Jump to content

Brian Stanfield

HERO Member
  • Content Count

    1,232
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    1

Reputation Activity

  1. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to zslane in Community Content Program: Hall of Champions   
    I kinda agree with Spence on this. Adobe has effectively priced the hobbyist out of their product suite.
  2. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Spence in Community Content Program: Hall of Champions   
    It went from a program you can purchase to a rip off subscription. I could justify buying a program for intermittent use over 3 or 4 years.  But i cannot justify paying that amount for a 1 year access. 
     
    I'll need to shop around for a similar program that is still on the market
  3. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to lou_tennant in The Turakian Age is Seriously Underrated   
    Late to the party but... absolutely.
    Just (today) uploaded a Ambrethel world map in colour that might interest folk.
  4. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Reviews   
    Thanks, but I want to be certain to remind everyone who saw them that they are not my work; all I did was clean them up and make them printable.  
     
    They have been colored-- over many, many yea-- Good God!  DECADES!!!   Crap!  I'm old!  Still!
     
    I think one of the biggest appeals of Champions back in the early days wasn't the system itself-- Don't misquote me-- it was _awesome_, but I think the biggest "suck you in" thing about it was the character sheets.   No; seriously: you could picture a character in your head and you had your choice of mannequins upon which to draw it.  For years, there was _always_ a box of something to color with on our table just because _someone_ was going to show up with a character idea-- PC, NPC, hero, villain, background character-- someone was going to just _have_ to draw a character.  
     
    That kind of spread-- it became part of our group culture.  I have, at last count, eleven copies of the 2e Champions book, and easily half of them have the majority of the pictures colored-- a couple of them have _all_ the pictures colored.  And I was telling the truth: it's a variety of media, ranging from colored pencils (of quality running the full spectrum) to crayons to magic markers to other inks and the one watercolor  (he brought those with him; he was taking a painting class that met the afternoons before we gamed).
     
    Originally, I started out by scanning pages from a number of books in which "page X" hadn't been colored, which gave me a total of-- I think....  six pages?-- that I had scanned.    This problem ran through almost _all_ my 1, 2, and 3e stuff......  The BBB caught most of the magic marker...    Barbarians.....
     
    So I finally just scanned my original (which was coming apart already, as it was my favorite, and got the most use and abuse) and set about cleaning the colors out of all the pictures.  The reason that one particular image (which the painter then declared was "professional adventurer and alien medical prodigy Doctor Tarentela," if anyone's interested) is so large is because I'm not lying to folks when I tell them I have no artistic ability.  Even the scans I have done-- you have no _idea_ how much of that stuff was done pixel-by-pixel, changing one, zooming out, checking, going back in.....   Anyway, I found it much easier to work on a very, _very_ large image, at least at that level of attack, and so I scanned the colored images at 2400 dpi, so they'd be huge, did what I wanted to do, then reduced them down to fit back onto the image of the original scan, etc, etc, etc...  If you look, you'll see a colored image of Flare in that video, just a couple of pages after you see the one I cleaned the color out of.
     
    Somewhere along the way, looking at all those sterile black-and-white images, I realized just how much I actually _missed_ the desecration of my original books, so opened the original scans again and started cleaning up their appearance a bit, but not "uncoloring" them.  As I have multiple copies of a considerable amount of the early stuff, I have many pieces where I have to choose which one I want to keep  (which frankly, has nothing to do with the talent involved, and more to do with the memories of who did it   ).  I hope to one day have the time to finish the project and have it printed: my own personalized 2e book-- probably with a few house-rules hard-wired into the text, and combining the best of 2e Champs, Champs II, and Champs III  (and the vast selection of Advantages and Limitations I've collected over the years--- in color, filled with memories of people I haven't seen in as much as thirty years....
     
    So that's why that image was saved so large: by the time I got all the paper distortion and other problems out of the original scan, I actually just really _liked_ that picture.    
     
     
  5. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Reviews   
    Last video on this subject;nothing about the book; just proof that the goal they claimed--creating a new book from high quality scans-- is _not_ hard   tedious?  No doubt!  But not hard. 
     
    Still the difference in the end results is determined _completely_ by how you start.   This last video proves that by taking a few really good starts, and finishing them with the crappiest materials available (pretty much the opposite of the POD approach: instead of trying to shine a turd, I ran a few diamonds through the mud, just to see (and show you guys) what would happen. 
     
     
  6. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Reviews   
    POD for anything 6e and even 5e should be fine, at least as far as the interior goes: they will be printed from original PDF documents, which scale well and have precise mathematically-defined edges to stay crisp and clear-and of course, no one includes artifacts in the brand new document. 
     
     
    The only potential problem with POD for a modern book is poorly-formatted artwork.  JPG / jpeg are very old, very loss-heavy formats that people just won't get away from, but they will wreck your project.  Fortunately, if you want to print a 6e book, there is nothing remotely approaching nice artwork on the covers (I mean the blue backs, of course), so it's a non-issue u less you demand they look super-crisp.  Interior art, again, depends on how that art was stored, converted, etc. 
     
    That's why this 4e reprint is such a bomb:  is a series of photos.  Scans are just pictures.  These are pictures of words, sure, but they are just pictures at the end of the day, and they were taken at too low a resolution, stored incorrectly, and- itss just gone bad from start to finish. 
     
    . If you want to see what can be done with a Hugh quality scan, watch that third video. 
     
    If I find some daylight after work or this weekend, I will do a test with some of the Western HERO pages.  Though if you have western HERO, I e courage you to try it for yourself. 
  7. Like
    Brian Stanfield got a reaction from Chris Goodwin in Reviews   
    Duke, watching that first video with your "helpers" is like watching an episode of Mystery Science Theater 3000! I was laughing out loud for the better part of thirty minutes! Thanks for the review(s), and for reminding us what we should be expecting when we pay money for a product.
     
    Big Jack, I have many of the POD books for 6e because I was out of gaming for several decades and missed getting all the books in their original form. I am very impressed with the quality of the books I got (the Equipment Guide, Skills, Grimoire, and all sorts of others). They don't suffer from the same problem as the new 4e book. They're clear and crisp and the paper quality is good and durable. The cover colors may vary a little bit, but I'm not sure the original books were even exactly the same anyway. In short, I have a shelf full of the 6e books and I couldn't tell you which are the originals that I was able to hunt down, and which are the PODs. They're worth getting. 
     
