Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

[Beazulbob]

I'm not that great at building vehicles in 5th. Below are 2 vehicles, a mech and a satalight. Feedback would be great! I'd like to know if they are kosher, things I missed, etc.

 

1st) A satalight that has a robotic parasite comprimising the computer. The satalight was never intended for living creatures (thus no LS). Its primary purpose was as a weather satalight, the computer that handled that is now part of the parasite. If it were removed, a replacement computer would be needed. The defenses are very high, but it has been reinforced by the robot. I gave it poor movement and strength because it would seem to me that satellites barely qualify as vehicles rather then bases and use weak attitude jets.

The robot has science: weather, combat pilot, transport familiar, and HRRP w/ telescopic +16

 

 

Weather Satellite

 

Score..Stat..Cost

2…SIZE….10

10..STR….-15

13..DEX…...9

12..BODY…0

10..DEF…..24

2…SPEED..-5

Cost

-12…0" Ground

-4…..0" Swim

6……3" Flight

7……{Radar Suite} Radar, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

6……{Radio Suite} HRRP, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

10...{Meson Gun} 3d6-1 RKA (vs ED), OIF (-1), Bulky (-½), 4 ch (-1), +1 Seg (-½)

 

25…..[50] MP Sensor Routines, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

2…….{Spy Vision}: +30 telescopic vision, IR vision

2…….{Spy Radio} +30 telescopic radio, tracking

2…….{Laser Array - I} 2d6-1, RKA, no rng mod (+½), x25 rng (+½), 16 ch (6.25 km)

2…….{Laser Array} 5d6 V Flash, megascale 1"=1000 km (+1), 16 ch2

 

Disadvantage:.20 Appearance: Satalight, Strong, not conceal

Base value:….50

Total:………..70

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

This 2nd vehicle is a mech the size of a compact or sports car. I'm not sure if I should bother with the wheels limitation as the mech can also run. I assume but can be wrong that extra limbs allows it to punch/kick objects. It has a 2nd MP as it has a turret of sorts on each shoulder. The Nanobytes are a specialized nano-tech attack that re-writes machines and computers, making them loyal or even modifying their function some. The hack & internet attack are an extension of this - it can MC a machine it can not touch, though permanant modification requires LOS & range for nanobytes. I plucked the 360 radar from the vehicle sourcebook, but looking at the 5th edition hero sys book, it looks like 360 is free w/ the radio/radar sense.

Score…Stat…Cost

3….SIZE……15

38…STR……13

23…DEX…..39

17…BODY....8

12…DEF…..30

5….SPEED..25

 

8…10" Ground Movement, x2 non-cmbt

62..20" Flight, Usable as swim (+1/4), x8 non-cmbt

8…5" Flight, x2 non-cmbt 1"=100 KM megascale (+¾), OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

15..{Power Reserve} 200 End Batt, 10 Rec, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

2…{Mecha Limbs} Extra Limbs, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

4…{Power Couple} +10 Rec, req conn to pwr grid (-1), OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

10{Scanner} Radar, 360°, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

5….{Secondary System} 2 MP Mech Routines

 

35….[70] MP Mech Routines, OIF (-½), Bulky (-½)

3……{Nanobytes} 3d6-1 Transformation, variable changes (+½), limited to technology targets (-½)

3……{Meson Cannon} 9d6 EB (vs ED), AP (+½)

3……{Laser Cannon} 3d6 RKA (vs ED), AP (+½)

3…….{Missiles} 3d6 RKA (vs PD), no range modifier (+½), 4 clips 8 ch ea

3…….{Hack Focus} 14d6 MC robot/computer class

3…….{Internet}} 10d6 Mind Scan, +10 to hit, robot/computer class, 8 ch 1 turn, Only against robot/computer w/internet connection (-½)

3……..{Morph mode} Shapeshift into compact, sight, hear, touch, 0 end (+½), +18" Ground move, x8 non-cmbt

 

275…Base Value

15….Distinctive feature, can conceal Mecha - major reaction

10….Can be knocked down, Standing takes full phase

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

1) There is no one suppused to ride in it, is there?

I ask for a simply reason: It might better if you build it as an Automaton instead of a Vehicle or Base.

Bases and Vehicles have the advantage of giving their power to those occupying it for free. It's basically a lot of UOO's floating around. The disadvantage is the lack of own action and own senses.

