Building a Doctor (5th Ed Rev)

[That Retro Guy]

My apologies if this topic isn't posted in the proper Forum, but I'm building a Combat Medic using the 5th Ed Revised rules.  The character is a fully-educated Doctor who volunteered for Military Service.  His backstory isn't fully fleshed out, but something horrible happened causing the character to suffer from PTSD and subsequently being discharged from the Marines.  He feels guilty that he couldn't save everybody (and, in his mind, left his brothers behind when he was discharged), so he continues to use his medical knowledge to help out the people in his neighborhood.

 

Questions:

 

1)  Which Science Skills, Professional Skills, and Knowledge Skills are necessary to be a doctor (General Practitioner)?  His INT will be at least 20.

2)  Which Powers, Talents, Skills, and Perks would also be necessary?

3)  I was thinking that The Medic would have a Power Framework of some sort to simulate his chances of having a certain piece of Medical equipment that he needs.  Basic items like a Stethoscope, thermometer, blood pressure equipment (I don't know what it's called) could be automatic successes while other items would be more difficult for him to have.  Any thoughts?

 

 

[Lucius]

22 hours ago, That Retro Guy said:

My apologies if this topic isn't posted in the proper Forum, but I'm building a Combat Medic using the 5th Ed Revised rules.  The character is a fully-educated Doctor who volunteered for Military Service.  His backstory isn't fully fleshed out, but something horrible happened causing the character to suffer from PTSD and subsequently being discharged from the Marines.  He feels guilty that he couldn't save everybody (and, in his mind, left his brothers behind when he was discharged), so he continues to use his medical knowledge to help out the people in his neighborhood.

 

Questi ons:

 

1)  Which Science Skills, Professional Skills, and Knowledge Skills are necessary to be a doctor (General Practitioner)?  His INT will be at least 20.

2)  Which Powers, Talents, Skills, and Perks would also be necessary?

3)  I was thinking that The Medic would have a Power Framework of some sort to simulate his chances of having a certain piece of Medical equipment that he needs.  Basic items like a Stethoscope, thermometer, blood pressure equipment (I don't know what it's called) could be automatic successes while other items would be more difficult for him to have.  Any thoughts?

 

 

 

1, I would say that EITHER PS: Physician or Sci: Medical Science would be necessary. You can of course pile on a ton more skills, but that's all that is truly "necessary."

2. Paramedics. Again, you can and probably should pile on a lot more, but Paramedics on top of the above is all you need to be a general practitioner.

3. Basically you have to ask, what in game terms does this stuff do? I would probably build something like this:

MD Black Bag:  (Total: 12 Active Cost, 4 Real Cost) +3 with all Medical (12 Active Points); OAF (Requires Multiple Foci or functions at reduced effectiveness; -3/4), Gestures (Requires both hands; -1/2), Extra Time (Full Phase, Only to Activate, -1/4), Concentration (1/2 DCV; -1/4) (Real Cost: 4)

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The  palindromedary suggests a Diagnosis power built as "Detect medical condition."

 

 

 

[That Retro Guy]

2 hours ago, Lucius said:

The  palindromedary suggests a Diagnosis power built as "Detect medical condition."

 

 

 

Could 'Detect Medical Condition' be built as a Custom Power using the Skill 'Deduction' with the Limitation 'Only to Diagnose Medical Condition'?  And, if so, what would the value of the Limitation be?                                - 1/4?  - 1/2?

Edited June 19, 2019 by That Retro Guy

[Doc Democracy]

Lucius has it nailed (IMO).  There is very little you actually NEED to get what you want and have the relevant game effects.  A doctor diagnoses and does first aid.  Being able to do surgery might need a bit more.  All of this is based on knowledge and skills and he would be like most other doctors out there.

 

If you want him to be special, not to make mistakes and to be able to do surgery on the spot to make people better then you need to think exactly what it is you want.

You could build a special sense that allows him to diagnose at a glance and give MUCH more information than a casual glance or a cursory examination by a medical practitioner might glean.  You might be able to heal damage and cure disease (requiring the usual foci of surgery and application of medicines but with MUCH better success rates).  You might engender trust in people ("Let me through, I'm a doctor!").  In the same way you might get access to places that would otherwise be closed to you.

 

It all depends of the picture you have in your head about the character...you need to be more explicit if you want us to help you achieve that.

 

 

Doc

[Lucius]

9 hours ago, That Retro Guy said:

Could 'Detect Medical Condition' be built as a Custom Power using the Skill 'Deduction' with the Limitation 'Only to Diagnose Medical Condition'?  And, if so, what would the value of the Limitation be?                                - 1/4?  - 1/2?

 

Deduction is a pretty broadly useful Skill and you're limiting it quite a bit.

Diagnosis:  (Total: 3 Active Cost, 1 Real Cost) Deduction 13- (3 Active Points); Limited Power Only to deduce medical information (-1) (Real Cost: 1)

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Limiting palindromedaries to taglines, usually.

