Vassoom

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

That's "Hello Kitty" hanging from the forward sling swivel' date=' isn't it?[/quote']

 

Yup.

 

Indeed it is. It's actually one of the first things I noticed, since my wife has an identical little Hello Kitty chotchke that hangs from her purse...

 

Personally, I think that kind of detail really makes the image.

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

Is that 10mm Auto? Because if so' date=' it has at least 25% more muzzle energy than the most powerful .45 ACP loads. I'd either make the rounds completely equal or else up the 10 to 2d6 KA.[/quote']

Yeah, that's a good catch...and another area where I might need to make updates.

 

When I initially developed the weapons in my campaign, I simply categorized a standard "10mm" round as a metric hybrid somewhere between the .40 S&W and the .45 ACP...not realizing that the 10mm Auto was actually an existing (and very powerful) caliber.

 

But with so many of these 10mm weapons currently "in play", I need to decide whether I want the keep my "10mm" as a non-existent hybrid or reclassify it as the 10mm Auto. Since it's easier to keep it as a hybrid, I've left the stats alone. I think I'm more inclined to keep it as is because I definitely want there to be some separation (in game mechanics) between the most powerful handguns and basic assault rifles. If the plethora of 10mm handguns/machine pistols/SMGs current circulating in my campaign end up with 2d6 RKA and the same +1 STUNx, there's very little incentive to upgrade to the larger and more expensive assault rifles...which really need to dish out significantly more damage than pistol rounds to remain realistic. And if I have to further increase my assault rifles to make them noticeably more powerful, then I'd have to revamp all my armor levels to compensate...and I spent a LOT of time tinkering with my armor levels to make them balanced with the first batch of weapon stats.

 

Oh, the neverending trials and tribulations of the modern gamemaster...

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

Squee!

http://issuu.com/krissusa/docs/productcatalog

Awesome. Thanks for sharing this. The recoil compensation system in these is extremely clever, and I'm glad to see they've made it to market.

I've shot a Tommy Gun (M-1928) chambered in .45 ACP, and the lift was quite pronounced. I'd love to try one of these Kriss SMGs and see if it stays on target like they claim...

EDIT: Forgot to add that I've had these incorporated in my cyberpunk game since I first heard of them back in 2006 or 2007, using the following stats:

                                                       STR  PER  A/R
Name             Cal    OCV  RMod   Dam   STUNx  Shots  Min  Mod  Cost   Mass  Notes
-------------  -------  ---  ----  -----  -----  -----  ---  ---  -----  ----  ---------
PDI Super X     10mm    +1    +1   2d6-1  1d6-1   32    10   +4   61/19  1.90  AF5, iRC3
PDI Super V    .45 ACP  +1    +1   2d6-1   1d6    28    10   +4   67/20  2.00  AF5, iRC3

Looks like I'll need to modify the magazine capacity down to 25 since I was guessing at the final max capacity.

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

It would be a built-in shooting rest. Braced and Set every time you fire!

The +1 OCV from "Set" will help, but that 1/2 DCV from "Braced" is a killer. Although I suppose he'll get the advantage of partial cover from the drum...

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

What's a (relatively) efficient and quick way for a character equipped with a tactical shield to reload their pistol? Equipment suggestions are welcome. New York Reload suggestions...thanks' date=' but it's not ideal for me.[/quote']

I'm assuming this is for a magazine-fed one-handed (semi-)automatic weapon, with their other arm slung through the tactical shield's straps...

 

1) Some tactical shields are large enough and curved enough with small "feet" protrusions on the bottom that allow them to be "set down" on the bottom edge while continuing to provide cover. That would allow the shooter behind it to quickly slip their arm out and facilitate the reload.

 

2) If the shooter were wearing a rigid/fast-draw holster, they could thumb the magazine release to drop the clip, quickly re-holster the weapon, then grab a spare magazine with their now-free shooting hand and feed it into the holstered weapon.

 

3) If the shooter is a "gadget" type, they could have a utility belt with a few spare magazines rigged to spring perpendicular to the belt, allowing the shooter to thumb the magazine release to drop the empty clip, then jam the butt of the weapon onto the now protruding and accessible full magazine...with a simple twist to release it from the belt.

