greysword

Ok, I'll come clean. I was just using that as a simple example. My real motivation was designing the lasers for an X-Wing starfighter or TIE Interceptor. I built it as a straight RKA with the "special effect" being that the lasers all fire to get the full damage. I also added Autofire to simulate the rapid blasts we see on-screen. This is the simplest way to reflect it. However, I was (over) thinking that if the power had an increased quantity (4 for X-Wing & Interceptor, 2 for a regular TIE fighter), then they might be able to do a "combined" attack (one laser does normal damage, two (from opposite wings) do two sets of damage, and combining all four lasers on a single point is just wicked). I'll keep it with the simple part, though, since which lasers fire when can just be a special effect (Luke pulls the trigger and we hear several blasts come out). Thanks for clearing this up!

Thanks Chris!

Let's say we have a character named Hot Lead, who is a gun collector. Hot Lead acquired the dueling pistols used by Alexander Hamilton and Aaron Burr, and took them on night patrol. The pistols are built as 1d6 RKA Quantity: 2. 1) Is this considered one power or two powers due to the quantity? Later that evening, Hot Lead confronts Foxbat (because, which villain would find it more exciting to be shot at by the pair of historical relics than Foxbat?) and draws the pistols (one in the left hand and one in the right). 2) When firing at one target, is this considered a Combined Attack or a Multiple Attack? Champions Complete says this about the Strike combat maneuver: 3) Because they are quantity 2, is the damage 1d6 RKA, 1d6+1d6 RKA (with damage adjudicated separately), or is this a single roll of 2d6 RKA? Thanks for your help! - Chris B.

Thanks Simon!

Awesome, thanks! So to summarize: 1) Add the Experience 2) Reduce the (starting) Points by the amount of the payoff 3) Reduce the Matching Complications by the same amount 4) Delete the Complication It's really the reduction of the (starting) Points that increases the Experience Spent. The Matching Complication reduction and the deletion of the Complication are just bookkeeping exercises. The downside; there is no log of the initial (starting) Points and their later reduction, so no one would know what the actual starting points were, unless this is kept in the Notes log.somewhere.

Current setup: After deleting the Hunted: VIPER Complication (for simplicity) You can see only the "Complication Points Used" went down. Thank you both for your help!

Thanks for the input, HeroGM. That didn't work for the 6e character. Thanks Simon. Unfortunately, that didn't change the Experience Used. Do I reduce the Experience Earned and Matching Complications? I'm using build Build 20160607. The only way to get Experience Spent to move is to reduce the Point (initial points), but keep the matching complications the same.

How do I spend character points (from experience) to payoff complications in Hero Designer? I am using a 6th edition character. Thank you! - Chris

LOL, thanks to you both! I know Steve Long said he would love to do a Shadowrun-esque type book for Hero sometime. I just thought this previous book might be a good starting point.

Hi everyone, I just noticed there was a Cyber Hero book during the 4E era? If so, is it possible to have this officially updated to 6E? I think it would sell. Can we add it to the Patreon queue? Thanks!

Well, can't hurt to ask Topps or CGL, just to find out what the license fees might be, right? of course, anything written for a Her Shadowrun could be ported to a generic version if the licensing then falls through. I can't imagine CGL is paying a ton. That said if you create a Hero cyberpunk genre book, please take quite a bit of time to flesh out the story line and lore! There are quite a few writers on the Shadowrun books that have some great ideas for the cyberpunk world. Getting their help on your setting would help immensely, as one of the best parts of the Champions game is the ongoing universe. Having a fleshed out world to plug into makes it easier for new GMs to simply sit down, craft a basic story within the established framework, take a few NPCs from the Villains books, and get to rolling the dice. Honestly, I only play Champions in the Hero system (but it's our prime game), but if there was a Shadowrun-esque setting ready to go, I think it would be an easy leap (the use of massive amounts of 6-sided dice notwithstanding ). In the immortal words of Palpatine, "Do it!" Thanks Steve!

