Klytus

Originally posted by JmOz

I use Desolid, allow it to only be effected by one special effect as a -0 limitation, but then wave the +2 affects solid

 

So in essence 40-80 points depending on if you want it persistent

Yep. This is how I handle it.They even say in FREd under Dwesolid how it can be used as a form of invulnerabiity. I call it 90 Active Points to have a True Invulnerability: Desolid (40) ) END & Persistent (+1) Inherent (+1/4) = 90 Active Points. Then you fill in the appropriate Limitation for the one very specific form of atack you are immune to. I feel the need to make it worth at least 90 AP because 75% Resistant Damage Reduction is 60 points, and anything that is essentialy 100% RDR must be more expensive.

OK, this isn;t an in-game quote per-se, but I saw someon on the WoTC boards with this quote in his sig line, nearly busted a gut because it was so wrong, so I decided I simply MUST share:

from Fool of a Took (the handle being used on the board in question)

"Dad, what's the blowhole for?"-Chris *pointing to a whale*

"I'll tell you what it's not for son. And then you'll understand why I can never go back to SeaWorld."-Peter

I've seen Hard Skin written up like this:

Skin-Like-Steel: 4d6NND - not vs Resistant PD of 10 or better (40 points), Reduced Endurance 0 END and Persistent (+1), Does BODY (+1) Continuous (+1), Damage Shield (+1/2), (140 Active Points); Reciprocal (Only does as much damage as attacker) (-1/2), Only vs Physical Blows (-1/2). Real Cost = 70 points.

Personally, I've long felt that the object BODY rules are one the major places the HERO system falls appart. The idea that an object can do only as much damage as it has DEF + BODY regardless of who is swinging/throwing it is ludicrous. If I throw a baseball at you, it will hurt. If Nolan Ryan throws it at you, it will hurt more, but if a brick with more STR than the DEF+BODY of the baseball throws it, that baseball will do the same amount of damage, regardless of whether it is thrown by Bulldozer or Grond or even Superman. This same law applies to using a baseball bat as a weapon. Unless I am mistaken (I do not have FREd handy) it doesn't ADD any damage to your blow, it only sets an upper-limit of how much damage you can do because the object is fragile.

Personally, I add the DEF of the object to the damage being done with it. So 70 STR +DEF 5 = 19d6 of damage. However, using Move-Through logic, the car takes half the full amount of this damage, or all of it if the target takes no knockback (which is very likely to destroy it). Since this is a car we're talking about, I'd also call it a 1 hex Area of Effect attack.

When throwing something, use the DEF+BODY to determine base damage, then add damage from velocity using the Throwing Things table. Again, treat it as a Move-Through for the object in question.

I finally have a quote from a Champions game!

Said to our mentalist who was about to attack the enemy (female) brick.

"Bitch-slap her grey matter!"

In our group, there are only 2 of us that really understand the ins and outs of the Hero system - both from the rules and years of RP experience. This is why we usually work with the others when they design a character. The player in question describes a character concept, and we all sit down at the computer with Creator (I don't have Hero Designer yet) and we start plugging in the numbers and using our best design tricks. It works very well for us. The only complaints we get are regarding the difference between an imagined concept, what looked good on paper, but doesn't work in game. No one ever fusses about "His character is better than mine!"

Originally posted by Powerhouse

I never liked CLOWN much and as for Sanctuary... no. I can't see sharing space with someone who tried to kill me last week when he was trying to blow up a bridge.

 

Many supervillains are psychopaths, meglomaniacs, and the like... not who I want to chill with.

I think a major reason for doing Sanctuary was so that players who fancied their character was the next Reed Richards could sit and play chess against Dr. Destroyer and have it be "believeable" that no one was captured or actively trying to kill each other.

Originally posted by scholz

Is anyone seriously considering something like Rigid Armor?

 

I was really just talking about taking a some damage for haymakering something tough.

 

There are probably ways to buy this effect as a power (eg. Damage Shield). But that would seem odd for say a generic concrete wall. And yet if I hit a generic concrete wall with all my might, I am not likely to break it (although with 5 1/2 d6 of normal damage I could do it). I would be likely to hurt myself.

 

I was thinking more of a combat affect like the damage from movebys and movethroughs.

 

Maybe limiting it resistant defenses (most walls and such) and Haymakers is the way to go. I would probably give the 1/2 stun for hit locations (hand) or x2 (for head), even if I didn't use the locations normally to simulate that is unlikely you'd knock yourself out with a punch to a wall. But that you might actually do it with a head butt.

Sorry... got a little sidetracked.

Anyway, I don;t see why it would necessarily be limited to haymakers. If I punch a brick wall with the same force I apply to punching a person hard enough for it to hurt them, odds are I am going to hurt my hand on that wall - I'll just hurt it even worse if I'm insane enough to try to haymaker the wall. And in the comics, mortal men were forever hurting themselves by punching Superman with normal blows.