    I'm really embarrassed by the 4e POD release. Duke covers it pretty much in each of his videos. I "helped" (much like the "helpers" in the first video) to clean up the Western HERO book with Duke, although he did all the work. He did such an amazing job, I can't figure out why they'd release such a piece of garbage at the 4e Champions book when Duke has offered to volunteer his time and work for them to have a clean copy of a much superior quality. It doesn't really bode well for how decisions are being made for the HERO System (a common complaint I make and won't rehash here). 
     
    The 6e1 and 6e2 rulebooks were released as POD a couple of years ago, and then promptly disappeared from DTRPG because the interior text was having problems with the greyscale and whatnot. They had to re-work them to get them right, and then re-released them a while back. I was tempted to get copies of each of those books for reference copies at the game table, but after what I've seen from Duke's review here, I'm not a little bit wary of what those books look like! Essentially, they've lost sales (to my) for several of several copies of their POD books because of how amazingly bad the 4e book is! 
     
    I'd think, in all good conscience, they'd have to pull that POD and rework it because as it stands now, it's horrible. It looks like something I would have done with my first MS Paint program back in 1993 on my first homemade computer! Amateurish reprints of old titles have their place I guess, but not when they look so horrible that a nostalgic collector can't even enjoy the cover, let alone read the text inside. Really, PDFs are how we can "collect" titles these days. POD from a PDF shouldn't be that complicated, but somehow they've found a way to screw it up. Computers are much more sophisticated these days, guys, and the tools they offer for producing good books are widely available to people. Expectations are much higher these days, as they should be. As with many other things, DOJ needs to wake up to the 21st Century with their business model. 
     
    *Ok, quarantine-induced rant over*
     
    Thanks @Duke Bushido!
     
  8. Like
    Brian Stanfield got a reaction from BigJackBrass in Reviews   
    Duke, watching that first video with your "helpers" is like watching an episode of Mystery Science Theater 3000! I was laughing out loud for the better part of thirty minutes! Thanks for the review(s), and for reminding us what we should be expecting when we pay money for a product.
     
    Big Jack, I have many of the POD books for 6e because I was out of gaming for several decades and missed getting all the books in their original form. I am very impressed with the quality of the books I got (the Equipment Guide, Skills, Grimoire, and all sorts of others). They don't suffer from the same problem as the new 4e book. They're clear and crisp and the paper quality is good and durable. The cover colors may vary a little bit, but I'm not sure the original books were even exactly the same anyway. In short, I have a shelf full of the 6e books and I couldn't tell you which are the originals that I was able to hunt down, and which are the PODs. They're worth getting. 
     
    I'm really embarrassed by the 4e POD release. Duke covers it pretty much in each of his videos. I "helped" (much like the "helpers" in the first video) to clean up the Western HERO book with Duke, although he did all the work. He did such an amazing job, I can't figure out why they'd release such a piece of garbage at the 4e Champions book when Duke has offered to volunteer his time and work for them to have a clean copy of a much superior quality. It doesn't really bode well for how decisions are being made for the HERO System (a common complaint I make and won't rehash here). 
     
    The 6e1 and 6e2 rulebooks were released as POD a couple of years ago, and then promptly disappeared from DTRPG because the interior text was having problems with the greyscale and whatnot. They had to re-work them to get them right, and then re-released them a while back. I was tempted to get copies of each of those books for reference copies at the game table, but after what I've seen from Duke's review here, I'm not a little bit wary of what those books look like! Essentially, they've lost sales (to my) for several of several copies of their POD books because of how amazingly bad the 4e book is! 
     
    I'd think, in all good conscience, they'd have to pull that POD and rework it because as it stands now, it's horrible. It looks like something I would have done with my first MS Paint program back in 1993 on my first homemade computer! Amateurish reprints of old titles have their place I guess, but not when they look so horrible that a nostalgic collector can't even enjoy the cover, let alone read the text inside. Really, PDFs are how we can "collect" titles these days. POD from a PDF shouldn't be that complicated, but somehow they've found a way to screw it up. Computers are much more sophisticated these days, guys, and the tools they offer for producing good books are widely available to people. Expectations are much higher these days, as they should be. As with many other things, DOJ needs to wake up to the 21st Century with their business model. 
     
    *Ok, quarantine-induced rant over*
     
    Thanks @Duke Bushido!
     
  9. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Reviews   
    If this helps you, thank LL.  He reminded me I still like you people, even when I need to get the hell away from you for a while.  Review of two products; the first one bleeds into the next two. 
     
     
    Hope it helps
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
  10. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Champions: The Super Role Playing Game (4th edition)   
    Don't get super excited yet. 
     
    I think the POD company may have the wrong PDF:
     
     
     
     
  11. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Shapeshift, Transform, and You   
    Sorry I have been out of this for a bit.  Let me preface with this:
     
    I'm still not really up to this (things have been really, _really_ rough at work: we're running a skeleton crew because of the shelter-thing, and we had a major setback, and it's going to take nothing shy of herculean effort to get back on track, and dammit, I'm _old_.  Crap like that-- I don't spring back like I used to.
     
    That being said, even though I'd rather just collapse in the bed, I feel kind of guilty for dropping out.  So I'll try to at least get a show of participation in. 
     
    Moving on--
     
     
     
     
    Thanks, but I don't think anyone other than Doc (and perhaps Hugh) is picking up on the fact that I am not saying "this is how you do shape shift."  I am saying "shape shift is a special effect.  You want it to be the special effect of multiform?  Go for it.  I think it usually _is_ the SFX of multiform, honestly, which makes me wonder why both exist anyway.  However, they both first appeared in Champions III at the same time, and have.....  waffled?  in and out ever since.  For what it's worth, I find Multiform to be unnecessary, but that's not the point of this discussion.
     
     
     
     
     
    Except when it is.  I have been sticking with Changeling-like examples because 1) the last time there was a "shape shift war," that style of character was the primary point of reference and 2) he is the best possible example of a shapeshifter who changes rapid-fire, but _not_ because he he's wanting stealth or to hide, but because he wants Flight, Speed, Strength, -- whatever-- that is to say, he is the cleanest example of "the form is secondary to the goal."  His shapeshifting is straight-up special effects: new goal?  New shape to use a shape-related ability to achieve that goal.
     
    Multiform is a mechanic.  You chose the SFX.  I am willing to bet almost everyone chooses a whole new shape as the SFX.  I could be wrong; I really doubt it.
     
     
     
    Again: you're assuming things that aren't there.  If you want to be a complete unknown, you have to buy a power to go with it: I'd recommend Disguise as a good start.  It doesn't cost nothing, so I assume we're good.
     
     
    I can, and I do, and I let my players do it, too.  The Fun Police haven't found our secret hideout yet.  
     
