Gandalf970 Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 I am making up some races and I need to know how much the following would cost. This is a Fantasy World with a middle of the road magic. Not High Fantasy, but there is magic and people use it. Immune to Fear Complication: Cannot comprehend Magic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 4 minutes ago, Gandalf970 said: I am making up some races and I need to know how much the following would cost. This is a Fantasy World with a middle of the road magic. Not High Fantasy, but there is magic and people use it. Immune to Fear Complication: Cannot comprehend Magic Even though you said middle of the road Fantasy, the biggest question is how often in game do you expect this to come up? That affects the price. When I get a second I get some rough numbers. Btw someone might start saying about absolutes and Hero doesn’t have any, which by default it doesn’t however if you want immune to fear you can have immune to fear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandalf970 Posted June 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 I would say Fear will come up every third session. Magic will probably occur or be seen at least every other session. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandalf970 Posted June 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 Also how about a complication of not liking villages, towns or cities. It will come up every session I would suspect, maybe a 5 pointer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 1 hour ago, Gandalf970 said: Also how about a complication of not liking villages, towns or cities. It will come up every session I would suspect, maybe a 5 pointer? Let’s start here. Under Psy Comp you look at frequency. By your guess I rate it a Common 10 pts Next step is Intensity in other words how much of a bother is this to the character? Moderate is +0. Here I say the character will go into the city but will at a penalty for any interaction with City Folk. And the Player must have a good reason to go into the city (at least game wise at least protest-why must we have to go in there !) So a Strong level requires a successful EGO to go into the City. Change my mind! And Total is I’ll only go into the City Kicking and Screaming! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 2 hours ago, Gandalf970 said: I would say Fear will come up every third session. Magic will probably occur or be seen at least every other session. The magic complication does that mean the player can’t use anything magical that a regular person could? Like say use a magical scroll? If a mentalist controlled the character could the character then cast the magic? If no then you can use a Physical Complication to represent this. So I would rate this as Frequently 10 Pts and +5 Slightly. I went with Slightly cause I figure the character should be fairly competent with out magic but sometimes the magic would come in handy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 The Fear will take a little more time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Goodwin Posted June 11, 2020 Report Share Posted June 11, 2020 For immunity to fear, I'd do a couple of things. Extra Presence for defensive purposes only (against PRE Attacks). Possibly a psych complication. And then, Life Support vs. fear, for probably 3 points. This is assuming there are natural things that a normal person might be afraid of, and even other PCs might need to make EGO rolls against, but this character wouldn't have to. Panpiper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Shrike Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 In my Here There Be Monsters setting (which is a lower powered urban fantasy setting) I allow the following Talent: Fear Resistance (The effect of all fear and intimidation based abilities (including PRE Attacks) is halved vs this character.); Real Cost: 10 points The price is arbitrarily scaled to the point range of the campaign and its perceived general utility in that campaign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkonduty Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 Immune to Fear depends on how the campaign builds fear as an attack. Mind Control is a common way to build a fear attack. (Mind Control, Only to cause fear.) So a character could buy: Mental Defence, Only vs. Fear based attacks. But this won't work against PRE attacks to cause fear, unless you house rule it. PRE attacks target EGO or PRE, whichever is higher. So you can buy EGO, Only vs. Fear. This will work against both Mind Control and PRE attacks. This then begs the question what is Only vs. Fear worth as a limitation? I'd give it a blanket -1 but it is actually campaign dependent. Specifically, it's dependent on how often other types of mental attacks/telepathy occur. If you want to avoid the mucking about with complicated power builds and just have a simple power that does a thing then you will have to guess at it's cost. To get a sense for the correct cost compare it to other things that the players could buy for that many points. If you price Immune to Fear at 10 points, what else could the player get for 10 points? Are these other things as useful as Immune to Fear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 See if the top of my head, how often do you really are faced with a Fear Attack? In a Fantasy Game (not Horror). I’d put it at 5 pt off the cuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 3 hours ago, Killer Shrike said: In my Here There Be Monsters setting (which is a lower powered urban fantasy setting) I allow the following Talent: Fear Resistance (The effect of all fear and intimidation based abilities (including PRE Attacks) is halved vs this character.); Real Cost: 10 points The price is arbitrarily scaled to the point range of the campaign and its perceived general utility in that campaign. I really like the use of Resistance. I take that in that game, Fear based attacks were regularly to be expected? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawsplay Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 11 hours ago, Gandalf970 said: I am making up some races and I need to know how much the following would cost. This is a Fantasy World with a middle of the road magic. Not High Fantasy, but there is magic and people use it. Immune to Fear Complication: Cannot comprehend Magic Sounds like one of the Thralls of Talislanta. Psychological Complication: Cannot comprehend magic, frequently, fully impairing. Basically the character would not be able to succeed at any check to understand something magical, could perceive magic but never grasp how it works, and would not be able to do anything magical at all, whether that's activating a scroll, learning any magical skills, and so forth. That would be worth 25 points. It's also pretty impairing. At greatly impairing, the character is very primitive and still won't comprehend magical stuff, but might be able to make some checks to try. At slightly impairing, the character is more ignorant/incomprehending of magic than most people, like maybe a Cimmerian just out of the mountains. or a modern person in a magical world with only pop culture to guide them. If the complication only pertains to doing magical things, and not just general knowledge, I would downgrade it to infrequently. So the character couldn't use a wand to save their life and