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Conversion for stats from RM to Hero is definitely divide by 5. A RM 100 should equal a Hero 20.

 

For racial bonuses, you can divide those by 5 and add it as a bonus to the Hero characteristic.

Yeah that's what I ended up doing, the divide by 3 came from one of the RM books, can't remember which, the stat bonuses just seemed a bit high. Anyway I did up  spreadsheet using the divide by 5 rule and others I found online or within the books themselves. And have generally got the racial stat mods worked out. I did a quick comparison with the converted stat modifiers and the stat mods given in RM4, and to convert RM4 to Hero (stat mods) simply divide by 2.

 

For racial resistances to cold and heat, I chose to go with Life Support: Safe Environment, this way they are largely immune to the effects of intense heat and/or cold, depending on race, but can still take damage from a fire or ice attack.

 

The elves got Life Support: Immunity to all Terrestrial Diseases

But I'm not sure how to do Essence, Channelling, Mentalism, Poison and Disease Resistance.

I was actually considering ignoring Essence, Channelling and Mentalism Resistance.

Damage Negation or Damage Reduction seems a bit expensive for Poison and Disease Resistance, particularly when the elves get Disease Immunity for 2 points.

 

I just had the thought that I could take the MERP/RM bonuse divide it by 5 and use the result as the number of specific poisons or diseases the character is immune to.

The cost is relatively low compared to Damage Negation/Reduction.

The character has some hope that any poison or disease he/she is exposed to is one that he/she is immune to.

Perhaps I could do something similar with Essence, Channelling and Mentalism.

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Poison Resistance:  +5 with CON Rolls (10 Active Points); Only to Resist the effects of Poison (-1) (5 Real Points)

 

Disease Resistance:  +5 with CON Rolls (10 Active Points); Only to Resist the effects of Disease (-1) (5 Real Points)

Legend, thank you.

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What do you guys think of Power Defense used as such:

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Essence Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Channelling Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Mentalism Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

I've gone with rare attack on the limitation because, overt use of magic is/was rare in Middle Earth except in cases of dire need, uncommon has the same cost, common caost 5 CP's and Very Common 6 CP's.

 

It limits magic resistance to Drains, Transfers, Transforms and related attacks, to my mind this represents magic resistance quite well.

 

The resistance to physical types of magic, i.e. Magic Missile, Fireball, Lightning bolt should be handled as mundane attacks (albeit with a magical origin).

 

Having each realm, Essence, Channelling and Mentalism require it's own resistance power, allows the GM to introduce new realms of magic later in the game, without significant changes to the mechanic.

 

Thoughts and Suggestions, Please?

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The elves got Life Support: Immunity to all Terrestrial Diseases

....the elves get Disease Immunity for 2 points.

They get Immunity to Disease in General for 2 pts? How did they do that?

 

 

I just had the thought that I could take the MERP/RM bonuse divide it by 5 and use the result as the number of specific poisons or diseases the character is immune to.

The cost is relatively low compared to Damage Negation/Reduction.

The character has some hope that any poison or disease he/she is exposed to is one that he/she is immune to.

I'm confused and I don't know what you are doing here exactly.

 

 

 

What do you guys think of Power Defense used as such:

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Essence Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Channelling Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

4       Magic Resistance:  Power Defense (8 points) (8 Active Points); Only Works Against Mentalism Magic Rare attack (-1)

 

I've gone with rare attack on the limitation because, overt use of magic is/was rare in Middle Earth except in cases of dire need, uncommon has the same cost, common caost 5 CP's and Very Common 6 CP's.

 

It limits magic resistance to Drains, Transfers, Transforms and related attacks, to my mind this represents magic resistance quite well.

 

The resistance to physical types of magic, i.e. Magic Missile, Fireball, Lightning bolt should be handled as mundane attacks (albeit with a magical origin).

 

Having each realm, Essence, Channelling and Mentalism require it's own resistance power, allows the GM to introduce new realms of magic later in the game, without significant changes to the mechanic.

 

Thoughts and Suggestions, Please?

