social, once I think of how to phrase it.

 

http://www.herocentral.net/herocentral/get/files/premium/Barnstormer.HTML