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Howdy Herodom! I was looking at making some of the Overwatch characters for Champions, and had a bit of a hang up on their "Power Bar" powers. For those that don't play, these are powers that take time to charge based on your attacks and survival. How would someone build this? Would it be a Trigger? Or is there something else that represents this better?

Wow... they are annoying.

See, this is where the Power Skill comes in for me. When making power stunts, I tend to have "stunt powers" cost extra END and RSR to perform. If they get too abusive (like using several times in a row), I require them to take the stunt as a new power. It's worked well over the years, and allows the players to test their heroes' powers in new directions. For me, I'd allow something like "grabbing X and removing them from the field" as a new maneuver that doesn't need a power structure. IMHO, it's no different from performing other combat maneuvers like a Move By or Multi-Attack. Yes, it should have mods, but I don't believe that it should cost points. It's too much of a staple in the supers genre, which should mean that anyone can use it freely. Mind you, your campaign may vary, I just respectfully disagree with it costing points.

Does it really need to be built as a power/ability? I've always leaned into the genre conventions of a game over having to build every little piece. I can only imagine what someone like Superman would look like if every one of his tricks were statted out. Maybe look at making a custom maneuver over a power?

For Hero? Not much. I did run a Champions adventure where the heroes battled spellcasters looking to bring elder things to Earth. It was a bit darker than my usual games, but everyone had some fun. Most of the horror games I've ran were either in GURPS, Call of Cthulhu, or Chill.

I would say it's situational and a clear discussion of options to be had with the GM. In my case, I would probably allow a "I'm going to grab the guy at 30m speed and let him go into a building" as a damaging effect. Or I may rule that flying by and grabbing a target's arm may give you ONLY the target's arm (depending on how much Move By damage occurred). Could you do a fly by and just scoop someone up with no damage? Sure, so long as that's the style of the game. For example, playing in a four-color comic style game, you fly by and snag the crook to whisk off to jail. In a gritty, deconstructive game, you fly through the crook, splattering him around the area like a Pollock painting. Ultimately, as you know, it comes down to how you and the GM want to portray the character, and how the GM uses the rules around the concept.

Really looking forward to this. If I can offer one piece of constructive criticism? Please skip the watermarked pages as was done on Strikeforce. It's a bit hard to read I've found. So will this be a kickstarter or crowd sourced in some way?

I was told something similar, N-B. "You can tell folks who you think you are, but your actions will prove you're either a liar or telling the truth. Unless you're a REALLY good liar."

I'm a pretty lucky guy as well. I met my wife while working as a chat cop for WotC back in the very late '90s. She was my first trainee, and things just hit off from there. 20 years later, we're still together and gaming regularly (both in groups and solo). That said, that luck was earned through some rough relationships. In high school, I was steadily dating someone that despised gaming. She tried it once, hated it, and tried everything she could to pull me away from it. The ex-wife, to her credit, tried to game and understand what the hobby was, but she had other "hobbies" that were more fitting to her. Honestly, it was after her that I started looking for someone that was already into gaming to spend my life with, as it was important to me and something I wanted to share (along with comics, movies, art, and world domination). With all that in context, I agree with everyone that said "Communicate." Talk about what you enjoy, and why it's important to you. Relationships are odd in so many ways, as we tend to form them on a context of common interests, but find the commonality fleeting at times, especially with the little things in life.

To bounce off the OP, has anyone ever played in a game where being "killed" was just taken out of the action and returned after the combat? I know that's more popular in modern games, but just wondering if anyone's played that way in Hero?

A few over the years. I think the first vaporized himself with a massive attack in one of the first Champions game I played in. In most cases, though, it was a discussion a player had with me (or visa versa).

True. I'm straying too far from the topic. My apologies to the OP. This is a discussion for another thread, and another time.

Pathfinder still occasionally outsells D&D. I wouldn't be shocked if you see D&D dip a bit when Critical Role brings out more of their own systems, or when Kobold Press releases their new game. I agree with the troops statement... but financing is all in what you can bring to the table. 3PP could really help Hero and Champions become more visible, particularly if they're of a good quality. Maybe. But there are other ways to help a game outside of spending money. Don't get me wrong, buy products and all. But many of the popular games haven't gotten that without some serious work. That work doesn't necessarily equate to more money, but rather doing serious promotions. In a world where the internet is a low rent resource, there are better ways to create decent promotions. Let me ask everyone... if Hero (or any company for that matter) offered a Kickstarter to help them become more popular, would you support it? What would you expect in return? What do YOU think we (as fans) need to make Champions a better product line? What does Hero need? Yes, this has been asked before. But seriously... I'm not talking about "if I won the lottery" fantasies. What could Hero do right now that would make the game better for you? Edit: What do you think Champions' main competitor is? What's Hero's?

I stand by what I said. There are ways to bring popularity to the brand without spending a fortune. It would need more serendipity than money in many ways. The right group, with the right story can create the right ripples. In a dream line up, taking super-streamers and gaming Hero would be awesome, and potentially create something amazing for Hero and Champions. The problem is, that group hasn't been found yet to tell that story. And D&D may have won the battle, but the war still rages on, Hugh, and there's no end that I know...