I could be wrong about what "Mentalism" means in this context, but if it includes things like Telepathy, Mental Illusions, or Mind Control, you might want to use Mental Defense rather than Power Defense. If Mentalism includes such things and ALSO includes Drains, Transformations, etc. you might want to house rule that Mental Defense protects against those because they still have the "special effect" of Mentalism.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Channeling the Mental Essence of a palindromedary

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They get Immunity to Disease in General for 2 pts? How did they do that?

 

 

I'm confused and I don't know what you are doing here exactly.

 

 

 

 

I could be wrong about what "Mentalism" means in this context, but if it includes things like Telepathy, Mental Illusions, or Mind Control, you might want to use Mental Defense rather than Power Defense. If Mentalism includes such things and ALSO includes Drains, Transformations, etc. you might want to house rule that Mental Defense protects against those because they still have the "special effect" of Mentalism.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Channeling the Mental Essence of a palindromedary

Mentalism is merely one of the realms of magic. It is analogous to mental powers but is not limited to that. In the context of a Hero version of RM, Menalism would be a category of SFX for magic along with Essence (traditional magic) and Channeling (priestly magic)

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They get Immunity to Disease in General for 2 pts? How did they do that?

 

 

I'm confused and I don't know what you are doing here exactly.

 

 

 

 

I could be wrong about what "Mentalism" means in this context, but if it includes things like Telepathy, Mental Illusions, or Mind Control, you might want to use Mental Defense rather than Power Defense. If Mentalism includes such things and ALSO includes Drains, Transformations, etc. you might want to house rule that Mental Defense protects against those because they still have the "special effect" of Mentalism.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Channeling the Mental Essence of a palindromedary

I got the Life Support Immunity to All Terrestrial Diseases wrong it is 5 points.

 

Ok.. sorry I thought I mentioned that I am starting a Fantasy Hero game set in Middle Earth and I'm trying to figure out how to give the races the abilities they supposedly have in Middle Earth (according to MERP/RM).

 

MERP lists two realms of magic: Essence and Channelling. Rolemaster introduced Mentalism as a third, and some MERP modules included it in creature and NPC descriptions afterwards.

Quoted from the books:

 

"THE REALM OF ESSENCE: The Essence is that which is common to all things, living and dead, organic and inorganic. It has been characterized by many names—the Tao, Magic, the Unified Field, etc. It represents a force and order that defines the ways of the world. Changes in the patterns of the Essence dictate the flow of events, and the course of life itself. It is a power beyond the grasp of any being. Nonetheless, some who become one with the Essence find ways of manipulating its patterns on a temporary basis. This fleeting strength allows them to redefine the reality around them, molding elements and wielding very real power. Thus, the spells of those who are of the realm of Essence can be both beautiful and lethal, affecting one or many. In the end, however, the normal patterns will always prevail, and only the effects will remain to tell the tale."  -- Spell Law of Essence p.3

 

"THE REALM OF CHANNELING: Channeling is the power of the deities of a given world as channeled through their followers or other spell users. It is religious in nature and independent of the Essence. A spell user of Channeling draws directly on the power of his deity, even though this “usually” does not require the conscious cooperation of the deity. Thus spells of this realm do not necessarily reflect the nature of the deity as long as the spell user is using relatively subtle spells (i.e., healing, detection, etc.). More powerful and significant spells such as death spells and the revival of the dead might require the active consent of a deity, depending upon the world system being used by the Gamemaster."  -- Spell Law of Channelling p.3

 

"THE REALM OF MENTALISM: The mind is an amazing tool—yet, no one uses it to its full capacity. Mentalism spell users strive to use their minds in ways few even contemplate. By using the very personal power locked within themselves, Mentalism users are able to channel the power of the Essence through their own mental corridors; thus, manipulating and bending the reality that surrounds them. In a sense, they act as very minute imitations of the deities above, giving power not to clerics, but retaining it and directing its manipulation. Mentalism users are masters of the Essence within themselves. Because Mentalism users are not deities, however, they work within the limitations of their worldly bodies, their own senses, and perceptions. Rarely are they able to direct their spells beyond themselves or one target. Nonetheless, the power of the Mentalism user can reach great heights. They are masters of thought, gatherers of presence and

inner strength. Even though their focus is generally limited to singular targets, their abilities regarding personal confrontations are considerable indeed ... for, it is the Mentaism user who seeks to fulfill the destiny of his own mind."  -- Spell Law of Mentalism p.3

 

There were apparently a number of other realms which were introduced into RM over the years, one was called Psions, there was also Elementalism, Arcane, I'll see if I can find any definitions for the them.

