Pattern Ghost Posted July 22, 2018 Report Share Posted July 22, 2018 I don't mind the tone at all, or really that they're doing a shtick or two that have been done before. The execution just leaves me cold. It could just be that I was in a bad mood when I watched it, but the humor didn't resonate with me. Then again, an early trailer isn't the final product, and I like Levi, so I'll probably check it out at least on streaming or Red Box. Maybe theater if the reviews are positive. I think the DCAU version of the character got it pretty much spot on. They had a light-hearted approach to the character that contrasted well with the other characters in the setting. I'm thinking of the animated movie with Captain Marvel and Superman. I also liked how he was handled on Young Justice. Both approaches seemed to be pretty good modernizations of the character. As far as the comparisons to Big . . . I think they're inevitable. The first thing my wife said when she saw the trailer was "It's like Big." She's not really familiar with the character at all, and didn't even know about his transformation. So, there's the bulk of the non-comic reading audience's reaction right there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 9 hours ago, RDU Neil said: So, my wife just showed it to me, and was both excited, "I love mermaid stuff! It looks so pretty! Jason Momoa is beautiful!" and disappointed, "Oh my god, the writing and dialogue is terrible!" at the same time. Last night, I noticed Justice League was finally free on HBO, so I watched it... tried to watch it. "Oh my god, the writing and dialogue is terrible!" JL was groan worthy from the very first scene, and never let up. All they do is pose and say stupid, drawn out, one liners that aren't even remotely funny. The direction is so static and fake looking... they sexualize all the Amazons, added in lingering shots of Diana's butt, Flash is annoying and needlessly on the autistic spectrum... like they thought, "We need a Drax like guy for this movie." Steppenwolf is like an action figure stop motion, he looks so fake. Mother Box is evil? What? I kept stopping the movie and smh and doing something else, then coming back and seeing if I could farther... groan, repeat. I got to the part where they have to spend all the setup for a silly moment of the Flash zapping a box to make Superman come out of some soup... I'm really not sure... and then he is standing there, and suddenly all the others are posed in a line behind him (wha?") and they all stand there staring for a while, then Wonder Woman gets to deliver this big dramatic... "He's back." line that is like.... oh god... I turned it off. That was attrocious, and the kind of thing that makes me embarrassed to be a comics geek, since it is all the horrible fan boy tropes and awfulness in one place. The fact that this movie made 800 dollars, let alone 800 million is just more evidence that humanity is a disgrace. I'm not going to try to persuade you that Justice League was a good movie . Indeed, my impression of it as I came out of the theater was, "Wow, that didn't suck nearly as hard as I expected." The only reason I paid to see it was because Wonder Woman was above average and I wanted to see what they could salvage from the reshoots without Snyder(sympathies to the family but the man doesn't grok the genre). Justice League was not a masterpiece by any means. The constant flexing and posing, the annoying Flash and the CGI Villain were all just bad but there was some decent characterization and while the plan to bring back Superman was forced( When are they going to station some security inside that alien spaceship site?), it was decently executed. Batman was redeemed from the murderous lunatic of BvS and the post-credit scene was nice. That's why I said that the new trailers gave me hope. They are different in tone(and color palette) from the previous DCEU , so maybe they are starting to get the hang of it. I'll probably see Aquaman but if it disappoints then Shazam will be a wait for cable movie for me. And any subsequent DECU movie will have to preceded by either fantastic word of mouth or reviews from people I trust before I venture to the theaters(with a possible exception for WW 2). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 Quote Last night, I noticed Justice League was finally free on HBO, so I watched it... tried to watch it. "Oh my god, the writing and dialogue is terrible!" JL was groan worthy from the very first scene, and never let up. All they do is pose and say stupid, drawn out, one liners that aren't even remotely funny. The direction is so static and fake looking... they sexualize all the Amazons, added in lingering shots of Diana's butt, Flash is annoying and needlessly on the autistic spectrum... like they thought, "We need a Drax like guy for this movie." Steppenwolf is like an action figure stop motion, he looks so fake. Mother Box is evil? What? That and a lot of other things are why I didn't care for Justice League, even though it had enough decent parts that I'd watch it again. But as others more talented and perceptive than I have pointed out, DC is terrible at action scenes, they just cannot do them right, and it shows every single time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 To repeat: JL is the DCEU film I have enjoyed most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slikmar Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 Do we even know if they are using the acronym names Shazam stands for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 Nothing I've seen. I'm also wondering if it's actually a two way transformation, or he's just stuck as an adult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ternaugh Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 