     
     
     
    I think I've mentioned this already, but Power Pool does that very thing.  No one bats an eye.  The vast majority of Long-edition write-ups for establish powerful comic book characters feature a massive one-- a couple of "signature builds," and a great big dump of 'whatever the heck I feel like" points.  Maybe it's STR; maybe it's FTL.  Whatever.  Again, no one bats an eye.
     
     
     
     
    If you don't have way to conceal your identity, you still don't have a way to conceal your identity.  I don't understand why this is so difficult to get a handle on.  Seriously-- I and others have corrected this notion, but it keeps coming up.
     
    Like here:
     
     
    If you want it, buy it. Otherwise be like Changeling and be recognized instantly, all the time.
     
    "Skills as Powers" has _always_ been a valid concept.  I recall a discussion on a much older board-- was it Red October?  Was it Sysabend?  I don't remember-- as to what the "threshold" was for a Skill to be unquestionably a Power.  I think one of the Long editions codifies it.  Me?  I put it straight down to SFX: if you're going it with accessories and tools, it's probably a Skill.  If you're doing it like Mystique, it's a power.   Done.
     
     
     
    Thank you.  The other side of the coin, of course, if they didn't pay points for it, they don't have it.  GM may rule on individual issues as they come up.
     
     
    Preach, Brother!  Preach!  
     
     
     
     
    This has a cost!  It's a special effect.  You really have to buy a power upon which to place the special effect.  Those things cost points.  I can't figure out who to type this with the concern that I actually feel; it comes off with a tone of jackassery that I do _not_ intend, but I have to ask:  why is this hard to understand?  At absolutely _no_ point have I suggested getting this _for free_, and at _no point_ have I suggested getting solid in-game utility that you did not pay for.  Why do you keep reading both of those things into this?   It's a sincere question:  how can I, or anyone else, explain this so that you get a solid grasp on what I'm saying?
     
     
     
    And now you're reading stuff into _me_ (I think; complete apologies if I'm wrong) that I haven't even _hinted_ at saying.
     
     
     
    I agree with everything except "powerful."  Unless you mean the cost.  The cost is powerful; yes.
     
     
     
    My friend, costs alone aren't going to balance combat characters against other combat characters.  That's a fantasy I wish everyone would get off their radar.
     
     
     
    I have already confessed to being exceedingly tired, to the point of exhaustion, to the point that my eyes feel like they're cracking and sandy.  I am going to believe that this level of exhaustion is why I absolutely understood none of that except that, I think, you are saying someone will feel bad because he spent a lot of points on Shapeshift and someone else let him take it as a special effect.  If I mis-read that, ignore the following.  If I got it right enough, continue:
     
    Dude, that's the GM's fault.  He either excepts that Shapeshift as its own power is valid, or he does not.  He either excepts it is the Light on the Path of the One True Way, or he doesn't.  If he lets one guy drop thirty points on it and give the same ability to another guy for nothing, that ain't got _crap_ to do with me, you, or any one player.  That's just bad GM skills, and no amount of discussing Shapeshift:  Is it a necessary thing? is going to fix that.
     
     
     
    I'll keep that in mind if I ever play TFT.  Though honestly, I would expect a different game to be different, so I'm not surprised.  Also: it's a different game. It's probably different.
     
     
     
    I am going to give up shortly.  Don't mis-read that.  I am not going to change my mind (too many decades of play testing have demonstrated that this works.  I don't care if there are forty more editions before I die, and I'm the only dumb bastard doing it this way:  I _am_ going to still be doing it this way so long as anyone tries to convince me to pay for a special effect.  I am going to give up on helping you to understand why I feel this works.  I am going to try I slightly different angle before I do, though:
     
    I think this works.
    I will _always_ think this works.
    You will never convince me that this does not work.
     
     
    I want you to keep those three things in mind when you read these next two:
     
    I _don't care_ if you think it doesn't work.
    I _don't care_ if you use it or not.
     
    Now the last one.  As before, please keep all the preceding in mind as you read this:
     
    I only want you to understand why this is my position.
     
     
     
     
    I understand why your position is what it is.  I am only asking for you to make the same effort to understand mine.  Seriously:  I am not going to just show up at wherever-it-is-you-play-your-game with a cooler of Cokes and a bag of chips and a thermos of coffee and start yelling "you're enjoying it wrong!"  If you think piling an enormous point suck onto your shape-shifters is important, you go right ahead: it doesn't bother or even involve me in the least.  I promise: it doesn't.  You do you, and you enjoy it.  Seriously: I hope you and yours have as much fun as me and mine.
     
    And now I have given up.
     
     
    To me?  Disguise: 20- or better.  Sometimes 24-; depends on the points levels of the game.
     
     
     
    You know the best part of a game that doesn't do absolutes?
     
    It doesn't do absolutes!      
     
    Seriously: just by the mechanics of disguise, you can buy it high enough to offset some absolutely ridiculous penalties.  Would I allow it in a fantasy game?  Oh, who knows?  In a supers game?  I already do.   If Armor = Luck; if DEF = missed me, then a disguise roll so high that you don't have your  blown even after modifiers for your fat ankles = you don't have fat ankles.  Granted: that's the supers / magic version, anyway.  Skills-as-Powers is still real: give it a Supers / magic SFX, like "my cankles vanished!"
     
    Now I can't (and won't) stop you from putting absolutes on it.  But nothing in the rules say that you cannot have Disguise: 42-.
     
     
     
    As does Skill-as-power: Disguise.
     
     
     
    How about his Growth?  or his Growth and a touch of DI?  Certainly I can agree to not just walking around while saying "I'm flexing so I can keep looking like an elephant."
     
     
     
    There you go: the point of shape shift is not shifting shape, is it? 
     
    For what it's worth, though: I made three characters once with a shared origin, and they all had invisibility.
     
    Ultraviolent (yes; the "N" is intentional) was straight-up not see-able, and stuck that way.
     
    Fade couldn't be remembered or described.
     
    Camo was never noticed until he called attention to himself, at which point he was perfectly visible until the observer looked away.
     
    I have mentioned two of them (Ultraviolent and Fade) before.
     
    Now at various tables, these are well-recieved villains.  They were far less-well received on the boards, with numerous people telling me that I _had_ to give some sort of Mind Control to Fade to "force people to forget him."   I called bullsnuckles and got shouted down for it.  The fact of the matter, though, is that the end result I wanted was exactly what Invisibility does:  what did he look like?  I don't know.   Where did he go?  I don't know.  How long had he been here?  I don't know.  Is he here right now?  I don't know.
     
    I don't care how you slice it, that's frelling Invisibility, period.  _Can_ you do it with Mind Control?  Yeah; sure.   Why didn't I use Mind Control?  Because he didn't have mental powers: he had invisibility. 
     
