Anaximander

"We'll return to the Democratic debates, but first a word from our Sponsor"
 
 

Gabbard was by far the most palatable Dem candidate for me, in a lot of ways.  

Yeah, I've been guilty of doing everything I complain about and try to not to be too much of a jerk about stuff like that when running and playing games.  I just chalk it up as a different genre of fantasy.

That reminds me:  I've also read a lot of Greek and Norse mythology, and a little Egyptian (and a tad of Babylonian/Mesopotamian/Sumerian, and Hawaiian).
 
And also there were a lot of fantasy (and sci-fi) short stories in Dragon magazine, back in the 80's - most were not specifically based on D&D-specific things.

Related to Hermit's statement on religion, I think that his argument can be broadened to differences in station in general.  I might not hold serving people in especially low regard or the well-to-do in high regard.  I judge people equally regardless of station, but I was raised that way, but that is not how I would have been raised in medieval Europe where everyone was expected to live according to their station whether they liked it or not.  So, I find it jarring when I see a character talking smack to noblemen in general conversation without having their heads summarily removed.  Admittedly, enforcing those kind of standards with modern players presents its own issues beyond mere story writing.

I have yet to read Lord of the Rings.  I liked Arthurian legend and Greek mythology were my earliest connections with fantasy, and I've read the Myth, Xanth, Dancing God, Mallorean, and Belgariad.  I am also greatly inspired by Robin Hood and the Three Musketeers.  Truth is, I am far more of a science fiction guy and that is where most of my fiction reading goes.   Almost forgot the Adept series which had both science fiction and fantasy elements.

Quick informal poll.  Who of us got started in fantasy reading Lord of the Rings?  If not, what was your introduction?  
 
I have never actually completely read the Lord of the Rings trilogy or the Hobbit.  I think I completed the Fellowship of the Ring after having seen the movie.  My introductions to fantasy were the King Arthur stories, Clash of the Titans, AD&D 1e, the Compleat Enchanter, the Sword of Shannara (which I recognized as derivative of a book I hadn't even read, and don't think I got much further in the story), Robert Asprin's Myth Adventures series, Lawrence Watt-Evans' Ethshar novels, Xanth, the Incarnations of Immortality, Poul Anderson's Operation Chaos, Jack Chalker's Dancing Gods series.  

Yeah, I've been guilty of doing everything I complain about and try to not to be too much of a jerk about stuff like that when running and playing games.  I just chalk it up as a different genre of fantasy.

Related to Hermit's statement on religion, I think that his argument can be broadened to differences in station in general.  I might not hold serving people in especially low regard or the well-to-do in high regard.  I judge people equally regardless of station, but I was raised that way, but that is not how I would have been raised in medieval Europe where everyone was expected to live according to their station whether they liked it or not.  So, I find it jarring when I see a character talking smack to noblemen in general conversation without having their heads summarily removed.  Admittedly, enforcing those kind of standards with modern players presents its own issues beyond mere story writing.

What I want most out of a setting is internal consistency.  Basically, the physics and metaphysics of the universe should be true and the same throughout the entire story.  If the physics and metaphysics are thrown together haphazardly or changes from scene to scene without an internal explanation, that throws me off.
 
Regarding the use of anachronisms in storytelling, I am mixed and it strongly depends on how it is used.  There are many great and engrossing works of literature and cinema that are chock full of anachronisms.  Some times, the anachronisms are intended.  Sometimes, they are not.  Either way, the stories still maintain immersion throughout.  Regarding the use of anachronistic language in literature and anachronistic fashion sense in cinema, a story writer has to write and dress his stories in order to maintain the attention of the intended audience.  I've had literature classes in college, and I read at a high level, but sometimes, even the references from an American novel from only a century ago can be unapproachable without good annotation while the original English used by Chaucer might as well be a foreign language to most readers.  You have to write in a language and vocabulary sense of the intended audience.  Take the mesmer issue as an example.  I know what the word implies.  It has an oldish sound.  And, the fact that the word would not exist in the period in which it was used is not off-putting to me.
 
A similar problem can be had of fashion sense.  Some of the fashion sense of our ancestors would be shocking to us today if we weren't expecting it and could distract a potential audience from the actual story; so, you might get the clothes and hairstyles close to what the audience would it expect them to be even if it is not accurate to what they are supposed to be.  For example, if you want a certain character to considered attractive by an audience, you will want the looking attractive based on the biases of the audience and not to the biases of the people that lived in the time and place that the story is set.
 