 

[megaplayboy]

Just use a version of Analyze, but call it Diagnose.  With the right equipment, the doctor gets substantial bonuses to the roll.  The more accurate the diagnosis, the more effective the treatment will be.

[ScrewySquirrel]

A good doctor should be a skill-monkey.

 

KS: Disease Pathology (and other medical knowledges)

PS: Physician 

PS: Surgery

SS: Medicine

SS: Psychology

Deduction

Analyze

Conversation (to talk to patients, good bedside manner).

License to Practice: Physician (2 or 3 points)

 

Heal/AID powers with extra time (days or weeks)

 

[Lucius]

11 minutes ago, ScrewySquirrel said:

License to Practice: Physician (2 or 3 points)

 

I have never understood why, if a character pays points for the necessary skills to qualify for a license, they should have to pay still more points to have the license. Still less do I understand what it would mean to pay points for the license and then not take the Skills.

 

As far as I'm concerned, if a character has the necessary Skills, they automatically have the license UNLESS there is a good reason (such as a relevant Complication) why they wouldn't.

 

Do you assume a character has no license to drive unless they pay points for one?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Riding an unlicensed palindromedary

 

[Lucius]

1 hour ago, megaplayboy said:

Just use a version of Analyze, but call it Diagnose.  With the right equipment, the doctor gets substantial bonuses to the roll.  The more accurate the diagnosis, the more effective the treatment will be.

 

I think megaplayboy has the right answer here,

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says I failed my Analyze: Hero Rules roll

[ScrewySquirrel]

45 minutes ago, Lucius said:

 

I have never understood why, if a character pays points for the necessary skills to qualify for a license, they should have to pay still more points to have the license. Still less do I understand what it would mean to pay points for the license and then not take the Skills.

 

As far as I'm concerned, if a character has the necessary Skills, they automatically have the license UNLESS there is a good reason (such as a relevant Complication) why they wouldn't.

 

Do you assume a character has no license to drive unless they pay points for one?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Riding an unlicensed palindromedary

 

I see the license as a SOCIAL use.

 

A driver's license is a 0-point perk. you don't get anything special with it.  Lack of one might even be a complication/disad in several campaigns

 

But being a licensed physician gets you the access to things you wouldn't otherwise have, like medical records, or 'Let me through, I'm a doctor', or the right to charge money for your services.  the skills mean you have the skill, the license means you have the social perks that come with being a doctor.

[megaplayboy]

48 minutes ago, Lucius said:

 

I have never understood why, if a character pays points for the necessary skills to qualify for a license, they should have to pay still more points to have the license. Still less do I understand what it would mean to pay points for the license and then not take the Skills.

 

As far as I'm concerned, if a character has the necessary Skills, they automatically have the license UNLESS there is a good reason (such as a relevant Complication) why they wouldn't.

 

Do you assume a character has no license to drive unless they pay points for one?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Riding an unlicensed palindromedary

 

A law professor may have the knowledge to practice the law, but not the license.  A solo practitioner may have a higher PS: Lawyer than KS: Law, and a license to practice.  I'm agnostic on charging points.  If you treat their profession as an extension of an "everyman" skill(PS: own profession), then their license to practice becomes an everyman perk as well.  

[Lucius]

8 minutes ago, ScrewySquirrel said:

I see the license as a SOCIAL use.

 

A driver's license is a 0-point perk. you don't get anything special with it.  Lack of one might even be a complication/disad in several campaigns

 

But being a licensed physician gets you the access to things you wouldn't otherwise have, like medical records, or 'Let me through, I'm a doctor', or the right to charge money for your services.  the skills mean you have the skill, the license means you have the social perks that come with being a doctor.

 

Oh, I'm all in favor of this character, or any other appropriate character, being licensed.

 

I'm just opposed to charging points for it. I see it as being covered by the Professional Skill. Having PS: Physician means you come equipped with a medical degree, a stethescope, and a license.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wants to scope out some stethas.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Toxxus]

15 hours ago, Lucius said:

The  palindromedary suggests a Diagnosis power built as "Detect medical condition."

 

Might be a good spot for a variation of Analyze as well such as Analyze Medical Condition or Analyze Health.

[BoloOfEarth]

Since PS "are often used in a character’s employment" (6E1:87), and an unlicensed doctor (or lawyer, or what have you) can't very well get employment, I'm inclined to Lucius' way of thinking.  That said, the Fringe Benefit Perk does specifically list "License to practice a profession (e.g., Lawyer, Engineer, Physician)" - for 1 point, BTW, not 2-3 points as stated by ScrewySquirrel.  So it seems like it's a requirement to be a practicing doctor... which also implies that said license would entitle you to certain benefits beyond mere employment.

[steriaca]

Hey, who needs a licence. Just ask Black Jack (the anime/manga character).