 

4) The tactical shield could theoretically be configured the same was as the utility belt in #3...with a few spare mags attached to the safe side of the shield, with a small activation mechanism in the handle for the off-hand...thereby allowing their off hand to trigger the mechanism and cause the next full magazine to pop out, after which the shooter thumbs the magazine release to drop the empty clip, then jams the butt of the weapon down over the exposed full mag...with a simple twist to release it from the shield.

 

5) Hire a sidekick. "I'll hand it to you empty, you give me the other one ready to go, then reload the first one. Lather, rinse, repeat. Got it? Now stay close behind me, kid..."

Re: Cool Guns for your Games

For my gritty cyberpunk campaign, I like to keep it as realistic as possible for the players while also adding futuristic touches. One of the ways I try to do this is by providing images for the various weapons they come across...since, as they say, style is always in style. So I'll find existing weapons and through the magic of Photoshop, I'll tweak them to try and make them fit the campaign a little better. In my attempt to add to this excellent thread, here's one such firearm, complete with game stats:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]42656[/ATTACH]

The weapon actually stems from an amalgam of several HK prototype SMGs that never made it to production: the SMG-I, SMG-II and the MP 2000. All of which, btw, were eventually scuttled with the extremely effective redesign that became the UMP platform (e.g., UMP-9, UMP-40, and UMP-45). I really liked the compact look of the SMG-II along with its outstanding suppression features...something that is fairly important for runners in a cyberpunk campaign in which sneaking through a hostile megacorp's campus undetected might mean the difference between mission success and getting the team pinned down by corporate security forces, for example. So I made a few Photoshop modifications to one of the few SMG-II images I could find by upgrading the ammo from 9x19 to my mythical 10mm x 24mm Caseless (electronic firing) rounds, and I threw in the clear magazine from the G36 for good measure. I also modded the select fire switch from 0,1,3,30 to 0,1,5,40 options to match the AF5 game specs, and thus was the MP24 born.

Edit: Not listed in the game specs, btw, is the fact that since it fires caseless ammo, there are no brass casings left behind, so it also technically qualifies for a limited "Invisible Power Effects" advantage. But weapons are "equipment" in my game, so the Active/Real points are immaterial...which is why I didn't bother listing that in the stats.

Re: Fast combat?

What I'm looking for is a fast resolution system for combat. Now again, it's been some time since I ran the Hero System, but I seem to recall that the basics were pretty quick, but the options for combat quickly bogged things down.

 

My question to the community is, is combat faster now in the new edition? Or are there suggestions you can make to keep combat from getting bogged down?

 

I know hero isn't a "rules light" system. But If it can handle combat quickly and keep things cinematic, with car chases, two guns blazing firefights, and furious martial arts action, all without slowing to a crawl, then I think I'm ready for the plunge again. But I would appreciate some honest feedback. If combat is slow going, regardless of how great the game may be, I'd appreciate being told.

I, for one, can vouch for numbers 3, 5, 8 and 9. They help a lot just by themselves. Others (above) mentioned #4, and I hear that helps (but, personally, I've always enjoyed the dice rolling part of combat, and doing it beforehand just seems wrong to me.)

That said, I don't really see much difference in the speed of combat between 4E and 5E.

I guess, though, that if you are looking for a system that, as you describe it, "can handle combat quickly and keep things cinematic, with car chases, two guns blazing firefights, and furious martial arts action, all without slowing to a crawl", and want to know if HERO can handle that, the answer is a resounding "possibly".

It really all depends on the GM. I've played HERO campaigns where the GM would instantly "hand-wave" all of the extra rolls (by determining Hit Location himself, for example), and since he knew all of the rules inside out, he could keep the action moving very swiftly. Other GMs, on the other hand, don't seem to mind the "meticulousness" and "granularity" of some HERO combat mechanics, and they tend to mosey along at a much slower pace.

My recommendation: Use many or all of the above 9 suggestions, and then add a couple more of your own. For example, if you are playing "Dark Champions", but your characters are "good guys" who rarely kill anyone, then ignore BODY damage, and "hand wave" the bleeding stuff as you see fit. If you are looking for a darker, grittier campaign...then keep the BODY damage, but skip "extra" steps that require more dice rolls such as Hit Location, Knockdown, EGO rolls, etc. As the primary storyteller, the GM should always have license to creatively fill in those details as they see fit anyway, rather than simply relying on dice rolls.

The GM sets the tone. If you want "fast and furious", you can always get it there by simply using the HERO rules as a guide, rather than an instruction manual.