My thoughts: 1) I would definitely support a Patreon to get new material. I like ENWorld's En5sider, but I don't play D&D. Still, I supported it for a couple of years just because. At least I'd get useful stuff here. The trick is to give the backers a free PDF version of the book being created, as well as, the frequent updates. 2) The Western and Institute books look interesting. Got me thinking of a capes in the 19th century campaign. 3) If you want to see an IP that truly needs a a solid system that is dynamic yet relatively simple to adjudicate AND has a solid following, look no further than Shadowrun! The Hero system would be excellent for this game, and the lore would make it an easy port. You should contact Topps and/or Catalyst Game Labs to see if you can form a partnership. A Hero core with CDL lore means you can both share in the tsunami of money that will rain from the sky! (hyperbolic? maybe, but you have to admit that Shadowrun gamers like crunchy rules and are begging for a ruleset that makes sense and is east to adjudicate at the table. Thanks for listening. - Chris

We'll figure it out. For the rest of the board, I've stepped back for a little while to recharge, and plan to start again this summer (post pandemic, it seems). Oh, as an ironic point, I set up a side adventure for the homeless hero character (yeah, he's a hobo with powers) that involved a disease that is sweeping through the homeless camps in the city. 😮 These are excellent points, and I think the ideas you both presented go to the original point of the thread. How can we make a Champions (Hero system) version that is inviting to new players/GMs? Especially the GMs. If a new person picks up the core rulebook, it needs to be fairly "Complete" without being 700 (or so) pages. Otherwise, it's not inviting to try. Unfortunately, we don't have the games available for someone new to play for a while before GMing. What is a Complete game?

I suggested that beforehand, and we sort of had that, especially when the group decided to move the team to Florida. The players just seem to like to *surprise* each other with their character's traits (hence the lone wolf marker). One player especially likes to even surprise me (the GM) while we play. I like session Zero's, but even then, the characters seem to deviate from the agreed format. I suggested we switch to (the aforementioned) vigilante (or antihero) team format instead of a straight laced team, but that isn't what everyone wanted. It's okay, just fits in with the conversation we're having. I can't really compete with the depth of possibilities and min/maxing available with 6E.

😲 Um.. say what? But.. but... 🥺 ...what happened with my game, then? This is basically the PCs in my campaign (on temporary hiatus as I sort things out). Both Goodwin and sinanju are in it. None of the characters play nice with each other. For instance, Chris has a goody two-shoes character that wants to join a super team, sinanju plays a former assassin with a negative reputation who would like to be good but has a lot of underworld skills. The group basically acts (and presents to the world) like a vigilante group (A-Team), but verbally, the players want to have a straight-laced super team (like the Justice League). As for me (as GM) in this... This goes back to the original impetus for this thread. As an inexperienced/relatively new GM of Champions (or anything), I find it incredibly difficult to properly police the characters before (and during) play. The players (Goodwin, sinanju, and others at the table) have read and understand 6E1 and 6E2, have played 5th edition (and likely 4th or earlier), and are Masters with the rules. I have Champions Complete. I've read it a couple of times. I still can't remember the rules for knockback (they just won't stick in my head). The rules for character creation in 6E are incredibly complicated, and honestly, I can't tell what a power is going to do just by reading it. I need to see it in action. At the table, I try to be open to whatever the players bring, and I try to craft a story that includes their complications and background. Usually, this is over a couple of side adventures to the main plot to focus on each character. For this game, I proposed the characters know each other beforehand or at least had some sort of "six degrees of separation" that could make them connect once they met. The group decided for lone wolves that would somehow come together and work together. 🙄 Also as a terrible tactician, I'm always using 1/10th the strength in the villains repertoire, because I just can't understand how the powers work and what would augment another villain's action (even with the Villain books). I'm constantly frustrated by my inability to provide (what I consider) an acceptable challenge, thus decreasing the fun the other players have. Bottom line, the current mechanics are too cumbersome and the material too dense (and has not really been supported for a long time) for an inexperienced GM to run a Champions/Hero system game. I don't own 6E1 & 6E2, and I have no time nor desire to absorb that much information. But it's the bible of this game, so my lack of willingness is a concern. We need Champions 7E to be more like 4E in size and scope. Just wanted to add, thanks for the great discussion.

Thank you. I think the player has an ulterior motive with the passport buy, but I'm not sure what he wants to get out of it. I do think wants there to be repercussions of his travels, but when I asked his player to meet with an official from the State Dept (asked both in character and out), he balked at the idea. I think he wants Russia to send someone to "get him", but I'm not sure. I plan to just let him do whatever and pretty much ignore it unless it allows an opening for an adventure. I already tossed out a hook for a side adventure due to his meanderings. Oh, and it's a shared world space (he and I GM in it), so I'm apprehensive to make definitive rulings that will cramp him campaign. Thanks again!