    So..  Shape shift as inviso?  I'm totally down for it.  Shifting shapes would just be the -- dare I say it?!  Special Effect.  (yeah; we both knew I dared ).  
     
     
     
     
     
    Horribly nightmares to the time my wife decided she wanted to tame my beard...
     
    And the bare face I had to endure the two weeks it took to get my beard back!
     
     
     
     
     
    Since 6e has defaulted Transform to cumulative and has placed no upper limit on the amount of "damage" you can do with it, one die of Severe Transform: Self Only (-0, possibly better than that, depending on the game), is fifteen points.  Want to go all out, give it improved results something-or-other for +1; 30 pts.  
     
    Done.
     
     
     
     
    Not at all, because those same rules, right after saying the thing that keeps getting thrown at me:  "But a PER Roll doesn't work anymore!," is gives three examples of how a shape shift would be detected, with a SENSE, which, unless 6e isn't even HERO anymore, has a mechanic that includes a PER Roll.  
     
    So the official rules are "undetectable by PER unless detected by PER."
     
    Yeah....   I'm good, Dude.  Don't care for any more of that; thanks.
     
     
     
     
    I am _fine_ with T-form; really I am.  I am fine with Multiform.  Really, I am.  And frankly, I am _fine_ with the SFX of invisibility being "I became a credenza."
     
    My entire point is that Shapeshift, which gets wiggy-er with each re-issuing, is ...  redundant?  Superflous?  A special effect applicable to several possible constructs except that unimaginative people decided you should pay for this one particular special effect because they couldn't find some other way to do it (in spite of it coming into being _RIGHT NEXT TO MULTIFORM?!!!?!).
     
     
     
     
    Eh.  Now that T-form seems to default to cumulative, you can do it with a single die if you're not in a hurry.  Characters can (unless they have disadvantages to the contrary) voluntarily lower their defenses; that helps a bit.  And if you just want to _look_ like something without actually _being_ something, you can go with whatever-it-is-they-are-calling-intro-to-T-form now.  Is it still "Cosmetic?"  I don't remember.  Anyway, a single 3-point die of that will do the job just to look like "a certain thing."  If you want to look like "pretty much any ol' thing," "Improved Results" doubles that to a six-point die.
     
    Seriously:  _three points_ will get you the result you want, and we're on four pages of why I'm wrong for letting someone turn into a gorilla for the one Phase he's going to use his 30 STR to rip the doors off of the hostage's cage....
     
    Screwy, ain't it?
     
     
     
     
    I almost made it without a single tangent, but I would like to say that I actually _liked_ that idea.  From a Physics perspective, it made perfect sense:  the heavier something is, the more energy it takes to lift it, to move it.  HERO does (off and on) a similar thing with leaping though:  Deduct the amount of STR it takes to lift _you_, then figure out how much STR is left, and use that STR to determine your leap distance.  Similar thing with throwing heavy objects.  Never really got why they didn't do something similar with Flight (or Swimming, but that could get cruel in a hurry!   )  
     
     
     
     
    Currently, T-form is cumulative again, so if you're patient enough, I'd suspect it's really just GM discretion as to whether or not he will let you hit campaign caps with it or not.  I think the built-in limiter of T-form self is cost versus how fast you want to change and how powerful you want to be when you are changed.  Yeah:  you could do something similar with some Aid builds, too, but then you've still got those folks hung up on the "shape shift isn't a special effect!  Sometimes you just need to have a different shape for no reason involving any other power or ability" shooting that down.
     
    Or multiform, but you have to buy each shape individually.  Though the ability to turn into a seagull or a bagel probably doesn't cost that much, to be fair.
     
     
     
     
    "Better" is subjective: some people don't want to be limited to the forms they can buy one at a time  (though has there been an official ruling that you can't put Multipower into a power pool?  because that would be awesome.
     
    (yes; I know.  Thank you, though  )
     
    Interestingly enough, when you read through all the stuff in 6e about shape shift, you run across mentions of Growth, Multiform, and other powers that allow you to change your shape....
     
    Seriously:  In just those words:  other powers that allow you to change your shape.
     
    So....    Shape shift is...  the special effect of those powers, but not a special effect?
     
    Or just superfluous?  Is it the HERO System's supernumerary nipple?!  I think so, but hey-- that's just me.
     
     
     
     
     
    Thank you, but no; there is a specific example, right after saying you can't be not-fooled by shape shift using a PER roll about using touch to feel skin, or cloth, etc-- anyway, right after saying "PER-proof," it launches into how your other senses might tip you off-- other senses which are subject to PER rolls.
     
    So you tell me:  does it say I can't use my senses to determine if this is a shapeshifter, or can I?  The book is very clear that both are correct.
     
     
     
    Yeah.
     
    That would be-- what's the word I want?-- using PER to determine something's not right here.
     
    I haven't misunderstood what's written.  Dude, I have studied this at length:  I didn't like it when it showed up in the 80s, and with every new edition, the first thing I do is look to see if it's gotten any better.  (except for two very slight tweaks from 5 to 6, it's managed to get more cumbersome with every reiteration.
     
    I think, personally, is that a lot of people are, what we call in the South, "putting words in my mouth."
     
    We are on four pages (and thirty years) of my arguments against the validity of Shape Shift, and _at no point_ have I suggested that you can use Sight PER against "looks like x" or scent PER against "smells like X" or any of that nature.   
     
    I have said "you can make a PER roll--- "
     
    Which _is_ supported by the book---
     
     
     
     
    _Especially_ in the part he added emphasis to-----
     
    is one-hundred percent correct.  People have put a lot of effort into deciding I said something I didn't, and I think we'd all be better-served if it stopped at some point.
     
     
    6e1 267:
     
    Becoming large in small spaces
    Sometimes characters using Growth, or who use Multiform or other powers to change shape into a larger form, have to use their powers in areas that are too
    small to hold their new, larger, self. In this case, roll the character’s Normal Damage from STR. The walls/sides
    of the enclosing area take the full damage rolled on all the dice. The character takes half damage if the walls break. If the damage doesn’t break through the enclosure, the character’s increase in size stops at the limits of the enclosure and he takes the full damage rolled on all dice (not just the growth momentum damage).
     
     
     
    Not only does 6e assume there are other ways to change shape, it assumes growth momentum.
     
    Seriously, I know it's hard to write a thousand-page book, and it has broken the HERO tradition of a typo-per-page, but it has traded that for a considerable amount of self-conflict.
     
