Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

[waiwode]

Doing some thinking about my magical colleges and schools from an earlier post, and how spells would be purchased and used in the game.

 

Came up with the following bad ideas, tossed out for your disapproval.

 

New Skill

 

Lore, (College). (9+INT/5, 9+END/5). Cost 3/2

 

Each College has a different approach to Magic, their jealously guarded Lore. in order to take a (College) Lore skill characters must have at least one rank of Membership (College).

 

Spells will be learned by rolling (College) Lore as an INT skill. Every 10 points of Active Cost is a -1 penalty. A spell that is learned must still be paid for, the player must cover the Real Cost.

 

Spells will be cast by rolling (College) Lore as an END skill. Every 10 points of Active Cost is a -1 penalty.

 

Why two stats for one skill? I want to make "smartness" an important aspect of spell-casting, and more importantly, spell research, but I want fatigue and general physical conditioning to be a critical factor for spell-casting.

 

New Talent

 

Mastery, (College). Cost: 5/rank. Max Ranks = EGO/5.

 

Mastery represents an intuitive grasp of the secret Lore of a Magical College or School. Every rank of Mastery does two things:

 

a) It adds +1 to any spell learning, spell research, or spell casting roll.

 

It pays the next five points of real cost of spells from that College the player pays for.

 

Doug.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

An END based skill? A skill based on END could run as high as 19- at a base level. Maybe you meant as a CON based skill (which isn't a bad idea at all)...

 

Second thought: END gets used constantly, so the END skill roll would be going up and down a lot. Could make an interesting game mechanic, but could also slow things down a lot.

 

Mastery seems like it's giving away free points. Five points buys five points of spells, plus something. Although, if you're doing this as an unobtrusive way of making mages buy up their EGO, it works.

[waiwode]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

An END based skill? A skill based on END could run as high as 19- at a base level. Maybe you meant as a CON based skill (which isn't a bad idea at all)...

 

Second thought: END gets used constantly, so the END skill roll would be going up and down a lot. Could make an interesting game mechanic, but could also slow things down a lot.

 

Mastery seems like it's giving away free points. Five points buys five points of spells, plus something. Although, if you're doing this as an unobtrusive way of making mages buy up their EGO, it works.

 

Actually, using END as the base of the Casting RSR is mentioned in FH. If we assume that spell-casting is exhausting, then casting one or two spells will have a minor effect, however wizards will quickly wear themselves out if they continually cast.

 

All spells will have to cost END, of course. That doesn't upset me though.

 

Yes, Mastery is giving away points for free, paying for spells as well as being a "tight group" skill level. It's not the cheapest way to toss spells to characters, though. I was messing around with Frameworks, but just wasn't happy with how they worked out. Mastery offers a bit of a rebate, and the EGO cap prevents rampant abuse.

 

Thanks for the feedback.

 

Doug.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

Actually' date=' using END as the base of the Casting RSR is mentioned in FH. [/quote']

 

I must have missed that part. Thinking about it some more, though, it seems that it could provide some interesting tactical considerations. When faced with heavy opposition, do we stand and fight, or do we run, and possibly have to fight later anyway, and with reduced magic rolls?

 

Yes, Mastery is giving away points for free, paying for spells as well as being a "tight group" skill level. It's not the cheapest way to toss spells to characters, though. I was messing around with Frameworks, but just wasn't happy with how they worked out. Mastery offers a bit of a rebate, and the EGO cap prevents rampant abuse.

 

Ah, so you're having the characters buy each spell individually and at full points, but still throwing them a bone. Not a bad idea at all. Keeps magic from totally running away into superhero land, but lets a mage have more than just one or two spells. I may steal it.

[waiwode]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

Using END for a Magic RSR

I must have missed that part. Thinking about it some more' date=' though, it seems that it could provide some interesting tactical considerations. When faced with heavy opposition, do we stand and fight, or do we run, and possibly have to fight later anyway, and with reduced magic rolls?[/quote']

 

FH pg 252, second paragraph in the section on using CON to power spells.

 

And you are exactly right. It does bring an element of strategy into things.

