Advantages on CHAs

[Rebar]

I want to give my 'Whirling Dervish' some tricks.

 

1. 2X Knockback to STR (when running).
2. Autofire on STR (when not running)
3. 2x Knockback, applied running (damage from movement)

 

Max 40AP. So, with advantages,

• running can only come to 40AP.
• STR can only come to 40AP.

 

 

I think I've got it .. writ smaller.

 

26 STR (26AP)

11" Running (22AP)

 

16 Running does KnB, 1 1/2X KnB (16AP)

 

13 Multipower 13pts

1u STR does 1 1/2X KnB (13AP)

1u Autofire on STR (13AP)

 

OK, so Running tops out at 22+16= 38

And STR tops out at 26+13 = 39

 

Hmph. A running character that as only 11" of running?

Argh. He can do a 7 1/2 DC move-through... with approx 10" of KnB.

As long as he can get those pesky Viper agents to all stand within 11" of him, he could knock them all about ... 3".

 

Maybe I should drop the KnB on the running. Ends up being the same amount of KnB anyway.

 

 

[Greywind]

Running doesn't do damage. Ever. So, hard to justify it doing knockback.

[Amorkca]

You might want to do extra velocity damage on maneuvers; Move by & Move through.  With the extra Knockback on your STR that would transfer to the maneuvers.

[Pattern Ghost]

On 7/16/2018 at 9:35 PM, Greywind said:

Running doesn't do damage. Ever. So, hard to justify it doing knockback.

 

But you could name the power "two steps forward, three steps back."

[Rebar]

On 7/17/2018 at 12:35 AM, Greywind said:

Running doesn't do damage. Ever. So, hard to justify it doing knockback.

It does if you buy it with the 'does knockback' advantage.

[Rebar]

On 7/17/2018 at 8:06 PM, Amorkca said:

You might want to do extra velocity damage on maneuvers; Move by & Move through.  With the extra Knockback on your STR that would transfer to the maneuvers.

Right, but with an AP cap, I can't have the actual power exceed the cap. So, the attack itself can't exceed 40AP. How would I buy the extra damage? HA? EB?

 

I doubt the GM would allow me to apply my STR, - and on top of that - apply extra damage to the same attack.

 

But running is a separate power that I can use simultaneously, and I can put 'does knockback' on it. Using a combat maneuver allows me to apply two completely separate forms of damage: an attack, plus velocity damage.

[Simon]

59 minutes ago, Rebar said:

It does if you buy it with the 'does knockback' advantage.

No, it doesn’t.

[Greywind]

7 hours ago, Rebar said:

It does if you buy it with the 'does knockback' advantage.

 

Knockback is based on damage.

 

Damage is not based on knockback.

[Rebar]

OK, I guess I see your point. Running does not, in-and-of-itself, do damage, therefore - even if I applied 2x Knockback to it, it would  do 2x0 Knockback.

 

So is there no way of applying a knockback modifier to the velocity damage?

 

I have to buy a power to simulate extra damage from velocity?

[Greywind]

Add it to the STR that affects the damage.

[Simon]

1 hour ago, Rebar said:

OK, I guess I see your point. Running does not, in-and-of-itself, do damage, therefore - even if I applied 2x Knockback to it, it would  do 2x0 Knockback.

 

So is there no way of applying a knockback modifier to the velocity damage?

 

I have to buy a power to simulate extra damage from velocity?

Again, I would suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the rules of the system.

 

Start with the basics: reasoning from effect.

 

"I want the character to knock people back really far when he's running."

"You mean anytime he runs, people around him go flying?"

"No, only when he runs into them."

"Ok...so when he does a Move Through, they get sent flying.  Is that a facet of his STR?"

"No, it's from his running."

"Running doesn't do damage.  Velocity-based damage is part of the Move Through Maneuver, however -- do you want the increased knock back to apply to all damage done from the Move Through Maneuver?"

"Yes."

"OK, you'll need to familiarize yourself with the rules regarding placing Advantages on Maneuvers.  In particular, you're going to need to calculate the effective Active Cost of the Move Through Maneuver in order to determine the cost of the Double Knockback Advantage on it...and then pay for that cost.  It won't be particularly cheap."

[Rebar]

5 hours ago, Simon said:

Again, I would suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the rules of the system.

 

Sorry, I seem to be making the wrong impression. ? I'm not new.

 

I've been into Hero Games since 1985 - when it was merely Champions! The SUPER Role-playing Game! (I may still have my v1 rulebook in and old box). I've built several hundred characters, including those of my teammates. They come up with the ideas - I'm the guy that writes up the character sheets and crunches the numbers.

 

I'm not pushing the margins of the creation mechanics because I don't understand them, I'm pushing the margins because I'm Looking for new, interesting character ideas. If I'm not exploring odd power combinations and new SFX then I'm yawning.

 

Now, granted, it has been about 5-10 years since I could cobble together my team for a game, so I'm a little rusty.

 

And some of the trouble I'm encountering here is crossover with trying to convince Hero Designer to build things the way I want. When I'm creating characters on paper, the paper never tells me I'm not allowed to do something that I know I can do. So, I end up trying to build them in ways that HD will allow.

 

 

 

[Rebar]

6 hours ago, Greywind said:

Add it to the STR that affects the damage.

I would. The problem is the AP cap.

 

If it is related to STR, then - no matter how I try to construct it, the total of the STR damage cannot be more than 40AP.

 

That's why I thought of applying it to the other side of the damage - from velocity. With as much as 20" of running in a move-through, that's an additional 6 1/2 dice I could be leveraging.

[Simon]

Yeah...HD is following the rules of the system.  Know the rules and building something in HD is as easy as the particular construct allows.

 

I would again suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the rules.  Remember: you posted another thread wondering why “Instant Change” wasn’t available.

[Rebar]

To this example:

 

Quote

 

"You mean anytime he runs, people around him go flying?"
...
"Running doesn't do damage."

 

 

STR doesn't do damage all the time either. It does damage when you apply it as an attack.

 

Not that I'm still defending the construct, just pointing out that a Tasmanian Devil-like character can conceivably be considered doing extra knockback from velocity alone. It's not an outrageous construct.

Simply applying "does knockback" would mean that, when damage is applied through velocity from running, the advantage on running can conceivably apply.

 

[Simon]

No, it wouldn’t.

 

please do yourself a favor and read the rules.

[Rebar]

7 minutes ago, Simon said:

Yeah...HD is following the rules of the system.  Know the rules and building something in HD is as easy as the particular construct allows.

 

I would again suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the rules.  Remember: you posted another thread wondering why “Instant Change” wasn’t available.

It's still just software, It can't account for every construct.

 

I am quite familiar with the rules. When last I checked (though granted, it's been a while), Instant change was a 5/10 point power. I know there was a construct using Shapeshift somewhere. Maybe it was in the rulebook where I saw it.

[Simon]

Read. The. Rules.