- Vassoom

Re: Firing Into Melee, a rules quandary

Sorry' date=' I don't see the problem at all. If a PC in a game I was running tried to pull the "I shoot at my teammate and do everything to lower my CV" crap, I would laugh in their face.[/quote']Well obviously any GM worth a darn is not gonna allow something that ridiculous. I was just using that extreme example to illustrate how the ruling as constructed seems backwards.

 

Mojo Bones put into different words me "rationalization" and possibly better words. I didn't "rationalize" I simply logically interpreted the events, based both on concept and ruling.

 

You fire into a group of people if you're good at hitting people then you're good at hitting people. If you're bad at hitting people than the round just goes off into nowhere land.

Fair enough.

 

I just don't think that when you miss your initial target, it's fair to have those characters with higher DEX be much more likely to hit the unintended target than the shooters with lower DEX.

 

I guess it's just me. *shrug*

 

- Vassoom

Re: Firing Into Melee, a rules quandary

Well, here's a theory.

 

If they miss with trained skill, obviouslty the trained skill hasn't helped them in the least here. So those bonuses are ignored.

 

Now - they are STILL aiming into the melee, and nominally as close as possible to the intended target of a close fist fight.

 

Now, the person who's natural talent plays a larger factor than the person who relies more on training (which is established to have failed) still puts the shot very close to the intended target, but they'd missed and hit something else in the immediate area instead of just having gone wide with the shot itself.

 

Don't like it? I suggest using a [Flat] OCV to dertmine if another target was hit, for everyone. Say. . . 3-5 for any given game.

I considered the idea of using a flat OCV, but that also struck me as somewhat arbitrary. What should I set the baseline OCV equal to? Do I keep bumping up the baseline OCV used as the characters gain XP to keep the percentages the same? Or do I let their XP (and presumably, therefore, DEX gains) slowly diminish the likelihood of hitting an unintended target? And this still wouldn't really address careful shots into melee versus reckless shots into the scrum. Hmm.

Right after I posted the above conundrum, I started tossing around a few ideas on how I might possibly resolve it...and I think I've hit upon something pretty good. I'd be interested in hearing what you think. Here it is:

Instead of using the purely DEX-based OCV or using an arbitrarily assigned base OCV, what if the attacker's OCV was set to however much they missed their initial target by? Here's the example:

This method rewards those with a higher DEX and more CSLs since those are always going to factor into how much the attacker initially misses by. It also penalizes those making reckless attacks into melee, since doing so would automatically increase the likelihood of missing by a lot, thereby increasing their OCV versus the unintended target(s).

This method would also allow you to easily keep the book's DC "Combat Shooting" Talent's defined +5 OCV for purposes of not hitting an unintended target.

As a house rule replacement for "Firing Into Melee", I think it may be a winner. Let me know what you think...

- Vassoom

I'd like to solicit some more advice from the Dark Champions gurus out there.

In my hero-level near-future Dark Champions game, nearly everyone uses firearms, although there are still times when either one of the characters or a bad guy moves in for good ol' hand-to-hand combat.

The problem arises when the characters (or villains) elect to shoot at someone who is in the midst of a HTH melee. What happens when the attacker with the firearm (or missile weapon) misses, and how often might an unintended target be struck? Putting aside for the moment the "Combat Shooting" Talent (DC, page 90), let's look at what the book says happens.

Page 179 of Dark Champions addresses this issue, but the official ruling bothers me for two reasons. The ruling states that the GM can use the Concealment rules to help determine the likelihood of striking someone other than the target. I don't have a problem with this aspect of the ruling. However, it then goes on to state that if the attack is deemed to miss but is less than or equal to the Concealment penalty applied, the GM should determine the likely candidate among the unintended targets, and then the following second attack roll is made:

"The attacker must make another Attack Roll against that target, using only his base OCV from DEX (no bonuses from Combat Skill Levels, Combat Maneuvers, or the like apply). If that Attack Roll hits, the attacker's shot has accidentally hit someone other than his intended target!" [emphasis mine]

1. The OCV used to determine whether or not the unintended target is struck is the base OCV from DEX, and
   
2. The attacker gets no adjustments for Combat Skill Levels or Combat Maneuvers, etc.

These two parts strikes me as antithetical for two reasons. The first is that according to this framework, the more Dexterous you are (e.g., the higher your base OCV is), the more likely you are to hit an unintended target whenever you miss! Secondly, (barring the use of the Combat Shooting Talent), an expertly trained marksman is just as likely as a completely unskilled shooter to strike the unintended target, i.e., there is no "reward" for practice/skill levels here. (As a corollary, by excluding maneuvers, a carefully lined up shot is no less likely to hit the wrong target than a reckless hipshot.)