The satellite is not supposed to carry anyone. "Cannot be stunned" is 15 BP. "Does not Bleed" is 15 CP. There are still Hit locations (like the energy Core, the "brain" adn the like). "Takes no Stun" could be on the 45 Point Versions (looses abilites when taking Body) level. But overall you could even leave those automaton powers out. Satellites are normally not very robust, so it is reasonable that he has something similar to being "Stunned" when taking hits. Or this is part of the parasites actions.

You can save a lot from selling back the normal human senses and movement (wich every automaton gets). Had to look if he needs Lifesupport-Powers for Vacuum.

 

2) Multiform is the best way to go here. Had a similar idea not to long ago:

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php/86355-Alternate-Form-Car

Kepp in mind that Limiation that not all all Forms share tend to be less common and severe (after all he can change to a form where it is not a problem), so the "Wheels" limtiation might not be worth much for the car form because of the Robot form.

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

1) I hadn't thought of that... the parasite is the character, who will be improving the satellite over time. I'll write it up as an automaton and see how it looks!

 

2) The character is a soul that possesses machines, including this transformer. I'd be giving a multi-form of a character a seperate multi-form. I could just add another form to the main body to reflect this, though. Does the current write up look like a decent (but small) transformer?

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

A lot depends on the question if the Transformer can act alone:

If this Transformer is something he regulary uses and it can't act on itself (or is different/better when used by him), then yes he has to buy it as Multiform.

If the Transformer can act alone: Buy it as Folower and give him Desoldification + Posession even for general Posession purposes (that is how I would build a Jericho Style Posession).

 

Would not take the Endurance Reserve. Endurance Reserve is right for a generator in a human body or the powersource of a power armor. But a robot could just link that stuff up to his equivalent of "biological system" (the part his normal, motoric endurance comes from).

Also note that the CU has many examples of devices that cost endurance for normal people to use, with the SFX of being "powered by the wearer’s body heat and kinetic motion", including a Flight ring and teleportation Harness.

 

Bulky Focus:

It is not bulky if the charatcer can move it along easily. Or if it is part of something that can move easily on it's own.

 

Look liek a car:

The shape-shift could certainly get a Lockout-Limitation. You could even go so far and say that many powers get OIAID to simulate that some things (like looking inconspicious) only go in car form, others only go in Robot form.

 

Does the size Matter:

Have considered applying some of the Drawback for big size? The rules regarding vehicle size are a little bit wierd however (the given sizes are one step bigger than weight and modifiers for a character of equall size through growth).

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

Oh, i used the bulky focus limit because I used the vehic sourcebook example of the battlevan, mole machine, jetcar, & flying saucer - or are you meaning that if I take it as a multi-form or follower I'd have to drop bulky?

 

The 'driver' of the transformer is a small parasite robot - the same type that is hiding on the satalight. The parasite robots look like a skinny terminator w/out the meat.

 

Backdrop: the character DEM or Deus ex Machina, is a human soul that bounces between several robots, all altered by nanobytes to be receptive to his soul. One such robot is on a satallite. He bounces himself via radio frequencey from one body to another, although they all pass through the satallite, either directly into the robot body there or bounce off the satallite into another body. I bought this as multi-form combined with a teleport (to where ever another body is). One form is a powered suit of armor w a powerful computer lodged inside the suit, so I was trying to make the mech into a different kind of build (a vehicle w/ a small robot driver). It's possible for him to exit the mecha in his robot body, he is, while not powerful, capable (about as tough as a character 100 pts less pts then he is).

 

Posession: I could make the character a Jericho with a bunch of followers, but that could leave me insulated from combat (unable to be knocked out in most circumstances). Probably more true to the character design, but I intended for him to take his lumps in combat, get knocked out (pain from feedback via dmg), and have to scramble to survive tough encounters. Also, when he jumps bodies, he leaves the one he was in last behind, leaving it prone & susceptible to destruction or damage. If they are followers, that means they get killed instead. I'm not sure what a gm would do with repeated sacrifices of followers.

 

With the bodies spread about, unless he has plenty of time to arrange them near each other, typically only a single body is nearby local events (luck of the draw), although in long term games he can move bodies closer together. He was inspired by the character Noman, although quite different in bodies and personality.

 

I'll see if I can track down possession and the option of going with a limitation to take dmg as the possessed follower takes dmg.

 

Assuming I wanted to keep the mech a vehicle, does it look competent? I do not have the ultimate vehicle (where they wrote up some mechs), so I am unsure how this one compares.

 

Either way, thank you for the feedback, its given me quite a bit to consider.

