Godzilla, King of the Monsters

[Michael Hopcroft]

To get into the territory of a campaign where Gojira exists, along with several of the other kaiju -- how doe sit change things for everyone else?

 

At any time, without warning, some whopping great beast can wade into town, level everything, and kill thousands or hundreds of thousands of people without the slightest trace of malice. They do not need to plan attacks; it's as close to random as you can get Some cities will be left alone for decades, but some will be hit so often that they don't have time to build anything back up, or even to dispose of the dead and keep alive as many of the survivors as they can save. If there is nothing the humans can do to the kaiju, and they can only hope kaiju start taking each other down, a new reality has set in and humanity will become extinct if it doesn't adjust.

 

How do you relocate civilization to somewhere the kaiju can;t reach them and still provide enough food for all the survivors into the next century? Are there some who will take it as a judgment on Mankind and respond accordingly by attempting to annihilate those humans they see as to blame? How do the survivors cope with the PTSD that must be nearly universal by then? Would there be a wave of suicides?

[Grailknight]

Move out of the cities and areas the kaiju frequent. Track their movements for patterns and move the population to where they don't frequent. There would be no progress for a century or so and we'd lose 30% or more of the population(which may be a net good thing) but extinction is never on the table unless the kaiju are deliberate in their hostility.

[Lord Liaden]

I just got back from watching this movie. NO SPOILERS to follow.

 

If the recent Avengers: Endgame was "fan service," catering to those who had been following the evolution of the MCU, and the comics it's based on; then much the same could be said of G:KOTM. If you're already a fan of Toho's giant monster movies, you'll probably love this movie. (I am, and I do.) The film is replete with references to and riffs on its source material, from concepts to imagery to music. But the movie also builds on precedents established in 2014's Godzilla and 2017's Kong: Skull Island, and advances them into a more fully developed "monsterverse."

 

The kaiju/Titans are gloriously rendered here, with wonder, majesty, and terror. The four "name" kaiju from the Toho stable are all given scenes to shine in. The monster action is spectacular, and you get a lot of it, although there's more use of quick cuts and shaky-cam than I would have liked. Sometimes that made it more difficult to follow the action.

 

The plot of the movie is nothing ground-breaking, and fairly predictable, particularly if you're familiar with the conventions of the genre. OTOH if you like those conventions you may find it comforting. I consider the criticisms of the characters I've heard from some reviewers to be too harsh. Certainly there's no Hamlet or Lear among them, but several have decent story arcs and a few strong scenes. But other characters are there just to advance the story, or add some color or humor; and a few are seriously underutilized. Again, if you're familiar with the earlier kaiju movies you'll recognize some of the common character types. The cast are generally solid and make the most of opportunities given to them. I thought the screen time for the monsters and humans was actually pretty balanced, more so than in the 2014 movie.

 

As a piece of spectacle, this film deserves high marks. By some of the standards of movie-making -- plot, characterization, dialogue -- it's serviceable but nothing to write home about. But as a giant-monster movie it's a love letter to the genre.  If you approach it from that perspective you should get a lot of enjoyment out of it.

[Lord Liaden]

This will probably sound familiar. As I write this the critic score for G:KOTM stands at 41%, audience score at 90%.

 

Although in defense of the critics (can't believe I wrote that), I suspect the majority of the audience for this movie would be fans with a good idea of what to expect from it. I doubt that includes many professional critics.

[Pattern Ghost]

9 minutes ago, Lord Liaden said:

I doubt that includes many professional critics. 

 

Not many critics listed on RT as professional actually are. And most of those who are legitimate professionals are also poor critics.

[Bazza]

1 minute ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

Not many critics listed on RT as professional actually are. And most of those who are legitimate professionals are also poor critics.

 

Being a critic does pay much, which is why they are poor. 

[Starlord]

Critics favored the first movie.  Also, in several of the reviews I read the critics state that the movie isn't great, but if you love this genre you will love this movie.  Sounds fair to me.

 

As has been mentioned, this is somewhat of a unique/niche genre.  In most Godzilla movies, the plot and dialogue are merely a contrivance that pushes the movie toward the next big fight/destruction scene.

[Michael Hopcroft]

6 hours ago, Grailknight said:

Move out of the cities and areas the kaiju frequent. Track their movements for patterns and move the population to where they don't frequent. There would be no progress for a century or so and we'd lose 30% or more of the population(which may be a net good thing) but extinction is never on the table unless the kaiju are deliberate in their hostility.

One of the Toho conventions from the older movies is that sometimes hostile aliens (usually very Japanese-looking because the budget had gone into the kaiju) manipulate or mind-control the kaiju to use as a weapon against Mankind. Whether it is out of a demand for power (one possible subplot is for the aliens causing the rampage to show up and say "Serve our Great Empire and we will get rid of the kaiju for you!", although I don't recall them ever using it). Thus the rampages become much more directed until the control is broken and the aliens are driven away, at which time the kaiju cease to be weaponized and become significantly less hostile.

 

The Toho films eventually came up with the concept of Monster Island -- a place where the various kaiju can be relocated and live in peace away from mankind bothering them in hopes it will be vice versa. it actually works for the most part unless the system is interfered with.

 

The JSDF in those films, once they got the message that they can't really hurt Godzilla, are actually able to adapt pretty well. Their weapons (tanks, aircraft, that sort of laser thing), while they won't kill a kaiju, will slow it down when used with sound tactics. That gives time for the bulk of the population of an approaching city to evacuate into shelters or the countryside  - which means that while buildings and infrastructure are destroyed people are significantly safer than they would be otherwise.