Well to begin with, cost savings. It would be easier, I would imagine, to work with a relatively unknown IP than something that's considered a multi-media giant. That said, there is a fanbase already built for Champions, and the ability to work with that could be in their favor IF they know how to market it and create the fervor needed for it to be successful. Let's look at Mark Millar for a second. Here's a guy who created a bunch of indie books (as well as some mainstream ones) that moved beyond the comics. Wanted, Kingsmen, Jupiter's Legacy... the guy cranks these things out almost like he's printing money. They're okay books, the movies can be fun, and some have even gone on to video games. Is he a great writer? That's subjective. What he is is a decent businessman. He hitched his wagon to Netflix a while back and is basically a content creator for them. Pretty much every comic he makes is owned by the streaming giant, and gives them a golden goose to make new works with. How does this apply to Champions? It's a similar concept, but needs a person/team to bring it some visibility. Why is D&D 5e doing so well, even amidst the crazy OGL steps they made? They have streamers and influencers buying into their brand. Critical Role, Dimension 20, and a slew of other shows hammer D&D into the brains of all that are watching. People want those kind of games, and to emulate those kind of groups. Add in that they have their own video game branch, and the money from Hasbro, and they can make slip ups and still land on their toes. For Champions, or any game IP, to be successful these days, you need people to see it, play it, folks to talk about it outside of its own groups, and people to understand it. Achieve these three things, and you'd see things change for the IP, and for the game as well. Sure. But Cryptic dropped the ball with CO from the get-go, LL. I'm sure there were a ton of us that quickly bought in to play a MMO version of our favorite game, but what we got just wasn't Champions. At least not for me. The graphics were faltering even for the time, the game really felt reskinned, and, for me, it didn't feel like Champions. I always felt bad for anyone who bought a lifetime license, particularly since the game never really got better. IMHO, it felt like Cryptic had this thought about how cool a Champions MMO could be, and then just said "meh" during development. That has little to do with the IP, and more about the company it currently rests with. If a decent company was able to get the Champions IP and really do something with it... basically multi-media the heck out of it... I think it could contend with some of the smaller to medium companies out there. What if someone like Dark Horse or Skybound could produce something new? What would a Champions game look like if Sony Interactive or Insomniac Games took a stab at it? There are more Hero and Champions fans out there that remember the game as something fun... the problem is they needed to be reminded why it was fun. I would go into my usual rant about book design and production quality, but I've gotten tired of repeating myself. I'm sure you can find it on the boards if you search my name. Someday I would love to see Champions return to what it was and could've been... heck, I hope I can even help at times...

Well, to begin with, it's relatively unknown to the public at large. That works as an advantage in some respects. While Marvel & DC have "household names" at their fingertips, something like the Champions IP could piggyback off that fame depending on its use. Using the video game example, there are plenty of big games that have no ties to any other property. God of War, Call of Duty, GTA... none are based off other properties and have created a large fanbase for themselves with a draw extending beyond their games. The same technically could be done with the Champions IP. Would it be difficult? Possibly, but not impossible. The harder part, as we know, is expectations. A Champions CRPG may have to shed some of the HERO system to work properly. Creating a Crusader game like the Arkham games could be fun, but it wouldn't be a game with mechanics that we all love and play.

I wouldn't be shocked if the right bid was made that someone could buy the Champions IP. Whether that was for HERO or something else wouldn't really matter. I was always bummed we never got the old CRPG that was teased in Adventurer's Club...

Not really anymore rare than say Gravity Control or Momentum Control. It's only as rare as the GM needs it to be.

What about density-based powers affecting it?

I don't mind not having figured characteristics. I'm sure for some new players entering the game, it's a bit more attractive without them. Honestly, I've given thought to just making Perception an INT-based skill.

How does it hold up in more recent editions?

Coming from older editions, I completely agree. And while I cut my teeth on Champions/Hero back in the early '80s, I started viewing Disads differently in 4th, which has educated my opinions in 6th. I guess a big question I have is where is the compensation in 6th ed Complications? What do players get beyond story for them? Yes, they're "required," but the points no longer reflect spending points anymore. I think this is where I have some disconnect. Sure, I get that. This goes to concept and how it interacts with the Template chosen. In some cases, that 5 pt. version may not be feasible depending on campaign, organization, or even the character itself. Exactly. I've always seen the intentions of Complications/Disads in this light. Hunteds are a great example of this, particularly when looking at frequency. The higher pt. values typically indicated that the Hunted showed up more often. The same could be said about someone with a Psych Lim at Total, or a DNPC that showed up very frequently and was less than competent. Absolutely, Doc. In my case, I'm upfront with my players and often type up a small 6-8 page booklet that gives the house rules, packages, standard gear, etc. I always try and find a way to spotlight characters from session to session, and Complications work as a great vehicle for that. On the BadWrongFun part, I really wish that others would understand that at times.

Thank you, Doc D. That's exactly what I'm trying to say. Even back in the older days of Hero, I've always seen Disads/Complications as ways to tell a story with your character. Have a Code vs. Killing? Let's explore that by confronting a character like The Punisher. Have a Hunted by Viper? Okay, so you find an old Viper lab that has some info on you. Should they be a problem at times? Of course. When you have a x2 Vulnerability to Corgis, expect an occasional Corgi to show up and slobber on you. But having something like Subject to Orders? There should be other, more defining things for a character to take in their Complications. This is why I'm also using Quirks, so characters can be defined better.

I was looking through some older Champions books and came across the Mastermind option in Champions II (p. 21-22). Anyone ever try and bring this forward into newer editions? I often wonder why it wasn't included going forward. Was it just too game breaking? Anyone know?

That's pretty awesome, Bunch. Thanks for sharing.