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

So, we have the followign forms:

The Satleite

The Small Robot with a big Mecha (Vehicle could be right in that chase).

 

How about:

Multiform with Focus (the Robot bodies), Affected as Radio Group (can't switch when he can't reach the other), and a Required Roll.

Failing the Roll would either mean that body is "out of range/recently damage and must repair" or it is so far out it takes a lot of extra time (enough steps up on the time table, to make the failed roll a success) to get it to where you need it/to a place you can reach it via radio.

At least for him the satelite could be a Base (he can be there, but the base itself has limited value aside from beign a hard to detect refugium; a fringe chase where both multiform and base could work).

Perhaps he even has Regeneration with Resurrection, simulating that he will always reform up there as long as the satelite is there.

 

Posession (in 6E) normally has feedback. And like all Feedback in 6E it is: Damage after the Defenses of what you Posess, goes as Damage before your defenses. So a long as your defenses are weak (against Feedback) you would be fully succeptible.

 

No idea how good the robot is as a vehicle, have no vehcle book either.

 

About the Focus:

It really depends how hard it is for him to normally move the object. A Big Stone is a Immobile Focus for most, but only a Bulky for Superman and a normal for people with enough growth (Supermans TV thus has more Real points than average Peoples TV's).

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

1) The focus idea is great, although I'm unsure if it should be OAF or OIF (and the character doesn't have the bodies on him, they are located elsewhere in the city or even state.

 

2) I love the affected as radio group! A 1/4 limit I'm sure.

 

3) I put the satallite as a vehicle because of its booster rockets (a small movement). I could have done it as a base, but a vehicle sounded more accurate to me.

 

4) The regen w/ resurrection sounds great, I just need the points to make it work!

 

5) I'm firmly entrenched in 5th edition for budget reasons, as well as not wanting to re-write all my existing material. I'll see if I can locate a 5th edition version of possession.

 

6) I picked up the pdf of the ultimate vehicle book, so I'm starting to research things. I don't have the ultimate base, though.

 

7) Vehicles may apply the bulky limit to their focuses w/out limiting their movement. Go figure.

 

** The character multi-forms

1) Parasite robot riding in the satallite. Prime form, although not likely to see action, he has a blaster and a magnetic tk.

2) Adonis, a android made by aliens to infiltrate human society. A MA with multiple damage shields. Very human looking.

3) Arsenal, a pared down parasite robot wearing a modified battle suit.

4) Blue Man, a android made by aliens to infiltrate another alien society. A brick with growth, invis, or force wall.

5) Onslaught, a pared down parasite robot riding a battle mech.

 

** He can possess robots, androids, and perhaps cyborgs. He can infiltrate computers but doesn't have a computer form.

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

1) when in doubt, always use IIF. It is near impossible to locate his bodies before he uses them/when he not uses them, so that fits for inobvious (in the sense they are hard to take before he uses them).

They are inacessible simply by vitue of being hard to transport (you can't "snatch" away a Android Body as you can a Blaster-Pistol).

 

2) Is 1/4 in 6E, but it depends how common the GM things Radio Senses are (and how easy to track/often disrupted they are).

 

3) The Space-Robot/Sattelite form is currently the weakest (wich also means you can easily make it the Primary form, that pays for the Multiform). But there should be possibilities to use those points: High Processor capabilities (Overall Skill Level simulating taking extra time, if those exist in 5E), Spy-Camreas or other long range observation abilities (not part of the sattelite before he took over), perhaps a database (good knowledge skills). With the multiplier of a base/vehicle you get a lot of opportunities.

 

4) I am not certain how much regen teh Alternate Forms really need. Perhaps it would be okay for them to only pay for Ressurection (asuming that is an adder in 5E, not an Advantage) not for real Healing (this is done in the sattelite). And Perhaps the entire thing is limited to only get him back to 0 or 1 Body.

 

5) In 6E it is in the APG. Basically it is a 40 Standart Effect Mind Controll and 30 Standart Effect Telephaty. (Enough for a +30 MC and +20 Telephaty result vs. EGO 10 and no Mental Defense) for a flat 60 Point Cost, and +1 Cost/+2 for each Effect.

Part of the included Limitations are: Must archieve at least +20 Mind Controll Effect, Your own bodies Senses are Blinded, Feedback, Can only controll his own body as Full Phase action (in wich the posessed being does not acts), Cost Endurance to Maintain.

So in the worst chase you can always rebuild this with standart Mind Controll and Telephaty, linked and/or as Compound Power (when 5E had those).

