Summoning a truck

[GhostDancer]

 

[GhostDancer]

 

[GhostDancer]

 

[Hugh Neilson]

Reason from effect - what is the impact of having the truck? A bit of extra movement only available out of combat? We could make a pretty convoluted structure with a Multipower of small movement increments Usable on Others. What about 1 meter of Running, Usable on 8 others; owner of power controls; must remain close (+1 1/2), Megascale 100 meters (+1), Physical Manifestation (-1/4)? 3 points, and we can travel 100 meters per phase. Assuming a 3 SPD character, that's a top speed of 1.5km per minute, or 90 kph. Make 100 meters 200 and we have a pretty souped up truck that tops out at 180 kph. You arrive within a few hundred meters of your destination (you can't just park it in the middle of the street!)

 

Too expensive? If it takes 5 minutes to activate, that's a -1 limitation and drops it to 2 points. If you're 0 DCV while you sit in the truck (Concentrate Throughout), that's another -1. 1 point.

 

Voila - you can Summon a truck. Up to 8 people, including you, can ride (some are in the back). You drive - they have to stay in the truck.

[Christopher]

One of the players wants their power to be able to summon a truck and/or car at will and wherever they are, as well as make it disappear when not needed. Soooooo, how would you build that? The vehicle would pretty much be a standard vehicle, not suped-up.

There are mostly two ways to do this:

1. Summon. It explicitly mentions that you need Slavishly Devoted for a object like a car. Also by deftault you only get a "generic Truck" from this. Something you find on a Vehicle list as stock car.

If you want the Batmobile you also need "Specific Being". And damage to it sticks around between summonings (as usualy for specific being).

 

2. Movement Power, "Useable by nearby" or "Useable by others". Movement is the game effect, "summoning a truck" is the special effect.

It needs proper advantages to not cost endurance/be persistent (if that is wanted). Also if the goal is to be able to move lot's of mass, it might need proper increased mass.

 

It depends a lot on what the overall goal of this power is. Is it only about moving yourself (and the team) around fast? Or is it about having the full utility of a vehicle?

Also, is it a specific vehicle or a generic one?

[massey]

Also by deftault you only get a "generic Truck" from this. Something you find on a Vehicle list as stock car.

If you want the Batmobile you also need "Specific Being". And damage to it sticks around between summonings (as usualy for specific being).

 

That's not my understanding of how the power works.  "Specific being" means that you're summoning a specific person or specific item that already exists in the campaign world.  If I have a 300 point summon "truck", I'm not going to get a generic truck.  I'm going to get a 300 point truck that is written up with whatever stats I put into it.  "Specific being" is an advantage because it basically amounts to a teleport usable against others.  It brings someone who exists in the campaign universe directly to you.

[Greywind]

I don't agree with that. You might get a 300 point truck, but the GM is going to have the say as to where the points go. You're just getting the truck. Not designing it.

[Hyper-Man]

Summoning a specific being does not necessarily mean a 'teleportation' sfx is involved.  It can still involve the summoned arriving under their own power and requiring them to inhabit the area.

 

example:

[Hugh Neilson]

In a lot of cases, Specific Being seems more of a limitation than an advantage.  "Summon a typical cop" gets me a hale, hearty cop who, depending on the other aspects of the build, may be predisposed to help me out.  Summoning Officer Frank O'Riley may get me a reminder that last week, Officer O'Riley was reduced to -7 BOD, so he shows up still in traction - and maybe he's not all that predisposed to help me out any more.  I don't think a blanket +1 was the best approach to that particular modifier.

[massey]

I don't agree with that. You might get a 300 point truck, but the GM is going to have the say as to where the points go. You're just getting the truck. Not designing it.

 

Generally Summon allows you to design the thing you're getting, within GM guidelines.  Specific being lets you take someone who already exists in the universe and bring him to you.  That's the advantage of it.

[Christopher]

In a lot of cases, Specific Being seems more of a limitation than an advantage.  "Summon a typical cop" gets me a hale, hearty cop who, depending on the other aspects of the build, may be predisposed to help me out.  Summoning Officer Frank O'Riley may get me a reminder that last week, Officer O'Riley was reduced to -7 BOD, so he shows up still in traction - and maybe he's not all that predisposed to help me out any more.  I don't think a blanket +1 was the best approach to that particular modifier.

It gives you are hale, hearty, generic cop.

They will always have approximately the same skills (within the variation allowed by the 75/150/300 point Cop Template).

You don't get to choose where thier points are spend. But you also always get a intact version that is ready to battle. Also for most parts I consider no specific summons to be "disposeable". There is not penalty to getting them killed (you can asume they just unsummon on being disabeled or some other fitting special effect).

 

On the one hand specific being allows you to either summon a specific being from the world (for this care must be take so it does not become a cheap way to Mind Control even the toughest foes), or desing what you summon.

You don't get "generic Fireelemental", you get "Fridolin the Fire Elemental" wich has a lot of XP wich he used to buy up complications/learnt new fire tricks the generic ones lack/might have a few skills yo don't expect or won't find in a generic a fire elemental.