The best way to exemplify my problem with this ruling is by example. Let's assume that an important NPC and the nefarious Villain are duking it out in HTH combat. On the sidelines we have both our overeager Hero as well as one of the villain's overzealous henchman Mooks. For the purposes of this example, both the NPC and the Villain (the HTH combatants) are DCV 6. Also for the purposes of this scenario, let's say our Hero is a gifted and highly trained marksman, with a DEX of 20 and 2 Combat Skill Levels with his firearm. The untrained Mook, on the other hand, has a DEX of 10 and doesn't even have proficiency with the gun he just picked up off the floor.

Now, let's assume both our overeager Hero and the overzealous Mook decide to shoot into the melee, and that both of them manage to just miss, thereby enabling the official "firing into melee" ruling.

Based upon the ruling as stated, our expert marksman with a base OCV of 7 is nearly three times as likely to hit the DCV 6 unintended target (12-, 74.1% of the time) as the unskilled Mook with an OCV of 3 (8-, 25.9% of the time)!

How in the world does this make any sense?!? God forbid the Hero be a gifted superhuman with a DEX of 28 and a base OCV of 9...he'll hit the poor NPC 91% of the time!

Granted, I understand that a more skilled marksman may initially miss their target less often, but even if all else is equal, the more Dexterous shooter is still penalized, and that doesn't sit well with me. [As a second example, assume the Hero is merely gifted but not an expert marksman, and his 7 OCV is based solely on his 20 DEX, while the "average" 10 DEX Mook is a former military marksman who has 4 CSLs with firearms that raises his final OCV to 7, as well. So now both of them have the exact same chance of missing initially, but the Hero (with the higher DEX) is still 3x more likely to strike the unintended target! Huh?]

You wanna know how broken this rule is? The Hero is actually better off using a weapon that he is completely unfamiliar with and taking the -3 OCV penalty to his OCV, not applying any CSLs, then Hurrying (another -2 OCV) his 3-shot Rapid Fire attack (another -4 OCV), but all the while initially aiming at the NPC, since he's virtually assured of MISSING HIM with all 3 shots (needs a Natural 3 to hit, for a mere 0.5% chance of "accidentally" hitting the good guy) but knowing that he then gets his base OCV of 7 against the other guy in melee and is therefore 74% likely to hit the VILLAIN!

Am I missing something, or does anyone else also have a problem with this ruling?

I'm thinking of scrapping this Bizarro-World ruling and coming up with a house rule that is the opposite, wherein the more gifted you are (higher DEX), the more skilled you are (appropriate training and CSLs), and the more proficient you are (other OCV modifiers like, say...Weapon Familiarity), the LESS likely you are to hit that innocent bystander or unintended target.

That being said, I'm not sure exactly how to design that rule yet. Has anyone out there already done so? And if not, got any ideas?

I already use an optional critical/fumble system that takes into account the *really* bad "Oops!" scenarios...but I need to create a ruling that handles misses when firing into melee that aren't catastrophically bad Attack Rolls. No matter how I eventually define the new rule about shooting into melee, the following three things should always be kept in mind:

1. It should help reinforce that it's rarely a really good idea to shoot into melee
   
2. It should easily allow for something like the Combat Shooting Talent to be applied in a beneficial way (in order to encourage its use)
   
3. It should penalize the less dexterous, less skilled, and less proficient shooters, not the other way around

With that said, let's open the floor to comments and suggestions...

- Vassoom

Re: Rocket-propelled Chainsaw

No way... this is just another panel from the webcomic that the first panel came from.

Neat panel.

- Vassoom

Re: Rocket-propelled Chainsaw

there are only two problems i can see with the design firstly the chain saw ignition how would you pull the starter cable before launch. trying to slide a running chain saw into a tube strikes me as risky and having a hole to pull the cord through and some sort of break away tether would make the firing more difficult plus expose the operator to rocket exhaust.

 

ideally i guess you could have some sort of electric starter motor unit perhaps attached to the side of the launcher to save projectile weight.