What does throw me off is an excessive use of slang and pop culture references, especially as I get older and stay up with slang and pop culture less and less.  Okay, they work in comedy when I actually understand the reference.  Two examples where the use of slang and pop culture references are the Naked Gun movies and The Knight's Tale.
 
In regards regards Naked Gun, I loved the movies when they came.  The humor is right up my alley.  I saw the trilogy on sale at Walmart for real cheap; so, I bought them.  I still enjoyed a lot of the humor, but I really had to think back to get a lot of the pop culture jokes.  I'm over 50.  I was still a young man when the movie came out and was still active in staying up with pop culture.  I wonder if some guy in his 20s now would even have a chance at getting many of the jokes.
 
Then there's The Knight's Tale, I wanted to like this movie and I genuinely tried, but ultimately, I didn't.  The anachronisms and cultural references were just too jarring for me.  First, I was starting to lose my interest in pop culture; so, the pop culture was not endearing to me, and it's use of anachronism was so haphazard that it left me feeling like it didn't know what kind of movie it wanted to be, and that's a shame, because I kind of liked the actual story.

I probably would have liked The Knight's Tale better if I knew what to expect going into it.  It's kind of like when you are expecting Sprite and getting water or water but getting Sprite.

Probably cause it’s a game  and not book keeping. 

Gods, Religions, and Religious institutions as unimportant and lacking any power or purpose save as healing shops.
It's such a waste of material to use it that way. And it often throws me off. Even if the gods don't feel chatty, religious leaders can still exert enough influence and power to hobble or raise up rulers, they can direct codes as strong as any secular set of laws. And, unless one is speaking of 'chaching, the God of #$#You, Payme!', their entire purpose should never be confined to just taking gold and then curing that STD you got at Madame Stonegate's House of Dwarven pleasures.
 
Not meaning any disrespect to anyone who follows Chaching
 
And I always appreciate when the not priestly types still have a spiritual side, and pay a bit of respect to the gods. NPCs who are farmers, bartenders, or the like who tip their hat to the local holy man, or pray for good weather etc are small touches, but it shows off nicely. Heck, even creative ways of using a god's name in anger can reflect wel. But when a fantasy village seems to be entirely secular to a man, unless there's an in setting reason, it kind of jars me a bit. I don't expect Hozanas and Psalms all the time, but the idea of "Who do these god people think they are anyway?" Should not be the norm unless you're going for a Monty python skit
 
 
But that's just me.. just sort of makes me roll my eyes and disrupts my immersion a bit.
 
 

My idea for Star Trek is to place it some where between the original series and the movies while adding in nuggets from what I like best of the later series and from some of my own ideas.  I'd keep the design of the original uniforms and phasers.  Older ships would like the ships from the series.  New ships would look like the ones from the movies.  Klingons would be divided into two subspecies, one with the ridges and one without, and they would still be an enemy species.  I would add some of the races from TNG and DS9, and I would make Federation society and economics into something I consider more realistic.  (I'm sorry.  I just can't buy into some of the political and philosophical views espoused by Roddenberry long enough to maintain a whole campaign.)

My idea for Star Trek is to place it some where between the original series and the movies while adding in nuggets from what I like best of the later series and from some of my own ideas.  I'd keep the design of the original uniforms and phasers.  Older ships would like the ships from the series.  New ships would look like the ones from the movies.  Klingons would be divided into two subspecies, one with the ridges and one without, and they would still be an enemy species.  I would add some of the races from TNG and DS9, and I would make Federation society and economics into something I consider more realistic.  (I'm sorry.  I just can't buy into some of the political and philosophical views espoused by Roddenberry long enough to maintain a whole campaign.)

Just don't allow a Star Wars captain to end your universe by letting her be the first person to ram an enemy vessel at hyperspeed.
 
Because then all capital ships are a waste of resources as they get annihilated by droid-operated ramming drones just large enough to have a hyperspeed drive.
 
Or Force Lightening.
 
Palpatine:  Hi guys, I'm back in town for a couple of weeks.
GM:  Hey, good to see you.  Still got your Dark Lord of the Sith character from before?
Palpatine:  Sure do.  The DM where I live now runs a higher point campaign, but I'm sure I can make it work.
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.
Two Session later
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Palpatine:  Rebel fleet is advancing on my temple?  I'll show them.  I use Force Lightning!
GM:  On who?  Rey or Kylo?
Palpatine:  No, the Rebel Fleet.  I raised my Force Lightning to 10d6 RKA - Cone - AoE.  From here I can hit everything between low orbit and where I'm standing.
GM: . . .

I strongly dislike the phrase " the original series." 
 
