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Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase Three and BEYOOOOONND

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3 hours ago, Scott Ruggels said:

I thought someone like Katie Sackoff would have made a much more dynamic superhero. She has more acting range than Larson does.

 

I agree on Sackoff, but in the thread we had speculating on the casting someone made a very valid point: They need someone younger, who won't age out of the role over a span of years. Larson is 29 to Sackoff's 38. Likewise my personal top pics all having over 5 years on Larson. (Yvonne Strahovski, Amanda Schull, Charlize Theron, and a maybe Emily Blunt based on that Groundhog's Day type movie she did with Tom Cruz.)

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9 minutes ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

I agree on Sackoff, but in the thread we had speculating on the casting someone made a very valid point: They need someone younger, who won't age out of the role over a span of years. Larson is 29 to Sackoff's 38. Likewise my personal top pics all having over 5 years on Larson. (Yvonne Strahovski, Amanda Schull, Charlize Theron, and a maybe Emily Blunt based on that Groundhog's Day type movie she did with Tom Cruz.)

 

We should just skip all of the aging out nonsense, and cast Helen Mirren. 

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Black Panther and Wonder Woman were entertaining despite the political needling. The problem that follows is when Hollywood learns the wrong lessons from their success. They begin to think that it was the political moralizing that appealed to audiences, and not the, well, entertaining elements (the action, the character interactions, the narrative arc, etc.). When that happens, too much focus gets put on stuffing future projects with political messages (in order to make them Socially Important), and then you have an inevitable backlash crashing up on a movie that is perceived as having a political agenda (e.g., Captain Marvel), before anyone has even seen it. Social politics start to dominate the cultural discussion about a movie, and the objective of just making good, entertaining movies starts to get lost in the scuffle.

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To be fair, most of the buzz leading up to BP's release was about the nearly-all-black cast and the portrayal of an advanced African culture.  Just the fact that an all-black cast is newsworthy... is newsworthy.

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1 hour ago, Ternaugh said:

 

We should just skip all of the aging out nonsense, and cast Helen Mirren. 

 We should skipt the aging, because I don't think Phase IV is going to work out. Even aside the fact of brie Larson's  declarations. I just don't think the steam will last.

 

 Captain marvel is not a compelling character, the way Ironman, Spiderman, or Black Widow are.  basing the future on Captain Marvel I think is a mistake. it was never a fan favorite, and brie Larson Doesn't look like she is having fun, the waty the other cast members are. Sincve this is not the RL Politics thread i will avoid any outside discussion of brie's statements, and contract riders, but I fear that she will do what Sana Aminat has done to the comics.

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7 hours ago, Old Man said:

To be fair, most of the buzz leading up to BP's release was about the nearly-all-black cast and the portrayal of an advanced African culture.  Just the fact that an all-black cast is newsworthy... is newsworthy.

 

It was a running joke on the BP set for Andy Serkis and Martin Freeman to be referred to as "the Tolkien white guys." :snicker:

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Yeah I'll wait to hear from actual fans and viewers, the reviewer system is almost entirely broken and corrupted.  People were giving Black Panther 5 stars and calling it the best film ever made, and it quite simply is not.  Its a fun action film with some flaws and some great bits, but not a standout even in comic book movie genre.  Having already heard from fans who saw an advanced screening who were praising the cat and not much about the film its self is kind of telling.

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There is still a press embargo in effect for actual reviews until about two days before the movie opens. 

 

The embago was lifted for first impressions on twitter that have no spoilery information or plot details. 

 

I saw something to this effect. Will find it so we are all on the same page. 

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30 minutes ago, Bazza said:

There is still a press embargo in effect for actual reviews until about two days before the movie opens. 

 

The embago was lifted for first impressions on twitter that have no spoilery information or plot details. 

 

I saw something to this effect. Will find it so we are all on the same page. 

 

That's SOP for movies nowadays, especially the blockbusters. Concern over spoilers, mostly.

 

It's actually a good sign when the studio allows first-impression review tweets well ahead of the official release date. It shows they have confidence in the movie.

