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Political Discussion Thread (With Rules)

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The problem is, I don't even know what honor would look like.

What courage would look like.

What virtue would look like.

What wisdom would look like.

 

If we replaced all the politicians?

 

Then what?

 

If we don't investigate, we don't learn from our mistakes. We don't have a public discussion about why the US is meddling in Nigeria and what our interests are.

 

If we do, I can see no other outcome but blame and recrimination.

 

Do you know a third path,?

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And as a followup to that inspirational moment, here's Cap's speech to Spider-Man from Amazing Spider-Man #537:

 

"Doesn't matter what the press says. Doesn't matter what the politicians or the mobs say. Doesn't matter if the whole country decides that something wrong is something right. This nation was founded on one principle above all else: the requirement that we stand up for what we believe, no matter the odds or the consequences. When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world — No, you move."

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I swear it's getting to where satire cannot outdo reality in America.

 

Months ago this was satire: http://www.clickhole.com/article/beautiful-when-7-year-old-boy-could-no-longer-affo-6296

 

Today this is reality: https://www.thedailybeast.com/dear-baby-connor-your-coverage-is-denied

 

No matter how horrible satire is today in america, reality quickly surpasses it.

I wonder if the insurance companies have any idea how many people have come to truly hate them? I'm almost surprised that mobs have not yet started burning headquarters buildings. I'm there are a lot of people out there who aren't real stable

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Yes. Although that someone might be a glowing radioactive cockroach.

 

 

It shouldn't be that hard. How are they going to adjust the platform? Will they counter voter suppression in Wisconsin? What are they going to do about foreign social media operations? How are they going to convince disaffected GOP voters to vote for them?

 

I really feel like the currently strategy is to sit back and hope for an impeachment, and hope is not a strategy.

I suspect that the Republicans are going to face a bloodbath at the midterm elections. However the Republicans have been pulling things off partially because the Democrats seem to have lost something. Contact with the people maybe? Their leadership seems to be just as much Millionaires and up as the Republicans from outside glances, so maybe that's part of it... I don't know, but their assumption that they're going to win and saying "how could you even think of voting for him instead of me? Has not been working."

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Okay if that's how the folks of the country prefer it called, then that's how I'll call it.

Just like I prefer America to "Murica" or "Bloody Yanks"

 

 

 

Thanks.

Perhaps it's funny perhaps it's not but I think the only place I've ever seen or heard the "'Murica" is in mocking internet memes and commentary. I live in an area that mostly supported Trump and I don't think I've ever heard that

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Except for Trump, who started his reelection campaign the day after the Inauguration. He loves campaigning and basking in the adulation of crowds at rallies, but doesn't want to do the actual job.

I was thinking basically the same thing

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I suspect that the Republicans are going to face a bloodbath at the midterm elections. However the Republicans have been pulling things off partially because the Democrats seem to have lost something. Contact with the people maybe? Their leadership seems to be just as much Millionaires and up as the Republicans from outside glances, so maybe that's part of it... I don't know, but their assumption that they're going to win and saying "how could you even think of voting for him instead of me? Has not been working."

Now i'm not an American but I think that you may be being optimistic suggesting a Republican bloodbath.  With so many states having Republican governors i'm sure they will find a way to ensure that many Democrat supporters don't get to vote or don't have their vote counted or something. Then there is the question of what effect Steve Bannon will have on things,could the U S congress become MORE right wing because of his efforts ?  Then you have Fox media; is it still as pro Republican as it was ? If so, what chance have the Democrats got ?

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Now i'm not an American but I think that you may be being optimistic suggesting a Republican bloodbath. With so many states having Republican governors i'm sure they will find a way to ensure that many Democrat supporters don't get to vote or don't have their vote counted or something. Then there is the question of what effect Steve Bannon will have on things,could the U S congress become MORE right wing because of his efforts ? Then you have Fox media; is it still as pro Republican as it was ? If so, what chance have the Democrats got ?

I foresee some serious rage out there when people start getting kicked off their insurance or forced into insurance that doesn't actually cover anything because that's all they can afford.

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I believe the excuse, although Trump would never admit it, is self-interest. His past actions show a pattern of decision making based on whatever would be best for him, personally, whoever else was involved.

I was talking about other presidents and politicians. Trump, as Nolgroth says, is in a pathological class of his own. He doesn't even seem to know what truth *is.*

 

Everything he says, he sounds like a guy leaning out of an alley trying to hustle you into buying a hot wristwatch.

 

Dean Shomshak

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I was talking about other presidents and politicians. Trump, as Nolgroth says, is in a pathological class of his own. He doesn't even seem to know what truth *is.*

 

Everything he says, he sounds like a guy leaning out of an alley trying to hustle you into buying a hot wristwatch.

 

Dean Shomshak

And then have his buddies mug you for your wallet

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I would give some respect to Ford. He was not, of course, elected, and I don't know that he had a chance in 1976. The preemptive pardon to Nixon was, I think, an attempt to get past that episode with a minimum of recrimination.

 

I feel that nowadays those in power look to maximize recrimination, drag out sordid spectacles, and play spectacle for their bases, to obscure just how little they actually do.