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"Psions are the power of the individual formed into usable effects. This is in no way similar to Mentalism. Mentalism uses the Primal Essence within a person, while Psions uses the will of the person alone."  --- Spell User's Companion p.8

 

Mental Defense would work against Psions and possibly some specific spell effects in the three realms of magic.

 

From what I was reading, the racial bonuses for Essence, Channelling and Mentalism resistance apply to all magic effects from the particular realm of magic. Most races have some sort of resistance or vulnerability in this regard.

While I can't actually find a way to create this type of blanket resistance to a realm of magic, I expect it would be rather costly in CP's.

 

Now my understanding of these resistances in MERP/RM and the intention behind them is that they were meant to represent such things as Frodo struggling to stay alive and resist the morgul blade that had wounded him, his further struggle against the allure of the One Ring, Arwen's and Meriadoc's struggle against the Black Breath after they slew the Witchking, the hobbits under the Barrowwight's power in the Barrow Downs. These are the sorts of things I envision the MERP/RM resistances applying to. The physical side of magic such as dodging a fireball, or avoiding a rain of icicles, etc. are in the physical realm and would best be avoided using physical means rather than metaphysical means.

Therefore I think the Power Defense option fits this scenario better. It is not too costly in CP, it is flexible enough to represent different racial levels of resistance, is limited enough to not upset the game balance and can be readily adapted to any new realm of magic should they be introduced.

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Ok.. sorry I thought I mentioned that I am starting a Fantasy Hero game set in Middle Earth and I'm trying to figure out how to give the races the abilities they supposedly have in Middle Earth (according to MERP/RM).

Yeah, I got that I think. But here's the part I don't get.

 

 

I just had the thought that I could take the MERP/RM bonuse divide it by 5 and use the result as the number of specific poisons or diseases the character is immune to.

The cost is relatively low compared to Damage Negation/Reduction.

The character has some hope that any poison or disease he/she is exposed to is one that he/she is immune to.

It sounds like you're saying that you will take a number from the MERP game, divide it by 5, and get a quantity, call it X. Then the character spends from 1 to 4 pts on a Life Support: Immunity to X Diseases or Poisons (filling in X with whatever the actual number is.) Then when the character is exposed to a poison or disease, they get a random roll of some kind to see if it's one they are immune to. If so, they can record it by name and the character is ever after immune to that specific thing. If not, I guess you have to record that too, as "NOT Immune to ____" In any case, once they hit that maximum number of immunities, that's it; they're not immune to any other poisons or diseases.

 

If that's not what you're saying, I don't know what you are saying; and if that IS what you are saying, I think it strange.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

And that's the opinion of someone who thinks a palindromedary is pretty normal.

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Yeah, I got that I think. But here's the part I don't get.

 

 

 

It sounds like you're saying that you will take a number from the MERP game, divide it by 5, and get a quantity, call it X. Then the character spends from 1 to 4 pts on a Life Support: Immunity to X Diseases or Poisons (filling in X with whatever the actual number is.) Then when the character is exposed to a poison or disease, they get a random roll of some kind to see if it's one they are immune to. If so, they can record it by name and the character is ever after immune to that specific thing. If not, I guess you have to record that too, as "NOT Immune to ____" In any case, once they hit that maximum number of immunities, that's it; they're not immune to any other poisons or diseases.

 

If that's not what you're saying, I don't know what you are saying; and if that IS what you are saying, I think it strange.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

And that's the opinion of someone who thinks a palindromedary is pretty normal.