6 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said: Nothing I've seen. I'm also wondering if it's actually a two way transformation, or he's just stuck as an adult. There's more than one transformation shown in the trailer, so I'm guessing that he can turn back. Of course, he did appear to be at a carnival, so maybe he had to find a Zoltar machine. slikmar, zslane, RDU Neil and 2 others 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDU Neil Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 17 hours ago, zslane said: I can't help but think that this Shazam movie is taking a huge step back in that department, reintroducing the idea that superheroes are "just for kids" back into the pop culture consciousness. I do believe their heart is in the right place, but I also think the direction they're going in with the character is a dubious one. It certainly isn't something I'm particularly drawn to, either. But I'll take a relatively wholesome "kids love of superheroes" and the "what kind of superpower would you want?" conversations, over the brainless, "Yeah! Booyah!" male-gaze flexing idiocy and horrible, boring "action" of bright colors and lingering, intense stares that was Justice League. (I haven't seen BvS, as I couldn't stomach Man of Steel, and only made it five minutes into Suicide Squad before the abject objectification of Harley Quinn made me turn it off). Ant-Man (first and second) were very much kids movies as well as being heist/caper films, and that is part of what really worked for me in those movies, because it owns the aspect of Scott Lang as a father, first and foremost, not just in his interactions with Cassie, but in the tone of the movie. Once the movie becomes "from the POV of the adolescent male" well... likely it will go downhill from there, but then, I never really cared for Captain Marvel much, except for the Ordway "Power of Shazam!" run. drunkonduty 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDU Neil Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 15 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said: As far as the comparisons to Big . . . I think they're inevitable. The first thing my wife said when she saw the trailer was "It's like Big." She's not really familiar with the character at all, and didn't even know about his transformation. So, there's the bulk of the non-comic reading audience's reaction right there. Nearly the exact reaction my wife had. "Oh... he can change back and forth?" after watching it. She laughed at all the jokes and said, "It looks cute!" enthusiastically. Again, if and when there are reviews that make it sound as good as Wonder Woman, we'll go see it. Otherwise, eh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 Quote Do we even know if they are using the acronym names Shazam stands for? Doesn't appear that Shazam explained anything to Billy at all, just gave him the power and left for a hammock in the Caribbean or something. Quote only made it five minutes into Suicide Squad before the abject objectification of Harley Quinn made me turn it off The objectification of Aquaman didn't bother you any, apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 13 hours ago, Grailknight said: They are different in tone(and color palette) from the previous DCEU , so maybe they are starting to get the hang of it. You mean, getting the hang of copying the MCU. Only time will tell... (If there's been a better example of surrendering to "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em," in recent cinematic memory, I can't think of it.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 I don't perceive the tone of MCU movies as being monolithic. Sure, there's always a measure of humor in their films, more than in the generally bleak pre-WW DC films. But the predominant tone of Winter Soldier is very different from Ant-Man, and both are very different from Thor Ragnarok. I'm satisfied with the spectrum they present us with. Joe Walsh, slikmar and RDU Neil 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 When comparing shared universes, there is a very notable difference acknowledged by virtually everyone who has experienced both the MCU and the DCEU. There's a general tone and visual aesthetic identifiable with each, even if there are more specific variations to be found within them. The brighter, more colorful, more optimistic tone and palette that began with Wonder Woman, and which is being carried forth in the upcoming DCEU films, share more in common with the MCU than with the Snyder-verse. I believe this reflects a very calculated strategic course correction promulgated by Hamada's regime, and to my eyes it is very clear where they cribbed this tone and aesthetic from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FenrisUlf Posted July 23, 2018 Report Share Posted July 23, 2018 I suppose this will work here -- can anyone tell me if the horrid stories I've heard about the new 'Titans' trailer are accurate? I mean, Starfire kills people like she was the Punisher and Dove yanks a guy's limbs off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 Trailer I saw, Starfire looks awful and has fire for a blast, Dove is beating on people and hacking them with (her) wings, Robin shoots four people and uses profanity, etc. It looks terrible to me, but maybe people will like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Neilson Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 3 hours ago, zslane said: When comparing shared universes, there is a very notable difference acknowledged by virtually everyone who has experienced both the MCU and the DCEU. There's a general tone and visual aesthetic identifiable with each, even if there are more specific variations to be found within