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38 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Yeah I'll wait to hear from actual fans and viewers, the reviewer system is almost entirely broken and corrupted.  People were giving Black Panther 5 stars and calling it the best film ever made, and it quite simply is not.  Its a fun action film with some flaws and some great bits, but not a standout even in comic book movie genre.  Having already heard from fans who saw an advanced screening who were praising the cat and not much about the film its self is kind of telling.

 

Quite a few people did give BP five stars, but if any people were calling it "the best film ever made" they must have been too few to easily spot in the crowd. You have the right to your opinion that it's not a great movie, but obviously there are very many people who would disagree with you, as is their right. Goose the cat is often being singled out -- he's a significant supporting character for the comix Captain Marvel , after all -- but only as one of several positive features that most audience tweets have mentioned. Under the review embargo they aren't allowed to say much about the film itself, only give general impressions.

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I can totally understand it has a powerful cultural resonance and it's a pretty good movie, but it's not in my top 10 Comic Book movies or even in my top 5 Marvel movies

 

PS:  It's also not as good as Forrest Gump, which means its not even the best picture to use the words 'Black Panther' in a movie.  :)

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14 hours ago, Old Man said:

To be fair, most of the buzz leading up to BP's release was about the nearly-all-black cast and the portrayal of an advanced African culture.

 

Indeed. It was this unprecedented degree of black representation that catapulted the movie into the ranks of All-Time Most Important Cultural Event Since Roots. Disney/Marvel fed as much fuel into that fire as they could, knowing it would prove a very effective box office accelerant, and it worked. Hell, the movie even nabbed a Best Picture nom, something no superhero movie has ever managed to do. And that's because no other superhero movie was deemed Socially Important, even though at least a few were arguably better movies.

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I just don't understand why its not enough to just say "it was a pretty entertaining movie that some people found very profound and important."  I mean, every time Kirk Cameron puts out a Christian-themed film some people find it profound and important, even life-changing, but that doesn't mean we all have to call it some wonderful event that is super meaningful and a great film.  Tens of millions of comic book fans though Iron Man was a hugely important and meaningful movie in their lives, bringing some to tears at finally seeing a funny book movie done well.  That didn't make it something special and super important, just meaningful to a group of people.  If you cannot distinguish between a film's inherent, objective qualities and skill then that's kind of a problem with your ability to review things properly.

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18 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

I just don't understand why its not enough to just say "it was a pretty entertaining movie that some people found very profound and important."  I mean, every time Kirk Cameron puts out a Christian-themed film some people find it profound and important, even life-changing, but that doesn't mean we all have to call it some wonderful event that is super meaningful and a great film.  Tens of millions of comic book fans though Iron Man was a hugely important and meaningful movie in their lives, bringing some to tears at finally seeing a funny book movie done well.  That didn't make it something special and super important, just meaningful to a group of people.  If you cannot distinguish between a film's inherent, objective qualities and skill then that's kind of a problem with your ability to review things properly.

 

"It's not about you." --Ancient One, Doctor Strange

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3 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 Tens of millions of comic book fans though Iron Man was a hugely important and meaningful movie in their lives, bringing some to tears at finally seeing a funny book movie done well.  That didn't make it something special and super important, just meaningful to a group of people.  If you cannot distinguish between a film's inherent, objective qualities and skill then that's kind of a problem with your ability to review things properly.

 

 Partisan Tribalism have mostly derstroyed people's abilities to think critically. Critical thinking is an anathema to the current elites, so Everything is held up with the fanaticism of College sports fans, but without any sort of sportsmanship.

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21 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

Those two aren't without merit, but I couldn't stand either one and wouldn't put them in the set.

 

This whole "consensus" thing is tricky. :P

 

And there it is. Casablanca and Citizen Kane are two of the most widely revered movies in film history; but Pattern Ghost doesn't like them and doesn't agree with that assessment. As he has the right to. What he would not have the right to, is to say that everyone who doesn't share his view is objectively wrong for doing so, and to denigrate their taste and intelligence because of that.

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