Well ... I was saying something like that.

Given that they did not have immunity to all poisons, I was going to work with the theory that they were immune to some and arrive at a the number of those by dividing their MERP resistance bonus by 5 to determine that number, however I was going to allow the player to choose which poisons his charactzer was immune to.

"Was" is the operative word because it was only a thought and I hadn't got much further with it than what you see typed here.

Urlord's suggestion made far more sense to me, I just couldn't see it because of my unfamiliarity with Hero System. I hadn't actually read anything in the rules that dealt speciifically with how poisons affect a character.

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Well ... I was saying something like that.

Given that they did not have immunity to all poisons, I was going to work with the theory that they were immune to some and arrive at a the number of those by dividing their MERP resistance bonus by 5 to determine that number, however I was going to allow the player to choose which poisons his charactzer was immune to.

"Was" is the operative word because it was only a thought and I hadn't got much further with it than what you see typed here.

Urlord's suggestion made far more sense to me, I just couldn't see it because of my unfamiliarity with Hero System. I hadn't actually read anything in the rules that dealt speciifically with how poisons affect a character.

That's one of the things you have to decide - how, exactly, will poisons and diseases work in your game? In so far as we have a "standard" answer in Hero, it's usually assumed that they are attacks (probably Drains) that work against an Alternate Defense, namely, Life Support: Immunity.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wants Life Support: Diplomatic Immunity

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That's one of the things you have to decide - how, exactly, will poisons and diseases work in your game? In so far as we have a "standard" answer in Hero, it's usually assumed that they are attacks (probably Drains) that work against an Alternate Defense, namely, Life Support: Immunity.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wants Life Support: Diplomatic Immunity

You can also add that the damage can be mitigated by a Con roll to reduce the effect.

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I just want to be able to blind myself with fletching when I roll badly firing an arrow.  That there is the Rolemaster experience.

Had a character drop two arrows, break a bow string, then in frustration draw his sword and leap through the window to attack, only to get stuck in the window and have his right hand hacked off, while trying to extricate himself. Promptly surrendered after that. The bandit leader let him live, and walked away laughing his head off.

The character spent the rest of his days as a left handed swordsman, who constantly hunted the wilds for that particular bandit.

Never did find him.

Generally played MERP over RM, we always loved the system, but as a standby or "let's have a break" system. The players in my group seemed to get attached to their characters, and didn't like seeing them die or be maimed in battle.

So we used systems that favoured character survival, mainly AD&D, Palladium Fantasy, and Chivalry and Sorcery.

The players for some reason treat their characters the same way they do their online characters; as an investment in time. They seem very disappointed when all the effort and time they put into building the character and earning experience etc. is ended by the character's death.

I'm not sure why this is so, but it is true for most of my gaming group.

 

I digress, MERP and RM criticals and fumbles were and still are AWESOME!!!!    :)

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  • 4 weeks later...

I modelled a great deal of Caleon on various Role Master concepts. Healing, Arcane Magic, crafting materials, the use of "essence" and the Pale. Played Shadow World for years in HERO, but was very exposed to and still employ a lot of their conceits.

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I've played a lot of both systems, but when I look at RM these days I just think how much easier it is just to do things in Hero. So many exception-based rules in RM and so much needless complication. Take a look at Construct Companion or Fire and Ice which drill down into niches and it all seems like pointless complication. Building a construct (automaton) is child's play in Hero. And the magical realms of power in RM have poor differentiation while in Hero they can easily be given their own unique feel.

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As far as the difference in Essence, Channeling and Mentalism is concerned, it can be summed up in this way:

 

Essence = manipulating the ambient magical energy in the environment.

 

Channeling = using the power of higher and lower dimensional entities. Borrowed power.

 

Mentalism = using the magical energies flowing through ones mind, body and spirit. Chi or Prana.

 

Other than that, there are few limits on what one can do with a particular Realm of power. There is a lot of crossover effects as one can imagine. In general, Essence seems to be the best at affecting large parts of the environment. Channeling seems best at healing and affecting dimensional beings. Mentalism is very versatile, but not as far reaching as the other Realms, but it shouldnt be underestimated.