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According to the trump regime's spokeszombie, if you say something completely and provably false it's not a lie if you sincerely believe it. https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/10/24/1709365/-Sarah-Sanders-Kelly-s-lies-about-Frederica-Wilson-were-heartfelt-so-he-wasn-t-wrong

 

Oh well, is this a surprise? After all when a republican congressman accused planned parenthood of using most ofmitcs resources to provide abortions, and was proven wrong, he simply said his lie wasn't a lie because it was not intended to be a factual statement.

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I would give some respect to Ford. He was not, of course, elected, and I don't know that he had a chance in 1976. The preemptive pardon to Nixon was, I think, an attempt to get past that episode with a minimum of recrimination.

 

I feel that nowadays those in power look to maximize recrimination, drag out sordid spectacles, and play spectacle for their bases, to obscure just how little they actually do.

In retrospect I think our politics would have been better had Nixon gone to prison and all of his misdeeds fully exposed to public scrutiny. It might have had a stronger deterrent effect upon subsequent administrations(including this one).  It annoys me to no end that the media treats impeachment as the end of the disciplinary process for presidents.  News flash: if a president commits "high crimes and misdemeanors", there's a very strong chance that some of those high crimes are also serious felonies.  It's not only "okay" for presidents, once removed or out of office, to be prosecuted, it's okay for them to be incarcerated too.  It sends the message that no one is above the law in our country.  

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So Jeff Flake just announced he'd retire rather than embrace Trump. Sad thing is this probably actually works in Trump's favor, as he replaces a political foe in the GOP ranks with an ally.

 

Props to him for standing on principle. He didn't go quietly.

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I'm not sure the GOP will let itself be voted out of power. I think there is a good chance they will stage an open coup and essentially seize power as a one party "democracy" to "save 'murca!"

 

The GOP looks like it wants to be the only party that gets to weild power. Obama getsnin and they seek to cripple the presidency, obstruct everything, essentially block every single thing the democrats tried to do. Now, they think trump should have unquestionable powers, that the filibuster they used constantly under Obama should be eliminated, that any avenue democrats would have to obstruct trump's insane extremist agenda which they used in incessantly against Obama should be ended

and nothing should block the GOP agenda.

 

In one state when a democrat unseated a long time republican governor the GOP senate voted to drastically curtail governor powers before the democrat took office. In michigan the GOP state government passed a very unpopular emergency overseer act that eliminated democracy at the city level. The public overwhelmingly voted to repeal it. A month later the state government put in back in place with an amendment that meant the public could not votenit down again. (Where were the guns tat are supposed to protect us from dictatorship when this happened?)

 

I honestly think the GOP is pulling off a slow motion coup d'etat to essentially make America a one party government.

 

Ironically democrats might be the ones to finally resort to the second amendment to stop tyranny in america.

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Speaking of the second amendment, the latest issue of "America's First Freedom", one of the NRA's publications, has a cover that depicts Antifa as the bad guys and calls them "violent radicals". I assume that if the NRA is against anti-fascism, then they must be pro-fascism. Looks like it's finally time to figure out how to resign the life membership I got way back when things are different.

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NRA rhetoric has been dialed in at "Absurd" for a while now. There are more respectable organizations to contribute to, IMO.

 

As far as Antifa goes, they do have a subset of idiots who seem set on provoking violence, so that's not helping the more reasonable side of their cause. I get the impression that they're kind of decentralized and not really an organized thing, similar to the Black Lives Matter movement. This has a big drawback in that any idiot can claim to be one of you, and hurt the cause more than help.

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According to the trump regime's spokeszombie, if you say something completely and provably false it's not a lie if you sincerely believe it. https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/10/24/1709365/-Sarah-Sanders-Kelly-s-lies-about-Frederica-Wilson-were-heartfelt-so-he-wasn-t-wrong

 

Oh well, is this a surprise? After all when a republican congressman accused planned parenthood of using most ofmitcs resources to provide abortions, and was proven wrong, he simply said his lie wasn't a lie because it was not intended to be a factual statement.

 

There is a word for telling lies that you honestly believe.

 

Mistake.

 

It's any reaction when presented with the truth besides 'I didn't know that. I am sorry.' that makes these people delusional jerks.

 

"Ok, so maybe that wasn't true... but the fact remains, it could have been true. It was plausible." BZZZZT! WRONG!

 

It's hands down my single greatest source of frustration with the state of modern media - social or otherwise:  By the time the retraction is printed (if it ever is) the damage is done.

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I have to admit, I'm impressed with the Judo-style reversal Trumps team is doing vis-a-vis the Trump-Russia dossier.  I still don't get why it was wrong for the DNC/Clinton Campaign to pay for dirt. Isn't that what all politicians do?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/10/25/fusion-gps-fallout-dnc-clinton-fbi-take-heat-after-bombshell-that-dems-funded-trump-dossier.html

 

That and the increased attention to the Unmasking scandal. I will admit, that one looks bad.

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I remember reading hysterical predictions that GW Bush was going to stage a  terrorist attack and declare martial law to prevent either the election, or the transition to Obama Administration.  

 

I seem to recall mocking them profusely. 

 

With Trump,  I am not sure I dare mock any apparently hysterical prognostication...    :weep:

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