zornwil

Re: How do you feel about Superheroes that kill?

Re: Millenium City... Salt Mines? Cool. You're welcome to avail yourself of Detriot info at http://www.realschluss.org/x-champions/x-champions_setting/x-detroit.htm - much of it is accurate or just slightly exaggerated, though there are a few pure additions. Feel free to ask. Note the resources at the bottom of the page - sadly many of those links are dead, though, I"ve noticed.

Re: Appropriate challenges: how many points? 2 things - one, I just thought of, a PS to my prior post, lemming used to run huge groups, like 15 or something I think. Anyway, the other thing, regarding the idea of a formula, I'd think theoretically the Efficiency Rating system would be a good basis for some portion of such an analysis but I've never really played with it, keep not getting around to it. Has anyone out there used it effectively? (Note, I'm not saying you could just use its numbers, I do mean as part of a more holistic analysis)

Re: Appropriate challenges: how many points? 8-10 is a lot, to me. I can do up to 8 reasonably effectively, beyond that is too much for me.

Re: Musings on Random Musings On another but related note, we probably need a post for newbies: "Warning, any coincidences with prior fake identities will invite both intrusive and amusing inspection...coincidences can include: astrological signs, birthdates, interests such as cooking, having a cool car, having a great job, working at home, having kids, character flaws such as being unusually bad at cooking, and/or using any of the same words as the prior identities (such as "the" or "an"), among others."

Re: Musings on Random Musings Tinny old time radio music with organ. You forgot that part.

Re: Mental Powers I'd like to stress, I have no problem with the idea of a "Class of Minds Framework" - just not the Class of Minds as presented. Good point, Hawksmoor, too. PS - I do think that a CoM Framework does address the prior problem of "what are the limits of minds I can reach?" - but I would also add that the current CoM does not come across as a reusable Framework (even though a half-witted GM can easily adapt it)

Re: Mental Powers Yes, but Classes of Mind is not optional, which you implied by stating "Classes of Minds is *one* option presented in 5e and 5er". PS/EDIT - of course I view all rules as optional, but speaking with the "from the book" mentality here

Re: Appropriate challenges: how many points? Depends an awful lot on the power level of your agents and, to a lesser degree, how you intend to treat them when they're stunned (e.g., do you just leave them out once they hit 0 stun or give recoveries like normal characters?). I'm not sure how to give a straight-forward answer, except to say that at some point the #s of participants against the heroes of course will saturate them if the participants have reasonable power. Balance the defenses of the agents against how many hits the heroes can give them before knocking them out and tweak according to how long you want them to last. Consider that and relative SPDs. I would say this...if you are inexperienced with running, definitely start small and don't worry if the heroes get a few cakewalks while you get your "sea legs". Nothing wrong with that...in fact it's good for heroes to have that happen, they should feel powerful and special, generally. You may want to forewarn the players, though, that you're still testing the playing of the system and that these combats may not be typical. I'm going to guess the players aren't familiar, either, so in that case it's definitely an issue of letting yourself and them get acclimated.

Re: Mental Powers I'm a bit confused - you say "the other" but that indicates the minuses for "outside of your class", so that sounds like it is in the context of the Classes "option". Actually, reading 5ER on page 117, Classes is not indicated as an option at all. (hooray for the PDF! - and hooray for phone conferences as I can multi-task...)

Re: Musings on Random Musings Congrats, good luck!

Re: Corven's Heroes & Villains Appreciate all the work, CR.