 

There are also hybrid spells such as Sorcery (Essence and Channeling) etc.

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There are several concepts in SPELL LAW that convert over to Hero very, very well.

 

The spell list concept is easily recreated as a Multipower. Try not to conver the RM spell levels over directly as that way lies madness. Just try and convert them over as well as you can. RM spell lists have a lot of redundencies that can be eliminated with the use of Variable multipower slots. (Whereas RM wastes multiple spell level slots on spell upgrades)

 

RM requires a "spell roll" based on an appropriate skill (Essence, Channeling or Mentalism and a 4th Realm known as Arcane) so Hero spell Multipower needs the limitation Requires a Skill Roll. This skill roll should have a skill penalty based on the Active points of the spell being cast. In RM, higher level spells can be more difficult to cast.

The Multipower should also have the Side Effect limitation that occurrs when the spell roll is a critical failure. Create a chart and design some effects that can happen on a critical failure. For the purpose of spell casting, I consider a "critical failure" to be missing the skill roll by 5 points or more. Also a roll of 18 is always a critical failure, no matter the chance of success.

If a critical success is rolled, I usually give some bonus such as 1/2 Essence (Mana/End) cost, extra AP boost or some positive effect.

The skill rolls should be based on the following Characteristics. Each should cost 3/2 as normal.

Essence: INT

Channeling: PRE

Mentalism: EGO

Arcane: (the average of all three characteriatics)

 

Rolemaster also has a concept known as OVERCASTING . In RM, this is when characters try to cast spells that have a level over the characters experience level. Overcasting incures pretty hefty penalties and if failed, it acts as a critical failure (meaning, OUCH!) so it is not something that should be done lightly.

But Hero doesnt have levels! How do I do this???

Relax, I got this.

Your spells have an amount of Active Points. These are your spells levels. How many active points your character can cast should depend on a multiple of the characters Spellcasting skill. You can use x2, x3 or x4 depending on how powerful you want your spellcasters to be. I recommend x3 for a typical campaign. This makes a skill roll of 15 or less able to cast 45 active point spells normally or 60 active points at 20 or less. X4 or x5 is appropriate for high powered campaigns.

Overcasting should add an additional -3 to the spell casting roll in addition to the Active Point penalty . Also, a normal failure is considered a critical failure when overcasting. On an actual critical failure when overcasting, apply double the rolled effect. Also, then AP penalty is applied to the failure roll for effect (as a bonus, not as a penalty) so be careful!

 

Example:

 

Tynstar is a Magician of the Realm of Essence. He has an Intelligence of 20 which gives him a base skill roll of 13 or less. He then applies a +2 bonus directly to his Essence skill roll for 4 points for a total of 7points of Essence Skill and a base spell roll of 15 of less. Thus Tynstar can cast up to 45 Active points without "Overcasting", but more than this there are issues.

 

Tynstars party encounters some marauding Lugroki while adventuring for treasure one day and Tynstar begins casting Firebolt spells to help his comrades. However, reinforcements arrive for the Lugroki and his fighter companions begin to tire, so Tynstar prepares his Fireballs spell, which uses the entirety of his 60 point Spell Multipower. This is -6 to his spell roll (-1 per 10 active points in the spell), but because he is Overcasting, it gains an additional -3 for a total of -9 to the spell roll!

Tynstar realises that a 6 or less when overcasting is suicide, so he tries for some bonuses. He takes a full Turn to cast the spell for +2. He uses his magestaff which gives him a +3 for Essence spells channelled through it. That brings him up to 11 or less. Tynstar rolls a 10 and successfully casts the Fireball spell, scattering the charging Lugroki across the battlefield to the cheers of his companions.

 

Had Tynstar failed the roll, he would have had to roll on the Spell Failure chart to see what happened, taking the -6 active point penalty and apply it to the failure roll as a +6

 

Example spell failure chart.