them. The brighter, more colorful, more optimistic tone and palette that began with Wonder Woman, and which is being carried forth in the upcoming DCEU films, share more in common with the MCU than with the Snyder-verse. I believe this reflects a very calculated strategic course correction promulgated by Hamada's regime, and to my eyes it is very clear where they cribbed this tone and aesthetic from. So, basically, we don't like the DCEU because it's too dark. We like the MCU better for its more optimistic tone. But if DCEU changes their approach to become less ark and more optimistic, we will criticize them for cribbing from MCU. Basically, your movies are terrible, but keep making terrible movies - don't accept any of the feedback and try to improve, or anything like that. Christopher R Taylor, Matt the Bruins, Armory and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 8 minutes ago, Hugh Neilson said: So, basically, we don't like the DCEU because it's too dark. We like the MCU better for its more optimistic tone. But if DCEU changes their approach to become less ark and more optimistic, we will criticize them for cribbing from MCU. And gods forbid they make something actually lighthearted like Big with superheroes. Then it's pitchforks and torches! Twilight, Ternaugh, Christopher R Taylor and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkonduty Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 Don't forget the tar. Gotta have some tar. Maybe feathers too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zslane Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 WB tried to forge a creative and aesthetic identity that was distinct from the MCU and it didn't work. It didn't work because of a failure to understand the core of the characters and the essence of the source material. That's not a condemnation of the goal, but rather a condemnation of the execution. It should be possible to make successful superhero movies without copying the rather generic action movie tone of the MCU. Grimdark didn't work, but there's more out there than just two options, and any movie producer or director who doesn't realize this shouldn't be wasting precious frames of film (and our time in theaters). Now, WB understands that the quickest road to financial and critical recovery is to simply copy someone else's successful formula, rather than take the time to carefully craft another unique recipe. I mean, I can understand why they might be gun-shy about that. The last time they tried they failed miserably, and so I'm sure every instinct is telling them not to take any more risks and just go with the path of least resistance and "do what Marvel does." While I understand this instinct, I nevertheless have little respect for it, especially since I'm not a WB shareholder and can place artistic concerns above financial ones without worrying about my portfolio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkonduty Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 As to why it's okay to have a shirtless Jason Momoa being King of the Ocean yet kinda gross to present Margot Robbie as mentally ill rape bait: https://nationalpost.com/entertainment/movies/bring-on-the-shirtless-men-why-its-acceptable-to-objectify-the-male-body-but-not-the-females Don't worry, the article is much less confrontational than my opening sentence. RDU Neil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slikmar Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 2 hours ago, drunkonduty said: As to why it's okay to have a shirtless Jason Momoa being King of the Ocean yet kinda gross to present Margot Robbie as mentally ill rape bait: https://nationalpost.com/entertainment/movies/bring-on-the-shirtless-men-why-its-acceptable-to-objectify-the-male-body-but-not-the-females Don't worry, the article is much less confrontational than my opening sentence. Side annoyance - clicking a link to a site that won't let me read article without disabling my adblocker. The above site did so. I realize, they need to pay bills, but I have enough computer problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 Sometimes you can evade the adblocker notice by clicking the "reader view" icon in the browser bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern Ghost Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 Or use a different ad blocker. I didn't get the ad blocker blocker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 I think its a mistake to consider it a binary choice: Grimdark or Marvel. Marvel movies are basically action movies with super powers, they didn't invent anything new in terms of tone and content. Its Die Hard or Transformers, just with Thor instead of giant robots or John McLane. So using that kind of tone doesn't make it a "Marvel movie" it just makes it more of a standard action movie which isn't that great a leap but is better than grinding, perpetual misery. I think DC hits the tone just right in their older animated stuff, but I'm a comic book fan, so I accept certain tropes and assumptions that the regular moviegoer might find silly or unacceptable. I doubt it, not just because of my personal preference, but because its been demonstrated over and over that if you deliver a concept entertainingly and professionally it doesn't even matter how weird or illogical it is. People will accept a movie about an animate tree and a talking raccoon, or a wizard and a couple little people with a ring of doom, or space wizards with light swords. If you do it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkonduty Posted July 24, 2018 Report Share Posted July 24, 2018 @slikmar. Sorry mate. It is an ad heavy site. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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