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On 6/21/2018 at 7:54 PM, Lord Liaden said:

Not to speak for Dean, but I suspect the Oxford English Dictionary top definition for "nation" sounds most like what he means: "NOUN:  A large body of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular state or territory."

 

Well,  the Canadian nation certainly has its own scandals to live down.  ?

 

 

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A lot of white people in the US have been angry for a long time, not wholly without reason. They just feel more empowered to speak up now, taking their cue from their President. Unfortunately the most ignorant and spiteful thoughts and impulses are also being expressed, when previously the people having them felt constrained to keep them to themselves.

 

It's an ongoing debate as to whether allowing such poison into the open helps drain it, or spread it.

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I have my theory on this... (and I'm of the mind that letting it into the open only spreads it, not drains it. The internet has done nothing if not allow the isolated and hateful to become the organized and hateful.)

 

On "white anger"... well, generally...

1) Humans have a psychological need to position themselves and their self-worth in social hierarchies. It is part of our social evolution.

2) No matter how enlightened we try to become, when pushed, stressed, devalued, etc., the human condition is to instinctively take out our frustrations on someone perceived as lower on the social ladder. We look for someone worse off than ourselves to make ourselves feel better.

3) In America, traditionally, even the poorest, most beaten down white man could still look around and find any non-cis gendered white male to put their boot on, to reassure them of their preferred place... and that preferred place was just assumed... what is called "privilege" these days.

4) In the past, when a NCGWM advanced, gained influence, social standing, power, etc., it could all be viewed through the lens of largesse on behalf of the white male. Psychologically, white males "let" the NCGWMs have their little slice of the pie.

5) But "these days" that privilege is not only being called into question, but the NCGWMs are taking power for themselves. Obama was the big change. This was a black man with real power. No one "let him" be president... he had actual, social changing authority... not a token nod from the white man. That was too much to take, because now all the other NCGWMs were "gettin' all uppity" and expecting... gasp... actual change!

 

So all that anger that simmered in the bellies of the white males (and those co-opted by their patriarchy... I'm looking at you, Ann Coulter, etc.) no longer has its traditional 'release'... psychologically, those white males and traditionalists can't vent their frustration and anger on the traditional "lower down the rung" targets. They have to face the truth... they are just as f***ed as everyone else that isn't the 1%... and they can't handle it. Their anger is being used, inflamed and manipulated by those in true power to keep that power, and keep it directed at the traditional targets, rather than at who deserves it.

 

That is "what is wrong with Kansas."  That is why so many people act/vote against their own interests. Pure, Machiavellian social manipulation... creating the packs of hunger dogs to be used by the Koch brothers and such to undermine social change and operational government that would threaten their oligarchy. It isn't a conspiracy... it is right out in the open... because they've learned that most people can't be sophisticated enough to really analyze and understand their predicament. They can provoked and nudged and do all the work for those in real power.


The internet, like all technology over the past century, is just accelerating this exponentially. Remove the buffers of distance and time, pour on the gasoline... hell, the bastards will light the match themselves.

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3 minutes ago, Old Man said:

The history books will show that our democracy ended when Mitch McConnell refused to seat Merrick Garland. 

 

I hope you're wrong, but I ain't putting money down against the possibility. 

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Guys, I agree what's happening is wrong and bad, but it isn't a sea change in the nature of American politics or the American people. Watergate. Vietnam War protests. Segregation. McCarthyism. Japanese internment. Dust Bowl migrants. The pendulum swings. Nothing is broken yet. It does more harm to give in to cynicism and despair, and stop trying to be better.

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26 minutes ago, Lord Liaden said:

Guys, I agree what's happening is wrong and bad, but it isn't a sea change in the nature of American politics or the American people. Watergate. Vietnam War protests. Segregation. McCarthyism. Japanese internment. Dust Bowl migrants. The pendulum swings. Nothing is broken yet. It does more harm to give in to cynicism and despair, and stop trying to be better.

 

'Effing Canadian optimism!

 

 

 

 

?

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RDU Neil: Your theory is pretty much what a sociologist found and described in his book called, IIRC, Caste and Class in a Southern Town.. This was in, like, the 1920s? (Super-slow internet connection makes it hard to look things up and check the details, sorry. I expect Wikipedia could give you the summary.)

 

Dean Shomshak

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8 minutes ago, DShomshak said:

RDU Neil: Your theory is pretty much what a sociologist found and described in his book called, IIRC, Caste and Class in a Southern Town.. This was in, like, the 1920s? (Super-slow internet connection makes it hard to look things up and check the details, sorry. I expect Wikipedia could give you the summary.)

 

Dean Shomshak

 

I will go try to find that book... thanks!  (I'm old, but not 1920's old.)

 

 

Edit... ok I think I found it. Both 1957 and 1989 editions available

 

511aiDPi41L._SX338_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

 

From the 1930's I guess.

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1 hour ago, Lord Liaden said:

Guys, I agree what's happening is wrong and bad, but it isn't a sea change in the nature of American politics or the American people. Watergate. Vietnam War protests. Segregation. McCarthyism. Japanese internment. Dust Bowl migrants. The pendulum swings. Nothing is broken yet. It does more harm to give in to cynicism and despair, and stop trying to be better.

 

You're a Good Man, North Knight!

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