 

Mastery and the Working Mage

Ah, so you're having the characters buy each spell individually and at full points, but still throwing them a bone. Not a bad idea at all. Keeps magic from totally running away into superhero land, but lets a mage have more than just one or two spells. I may steal it.

 

Well I played around with trying to buy each spell as a skill-only deal. Or having each spell as a Talent. Or having each rank of Membership giving you so many Real Cost points in spells. Didn't like any of it. If I was playing at 50+Disads I would re-evaluate that, but since I'm prolly headed for the 75+Disads range for the PCs....

 

As for stealing, anything I post here is here to garner ciriticism and just possibly give someone else a hand. Everyone is welcome to it all. Please don't copyright it and sue me though! Just about have my student loan paid off, need all my cash!

 

Doug.

[Greatwyrm]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

I like what you've got here. One question, though. What would you think about letting mastery give you a 1 reduction in real cost per level, with a minimum cost of 1 on future spells. That way it could still give the roll bonuses, but function more like Linguist or Well Connected for purchasing new spells.

 

The reason I suggest this is, it doesn't really look like you're actually paying anything for the ability. There's no reason not to take all the mastery you can as soon as possible. To paraphrase a D&D guideline, if you make a power that you can't see someone passing up, it's probably too powerful. If you make it a reduction in cost, instead of a credit on points, I think it might work a bit better.

[waiwode]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

I like what you've got here. One question' date=' though. What would you think about letting mastery give you a 1 reduction in real cost per level, with a minimum cost of 1 on future spells. That way it could still give the roll bonuses, but function more like Linguist or Well Connected for purchasing new spells..[/quote']

 

Thought about that. The reason I avoided this (and it's not a good reason, just mine): I like Hero Sheets to add up. I can handle unspent "Spell Points," so if during play Dread Fostigulp's player buys a rank of Scarlet Spires Mastery and doesn't use the spell points until he can finish research Scarlet Onieromancy Shield, Real Cost 6, I can handle it.

 

However when Dread Fostigulf, who has 6 spells with a current cost of 2 or higher, factoring in his other level of Scarlet Spires Mastery, gains his second level of Mastery (and now a cumulative -2 to all spells, no less than 1) does he pay 5 points and get 6 back? Merely "lose" 6 points into the void (yes, basically, that would be my take on it). Not gain the benefit?

 

Confusion. However all of my players and I can add to five. Three times out of four, anyway.

 

paraphrase a D&D guideline, if you make a power that you can't see someone passing up, it's probably too powerful. If you make it a reduction in cost, instead of a credit on points, I think it might work a bit better

 

I think the difference between Feats and this Talent is that I fully expect every magic-using character to take it. I would be shocked and horrified if someone attempting to play anything other than a medler didn't.

 

The control measure is going to come with the rank limitation. Most starting characters are going to bump EGO up to 13 to catch the round-off and take three ranks of Mastery. Total cp spent= 21. The occasional character may take the plunge and have EGO 18 and four ranks of Mastery. Total cp spent= 36. But with Normal Human Maxima in play not many are going to be willing to run their EGO up to 23 for five ranks of Mastery. Total cp spent= 57. For 25 points of spells and 15 points of tight group levels. (Oh, and an unholy ECV).

 

That being said, you are correct. I think cost reduction works better. Just not for me!

 

Doug.

[Greatwyrm]

Re: Skill & Talent: Lore & Mastery

 

But with Normal Human Maxima in play not many are going to be willing to run their EGO up to 23 for five ranks of Mastery. Total cp spent= 57. For 25 points of spells and 15 points of tight group levels. (Oh' date=' and an unholy ECV).[/quote']

 

You should always expect players to do exactly what you think no one would. If you have some kind of mentalist college of spells, you should watch out for someone doing exactly what you spelled out here. A massive ECV and +5 to learn and use spells is awfully tempting when you can blow 25 RP on a spell.

 

That being said' date=' you are correct. I think cost reduction works better. Just not for me! [/quote']

 

Just my $0.02. What's fun for your game is what counts.