     
     
     
     
    Thank you, Doc, for both that, and for being the better-than-good sport you so typically tend to be.   You, LL, and Hugh are all pretty good about this, actually.  A round of back pats for all!  (After the corona thing is over, I mean   )
     
     
     
     
    I agree.  Like any other special effect:  you have to have a power to pin it to.
     
     
     
    The only real issues I see coming up are "because this SFX, then this power," which is exactly backwards, HERO-wise.  Yes; the power must be appropriate to the circumstance just as much as the SFX must be appropriate to the power.
     
     
     
    I don't think it's a special case, either.  I think it's redundant an unnecessary.
     
     
     
    I'm putting this down to grogginess: I can't make heads or tails of that.  Can you rephrase that, please?  No; I'm not being funny.  I'm being fuzzy-headed.
     
     
     
    exactly.
     
     
     
    I know your pain: you've seen the made-up words I'm fond of.  
     
     
     
     
     
    Wouldn't expect anything less than your best shot, Amigo.  
     
    Join the party!  
     
     
     
    You are absolutely _right_; Combat Luck _does_ suck!  I mean, the _mechanic_ says "Defense soaked it up," but the oratory / literary / narrative / SFX are "missed me completely."
     
    Un-acceptably unrelated, and gives it the power to narratively completely un-do another player's successful hit, to boot!
     
     
     
     
     
  12. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Chris Goodwin in Reviews   
    I need to watch the third one still.  I can vouch that the first two are well worth watching.  Duke is quite the character, and his "volunteers" are even more so. 
  13. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Greywind in Champions Now, A Review   
    Holy Wall-of-Text, Batman!
  14. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Spence in Western Hero 6th edition   
    I wouldn't say removed.  I'd just tuck them in Skills and Abilities.  No flying or anything, but some of the early pulp westerns has abilities that were clearly extra-normal. 
  15. Like
    Brian Stanfield got a reaction from Michael Hopcroft in Community Content Program: Hall of Champions   
    I seem to remember reading something about Champions Now being included in the Hall. But as you say, it goes pretty much against everything Ron is concerned with in his game.
  16. Like
    Brian Stanfield got a reaction from Sketchpad in How to Build: Clear the Room   
    How about something simple like Autofire, maybe with Penalty Skill Levels to reduce the cumulative penalties to hit p to a certain extent? Just spitballing here . . . if it hits I'll fire another . . . .
  17. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Brennall in Hero System Mod for Tabletop Simulator   
    Distance and Movement in the Beta ... current work
     
     
  18. Haha
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Old Man in 2020-2021 NFL Thread   
  19. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Chris Goodwin in Help Driving HERO   
    I just remembered that I wrote something up for this a few years ago.  Automobile Combat Hero
  20. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to mallet in Help Driving HERO   
    Although it unfortunately never got released for 6th Ed, the Ultimate Vehicle for 5th edition has a lot of extra vehicle combat stuff that might be helpful to make the combat driving more interesting and would be easily adaptable to 6th ed. 
     
    But as to your question, I think since vehicle combat, driving and stunts are going to be such a major part of the game you should use Hero to create what you want to see/experience. 
     
    Maybe create some new skills like: Vehicle Stunts, Fast Driving, Fast Turns, Vehicle Jumps, Off Road, Chasing (both to follow someone and lose someone following them), Etc... And the players have to buy all these skills and they can by levels in each of them to start and as they progress. This will allow some of them to specialize in different aspects of driving and use them to their advantage. And make things different and challenging in situations. Maybe keep Combat Driving as the "control skill" (so no one can have any of the sub-skills higher then their Combat Driving skill) and they roll Combat Driving either only in situations where no other skill might apply or as a complementary skill roll to the other rolls in special situations. 
     
    And then maybe modify some of the other skills to be driving related. For example, allow the Teamwork Skill to be used in driving to coordinate special stunts (two cars towing a giant safe down a city street and working together to use it to take out the cars chasing them, or one car spinning and facing the other teammates car coming up behind them, and using their car as a ramp so the teammates car can use the "ramp car" to make a jump, or when a passenger has to jump from one car to the other) 
     
    You can make some Talents like: Damaged Driver (gives penalty skill levels when driving a damaged car), or modify Deadly Blow so that it makes the car do extra damage when ramming another vehicle. 
     
    Some powers might be: Hood Holding (Clinging, but only for staying atop a moving vehicle), Drive Thru (Tunneling but only for driving car car through a wall or building without taking damage), Slow Down (Drain vehicle movement but only by hitting the other car first), Smoke Screen (Darkness, but only by spinning the wheels of the car and burning the rubber).
     
    This is all off the top of my head, but you get the idea. There could/can be tons of great ways to build up and make a game like this really fun and cool, including adding in maneuvers and driving martial Arts like dmjalund suggests. 
     
     
  21. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Brennall in Hero System Mod for Tabletop Simulator   
    Some important things to note in relation to the above. 
     
    1. The number of triangular faces on any OBJ model for TTS should be less than 30,000. For ideal performance the lower the better whilst remaining acceptable.
     
    2. The above process will not produce a coloured model. If you wish to "paint" the model you can use this tutorial to learn how: - 
     
     
    3: Then you will need to export the texture you have created and apply it to the model you have in Tabletop simulator. 
     
    For those who seek further help I should explain I use a different painting tool called 3dcoat which is not free (around $100 for the basic version and $300 for the full product).
     
     
     
     
     
     
  22. Thanks
    Brian Stanfield reacted to bluesguy in Hero System Mod for Tabletop Simulator   
    Here are a set of instructions that I found when doing a search on the net.  I tried this with a sample character that Hero Forge lets anyone download and it seems to work.  Still need to learn how to paint the mini 😉.  As a reminder these are not my instructions.
     
     
  23. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Doc Democracy in Shapeshift, Transform, and You   
    It is an issue if a GM requires a player to purchase Shape-shift when the shifting is really just SFX.  It is another place where there is a need for conversations.  If the player is going to want to exploit this extensively in game then it is probably appropriate to insist on the shape-shift power or some other method that costs points.  If it is all about how things look and might only rarely be exploited - like using your light blast to light up a room in an emergency - then it can be zero cost as part of the main power (or powers) that do have points bought for.
     
    It adds some uncertainty to the application of the rules.  That is always something to be alert to.
  24. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Chris Goodwin in Shapeshift, Transform, and You   
    The shape of the ground has, at least.  
     
    There's a lot of shapeshifting in source material in which one or more senses are left out.  When Mystique shifts into an exact duplicate of General Whoever, no one even has a chance to figure it out, except Wolverine who always seems to be able to smell her.  Plastic Man can change his physical form, but he always has his Plastic Man costume, mask, and flesh colored bits.  To that extent, I can see how the shape change vs. particular senses aspect was derived.  
     