GOD, this is absolutely it! ... ... this aspect of Champions really makes me Depressed as a GM. This wishy-washy aspect of points spend or not REALLY is maddening!!!!!! And, it really makes me not want to GM ever again. I can't understand when something should be free or be paid for. I think I get it, but most time when I try to assert this understanding (even when GM), I'm told I'm wrong. The other players can get it, but I don't get it. And, it seems to be SUCH A BIG DEAL, that it causes arguments. This reminds me of the Wargames quote from WHOPPER. I do this with the two character's I've been able to play. I spend frivolously to have the character make sense. Also, I spend on stuff the GM says I need to have in order to do something, even if I didn't;t want to spend points on that (like Computer Programing just to surf the internet and have a VPN on my super hero laptop, which I didn't pay for, BTW. I can have the laptop for free, but not the skill to use it). Thanks everyone. Unfortunately, I'm still lost as to what is free and what should be paid for, so I'm just going to ignore the topic, just agree with whatever the players say they want, and watch my fun burn to the ground (like normal). : ) Thanks for your help.

Thanks Spence and Duke. I agree with your points. In our games, normally we hand wave the need for any documents that don't pertain specifically to the story. This includes the mundane stuff we can get as citizens of the world (DL, passports, etc). Thus, I completely agree that a player should not be compelled to spend points on these items, regardless of whether they are in civilian or hero identity. Many times, heroes will have this paperwork in their civilian identity, but not their superhero identity. However, governments tend to "make exceptions" (as was mentioned before) to their heroes (I don't think Batman actually had a DL and the Batmobile wasn't likely registered, at least until he was good with the police). That said, it sounds like if a player does spend a character point for these documents, it means they want them to be relevant, in some way. The trick is how to make them relevant. This is where I'm bad at GMing in the Champions universe. I have a difficult time discerning the magnitude of "free" or "common" items and knowledge versus the same thing that is paid for points. Thank you everyone for your input, and I hope this helps future GMs looking for an answer to the same problem. In summary (TL;DR), credentialing (like driver's licenses, passports, professional licenses, etc) should not cost any character points. However if a player decides to spend a CP on such items, it's an indication that the player wants it to be relevant in some way and give them an edge over their fellow players. Thus, it is incumbent on the GM to do something in game that allows that sacrifice in points to mean something. Thanks again! - Chris B.

Excellent points and I think the answers received make sense. The character should get all of these credentials free just for being a citizen, especially in their civilian identity. I'm sure the DMV and Federal government has procedures by now that allow a masked person to get a drivers license or passport. The question to ask is what do they get for that spent point? Maybe for a DL, the character has passed a tactical driving course and has special privileges to drive fast and run red lights when acting in the public interest. For passports, maybe the character can forgo entering a port of entry, and instead log in their travels online within 48 hours of the travel (one of our GM's [the player for the character in the example] came up with that). Maybe for a professional license, it comes with access to the law/medical library, access to judges/other attorneys/medical professionals as an 8- contact or influences skill rolls, or access to certain databases. Does this sound reasonable or is this still a bit too much for 1 CP?

That's a good point, Surreal. This is mainly just background story stuff (what he does when not with the team). However, he has landed and been shot at by the Russia military. He also has taken pictures in a Russian mall/shopping center. As for the dog fight, that was over international waters, but the Greek authorities are hamming it up as US intervention on their behalf. of course, this is the player's side story he is creating, and eventually it will find it's way into the game. <sigh> the whole group are a bunch of lawless degenerates 😄 The universe is the standard Champions Universe (basically), so the world's government have had decades to come up with rules and laws governing superhuman activities. I just don't know what they are. I'm sure there would be something on the books about these events.

I understand, and this is an excellent answer! Thank you. The event that triggered this question is specific, but this could set the precedent for similar actions. P.S. The event that triggered the question is one of my players has mega-scale flight and is naive. Thus, he likes to travel to other countries and investigate "new things". He not only flies into countries to go shopping or have lunch, broadcasting live on social media, but he has recently started doing things that might upset the State Department. For instance, he flew to Greece and got involved in a pissing match that the Turkish Air Force was having with the Greek Air Force. He also flew to Russia and involved himself in help Russian citizen injured by an accidental nuclear issue/explosion. He bought 1CP in Passport, and we are debating if that would cover the character entering into any country legally without going through a port of entry, even if the nation wasn't friendly to the US. He argued that the Passport perk included the required Visas from the destination country. I thought it was simply a Passport (liek a Drivers License is just that, and an International DL cost more). Just wanted to share : )