 

I'll have to wait to see if the kaiju in this movie are animalistic or malicious. And a lot of the released clips are about the survivors of Godzilla's first attacks dealing with the fact that there are a lot more monsters out there...

[Michael Hopcroft]

2 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

I doubt that includes many professional critics.

 

2 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

Not many critics listed on RT as professional actually are. And most of those who are legitimate professionals are also poor critics.

 

2 hours ago, Bazza said:

 

Being a critic does pay much, which is why they are poor. 

A very large portion of the RT critic pool are film bloggers. Which may explain why Marvel and Disney films get such high marks (or at least higher marks than they would otherwise get, such as in the case of the Aladdin remake). hat said, I'd say about 50% of the pool are actual, paid-for-their work and published-in-a-somewhat-respectable-forum critics. And of those, about 10% are "top critics" from major newspapers and magazines.

 

That 10% is less than warm towards a lot of genre films. Particularly superhero films, which they tend to regard as a little ridiculous. Their jobs, as they see them, are to advise discerning, educated adult audiences on what works of cinema are worth their time. They view monsters, superheros, dragons, wizards, etc. as something you outgrow as you gain more real life experience. Obviously this is a theorem most of us and a lot of people in general disagree with. Once you understand that bias, though, the Top Critics are a lot more helpful. They are certainly more helpful than the bloggers writing in some sense to be sure they get invited to future screenings and relying on their Patreon payments to support their work.

[Pattern Ghost]

Here's how I generally read RT scores:

 

Low Critics rating / High Audience score: Probably a fun popcorn flick.

High Critics rating / Low Audience score: Probably artsy or pretentious, might watch if the trailers grab me

Scores are about Even: Probably the fairest assessment. Anything that gets at least 70% on both might be worth watching if I liked the trailer.

 

 

[zslane]

Humans would probably deal with recurring kaiju attacks the same way they deal with recurring natural disasters. Most folks would just rebuild and pray they survive the next one, just like people who live in Tornado Alley do. I mean, kaiju can easily be viewed as metaphors for natural disasters, which we live through on an annual basis (tornados, hurricanes, wild fires, tsunamis, earthquakes, mudslides, etc.).

[Starlord]

We've already seen how humanity responds to repeated Kaiju attacks...we build giant Mecha to fight them. 

[Lord Liaden]

41 minutes ago, Starlord said:

We've already seen how humanity responds to repeated Kaiju attacks...we build giant Mecha to fight them. 

 

To me that remark actually underscores the fundamental difference between the Pacific Rim franchise and these last two Godzilla movies. In the latter the kaiju operate on a grander scale than we humans do. We're just ants to these creatures -- the most our weapons can do is irritate them. Only a kaiju can kill another kaiju. The films' intent is to make us feel small and helpless, as in the face of a natural disaster. But Pacific Rim is about empowerment. In our jaegers we scale ourselves up to match the kaiju, so we can confront them on their level. As Rally Becket stated at the start of the first PR, "In a jaeger you can fight the hurricane. You can win."

[megaplayboy]

Saw it, enjoyed it.   I know that the Godzilla/Kong movie is next, but wonder where to go from here.  

I could see a Mechagodzilla showing up in a 3rd film, as one or more major countries decide to develop an "insurance policy" against the titans.  Or a Destroy All Monsters redo, complete with a Monster Island. 

[Greywind]

Kong climbs buildings. Godzilla knocks them down. No contest there.

 

Maybe they'll go Godzookey.

[Cassandra]

I liked his earlier, funnier ones.

[Dr. MID-Nite]

I just finished seeing it. It was a generally good and entertaining film. I thought they did a bit too much "name dropping" for the sake of nostalgia and Rodan and Mothra both get screwed in the screen time department...which is really a shame as the new Rodan design looks terrific. This won't displace any of my top five Godzilla films, but it is definitely in the top half of the series. I'll probably need to see it again to process it a bit more.

[Lord Liaden]

Mothra and Rodan do get less screen time than Godzilla and Mothra -- the latter two are the featured conflict in the movie. But Rodan has arguably the most badass scene in the whole movie. For Mothra, IMO you have to credit her screen time in larval as well as adult form.

[slikmar]

Plan to see later this week, still thinking IMAX. I really like the effect they have shown in previews of Ghidora's heads. Much more serpent like, makes them seem way more dangerous then he was.

[Lord Liaden]

I see depictions of Oriental dragons being a particular influence on how this Ghidorah's heads and necks look. But I assure you, Ghidorah in G:KOTM is every bit as dangerous as he looks, if not more so.

[death tribble]

On 6/1/2019 at 4:54 AM, Greywind said:

Maybe they'll go Godzookey.

In the name of all that is holy and unholy, please no.

 

Before I had seen the majority of Godzilla films, I had seen this cartoon and I hated it. Even the young Godzilla in the movies is nowhere near as bad as Godzookey. In my not so humble opinion. 

[Bazza]

I love Godzookey.   @death tribble

[death tribble]

 

[Bazza]

Because I speak what is true and you'll have to come to colonial Oz. 

 

Ps: Zod is a narcissist sociopath with a superiority complex. And he is a kitten. Meow. 

[death tribble]

If Zod was a Kitten, he would be Kitten Kong. and a Titan that Godzilla could not defeat due to being cute.