    The part I've tripped over, forever, is making "physical form" equal to Shape Shift vs. the Touch Group.  Meaning, if I can change my skin to feel like fur to the touch, I can also change my physical form into that of a furry worm.  
     
    I can easily see some shape shift abilities done as super-Disguise, if the shapeshifter has to "get it right".  But in most of the source material I've seen, either the shapeshifter doesn't care (i.e. Plastic Man) or can't be detected except through other senses (dopplegangers, Mystique).  
     
    And I too still want the super-power equivalent to Disguise.  (Or Disguise, Mimicry, Contortionist, if the character can change into a worm in order to escape through prison bars.)  
     
    Is it worth separating physical form changes from appearance changes?  They're combined in 6th edition Shape Shift, but weren't in 3rd edition (Champions III) and 4th edition.  
     
    Or might it be worth implementing a "fringe effect" the way Invisibility does?  Like with the living metal T1000 in Terminator 2.  If you get close enough to him, you have a chance to make a PER roll to tell that something isn't right.  No Fringe Effect would do the same thing it does for Invisibility, to give you Mystique's no-really-you-can't-tell change.  
     
    The thing is, the other super-power equivalents to Skills do have ways to overcome.  We don't have Spider-man buy Climbing 22- to represent wall-crawling; we use Clinging.  Clinging can be overcome with sufficient STR.  Stealth and Concealment can be defeated with a sufficiently well made PER Roll; Invisibility takes a different sense, really.  Maybe...
     
     
    ...this is the way to go?  
     
    However, I'm still liking Transform, Self Only.  And Duke, I do see your point about sufficiently high Disguise skill, but it still doesn't -- quite -- work for me for the above reasons.  
  25. Like
    Brian Stanfield reacted to Duke Bushido in Shapeshift, Transform, and You   
    First and foremost, I want to remind you and everyone else who might still be tagging along (we'll have to quit soon: traditionally, by page four, the threads become too philosophical and game-theory to be any actual use when discussing a particular mechanic and / SFX)  one more time that I am _not_ attempting to single you out, pick on you, shout you down, or any of that stuff right there.
     
    All I want to do is answer your questions. The other quotes are because different people used different words and examples, and maybe something they said will be more helpful to you than something I said.   
     
    I _do_ want to answer your questions, as best I am able, and as time permits, because this has been a personal crusade of mine since Shape Shift (this, and Growth Momentum, but that's not really for right here) since it showed up in Campions III.
     
     
    That being said, let's move on:
     
     
    The cost of of whatever skill or power allows you to do that, obviously.  There are Skills for it, and Skills-as-Powers has been a valid concept since day one, if not formalized until more recent iterations.
     
     
    No.  
     
    I am not talking about Mystique's _POWER_ at all.  I think that's where the difficulty lies:  HERO is extremely unique in the complete and total divorcing of SFX and mechanics.  I am saying the exact same thing the rule books (All of them, from every single edition) say:  Special Effects are _FREE_.  Period.  _That's_ what I'm saying.  
     
    As "Shape Shift," the power in 5, re5, and 6, as presented, _is nothing more than a special effect_, but this time you have to pay for it.   When has anyone turned into a refrigerator because they wanted to turn into a refrigerator?  Because their ultimate goal was _nothing_ but to be a refrigerator?
     
    Never.  There was another goal.  Was it to hide amongst the kitchen appliances?  Was it to create a large void inside themselves in which they could conceal purloined cheeses?  Was it because they wanted to cool off the barley sodas before passing them around in celebration?  It doesn't matter; I bet you dollars-to-dimes it was _never_ "just" to be a refrigerator.  If that's not the purpose of the power, if that isn't the desired mechanic, it's a special effect of something else, why do I have to pay an absolutely _gross_ amount of points to do it, and still have no better odds of success than using mechanics that have existed, unchanged, since the first edition?  I _don't_.  I don't have to do it at all, and I (personally; this is just me talking about the Shape Shift power itself, and not anyone inclined to use it, okay?)-- I find it asinine to assume that I all of a sudden I have to buy this _one_ special effect-- a fallible, foil-able special effect, no less-- to do something I've already been doing for thirty years-- more importantly-- buying a special effect, which the rules have never failed to stipulate are free.
     
    But getting back to your Mystique question (which I missed completely the first time through, and I'd like to take a moment to thank Scott, who picked up on it and quoted it, as that's where I saw it.
     
    The mystique question was already addressed, way back on page 1 (I think it was 1; might have been 2).  Shapeshift is _extremely_ inappropriate for Mystique, as she doesn't really change shape.  She might change size a bit; I don't know.  But she is always people-oid in shape.   That's Disguise; that's what it does.  Can she do the voices in the source material, or do I just think that because they use a whole different actor in the movies?  If she can do the voices-- Mimicry.
     
    Done.
     
    Why are these not effective?  They have no more and no less chance of failure than Shape Shift, as written, and even fail on the _exact same mechanic_: it's all about perception: roll a 3 and boom-- six-foot-two white guy, right there.  Or six foot blue woman, if she's pretending to be a 6'2 white guy; I don't know.
     
    I'm not the only one thinking this:
     
     
     
     
     
    In fact, I think you addressed that question above to me, since I started this snowstorm, but you weren't the first person to ask that question:
     
     
     
     
    Here's GB(i) making the exact same Shapeshift / Disguise correlation in the other direction:
     
     
     
     
    No matter which side of this we are on, no one seems to be able to deny that these two are effectively the same thing.  What makes them the same?
     
    Well, one of them lets you disguise yourself as something else.  The other lets you disguise yourself as something else.
     
    No; seriously: _read_ the shape shift description: you are paying a _crap ton_ of points to buy Disguise, over and over and over, versus each sense group, then special senses, etc, etc, etc-- but at _no point_ do you _actually_ "become thing thing."   You look / feel / sound / smell / taste like the thing, but you will never _be_ the thing.  How can you get found out?  Why, using the same foils that Disguise has.
     
    Fascinating.
     
    I would like to point out that in the past when I mentioned that, by the rules of Shapeshift, you never actually _shift shape_, you just fool the senses of any perceiver in the area (like Disguise   ), I have quite often been told "well once you buy all that, you can just assume that you have _become_ the thing, since that is the special effect of this power.
     
