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Penetrating Attacks and Partial Dice 5th Ed Rev


Vindicus
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Just wanting to make sure I understand. If I purchase a (1/2)d6 killing attack and apply penetrating does it do 1 body every time or only when I roll 4,5,6? It shows a 1 point killing attack as doing 1 body penetrating and it seems counter-intuitive that a more expensive killing attack would do less damage on average when penetrating heavy armor than a weaker attack. All comments welcome but citation preferred.

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37 minutes ago, Hugh Neilson said:

That's an issue discussed in the past.  My fix is that your 1 pip gets a d6 roll and, on a 6, that 1 BOD is penetrating.


That equates to a ~16.67% chance of that 1 BOD being Penetrating - yet the power was NOT purchased with any kind of Limitation requiring an Activation Roll for the Penetrating function (which would fall somewhere between 9- [i.e. ~37.5% chance on 3d6) and 10- [i.e. ~50% chance on 3d6]).  If the Penetrating is now subject to chance where it otherwise wouldn't be per RAW, then it's limiting ... and, thus, worth a Limitation … right up there with the value of a 9- or 10- Activation Roll's value … adjusted (x1/2 the limitation's value prior to adjustment?), of course, for the fact that it's only the Penetrating component to which the Activation Roll would apply.

I say this because I think we all agree that a Limitation that isn't limiting … is worth nothing (-0) … which can only be consistently true if its converse (anything that is limiting … is worth something) is also consistently true.

Note:
For cleanliness, I would tend to write what you suggest up as Penetrating bought as a Naked Advantage for N points of the power … with the 9- or 10- Activation Roll applied to the Naked Advantage's cost without adjustment. Doing it this way gives the player a cost reduction for the GM-required Limitation, avoids any need for goofy house rules while introducing the element of chance you've required … and completely avoids the potential problem of the Limitation modifying/applying to more than just the Penetrating aspect of the power. 

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2 hours ago, Surrealone said:


That equates to a ~16.67% chance of that 1 BOD being Penetrating - yet the power was NOT purchased with any kind of Limitation requiring an Activation Roll for the Penetrating function (which would fall somewhere between 9- [i.e. ~37.5% chance on 3d6) and 10- [i.e. ~50% chance on 3d6]). 

 

Why doesn't 1/2d6 get an "activate 10-" limitation?  There is penetrating BOD only 50% of the time.  1d6 has no BOD penetrate ~16.67% of the time, which should be a 13- activation roll, shouldn't it?

 

If we applied the actual RAW - the amount rolled as BOD, counted as a normal attack, is penetrating, then 1 pip would add nothing and the advantage is wasted.  Just like 1/2 END does not reduce the END cost of a power of under 20 AP.

 

 

Why should I ever buy 1d6 RKA, Penetrating, Standard Effect?  I can spend the same on 3x 1 pip RKA, Penetrating and now all three BOD are Penetrating.  RAW says I can!

 

Hey, maybe I should also put Linked on two of the three 1 pip Penetrating RKAs - you have to use the first one to add any subsequent ones.

 

It's RAW, so that's all fine, right?

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2 hours ago, Hugh Neilson said:

It's RAW, so that's all fine, right?


RAW's the law unless the GM says it isn't.

With that in mind, just as GMs should consistently approach and work with players to make sure a Limitation that isn't limiting is worth nothing (-0) … players should consistently approach and work with GMs to make sure anything/everything that is limiting … is worth something. Good players and GMs, alike, tend to be amenable to such dialogues … and open to one another's perspectives. 

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7 minutes ago, Hugh Neilson said:

IIRC, 1/2 d6 has always been 1 BOD on a 4, 5 or 6.  I agree that the rule should be a 0 BOD roll, but RAW for a couple of editions, at least, has been that the 1 pip is penetrating.

 

So 1 PIP is both cheaper and 100% reliable vs. the more expensive and only 50% reliable 1/2d6 ??

 

That makes no sense at all.  I would houserule that instantly.

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