can't seize control of magical artifact, but still understands that mages cast spells, might have a general knowledge of what different magical orders do, can understand in a simple way that magic depends on energy or entities or whatever, and so forth. It might not be worth any points if all magical items or rituals require a Magic skill to use, and the character simply lacks it. But if the character can't use a necklace of fireballs or activate a magic carpet that requires the will of the user, that is likely worth something. "Fear" in Fantasy Hero is a special effect. I can think of several things it can do. There's fear-based Presence Attacks. There are things that cause people to flee, like Mind Control. And there are fear rolls people have to make. I think the latter is just an application of Ego. Lots of Ego. Assuming this resistance is much higher than even the most strong-willed normal person, I'd say: Fearless: +30 Ego, Only versus fear (-1/2); and +20 PRE, only to defend against PRE attacks (-1/2), only fear (-1/2). That's a hefty 30 points. But this character won't fail any normal Ego Roll related to fear without a substantial penalty, and is almost immune to any kind of presence attack that is supposed to be scary, which includes a lot of intimidation attempts. Fear spells would be pretty much useless against this character. As long as this character isn't also a mage or some kind of omni-competent spy or something, there should be points in the budget for it. An alternative construction: Mental Defense +30, only against fear (-1/2) EGO +30, Only to make Ego rolls (-1/2), only against fear (-1/2) PRE 20, only defensive, only against fear That raises the cost to 45. But it also makes the character immune to fear-based mental blasts, and Drains based on fear that are resisted by Mental Defense. Gandalf970 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandalf970 Posted June 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 Pawsplay you are correct. I am bringing the Thralls, Jaka and maybe the Kang into a homebrew world. Thank you so much for this help, I am still trying to wrap my head around all the Powers and where to find them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianaJoe3 Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 15 hours ago, Gandalf970 said: I am making up some races and I need to know how much the following would cost. This is a Fantasy World with a middle of the road magic. Not High Fantasy, but there is magic and people use it. Immune to Fear Complication: Cannot comprehend Magic As others have commented above, "Immune to Fear" will depend largely on how you model Fear. If Fear was a defined type of PRE Attack (which is how I would do it), then its counter would be something like PRE, Defensive only (-1), Only vs Fear (-1 to -2). Buy as many points as you need to reduce most fear attacks to <10 points of effect. Being unable to comprehend magic does not sound very limiting to me, especially in a low-to-moderate magic setting. While the character may not be able to use magic, he will generally have other options to compensate. I would consider it Infrequent, slightly limiting (10 pts). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Shrike Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 10 hours ago, Ninja-Bear said: I really like the use of Resistance. I take that in that game, Fear based attacks were regularly to be expected? Not necessarily "regularly"...in the monster of the week sort of set up you might go a couple sessions and get little or no use out of it, but then get into encounters with things that rely heavily on fear / existential horror as part of their gimmick and get a ton of utility out of it all at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallet Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 Fantasy Hero 6th ed. already has the Fearless talent in it: Fearless Effect: Power Defense (20 points) and Mental Defense (20 points), Only To Resist Fear Description: The character possesses such great courage that virtually nothing can terrify him — not even fear-spells or demonic fear-auras. In game terms, this counts as 20 points of Mental Defense and Power Defense that only apply against fear-generating powers (such as Drain PRE, Mind Control, and Change Environment; see page 414). Generally, the GM should rule that this provides absolute immunity to fear (via the Absolute Effect Rule), but he may allow some strong fear attacks to overcome the defenses in the usual manner. Game Information: Power Defense (20 points) (20 Active Points); Only To Resist Fear (-2) (total cost: 7 points) plus Mental Defense (20 points) (20 Active Points); Only To Resist Fear (-2) (total cost: 7 points). Total cost: 14 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawsplay Posted June 12, 2020 Report Share Posted June 12, 2020 I find that construction weird because I don't think most fear attacks built as Drains would be versus Power Defense, but AVLD in some fashion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkonduty Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 14 hours ago, pawsplay said: I find that construction weird because I don't think most fear attacks built as Drains would be versus Power Defense, but AVLD in some fashion. A lot of the write ups of fear effects, as created by different NPCs, are PRE Drains. Hence the Power Defence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Ruggels Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 54 minutes ago, drunkonduty said: A lot of the write ups of fear effects, as created by different NPCs, are PRE Drains. Hence the Power Defence. Especially in FH Scenarios. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 Gandalf970, DD and Scott have good points. My group rarely uses fear and truthfully I can’t remember using even a basic PRE attack so in out group, Fearless at 10 pts is excessive. But as the other two noted if you use more fear based attacks in your game then it’s worth more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawsplay Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 8 hours ago, drunkonduty said: A lot of the write ups of fear effects, as created by different NPCs, are PRE Drains. Hence the Power Defence. I just don't know why you would build a PRE Drain as working against Power Defense. How does that make much sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L. Marcus Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 ... Power Defense protects against Drains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pawsplay Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 And PD protects against damage, but poisons are built differently. Why would a fear power target Power Defense and not Mental Defense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Shrike Posted June 13, 2020 Report Share Posted June 13, 2020 It's due to a quirk of the system; draining a character to 0 PRE causes them to run away from danger on a forced 9- roll made each phase they are in a threatening situation. Drains work against Power Defense by default, so there you have it. A character with PRE 0 must succeed with a PRE Roll each Phase to act offensively or remain in the face of anything even remotely threatening. If he fails the roll, he flees. drunkonduty 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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