[Anaximander]

I happen to work as a housekeeper in an operating room.  I've seen surgeons and surgical staff put it in long, hard hours and still keep going; so, I would think some sort of capacity to deal with fatigue.  I figure maybe increased CON for the purposes or resisting sleepiness and fatigue and/or Life Support: Reduced Sleeping.

[steriaca]

If you're going the Black Jack route, you're definitely going to need powers to represent his powerful medical skills 

1) Healing, OIF (his black bag, but in the rare case of going without it, he can work with improvised tools). This should take care of standard first aid stuff.

2) Transformation, broken/missing limbs and organs to full function human, extra time, requires a sterile operating room, requires a skill roll.

3) Transformation, sick person to well person, extra time, requires a skill roll, sickness must be known to him first.

4) Black Jack was able to remove a subdermal twin and was able to fabricate an artificial body for her. THAT might be stretching the whole healing powers of your doctor, but I still have to mention her.

 

Edit: It should be noted that the transforms do not "heal back" and are NND. But are also so easy to wreck.

[megaplayboy]

IMO a highly successful professional NPC can justify 15-25+ points in relevant skills and also a few extra points of INT, PRE, or whatever stat is appropriate.  A successful litigator with 25 years of experience, or a successful surgeon with 25 years of experience has a lot of skill, knowledge and experience relevant to their area of expertise, plus more than a smattering of knowledge of related areas.  

[starblaze]

Don't forget that he usually would have some wealthy perk.

[Asperion]

Most people in the medical profession will be highly knowledgeable in both diseases and medication.  As a result, I would require them to take KS in both diseases and pharmacology at a minimum of 11-.  This (along with other medical skills) can be increased with SL: medical (+x).  Since most of the time doctors will spend it researching, I believe that some form of research skill is also justified as part of the medical skills package.

[Lucius]

3 hours ago, Asperion said:

Most people in the medical profession will be highly knowledgeable in both diseases and medication.  As a result, I would require them to take KS in both diseases and pharmacology at a minimum of 11

 

.

 

These might be Science Skills (Pathology and Phermacology)

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Palindromedariologist

[Daniel Pennington]

Just a note: you've decided on making him an ex-Marine, so what was his MOS? The Marines so not have medics, they are assigned Navy Medical Corpsman personnel for that job, so if he was a Marine his MOS would have to be combat specific, though he could have been a pilot or driver if you don't want to gve him a combat MOS. Just FYI into how it works in the "real life" military. So basically if you want him to have been assigned to a medical position in a Marine unit you should make him Navy, which doesn't mean he'd be any less attached to his squad. Otherwise sounds like a great idea for a hero.

 

Semper Fi to all my Marine brothers from an Army Corp of Engineers vet

Edited June 23, 2019 by Daniel Pennington
For barely awake grammar and spelling errors

[That Retro Guy]

2 hours ago, Daniel Pennington said:

Just a note: you've decided on making him an ex-Marine, so what was his MOS?

 

  Well, to be honest, I haven't fleshed the character out that far yet.

 

 

2 hours ago, Daniel Pennington said:

The Marines do not have medics, they are assigned Navy Medical Corpsman personnel for that job. . . . So basically if you want him to have been assigned to a medical position in a Marine unit you should make him Navy, which doesn't mean he'd be any less attached to his squad.

 

They don't?  I didn't know that.  I just assumed that each branch of the Military had their own Medics.  I try to learn a new fact each day . . . I guess that this factoid takes care of today.   Maybe I will just make him a Navy Medical Corpsman for the real-world realism.  Thanks! 

 

 

2 hours ago, Daniel Pennington said:

Semper Fi to all my Marine brothers from an Army Corp of Engineers vet 

 

I'm sure that I speak for everyone on this forum when I say, "Thank you for your service, sir!" 

 

------

 

While I'm thinking about it, here's a couple of more real-life Military questions for HeroSystem 5th Edition Revised

 

1. Shouldn't even Combat Medics (regardless of which branch they are in) have a Weapon Familiarity in Pistols and a Transport Familiarity in 4-Wheel Military Vehicles?
2. The Hypocratic Oath (Do No Harm) should definitely be a PsychLim.  So . . . Very Common, Total (25 pts), or a different Intensity?

 

 

[Daniel Pennington]

Well, depending on if they were enlisted or an officer, all go through some kind of basic training (army and air force) or boot camp (navy and marines). Obviously the army and marines receive much more intense combat training than the other 2, but all are trained in rifles at a minimum, officers and some specialties receive pistol training or other types of weapons familiarity training. For example, in basic I received INTENSE training with an M16, antipersonel mines, and LAWs (mini bazooka) but didn't receive any training pistols till later on.  But that was 35 years ago, so it might have changed and I have No idea what weapon training navy medics receive. And thank you for your kind words.

 

As far as vehicle training, that is often taught on the job unless its you're particular MOS. Most are no different than a standard car or truck; in fact, most ARE just upgraded civilian vehicles.

 

Dark Champions source book has a very good background skill package group if you can get your hands on a copy.  The skills apply to both 5th and 6th edition with no issue.