    Wait a minute?  If I buy a power that specifically states I don't become the thing, I can just assume that my SFX is becoming the thing?  Well why can I _not_ do that with some other power?  SFX are free, right?  The mechanics, per the rules, do _not_ lock me into a particular SFX, right?  (except Shape Shift, which violates the Hell out of that, mostly because it's not a power: it's a special effect that you are paying for, but have to actually apply the special effect on top of the build to make it work right in the first place....    oouuuhh....  wait a minute... I'm getting dizzy......)
     
     
    The best thing I can point to is this:
     
    https://drive.google.com/open?id=17vsVRhoXu4voqIj32aZCyuRIi7dw2ttm
     
     
    If I grabbed the correct one (I _am_ still dizzy, so pardon my if I've messed up), that is Changeling, a shape shifter from Teen Titans.  He was written up in Different Worlds #30, in 1983.  That's the year after the Champions second edition was released (in a lovely box, with dice, maps, and an adventure!     ).  That write up was done by Steve Peterson. Actually, he wrote up all of them (at least the 1983 version) for that magazine.  I don't know if you follow any of the history of the game (Lord Liaden once said I was a frustrated librarian.  If he was wrong, it wasn't by much  ) , but if case you don't, Steve Peterson is the man who wrote the game.  Seriously:  He wrote Champions.  (He and George MacDonald, actually, but I couldn't tell you who was responsible for what.  Scott might be able to; I don't know).  He created the Hero Game System (That's what it was called in the 2e era).  He wrote three editions in total, _none of which_ included Shape Shift.  For what it's worth, 4e was little more than collecting all the 3e stuff and beating it with a large stone until it all worked together, so in effect, he wrote the bulk of that, too.  And still no Shape Shift.
     
    Why not?  Seems like an odd omission.  There are lots (I assume, based on the existence of this power in the Long editions) of shape shifters in the comic books.
     
    Well being as how he wrote up at least one (There may be others published; there may be who-knows-how-many unpublished at his own table) without it, I'm going to go out on a limb and guess he didn't really think it was necessary.  When you look at the Changeling write-up, he pretty clearly thought Shape Shift was a special effect.
     
    I do, too.
     
    Funny aside:  I didn't know that write-up existed until about two months ago, when I finally got my hands on a copy of that magazine.  I won't say I felt vindicated, but I _did_ feel like I was in some pretty good company.     Glenn Thain (one of Peterson's players and play testers, by all accounts, wrote up the X-Men and Magneto (Magent-o!  Gad, that costume was hideous!), but apparently Mystique wasn't an X-Man then or something, because she's not one the ones listed.     I can't get you any "official" confirmation on Mystique's "Super Disguise," but the concept holds up to reason.
     
     
     
    I think Doc gave a nice, succinct explanation of when it's an SFX for Disguise and when it's an SFX for something else:
     
    (yes; I quote Doc a lot, even when we don't agree, because he is an astoundingly good sport about such things   )  
     
     
     
     
    This, though:
     
     
     
    If this is really the case for you, then Shape Shift isn't right for you any more than Disguise or anything else, because this is exactly who Shape Shift works, as presented.  Seriously:  It's fifty points worth of Disguise, with way less modifiers than you can get for actually just throwing fifty points into Disguise.
     
     
     
    I'd like to say "I don't know where you're getting this."
     
    I can't, though, because I _suspect_ it's from reading more into this than is applicable.  Remember:  In HERO, SFX and _mechanics_-- i.e., abilities-- are completely separate.  You will make a lousy fly if you're using that as your SFX for -- I don't know: Clinging:  "Hey, Boss!  That there fly just landed onda winder and broke it!  What gives?"  "Why ain't dat fly makin' no buzzin' sounds?  And, as Hugh points out, "Hey; ain't dere a hero what can become a fly?"
     
    If you didn't by _all_ the appropriate things, you've only increased your chances of getting discovered.  If you didn't by Disguise and perhaps Mimicry, if you intend to make sounds, then your chances aren't very good to begin with.  Can someone suddenly "just realize" that there's a hero who can turn into a fly?
     
    Good God, Man!  We are postulating people who shoot lasers from their eyes and throw battle ships at one another.  It's a _comic book_.  Of _course_ they can just realize it; that would be just one possible special effect of you blowing your disguise roll-- or not having disguise at all.
     
    Let's look at it another way:
     
    I remember a silver-clad Captain Marvel in the old TSR Marvel Superheroes game.  She could fly by turning into a beam of light.
     
    Do you have a problem with that?  No sarcasm; no antagonism.  Do you take issue with this idea?  There are characters who turn into actual meteors and columns of fire-- not just _ride_ them, but _become_ them-- just to fly.  There are characters who don't have wings who suddenly just sprout them when they leap into the air.  Do you have a problem with those?  All of those things _are_ shape shifting.  They are also _just special effects_.
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
    Not even close, and not exactly.
     
    If you don't have an appropriate way to deceive them, then they will just somehow know that you are not a fly.  They may or may not know that you are shapeshifting ninja (that's up to the GM and the way the story is going at that moment, of course), but you not be able to fool them that you are fly if you don't buy a mechanic that will fool them.
     
    Look at this another way:  I buy shape shift!  Now I can turn into a fly (if I make the logical leap that I have bought enough points to ignore the fact that I actually don't turn into a fly, but have to actually just "declare it as so," which I can't accept for any other reason).
     
    I look like a fly!
    I feel like a fly!
    I smell, sound, and taste like a fly!
     
    But I can't fly.
    I can't cling.
    I don't have 360 vision.
    I _will_ live more than two days, and that's a definite plus, so I'm not going to complain there.
     
    I _just_ look like a fly.
     
    How is that better?
     
    Second best part?  It cost me half my build points to pull this off.
     
    Best part?  If they make their PER roll, I'm not a fly anymore.  I'm a 6'2 white guy.
     
     
    That's going to be problematic, because "only in appropriate form" is a valid limitation.  Only in HERO ID; Only in Armored Form; Only as Mr. Hyde, etc, etc.  I don't know how to help you get things to click on that one, but it's a valid limitation.  It's worth -14 to -1/2, depending on what the GM determines to be the relevance to the campaign and the frequency with which you will truly be limited.
     
    And why would your STR be cheaper because you were a fly?  A fly is _totally_  _not_ an "appropriate form" to be particularly strong.  Granted, "Hey, Boss!  Dat fly just opened the door and left" would not only be a dead give-way, but hilarious as a departure.     
     
    Look at the Changeling write-up:  fairly basic stats (for the time; DEX's were almost always inflated in the older editions), then lots of "Plus this" and "plus that."  _Those_ are a bit cheaper (-1/4) and they have the "only in appropriate form" limitation.  (See Doc's "turn into an elephant" examples, above)
     
     
     
    There is.  It's Disguise.  The thing you have to pay for ten-times over before you can call it Shape Shift.
     