- Vassoom

Re: Rocket-propelled Chainsaw

OMG...that's awesome, fw!

Did you draw that?!?

- Vassoom

Re: Seeking MA Info/Help

HERO Fu

Maneuver OCV DCV Notes

4 Examine Post +2 +2 Block, Abort

4 Ignore Post -- +5 Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort

4 New Post +0 +2 4d6 Strike

3 Quote Post -1 -1 Grab Two Limbs, 20 STR for holding on

4 Counter-Post Quote +0 +0 6d6 Crush, Must Follow Grab

Very good, but you forgot:

5 Off-Topic Post -1 +2 2d6 NND, Target Falls

4 Flame Poster -2 +0 HKA ½d6 (2 DC), 10 STR(Rep Power) Min, +1 DC per +10 Rep Power

- Vassoom

Re: Rocket-propelled Chainsaw

No gyros needed! Just two chains' date=' counterrotating! [/quote']Nice!

 

I like the way you think!

 

- Vassoom

Re: Rocket-propelled Chainsaw

Stabilizing fins are nice and all, but I would think you'd also need a gyroscope in the housing core to counteract the rotational force of the spinning chain.

I mean, come on...if you're going to design a Rocket Propelled Chainsaw, at least make it realistic!

Great stuff.

- Vassoom

Re: Spray and pray: spreading autofire?

Once you start allowing Autofire attacks with significant plusses to OCV and multiple hits' date=' it completely breaks the balance of the Advantage, IMHO, and makes it far too potent.[/quote']It does however, allow high ROF autofire attacks to function in a more realistic (if unbalanced for the cost) fashion. Right now a AF20 attack has very few advantages over an AF5 one when fired at a single target.

Perhaps.

 

But that's a bit of a leap from the OP asking how best to model the advantage of throwing a handful of shuriken to better simulating AF20 weapons.

 

I would also argue that a more "realistic" build for a minigun or any weapons in a similar class of AF20-type heavy weaponry would probably be better constructed as an attack using Non-Selective AoE Line with AF5 or AF10, not a "normal" AF20 attack that requires you to hit a target's DCV.

 

In my opinion, since Dark Champions tends to be on the lower end of the HERO power scale (although naturally Your Actual Mileage May Vary), allowing AF attacks to be spread for significant plusses to OCV and still retaining multiple AF hits risks unleashing some seriously unbalanced attacks. But of course, it all depends on your campaign.

 

- Vassoom

Re: Spray and pray: spreading autofire?

The Ultimate Skill has a new Autofire Skill, Precise Sprayfire.

 

+1 OCV for every 2 shots fired, rounded down, i.e. 2-3 shots, +1 OCV; 4-5 shots, +2 OCV; 6-7 shots, +3 OCV, etc.

But you can only hit once.

 

I was thinking of houseruling it to half the shots fired, rounded down. So 5 shots would give +2 OCV with a maximum of 2 hits, 10 shots would give +5 OCV with a maximum of 5 hits, and so on.

 

Someone a while ago also posted a house rule for spreading autofire, based on the normal spreading rules. +1 OCV for every shot lost to spread the attack. So with a 5 shot autofire you could get +1 OCV with up to 4 shots hitting, +2 OCV with 3 hits, +3 OCV with 2 hits, or +4 OCV with only 1 shot able to hit.

Autofire already has an enormous built in advantage that if you roll well on your Attack Roll, you get multiple hits with one Attack Roll. I feel this accurately represents the skill of the shooter...e.g., a less skilled shooter will quickly drift off target due to recoil and/or lift, whereas a skilled shooter (with a higher OCV) will be able to keep the weapon on target and score multiple hits.

Remember, +2 OCV is HUGE. All things being equal (ex: 8 OCV vs 8 DCV, for an 11- success), +2 OCV takes your 11- (62.5% chance of success) up to a 13- (83.8% chance of success), for an increase of 21.3% to the success rate! And you want to allow multiple hits in addition?!?

I agree with the Ultimate Skill ruling that if you want to spread the shots around the hex to try and increase your chance to hit once, then you would only get to hit once. I also feel that the ability to do so would properly be reflected as a learned/practiced skill, i.e. it would be a skill that costs points rather than a maneuver that anyone could successfully pull off.