It implies that there were others.... 
 
 

I admit I haven't in the Crisis TV shows.  I've cut the cable a long time ago, and I am not going to pay for umpteen millions streaming subscriptions to watch show for which I am not even the main target audience, but I remember the comic books series.  I grew up reading DC comics in the 70s, and I love the multiple universes where alternate of well known characters could co-exist.  I even use it for my super hero campaign.
 
I read the Crisis books, and my feelings were mixed in regards to results.  First of all there was the killing off of favorite characters without the prospect that they were at least still alive in an alternate reality.  Then, there was the unintended consequences of creating plot holes and continuity errors that were as bad or worse than the ones they were trying get rid of.  Finally, they through away a lot interesting story potential by draconicly trying to make all characters comport to the current favored reality.  Frankly, I think it would have been interesting to see characters from different universes struggle as they cope with the confusing of adapting to the new universe.  Worst of all, I was one of the few fans at the time that actually liked the existence of multiple universes even if it did get a little confusing from time to time, but that goes back to no longer being apart of the main demographic that comic books publishers are aiming for.  That being said, I did like many of the changes.  I was also into a system called DC Heroes at the time, and in my head canon, the core DC universe at the time was just one of multiple universes where a Crisis like event occurred, and there was an infinite number of universes that remained completely unaffected by it.

The versatility of the Star Wars universe is a big reason why I like over the Star Trek universe for roleplaying purposes.  It also has a lot to do with why I like the idea of super hero roleplaying games.

I’ve said this before but I’ll mention it on this thread. Back when when the Internet was new and dial up, I saw other people’s WEG inspired websites. And the feeling I got from them was that just about anything Sci-fi could be included in a Star Wars games. Just might have to have some of the serial numbers filed off.

Hard to say since I haven't seen the show, so, any symbolic speculation would be difficult unless they writing the Romulans to represent the Protestant versus Catholic tension that occurs within Ireland, but I haven't heard much on the news about any recent tensions along that route; so, I can't imagine it being enough apart the cultural imagination to feature in TV show.
 
The fact that TV show and movies use different accents or belonging to certain cultural groups to symbolically represent certain ideas is kind of a problem.  Most villains are given either German or British accents.  A southern or midwestern accent is either backwards and folksy or smart and evil.  Native American are always shown as being ecologically concerned and in touch with the Old Ways that strangely coincides with western New Age ideas, and so on.  Whether intentional or not, I think it leads to a lot leads bad ideas in regard to what different cultures should be like.
 
I'm Oklahoman.  I'm part Indian, part white, and had a black godfather.  I have a high IQ, and I am well read.  I sound like a hick, but I think at the masters degree level.  Yes, I am politically and socially conservative, but I am not an ignorant goose stepper about it; yet, if Hollywood were to portray me, I'd probably come out looking like a hateful racist who's not even smart enough to tie his own shoes.
 
I suppose this is where I should admit that I like to use accents when I roleplay, but I try to be respectful about.  Not all of my British are snobs, not all of my Germans are Nazis, and so on.  I hope I do my accents well enough and respectfully enough that real speakers of those accents take it with good humor should they actually hear me.
 
 

No wonder everyone says that Romulan Ale is "Magically Delicious."

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My current view on canon and stories in general has taken a recent twist.  I took some time to study concepts like The Hero's Journey and the Monomyth.  Terms I have heard but have never understood.  I still don't fully understand them but the more I study the more my interpretations of stories change, and for me, canon is about the hidden truths of the story and its window dressing.  
 
Also, the more I learn the more I want the players to have the opportunity of being the Big Danged Heroes of their story even if it means kicking Luke Skywalker, Captain Kirk, or Batman to the curb.  One example of what I want to do is run a Star Wars game using the Fantasy Flight Games system.  It would be set approximately in the time just before the events the first movie.  I would spend the early part of the game making sure that they and me are comfortable with the system and are invested in the stories and NPCs they interact with.  When I feel that everyone is comfortable and ready for a change, I would introduce a planet killer that may or may not be the Death Star, but instead of destroying Alderaan, I would destroy a planet the characters are emotionally invested in and killing of a few friends and even rivals in the process.  That way when they go after the planet killer it will be personal.  Also, the planet killer's Achilles' Heel will be designed around the strengths and weakness of the player characters rather than necessarily trying hit some poorly designed exhaust port.  In addition, if I introduce any of the main characters from the movies, books, and TV shows, I would try to stay true to their core values as I understand them, but I might change the events of their lives.  When all cases, I want to have my players be my guides on what direction I want the overall story to go.