 

6) I have only seen the Base Writeups in Champiosn 6E. They had a "Lcoation" Power, wich seems to determine just how hard it is for the bad guys to get there (spacestation is more expensive/secure than city).

 

7) Wierd. In the end it depends on the question: Do you make it as a Vehicle or Automaton? Vehicles have of course the problem of not having senses (a lot of point cost; sight alone is 35 Points in 6E) or requiring a targetable driver (because you know where he sits).

 

8)If you ever make a Computer Form, could it be a cheap, refurbished Laptop?

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

1) IIF is indeed safer. Would an inactive body count as bulky?

2) I think it would qualify as the 'not in enviros that prevent radio reception', which is a 1/4

3) The satallite has already been modified beyond its original intent. I have scavanged parts from other satallites, adding weapons. Also, I can use the telescope and radar 'out of the loop', so that Nasa doesn't see what I do.

4) Instead of regeneration - resurrection, I could by a trigger for my teleport & multi-form. Each form has +20 stun, +5 body, only vs damage from prior body (-1). The gm said each body would need resurrect.

5) GM said no to possession - said use multiform and pay the cost of what the body can do.

6) Yeah, bases have to pay for their location, but vehicles do not. Since he manuevers the satallite towards space junk to collect parts, I figure its more vehicle then base. I think a base pays something like 30 points to be in space.

7) Well, I figure that the lack of sight is not a problem, it means that a driver/pilot must interpret the data. The mech is inactive without me plugging into it. The targetable driver bit is a tad worrysome.

8) First he would need to physcially handle it to infect it with nano-machines in order to 'prepare the way'. Afterwords it would be easy, but scary. A computer is so easily destroyed that I think I'd rather opt to hack it then put my soul into it.

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

I've included a link of the write-up with this post. It includes all forms and vehicles used. I figure it's easier to read this way then by piece-meal comments and allusions.

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

7) The problem is that the vehicle needs Senses to even give the driver that much information. When the "driver cabin" of a vehicle is a cubical steel cell, you either need Sight that can see through Steel ("Penetrating" Sense Modifier for sight in 6E) or a camera on the outside that gives you information (buy the Vehicle the Sight-Sense).

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

I've looked up tank and mecha examples, and they do not buy sight (although they do pick up infra & nightvision). Although you could define a vehicle as not giving LOS to the outside world and could take vision as a power, I think that it is not assumed nor required.

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

Adonis:

His weight woudl be a Problem. 400 kg is simply to much to fake being human. He would most likely break most chairs by sitting on them, when he ever falls the impact/problems with helping him up would be noted, any medical examination would reveal that.

Not to mention problems with beds, most floors and the other gender if he likes to be on top...

 

The Mecha:

Recently read the part about 6E Vehicle Combat/Movement again. Apparently all vehilces are supposed to have a turn mode, unless bought off. Better check that back before finalizing him.

 

Would have put a "Multiple Inacessible, Inobvious, Bulky Foci" Limitation on the Multiform instead of making it a Complication/Disad. A teleport is not really nessesary, after all it is very likely that his body is just to far out the be usefull.

 

No Ide for the rest, as I do not own 5E.

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

Adonis does have serious problems hiding his robotic nature. It could be I should set his weight to 200 kg instead, its just that a metal & plastic man seems he would be very heavy.

 

Turn modes, why did it have to be turn modes! I'll check 5th edition, but I'm sure it will require the same. A very small and clumsy mech!

 

I put the body foci as a disadvantage since each body has to deal with it, not just the body that buys the MF. Any body can be damaged while uninhabited.

 

The teleport is megascale to reach the satallite, once there, he beams himself back to earth in a different body.

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

I see it that technically you play a guy with Alternate Forms. So the main point of focus for all complications and limitations should be his sheet. After all, he is the one that get's XP, has to pay for the Power of Multiform, dies, etc...

It is just like playing someone with Folowers, when the PC and Folower can never be at the same time in the same place.

[Beazulbob]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

What would you think the limit should be? A +1 seems too good (even for oaf bulky), perhaps a 1/2?

[Christopher]

Re: Need feedback & help building 2 vehicles

 

What would you think the limit should be? A +1 seems too good (even for oaf bulky)' date=' perhaps a 1/2?[/quote']

In 6E we have rules for "Multiple Foci". This falls under "Multpile Foci, where losing a Focus disabled a part of the Power". It's "at least 1/4 less Limitation". So just take bulky Foci and substract 1/4 from the limitation Value.