The standard maneuvers "Blazing Away" and "Suppression Fire" adequately cover other aspects of "spray and pray".

Ask yourself this question: If I'm a player and have an Autofire weapon, when would I not take +5 OCV with up to 5 hits (your proposed house rule), or +3 OCV with up to 2 hits (other person's house rule)? I'll bet the answer is that you would almost always take that, which proves that it is far too generous a ruling.

Once you start allowing Autofire attacks with significant plusses to OCV and multiple hits, it completely breaks the balance of the Advantage, IMHO, and makes it far too potent.

- Vassoom

Re: Hudson City rocks OUT!!!

but the funniest thing is i imported an old game as a storyline now in my campaign. If you rememer the old RPG Ninjaburger then you will get a specal laugh out of this one. Even though hudson city has several fast food chains, the major ones in my campaign are Ninja-Burger (home of the Ninja-to, their version of the wopper) and Samuri-dog ( Ill take the Ronin with fries and emperor-size it). I wanted to add a little bit of laughter now and then so the players can just chuckle from time to time. so... the 2 fast food joints are having an all out war. Both deliver 24 hours (or can drive thru or take out) but both try to upstart each-other with a combat with foam weapons and paper mache armor ( they ARE civilians and just promoting the image ya know!) .

 

The Saturday event at the convention , the food was sponsored by SAMURI-DOG... and ninja-burger would not let that stand idly by and happen. SO they did an impromtu attack and tried to assail the booths samuri-dog had set up.... but my heros put a bunch of them in the hospital ( as i said .. they are civilians..) so i gave them credit for foiling one of my plotlines. But if you look up at a rooftop sometime, and see a ninja with a white paper bag with a ninja hood symbol on it... remember dont shoot the civs.. they only get paid $5.65 / hour plus tips for deliveries.

 

overall they had a blast and had fun. Yes they stoped the bomb from being stolen but now they got press coverage of their activites... HMMM wonder who will be looking for them NOW that they are on the grid?

Dude, you have GOT to make it a three way battle royale...add "Pirate Pizza" to the mix!

Samurai and Ninjas and Pirates, oh my!

- Vassoom

Re: Knightshift Stories -- Campaign Log

Ermmm...does this means that everytime I've clicked the rep buttom I've been making a fool of myself? HUMANITY WILL SUFFER FOR THIS

 

I've always thought I was giving rep......cough, cough. Thanks for the heads up!

The secretive ways of the "Rep Power" are veiled and mysterious...

- Vassoom

Re: World encyclopedia

Help, help, the paranoids are after me!!

 

j/k

"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you!"

- Vassoom

P.S. (You do realize I was being facetious with my first post, don't you? )

Re: Knightshift Stories -- Campaign Log

SESSION SEVEN – 08 SEP 06 “SIGNS' date=' PART II”[/size']

 

Even in a town as crime-ridden as Hudson City, where the chorus of urban night sounds is often punctuated with the sharp reports of gunfire, heavy automatic weapons fire can grab one’s attention...

Looking forward to the next installment.

- Vassoom

Re: World encyclopedia

You will find the following has most or all of that information, in a much better format:

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/countrylisting.html

If I were to use THAT one, then the CIA would KNOW that I now know the title of the Liechtenstein National Anthem, and they would share that information with the NSA, who is already tapping my phone calls, and with the Department Of Justice, which is already sifting through my internet search results via MSN, Yahoo, and AOL!

Egads, just imagine what they could do then!

No thank you! I'll stick to Toadmaster's URL, thankyouverymuch.

- Vassoom

Re: World encyclopedia

I ran across this site while looking for some data, I thought it makes a pretty good reference for running a game in a country other than your own. I thought this was the most likely forum for interest in this.

 

Lots of details including the national anthem, monetary system, political system, population distribution etc.

 

http://www.nationsencyclopedia.com/

Totally REP worthy!

- Vassoom

Re: Low recoil gun-fu

Well' date=' while I did a great deal of shooting as a kid, I don't think anyone who knows me would say I am "Quick" [/quote']

See, the beauty is, even if you feel you are a SPD 2, all you need are a couple of Penalty Skill Levels to offset Rapid Fire penalties in order to pass that test.

I forgot another thing about the International rapid fire strings. They are at 25 yards' date=' the times are as stated earlier, but each shot is at a separate target [/quote']Ok, that's just plain crazy hard.

 

- Vassoom