Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase Three and BEYOOOOONND

[slikmar]

Iirc, after one more day, the in comic explanation was that strange cast a spell just like this, but if peter revealed himself to someone, then all their memories of him returned.

[Matt the Bruins]

I don't think Mysterio would even know who Dr. Strange is, much less be capable of impersonating him around Wong for any length of time.

[Lord Liaden]

On 8/25/2021 at 12:27 PM, zslane said:

Anyone else get the feeling that this Dr. Strange isn't really Dr. Strange at all, but Mysterio posing as Dr. Strange? Assuming that Keaton returns as the Vulture, we'd only be missing one of the Sinister Six: Mysterio. And the most obvious place for him to be hiding is in plain sight.

 

3 hours ago, Matt the Bruins said:

I don't think Mysterio would even know who Dr. Strange is, much less be capable of impersonating him around Wong for any length of time.

 

Yeah, that seems pretty far beyond even Quentin Beck. OTOH hiding in plain sight would definitely suit him. If I was to use that plot point in the movies, I'd have him pose as J. Jonah Jameson. The better to make Peter's life hell.

[Bazza]

HOW MARVEL'S SHANG-CHI HAD TO "DESTROY" ITS OWN RACIST ORIGINS

The first in a series about Shang-Chi’s origins, rise, fall, and rebirth.
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/shang-chi-racist-origins

[csyphrett]

3 hours ago, Bazza said:

HOW MARVEL'S SHANG-CHI HAD TO "DESTROY" ITS OWN RACIST ORIGINS

The first in a series about Shang-Chi’s origins, rise, fall, and rebirth.
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/shang-chi-racist-origins

He was the son of Sax Rohmer's Fu Manchu. That goes all the way back to the Yellow Peril.

CES 

[mattingly]

12 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

Yeah, that seems pretty far beyond even Quentin Beck. OTOH hiding in plain sight would definitely suit him. If I was to use that plot point in the movies, I'd have him pose as J. Jonah Jameson. The better to make Peter's life hell.

 

That's my guess, too.

 

[Grailknight]

6 hours ago, csyphrett said:

He was the son of Sax Rohmer's Fu Manchu. That goes all the way back to the Yellow Peril.

CES 

 

Yes, the first run of Master of Kung-Fu drew heavily on the original Rohmer works. I thought the choice to place it in Great Britain while jumping into the then modern world was inspired. Then they made it into some of the best James Bond adventures that were ever written. Those Moench/Gullacy arcs were Marvel at it's finest.

 

Plus they introduced me to Fleetwood Mac! 

[Greywind]

Beck is dead. Riva has all the Mysterio tech now. And there has been more than one Mysterio in the comics.

[Ternaugh]

1 hour ago, Greywind said:

Beck is dead. Riva has all the Mysterio tech now. And there has been more than one Mysterio in the comics.

 

Maybe he's only mostly dead.

[zslane]

Or a Mysterio from another universe.

[Greywind]

Could be Rey Mysterio.

[Lord Liaden]

How many superheroes and supervillains have we seen "die" in the comics, only to come back by one means or another? They're dead unless and until some writer wants to use them.

[Greywind]

Which is a major part of what is wrong with comics continuity.

[archer]

13 minutes ago, Greywind said:

Which is a major part of what is wrong with comics continuity.

 

Look at it as a feature, not a bug.

 

The big two comic companies print between 20-25 titles per year at 12 issues each per year. Plus there's assorted annuals and one-shots. That creates a huge need for villains to grace those pages. 

 

If the villains die, full stop, rather than being left for dead and miraculously reappearing later, the writers have to come up with a constant stream of new villains.

 

And the audience would become conditioned to not get attached to the villains because the villain would get killed off after a few of appearances. And there could be no "redemption" arcs for those characters nor any chance for them to sink further into whatever madness drove them to become a villain in the first place.

 

Movie supervillains can be killed off because even at a frenetic pace of churning out new movies, there's at most three movies per big comic book company per year (as opposed to 260 comic books minimum per year).

[Greywind]

18 minutes ago, archer said:

If the villains die, full stop, rather than being left for dead and miraculously reappearing later, the writers have to come up with a constant stream of new villains.

 

And that is where the creativity comes in...

[archer]

1 hour ago, Greywind said:

 

And that is where the creativity comes in...

 

 

Yeah, you creatively come up with 200 new villains per year for 60 years and creatively try to keep your comic book world from seeming like a huge joke of idiots donning a costume for the express purpose of shortly thereafter dying at the hands of "heroes".

 

 

 

[Matt the Bruins]

At least DC solved that problem by having reboots so frequently no one knows if a given character is still supposed to be dead or not! 😆

(I kid, but I was very glad to see Ma & Pa Kent return with the one at the end of Doomsday Clock.)

[archer]

4 minutes ago, Matt the Bruins said:

At least DC solved that problem by having reboots so frequently no one knows if a given character is still supposed to be dead or not! 😆

(I kid, but I was very glad to see Ma & Pa Kent return with the one at the end of Doomsday Clock.)

 

I'm a fan of the company at least attempting to keep some kind of continuity. So stuff like the LSH Threeboot drives me nuts. I have no idea how high their number of reboots is at the moment just for that series.

[Lord Liaden]

DC's original Crisis on Infinite Earths had a very clear purpose, to clean up and streamline what had become a cluttered continuity, which their editorial staff considered problematic for them and for readers. For the most part the story was well thought-out and executed, and left DC with a single, far more coherent setting, and the opportunity to change certain details they thought had outlived their usefulness. The series was also wildly financially successful, which was probably its downfall, as publishers had trouble seeing past, "reboots equal big bucks." So it went from the comic book event of a generation, to, "It's been a few years, guess it's time for another reboot. Yay."

[Lord Liaden]

3 hours ago, Greywind said:

 

And that is where the creativity comes in...

 

I remember reading an interview with former Marvel Editor-in-Chief, Jim Shooter, from the early 2000s, where he described an encounter at a comic convention with the then-current Marvel EiC -- I think it was Joe Quesada. Anyway, Marvel had recently scored big successes with their X-Men and Spider-Man films, stimulating interest in the comic lines, and Quesada asked Shooter what he would do next. To paraphrase Shooter, the company had collected the easy money by capitalizing on existing franchises. Now they needed to do the work of creating new characters.

 

Needless to say, that advice was not much followed.

[Grailknight]

8 hours ago, archer said:

 

 

Yeah, you creatively come up with 200 new villains per year for 60 years and creatively try to keep your comic book world from seeming like a huge joke of idiots donning a costume for the express purpose of shortly thereafter dying at the hands of "heroes".

 

 

 

 

Or you could make villain death as rare as hero death and write stories where everyone survives.

 

The Flash went 30+ years with only one villain death(The Top) and it worked just fine because there was a large Rogue's Gallery.

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

And because nobody liked The Top. 

[Bazza]

Nobody could Top it. 

[Greywind]

Maybe if he'd ever stop singing You Spin Me Round...

[csyphrett]

I felt bad for the top. He was one of the few villains whose power was killing him from the inside.

CES