iamlibertarian

I like the concept, but still run into the "no skills in a Framework" problem.

Here is how I am picturing it... Have a computer or AI in the character's head. Have a set of "slots" into which I could slip chips with skills, data, "powers" (like GPS or Detects or Skills, or yes, skill levels (like targeting or OCV/DCV) or whatever.) Let's say 4 slots. But the character can also make more "chips." Let's say he gets into an enemy's database. Can download all the data onto a "chip" for later recall. But then he senses the enemy is near, and takes that chip out and installs an general OCV/DCV chip and a pistol +Targeting chip, along with chip #4 being a Spatial Awareness chip (to go with his CyberEyes already paid for). Each chip taking a half-phase or a phase to insert. When the combat still isn't going well, takes out the +Targeting Chip and slips in the "Wired Running" chip to add speed to his escape. Once he gets to a safe place, he slips out the general OCV/DCV chip and replaces it with his Surgeon chip to take care of his wounds. Now, let's say he's not Entirely unique. What if it were in a superhero level Cyberpunk game. How about stealing chips from other characters/NPCs? All of this would be easy in a Framework, easiest yet in a VPP, but still very viable in a Multipower. But no Skills or Skill Levels are allowed in a Framework. This is why I am leaning toward a Multiform in a VPP. The time it takes (and the roll to do it successfully if in combat) is to "switch chips" (that being the SFX). And, to represent X# of slots, build the base form (AI/chip receiver in the brain, "wired reflexes", cybereyes, etc.), and for each "slot" the character can make one GM pre-approved change to the base character. This would even cover finding/stealing other targets' chips (because they would be pre-approved by the GM already.

True on the super useful. Now if only skills could be put into a VPP...

Makes sense...which is why it would be nice once in a while (for me) to start at a higher level. I mean, I don't have to play a full on, multiverse saving Dr. Strange, at his power levels, but it would be nice to be able to play a somewhat powerful mage that can at least have an effect on the entire world (after some xp even) 😆😇 I can make a pretty potent Wizard with 400 points, but with 600, damn! lol

I will definitely look into the Optional Expanded Cramming. Would that work with the more Physical options though, like +OCV/DCV or Sharpshooter? Or 'wired reflexes'? Or add to INT, or add active GPS to the character? I am trying to put together some sort of true Cyberpunk character that would then be fit into a Champions game. Thanks! DC

I just had a thought... you could Multiform your own character, with a Chip Jack in your head for the main character, with each Form requiring a particular chip or set of chips (OAF Fragile, with each chip recreatable from a main (or backup) database if the time is taken... Sorry, just thinking 'out loud'.) DC

Chip Jacks, with skills (physical or mental or knowledge or the like) on the chips: How would you create them? Super easy if a VPP can be used, less easy but still viable in a Multipower. But without explicit GM exception to put skills in a framework, would be prohibitive to build (imho) without a framework. But then my experience is limited along this line of thinking. So, suggestions? You know, plug in the chip with world history at x-level, or a GPS chip, or a Mental Focus chip (+4 Int), or a 'skill wire' chip if your character is 'Wired' (+2 DEX or OCV/DCV or Sharpshooter or the like), or the Chemistry 18 or Surgeon 16 chip, or the Lockpicking 15 chip, and so on. Thanks! DC

Basically what you are saying is you couldn't take a high fantasy mage (built as one), campaign for 8 real-life years, and turn that character into a Dr. Strange like character? How about (movie versions) an early Iron Man with the short-lived suit built in a cave...could it in a really long campaign grown into the Iron Man in his last movie, AI assisted, large number of "duplicates", etc.? Would the characters just not grow that way? Would an early Dr. Strange pretty much have to start out very close to a later Dr. Strange?

I would Love an 8 year game... Even if breaks were taken, or the occasional Guest GM helped out, or rotating GMs within the same campaign setting.

I went with the Negative Adder. It was soooo easy :):)

The VPP Multiform-only idea doesn't even take much prep ahead of time if you have a copy of HSB, or whatever source book(s) you need in front of you or in PDF right in front of you. Of course unique/specialty builds are a different story. But if you are truly closely duplicating Beast Boy, you can just open HSB at the first game in which the character is played, and build other animals not listed between games.

Lol, I am building a Beast-Boy-resembling character, and googled Hero System Beast Boy, and voila, here I landed. I prefer to read older stuff already hashed out than start a new topic When I can.

Agreed. I am not trying to argue that you Can put a limitation on the Pool (to save character points). I am arguing (with just one person) that putting a focus on the VPP does not Reduce the available points in the pool, and using the example of Technon (6E1 page 410). Technon has a 30/30 VPP. Technon applies OAF to the VPP. This OAF reduces the CP cost of the Control. After the OAF, Technon still has a 30AP Control and a 30 point Real Point Pool to work with. Unclevlad appears (to me) to be saying that the Size of the Real Point Pool is decreased because of the OAF, but the Technon example shows this not to be the case. Agreed. Exactly! Simpler, yes, when done on paper. But in Designer, it doesn't work. Designer will reject any power with a AP cost above 30.

There is such a thing. The fact that everyone claims that if you can do it in Designer, it is legal proves it. And it does exist in Designer. Emphasis is mine. The example of Technon shows that this is an incorrect assessment. He paid for a 30 CP for a 30 Real Point Pool. After applying the OAF to the VPP, he still has a 30 Real Point Pool, allowing him to slot 30 RP of powers at the same time. The available pool does not decrease because of the application of a Limitation to the VPP. There is nothing here with which I disagree. I used 30/30 both because that was what 6E used in its example, and for sake of ease during discussion. But nothing in your explanation shows that the Available Pool Pool Points decrease because of application of a Lim (in this case an OAF) on the VPP.

I just started something with pieces of both, though I did not think of the adder part, which is probably easier. I created a VPP in the actual character .hdc with the true cost of the VPP at half no-lims, half limited. Then I created a separate .hdc with the actual Pool/Control levels I wanted to achieve, and started building the powers/slots in that one (with the Compound Powers like you suggested), with a note in the Real .hdc explaining this. But since I only barely began that process, I think I will restart and use the negative adder suggestion you made. Thank you!!! So much simpler, while still being able to create powers up to their max level in a Single VPP.