    For what it's worth, this was the comment that lead me to believe that you're sticking point is your own assumptions that changing shape automatically brings other things with it.  It doesn't.  Separation of SFX and Mechanics.  Guy A has fire-based powers.  He has Flight and a fire tornado attack.  Guy 1 Has fire-based powers: he has fireballs and a fire-shield force wall.  (Barrier, if you're a 6e guy).
     
    Neither of them got _anything_ automatically because they had fire powers.  They don't even have the same powers.  If you don't assume that "fire powers" means you have certain things, why would you assume "looks like a fly" means you have certain things?
     
    Going a bit further:  let's say they're both cyborgs.  What powers do they automatically have?
     
    Excellent!  None!  That's absolutely correct.  They don't have anything they didn't buy.  Just because we have always pictured all cyborgs as having two mechanical legs and one mechanical arm and one mechanical eye and usually a chunk of metal somewhere on their head doesn't mean that we are remotely correct  (Why the hell do we do that, anyway?  Steve Austin, maybe?  Jared Synn?  Yeah, probably Jared Synn.....).  Hell, one of those guys might have tank treads and no legs!  Or cannons where _both_ arms used to be!  Who knows?  All we can say for sure is if he didn't buy it, he doesn't have it.
     
    Changeling doesn't have Disguise.  Everything he turns into is bright green (thanks, whoever clued me in to that!  ).   Hey Boss!  Dat fly is bright green!  I bet it's dat hero, Changeling!
     
    See how that happens?  He didn't buy it; he can't expect to get it.
     
     
     
     
     
    Sure.  One could equally logically infer that because it's not mandatory, identity isn't special.
     
     
    Why not?
     
    No; seriously.  I'm not baiting or taunting: as I said way up at the top, I want to answer your questions as best I am able, as time permits (which I am running out of now, and have gotten no writing done, so I will have to wrap this up shortly.
     
    I genuinely would appreciate an earnest attempt to be the first person to make me understand why this isn't valid.  No: I am _really_ not kidding.  What you look like has always been free; your special effects have always been free.  No one thinks about a teleport that turns you into a bolt of lighting-- completely into a living bolt of lighting-- or a Flight that turns you into a ball of pure fire.  No one (except me) complains about a Summon that lets your feet hop several miles away and your hands carry things to the ends of the earth without the benefit of your eyes showing them what's going on.
     
    All that said, I heartily encourage you to explain to me what it is I am missing in the grand scheme of things, and why I cannot declare that my special effect for flight is turning into a bird?
     
     
     
     
    In which case?  That is valid both with the Shape Shift *ahem* Power that is in the Long Editions and it is the case with the way I have been doing for decades now.  I haven't had any trouble with it.  That doesn't mean I _won't_, of course, but I haven't yet-- at least, not any that aren't exactly as likely to pop up with Shape Shift if you _also_ stick to the letter of the rules and note that "the rules don't actually let you shift shape."  If you can bend that rule, why can't you bend the other, particularly when the desired results are _identical_?
     
     
     
    I'm just going to leave this right here:
     
    https://drive.google.com/open?id=17vsVRhoXu4voqIj32aZCyuRIi7dw2ttm
     
    Yes; you've already seen it.  But it seems to imply that I very much can, since Shape Shift is just special effects.  Would it feel more proper to let me take "appropriate form" and then charge me "variable special effects" because I can do a multitude of forms?  I mean, it doesn't to me, because then it's actually _cheaper_ to just buy everything straight and declare my special effect is that I turn into a bolt of lightning when I do anything.
     
     
     
    Cool.  Someone else who doesn't like Power Pools.  Sweet!
     
    Oh, no; wait.  You said something about changing your character.  You don't have to do that with a Power Pool.  Just declare you want it.  Hell, it's actually _cheaper_ that way, as you don't have to buy the individual bits you want to use-- you can do _anything_.....!  And the only concept you need is "I bought this Power Pool....."
     
     
     
     
     
    No; you're reading things into again: you are assuming a flawless disguise _on top of_ the special effects for a particular power.  I'm not sure why-- sincerely; I'm really not sure why-- you can't seem to get away from doing that, but you're reasoning from _special_ effect as opposed to _game_ effect.  It doesn't hold up, and it's not how the system is designed to work.  If you want a _game_ effect, you buy a mechanic, then you can pick any special effect for that mechanic that you want.  Those are the rules, and have been for six-and-a-half editions.  And the Complete book.
     
     
     
     
    uhmmm... 
     
    yeah.  That's pretty much what I've been trying to get across for three pages now.  To be fair, that's a bit more extreme than I go  ( I assign penalties, etc, but I like to keep the game moving, so I'm a bit more on-the-fly, if you'll pardon the expression, and just sort of do a "summation modifier" of "everything wrong with this picture" and call it good).  I have had a shapeshifter be just as easy to hit as a hummingbird as he was as a human because he didn't buy Shrinking.  I've also had that same player decide he wanted to simply be a "man-sized hummingbird" so that he could use his STR to carry a wounded a bystander to a hospital.  I allowed it, once, and told him not to make a habit of it-- again, GM call as appropriate to the situation, but clearly _not_ a hummingbird in either case:  Hey, Boss!  Howcum dis hummin' boid is so much easier ta hit den dat udder one?  It's like he don' know how ta be a hummin' boid!  
     
     
     
     
    Why?  Isn't that just the mechanic for having a STR30?  Nothing creative about that.  Or does he have a special effect for using his STR?  Most people don't think of that, but the rules allow it.
     
    Say that when he uses his full STR, he is surrounded by an aura of flame!  What to get creative?  Perhaps he knows there's an invisible opponent in the barn, and makes a full-STR strike against a dry hay bale.  The GM rules "this is creative enough that I will allow it this one time (ala 'man-sized hummingbird')."  The hay bale begins to smolder, and his speedster companion grabs the bale and races around the barn, filling it with smoke, and suddenly the invisible assailant begins to cough and reveals his position!
     
    Now _that_ would be a creative use of his STR.  However, I'm betting he wasn't creative enough to assign a special effect to is STR beyond "Barney hit bad guy!"  Am I right?
     
     
     
     
    Yeah.  
     
    Nobody here is suggesting that, either.
     
    At least, not as far as I now.  That's all on you, reading way more into the SFX than is in the mechanics they are attached to.  HERO works the other way around.  
     
     
     
    I've gotta run.  I shot my "me time" doing this.  You should feel flattered!  I haven't done anything of this length since the last time I was bantering with Hugh to test my commitment to an idea or two.  
     
     
     
×
×
  • Create New...