 

3D6

3-5: AP/10 D6 stun damage

6-8: AP/10 D6 Normal Damage

9-12: Lose x2 Endurance as LTE

13-14: AP/20 D6 Drain to INT

15-16: Ap/20 D6 Drain to EGO

17: AP/10 D6 Drain to Multipower pool

18: Ap/15 D6 Killing damage.

 

If the failure effect roll was a 10, +6 for a 16 then Tynstar would have taken a (60ap/20) 3D6 Ego Drain!

Note that drains should recover at a slow rate such as 5pts per day.

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Spellcasting in the RM system uses Essence. In Hero this is a form of Endurance of course. You can do it as an End reserve, however I add it to the character sheet as a new derived characteristic. Take INT, plus EGO, plus PRE, then divide by two for the Essence characteristic. The Normal Characteristic maximum is 50.

 

Essence Recovery can be based on the normal REC characteristic or can be derived from something else like Int plus Ego Plus Pre divided by 10. This recovery is per hour, not per turn. (For 6th players who dont use secondary characteristics, I would have Essence default to 20 and Ess Rec default to 4)

 

All spells must cost Essence. If a power is zero endurance, it must take the Cost Endurance limitation. In general the zero enduarance advantage is forbidden. 1/2 endurance should be considered on a case by case basis, but in general should be rare. Spells should cost AP/10 as a general rule.

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on Spell Adders and Power Point Multilpliers

 

RM has two interesting concepts that help magic users. The first is called a Spell Adder. It is an item that is enchanted to allow a magic user a free use of one of her spells without needing to use Essence. (Power points in RM) This can be extremely strategic because an adder can be used to cast a powerful spell when the character is low on juice. In RM adders are rated by how many "free spells" it allows per day. It is assumed that once the magic user gets a good nights rest, all adders the magic user has refresh.

 

In Hero these are written up as Naked Advantage 0 End with the limitation Charges applied. The charges refresh daily. Each specific Adder is tuned to a specific Realm of magic. However, Arcane Adders can be used by any Realm. Also some Hybrid Realm adders can only be used by specific professions which match the proper Realms.

 

Power Point Multipliers are exactly as they sound....magic items which multiply the number of points a magic user has to cast spells with. They are rated from x2 to x10 (or higher in some very rare cases). Thus a mage with 50 power points normally but with a x10 multiplier, he would have 500 points to play with.

 

Hero doesnt exactly work this way. What I do is translate PP multipliers as Endurance reserves which can be used for powering spells. Each x1 is 10 Essence/Endurance in the pool. In general I have the Recovery be 1/10 of the full pool which recovers per hour.

 

Like Adders, Essence multipliers are usually limited by Realm and sometimes, specific professions.

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I always thought the essence flows in shadow world were a neat concept. And they parallel the concept of Nodes from White Wolfs Mage.

 

And Shadow World hero stats for Dragons were awesome!

I enjoy the Essence Flow concept as well.

 

When I was setting up my campaign, I had to decide exactly how I was going to model the flows and foci since they are an essential element of the Shadow World setting.

 

Ultimately I decided to model the Flows themselves as a Recovery to Essence pools. The size of the Flow determining how much Recovery. If you tap a Flow, its Rec score augments your own, though while personal Essence Recovery is on an hourly basis, Essence Flow Recovery is available per minute. Thus one can refill their own personal stores very quickly. A minor Flow has a Recovery between 5 and 10 points per minute. A major Flow has a Rec between 10 and 20. Some larger flows are possible which can have a Recovery as high as 50, but these are rare.

 

A Foci is where multiple Flows intersect and this convergence of Flows creates a pool of Essence that can be tapped and utilized as an End Reserve. A minor Foci might have between 50 and 100 Essence available. A major Foci could have 100 or more Essence in the pool. 500 Essence in such a pool is not unheard of. A Key Foci is one of the essential Chakra points of the world and can hold as many as 1000 Essence in the pool. Wars are often fought over the possession of a Key Foci and damage to such a Foci can have devastating consequences felt across the entire world.

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