Simple question about 6th Ed

[bobrunnicles]

I know, I know, is there such a thing? Anyway, a little background - I stepped away from the HERO fold for a while last year (heresy!) for personal reasons unrelated to the game itself (of which I am a huge fan and own most everything printed since it came out, including gems like Wings Of The Valkyrie ) and I recently started contemplating getting a new campaign going. The main frontrunners for a system are either HERO or GURPS; I'm leaning towards HERO but am a little wary of getting things underway and picking up books and other things for my group with 6th Ed looming on the horizon.

 

The question is this, and it's one that I've been unable to find a satisfying response to in any other post despite spending most of the morning trawling the forums (which undoubtedly means someone will link one here within minutes lol) - is the general idea that 6E will remain *mostly* compatible with existing books like prior editions have? I think that it's probably meant to be but Steve has said in several threads I looked at that 'nothing is sacrosanct' and 'everything is up for review' and that worries me. If it weren't for this, the decision would have gone HEROs way long ago, but after building an even more vast GURPS library over the past few decades and then 4th coming out and reprinting a lot of stuff, I just don't know what to do.

 

Apologies if this has already been answered (I can't believe it hasn't, actually) but everything I've read has tended towards specific issues people want addressed (or left alone!).

[Steve Long]

Re: Simple question about 6th Ed

 

I think the best answer I can give you is to reprint verbatim the opening text from the "Steve's Philosophies for 6E" thread on the 6E forum:

 

Before starting on any major RPG project I think it’s important to define the nature of the project, the goals I have in mind for it, and the design philosophy that’s guiding my work. Since we’re asking y’all for your input and ideas on this particular project, I’d like you to be aware of my guiding philosophies for designing and writing the 6E rules so that you know where I’m coming from. I’m not posting them to suggest that you have to agree with them (though I hope you will), but so that my position is clear and you understand what I’m doing.

 

1. Everything is up for consideration.

 

There are no sacred cows here, no forbidden ground, no boundaries limiting where I’m going to go in my quest to make the HERO System rules even better — and therefore no restrictions on what you can suggest to me.

 

No potential change, no matter how radical, is going to be ignored if I think it could make the rules better. No rule, no matter how fundamental, is going to escape scrutiny. Literally everything — the type of dice used, the various scales in the game, point costs, how Skill and Attack rolls are made, everything — is up for discussion and consideration.

 

So don’t feel you have to hold back! If you have an idea for an improvement you think is solid, go right ahead and post it. All you’re risking is the ridicule of your fellow fans. I might say “No,” but I’m still going to consider what you said and appreciate that you said it.

 

 

2. The HERO System as it currently exists is a pretty solid rules system and doesn’t need a lot of significant changes.

 

Guiding Philosophy #1 notwithstanding, I am no fan of change for change’s sake. I’m not going to start changing things just because I have the opportunity and means to do so. I think the HERO System in its current incarnation is the best roleplaying game ever created — all I want to do is make it even better. I am contemplating some changes that are pretty significant, but for the most part I think the HERO System’s doing pretty damn well as it is.

 

 

3. We have to change the HERO System enough to make 6E worth doing.

 

Guiding Philosophy #2 notwithstanding, there’s no point in jumping through all the hoops to create 6E if all we do is tighten a nut here and polish a rivet there. If we’re going to go to all this effort there should be some substantive changes involved — not for the sake of change, but because those changes are solid improvements to the game. At this stage I don’t think the 6E rules changes are going to be so extreme as to “invalidate” old books, but as a practical matter they’re going to have to improve things enough to make you notice. As we said back when we launched 5E, “It’s not that you’ll have to upgrade — it’s that the new rules are so cool you’ll want to.”

 

 

4. I want to enhance the HERO System’s ability to simulate “dramatic realism” in your games, and thus to let you tailor it to the type of game you want.

 

By and large I think the HERO System does a great job of simulating “dramatic realism.” That’s not the realism of everyday life, but the “realism” depicted in comics, movies, novels, and TV shows — the sort of “reality” where the hero is hard to kill, can accomplish amazing things at times, and always gets the girl in the end. I don’t want to veer toward true “simulationism” of actual reality (if that’s even possible in an RPG), nor do I want to go too far off the beaten track toward a “narrativist” approach to gaming. By hewing toward dramatic realism, the HERO System makes it easy for the end user — the fan and customer — to tailor or customize the rules to reflect whatever type of “reality” he wants. If you want to go for “heavy realism,” you incorporate the optional rules that allow for that; if you do want to worry about “realism” at all, you can ignore some of the standard rules.

 

By and large I think the HERO System already does a fine job of this and doesn’t need to be tweaked too much (if at all) to meet this goal. However, presentation and organization of the rules may enhance its usefulness in this regard; so will calling things to the reader’s attention in sidebars, text boxes, and the like. I plan to keep all that in mind while writing and designing.

 

 

5. I would like to increase the HERO System’s granularity and precision.

 

As we’re all fond of saying, the HERO System can simulate anything. However, some aspects of the system don’t seem to have enough granularity — i.e., ability to precisely define and differentiate things — to make this as easy or helpful as it should be. Ideally I’d like to increase the System’s granularity. Unfortunately, most of the changes needed to really do this are so extreme that they’re not worth making. I’ll just have to settle for what I can get.

 

 

6. I want to continue to make the HERO System easier to learn and to use.

 

I think that in 5E and its product line we’ve made major strides in improving the approachability of the HERO System and increasing its “ease of learning” factor. The HERO System is hard-core gaming that rewards attention and effort, and we’re never going to get away from that entirely (nor should we). But anything that can reasonably be done to lessen the learning curve and improve usability is something I want to consider as part of the writing and design of the 6E rules.

 

That's about as much as I can say at this stage of the drama, since I haven't yet begun writing. However, I do not believe that using material from previous editions will be particularly difficult.

 

For now I'm leaving this thread open, but if it veers into 6E forum territory I will close it down. Caveat poster.

[bobrunnicles]

Re: Simple question about 6th Ed

 

You know, I was just contemplating the original post I made a little while ago in the shower, and it occurred to me that I've answered this several times before for other people regarding other games (although these have mostly been now extinct games like Star Frontiers, Gamma World etc), and the answer has always been the same....just because they aren't getting any new stuff published for them doesn't mean they don't still play exactly the same! If I start my group playing 5E and we like it, there's no *necessity* to picking up 6E at all (although I probably would personally, being a completist and all), it's not like there isn't mountains of stuff out there for 5E (more than I could ever use, probably) to play with for years to come.

 

So my original post is mostly just an ill-considered rant, I guess - sorry!

[bobrunnicles]

Re: Simple question about 6th Ed

 

I think the best answer I can give you is to reprint verbatim the opening text from the "Steve's Philosophies for 6E" thread on the 6E forum:

 

 

 

That's about as much as I can say at this stage of the drama, since I haven't yet begun writing. However, I do not believe that using material from previous editions will be particularly difficult.

For now I'm leaving this thread open, but if it veers into 6E forum territory I will close it down. Caveat poster.

 

 

Thanks, Steve - especially for the emphasised bit FWIW I actually posted this here as it seemed like similar threads in the 6E forum were closed for not actually discussing the rules themselves, per se.