Hi Everyone, I have a question about when a player should be made to purchase a credential as a Fringe Benefit and when it should just be a "free" item. Do you make a player purchase the Drivers License fringe benefit if they want to operate a car, or is a drivers license a free item? How do you differentiate the situations that govern the two costs (free vs CP)? For international travel, do you make the character purchase the Passport fringe benefit if they want to fly to Europe from the US? How about China? If purchased with Character Points, does the Passport benefit include the Visa requirement, as well as having a passport? If a super flies to Rio De Janeiro via commercial airline in their civilian ID, would they get a free passport, but if they flew into the city using Flight or Teleport, would they need to buy the Passport perk? Does a character need to buy a Professional License (doctor, lawyer, stock broker, PI, etc) using character points if they have the Professional Skill(s) and a history in their background? If they do purchase the license but not any professional or knowledge skills, does this allow them to make skill rolls in that profession? If not, how could they pass the bar/medical board if they didn't have the skill/knowledge? In short, what does a character get when they spend 1 CP for a drivers license, passport, or license to practice a profession? When do you give a credential fringe benefit for "free" (everyman) opposed to requiring the player to spend a CP? Thanks for your help!

Clearly, it would be a mistake. I mean, the heiress to the name of a superhero family dating back generations couldn't possibly do anything that would put law enforcement in a position to question her... I mean, their integrity, right? 😋 It was a hypothetical question that might be useful in such a supplement for some GMs, I think. 😁

For the intrepid game designers in the community, I wanted to make a request for a Hall of Champions submission. One thing that helps me as a less experienced GM is the ability to use pre-generated NPCs and basic environmental settings. It's nice to be able to grab a few villains from the book, but also be able to grab a few normal NPCs that can be weaved into a story on the fly. To that end, I was hope to suggest a submission for the Hall of Champions store. Law Enforcement: The Sourcebook I would love to have a book that delves into Law Enforcement and how to insert it into an encounter, adventure, or campaign. Whether it is Champions, Dark Champions, Fantasy Hero, or Star Hero, every setting has a local constable, police force, or elite royal guard. Thus, the book would contain information on the makeup of local law enforcement, their general operating procedures, how they enforce the laws of the land, and how they might interact with a group of sanctioned heroes, rogue vigilantes, anti-heroes, and normal citizens. How do the police handle living in a land where superheroes have been around for decades or caped heroes are new to the world? How does the veteran beat cop feel about meddling heroes? How about the rookie? The precinct captain might have some words, good or bad. And how about the Commissioner? In the stars, how would a lone space ranger handle a group of vigilantes? What about Sector Command? What do local law enforcement do when they apprehend a super powered villain? How about when the heroes are arrested? The book might also have a few generic officer templates to use in a pinch. The buddy cops who always seem to be partners. The patrol sergeant who is first on the scene to take command. The detective who keeps asking the heroes questions after an encounter. The rookie fresh out of the academy. Maybe even a cop with special abilities, themselves. Lastly, a basic map of a police station, County jail, bank, and other places we might find cops or robbers would be helpful. I don't know if it's improper to make these sort of suggestions, but I wanted to throw one out that would benefit not only my game, but those of other GMs. Thank you for listening! - Chris

Hi Steve, I am in a discussion with my GM regarding my character's ability to do something even if a skill has not yet been purchased for that task. Here is the question, before I get to the examples: Is there something in the rules (that I missed, as I use Champions Complete and not the 6E1 or 6E2) which forbade actions by a character using their raw stats if an actual skill is listed in the book? With that question in play, my point to him is this: His stance is this: Basically the ruling is that if the activity that wants to occur is covered by one of the skills listed in the book and my character does not have that skill, they are too ignorant to do it. Period. The GM says this is because the rules say as much. For context, the above quotes were from a discussion I had with the GM about VPN. My character was at home and wanted to send an email to a blog in her hero identity. I could see the "evil GM" smile coming forth, as IP addresses are traceable, and I didn't think about that immediately, so I add that she uses a VPN. He then asked if she had any computer skills. I replied that she did not. he said then she doesn't know about VPNs. I responded with the fact that she was a PhD student in Physics, a teaching assistant, and it is likely the school uses VPN when instructors work from home, which then led into he intelligence quote above as another reason she might know and/or figure it out. This, of course, led to the second quote. Another example that rehashed the topic recently. Another character set up a corporation for the team. As the operations officer of the company, my character then informed the GM that she will ask for the Articles of Incorporation, and if the other PC didn't provide them, she would go to the County records Office and get a copy. The GM said that if the character didn't have the Bureaucratics skill, then the task would be impossible (my character wouldn't know to do it nor would she even know where to start). Is there something in the rules (that I missed, as I use Champions Complete and not the 6E1 or 6E2) which forbade actions by a character using their raw stats if an actual skill is listed in the book? Personally, I think someone with a mid-level INT score who is interested in doing something they know nothing about would be able to access the internet, but then again, that's being foolish and extrapolating my intelligence on the rest of humanity. Thanks for your help! - Chris