Basically Specific being works closer to a "Duplicate, 100% difference to main character" then your normal summon. Control is still weaker, but in turn they are easier to replace then a lost duplicate.

[Hugh Neilson]

It gives you are hale, hearty, generic cop.

They will always have approximately the same skills (within the variation allowed by the 75/150/300 point Cop Template).

You don't get to choose where thier points are spend. But you also always get a intact version that is ready to battle. Also for most parts I consider no specific summons to be "disposeable". There is not penalty to getting them killed (you can asume they just unsummon on being disabeled or some other fitting special effect).

 

On the one hand specific being allows you to either summon a specific being from the world (for this care must be take so it does not become a cheap way to Mind Control even the toughest foes), or desing what you summon.

"Summon: The King of the Land" seems a much more potent ability than "Summon Fred, a Specific Guard". The +1 advantage for both does not add any balance, so why have that advantage rather than a caution on the summoning of specific beings?

 

The GM may refuse to allow a character to Summon a being the GM considers too powerful or potentially unbalancing.

covers unbalancing uses already.

 

You don't get "generic Fireelemental", you get "Fridolin the Fire Elemental" wich has a lot of XP wich he used to buy up complications/learnt new fire tricks the generic ones lack/might have a few skills yo don't expect or won't find in a generic a fire elemental.

Basically Specific being works closer to a "Duplicate, 100% difference to main character" then your normal summon. Control is still weaker, but in turn they are easier to replace then a lost duplicate.

Summon costs Fridolin's total cp/5. If Fridolin gains xp, my Summon stops working. If Fridolin was knocked down to negative BOD last time I summoned him, paying double over Summoning a generic Elemental suddenly seems like a really bad deal.

 

Similarly, after driving the truck over an embankment, rolling it several times through the rocks before it fell in the lake, I think Summon Generic Truck is looking pretty good.

[massey]

It gives you are hale, hearty, generic cop.

They will always have approximately the same skills (within the variation allowed by the 75/150/300 point Cop Template).

You don't get to choose where thier points are spend. But you also always get a intact version that is ready to battle. Also for most parts I consider no specific summons to be "disposeable". There is not penalty to getting them killed (you can asume they just unsummon on being disabeled or some other fitting special effect).

 

On the one hand specific being allows you to either summon a specific being from the world (for this care must be take so it does not become a cheap way to Mind Control even the toughest foes), or desing what you summon.

You don't get "generic Fireelemental", you get "Fridolin the Fire Elemental" wich has a lot of XP wich he used to buy up complications/learnt new fire tricks the generic ones lack/might have a few skills yo don't expect or won't find in a generic a fire elemental.

Basically Specific being works closer to a "Duplicate, 100% difference to main character" then your normal summon. Control is still weaker, but in turn they are easier to replace then a lost duplicate.

 

No, the player can still build the character that gets summoned.  Summon is a power that requires the GM to watch for abuse, but (5th edition rules anyway, I don't have 6th):

 

"If the GM doesn’t want to spend the time and

eff ort to build a Summoned being, he may use

a standard character sheet out of a Hero Games

product, or let the player design it. In the latter

case, the GM should closely monitor the player’s

work to make sure the Summoned being fi ts his

(the GM’s) conception and standards and is not

unbalancing. The GM must approve all Summon

powers and Summoned beings after he examines

them for campaign suitability and balance."

 

Pages 222 - 223

 

You can Summon "experienced fire elemental" who is the exact same as Fridolin.

[Greywind]

 

"If the GM doesn’t want to spend the time and

eff ort to build a Summoned being, he may use

a standard character sheet out of a Hero Games

product, or let the player design it."

 

The GMs I've played with won't even make it to the "or..." They will design it or they will use a standard character sheet.

[Christopher R Taylor]

The way I handle summoning constructs like bases or vehicles is you treat the loyalty and services as a time limit: they stick around x time without a battle of wills and then poof.  The greater the amicability advantage, the longer they last up the time chart.  If you re-summon them before the time is up, it just increases duration.

[Hugh Neilson]

The GMs I've played with won't even make it to the "or..." They will design it or they will use a standard character sheet.

To me, if both GM and player are reasonable, the results should be pretty close. Summoning a Fire Elemental should get a Fire Elemental, not an ancient Fire Elemental who has spent 80% of its points on various Area and Cultural Knowledges to reflect its vast travels and can't produce a fire hot enough to get past mild discomfort, nor should it lack all Fire Elemental abilities the player has no immediate use for to reduce its cost or step up its combat stats, nor should it lack reasonable Fire Elemental complications because that would be easier for the player, and he's not saving any points for them anyway.

 

If I take "Summon Fire Elemental", I'd be basing it on the standard Fire Elemental character sheet. If the GM tells me Fire Elementals are different in his game, then I will base the Summon on his revised Fire Elemental. If In want a customized Summon, then it would be because what I want does not exist already, and I would expect the GM will vet the Summoned being's character sheet.