Re: How do you feel about Superheroes that kill? Perfect! Sigged! To be repped another day, out of it now for 24. In my campaign, death has occurred in three, I believe, circumstances at the PCs' hands. One was an accidental death in combat. Sad and while it potentially could have been avoided, it would have been still unlikely in the best case, and only at great expense. The government doesn't worry about "good faith" deaths like this by registered, cooperative mutants. Another was a direct retributive slaying. I've talked about it on the boards before. To make a long (and more nuanced) story short, a dark hero's mother was brutally killed. So the character - the Troll - sought out the murderer and tore him limb from limb and ate him. It was a culmination of another problem the character had been developing, a fascination with human flesh which came out of complex circumstances. The other characters were basically aware of the murder but due to it being the character's mother and the peculiarity of the circumstances looked the other way. Quite some time later, this dark hero has turned more towards white knight (after another incident below) and is now going through the justice system, having turned himself in for this murder. In between the time of slaying his mother and reforming, this hero was involved in murder by inaction. The Kingpin - who was behind his mother's death as well as many, many others of course - had just been captured red-handed a second time, this time surely to put him away (it would have in my world, the reason the Kingpin got out the first time, under a "house arrest" was due to all the political pull he could muster, and this was exhausted and impossible with this revelation). The Justice Squad, except for the Troll, was escorting Kingpin out when Wrath appeared. Wrath was a creation of the Kingpin in an experiment involving his own parent's tragic deaths. As Wrath wrapped the group in a dizzying darkness he beheaded the the Kingpin; the Troll probably could have done something (though that wasn't a foregone conclusion) and chose to sit by. I am not saying all these are heroic or for others' campaigns. These are all of the deaths by heroes that have occurred in 4 years of play. And I think within context they don't make the heroes less than that, though in the Troll's case it was part of something he overcame and in so doing became a true hero (new, too, as he has changed even physically, and is Nexus, Master of Dimensions). Though the Troll's anguish and vengeance could be seen as well from a back story that allowed him to be a heroic character, particularly by the end of his story arc as his inner demons, which had allowed him to embrace the Necronomicon (he simply found all of that to be a strange science and felt that there was no moral loss in so dabbling, ignoring gradual signs to the contrary despite his vast intellect) and then battle it in what became his death and rebirth.

Re: How do you feel about Superheroes that kill? What an interesting comparison. And I would say the opposite, even if I see Superman as more heroic. The reason is, I think too many idiots would try to "sneak past" Superman or such as Superman wouldn't wait for them to get in the house (because he is a good guy, he wouldn't want them breaking our house), would stop them, the cops couldn't do much because all they did, really, was trespass (no breaking and entering yet), and everybody knows Superman really won't hurt them unless they do something amazing. But NOBODY would screw around with Wolverine. Which leads me to the point that I don't see the vicious or killers as necessarily not heroes. Often I don't see them as heroes, but depending on the world they exist in and depending on the circumstances, as others have said, I don't see them as disqualified. And frankly I enjoy a little bit of splatter-hero every so often, even if more often for humor. Though I don't really consider that sort of stuff actually heroic, it's just an idle point but related in an entertainment way. Oh, and then there's the cathartic role of such things, but I don't see that as at all heroic.

Re: Exponential VS Linear ? Yeah, but not a game I'm bringing home to the group, so to speak!

Re: Exponential VS Linear ? ...in Space, no less!

Re: A Thread for Random Musings I say "dude" too much for a man of 42 (or is that a "man" of 42? ). Am I one of those annoying middle aged people who say young people things? I hope not, I think it's more a regional thing here, less age-respective. I hope. It's not like I say "boo-ya" or anything else.

Re: Mental Powers Originally I wasn't going to post again, as I only had something trivial to say, but then, on rethinking, I want to pick out the word "enshrine" above. That is what happens as Designers put rules down, even if they're intended only as suggestions (though if properly spelt out it does tend to lessen that impact). I personally have long said that no rules are sacred and I detest the approach as such, but so many people out there take these rules as gospel, in a way, and so that is why one has to be so careful as to what one really wants to put into the rules.

Re: Meta SFX Indeed, super-being. The General Council is eager to greet you. We will be bearing arms to give you a 21-gun salute...

Re: A really variable variable power pool Von D-Man, Steve Long wrote about a "proportional modifier" as your power "waxes and wanes" in DH #17. I am about to download it as I'm catching up on DHes, thought of you, thought you should know.

Re: In a Bind Well, see, that's where in practice I beg to differ, and would really like to have seen Escape Artist with the muscle control, lock-picking, breathing, and all that rolled into one. Why? Because it supports heroic fiction, that's all, otherwise it sort of breaks HERO standards, but HERO is there to simulate heroic fiction. Or at least offer a freaking package deal! signed, unusually irritated by this little thing... I know, I know

Re: What's the most outrageous plot your PCs have ever been subjected to

Re: In a Bind I think the logic was that Contortionist covered the significant part and was more specific, but I think it would have been better to have both. Or at least put Escape Artist in honorory mention in a PS example!!!

Re: Mental Powers I'd suggest we did fine without Class of Minds for many years prior to 5th. PS - please read that to mean - so what is the problem statement that this addresses?

Re: Meta SFX I don't think I'm suggesting anything in violation of that. Nor am I saying you said that. Just to be clear, I'm suggesting that since SFX are a topic, and one already enmeshed in the system, that clarifying and treating them properly is not in any way contradictory to remaining free in employing them.