I like the idea, though, that if you do not beat the BODY of a resistant target, you're gonna take "feedback" as if you had failed to do knockback with a Move Through - but halved because this is all being applied to your hand..

Originally posted by Gary

Rigid Armor would be even better than a force wall that never falls down. A KA that penetrates the FW would still do full stun minus the FW. Rigid armor subtracts the body before the stun multiple.

 

Ex: A 20 body 80 stun attack would do 7 body 67 stun through the FW applied to the person's regular defenses.

 

A 20 body 80 stun attack vs 13 rigid armor would do 7 body 28 stun applied to the person's non-rigid defenses.

 

It's more than 163 pts of effect for 49 pts.

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn that a barrier of any kind blocked an equal amount of STUN as BODY. I'll have to re-read FREd when I get home.

Originally posted by Geoff Speare

Sure, good point. You could do a couple other similar ones. What bugs me is non-related movement powers tossed in because they can be: Swimming, Running, Tunnelling, Teleport, etc. with little to no concern for special effects.

Well, that same gripe holds true for any attempt to cram any collection of powers into a multipower because it's efficient rather than because it fits concept and/or SFX.

Anyway, since this particular mechanic fits the concept, I've decided to let it stand.

Originally posted by archer

I've postulated an Advantage for Resistant Defenses called Rigid Defenses. Mainly, the Rigid Defenses would subtract their BODY from the BODY of a Killing Attack before determining STUN, rather than after. Rigid Defenses would also fall under the Self-Inflicted Damage rule. Rigid Defenses would be a +1/4 Advantage.

The only other way to simulate this in game is with a Force Wall. Consider a brick with this as a defense: Force Wall 13 PD/ED (65 points), Invisible to All Senses (+1), Reduced END & Persistent (+1), Uncontrolled (+½), Personal Immunity, (+¼) , Self Only (-½). Active Point Cost: 244. Total Cost: 163 points.

Basically, unless an attack does more than 13 BODY, he takes NO damage from it. Because the FW invisible, it appears as if it is simply natural toughness soaking up the damage. Because it is Persistent & Uncontrolled, it will come up again immediately after it is penetrated. The Personal Immunity allows him to interact normally with the real world as if the FW was not there (which, in reality, it isn't - the FW is just a mechanic to reflect his defenses). I didn't buy it Always On because that is not a Limiting factor here.

But, if we just stuck this Rigid advantage on 13 PD/ED of Armor, it would replicate 163 real points of power for just 49 points.

Um.... no.

Originally posted by Kristopher

It's 8? How does that work out?

It doesn't. Me and my friggin' typos...

You can always just House-rule it that Regen is its own power, just like in 4th Ed. This way, the fact that it "ignores" Healing rules is irrelevant because it isn't Healing. I did this for a while, then I went to the 5th Ed structure simply for uniformity. 5th Ed cost is also cheaper, 8 pts rather than 10, but the Active Point Cost is 20.

Originally posted by zarglif69

Hmmmmm... I'd recommend an AoE 0 End persistant always on no range transform vs. Ego, to change psychological limitations. Mind control wouldn't work very well for this purpose.

I thought about this... only there is a tendency to use Transform as the deus ex machina power, so I try to avoid it whenever possible. I don't understand why you think Mind Control wouldn't work well for this.

Doomsday would have to go here as well. He's an utterly mindless engine of death and destruction who does nothing BUT destroy. Only problem is, he is almost impossible to controll. Braniac tried once, and lost in the end.

It may be opinion, but I gotta agree with it: Doomsday is not a villian. Doomsday is an unstaoppable machine of destruction with no goals or motivation other than to destroy everything that moves. That isn't a villian - its a plot device. DC wanted to do Superman Dies story-arc, so they created Doomsday to show that no one else currently existing in the DCU could have done it other than somthing this powerful. The same thing with Bane and Batman - only Bane is actually an interesting character

Originally posted by Lord Liaden

Dean Shomshak did present one intriguing alternative take on a serial killer, though. He pointed out that most serial killers are skilled at leading a double life, often doing charity work, attending church regularly and otherwise appearing to be a "pillar of the community". Serial killers crave recognition and validation, and tend to have delusions of omnipotence. So, what would such a person do if he suddenly acquired superpowers?

 

Why, he'd become a superhero.

Hmm. If you buy this theory, I could see "Former Serial Killer" being used as a Social Limitation by a "reformed" hero. Suppose this guy turns out to be a fine, noble hero, if a bit of a glory hound. Then one of those super-detectives discovers that years ago, he was the "Infamous Taunting the Police Serial Killer".

I know that basic telekinesis is visible, but in what WAY is it visible? I mean, does a colored beam of force emanate from the character to the target? Or is it simply obvious that the guy standing over there moving his hands is the one moving all the objects about?

I am attempting to design an android for use as a PC, only I'm having serious problems balancing this thing. In an effort to tweak points, I came up with a 20 point Multipower with slots for various Enhanced Senses. Example:

Slot 1) Standard Sense Mode: IR Vision, UV Vision, Ultrasonic Hearing, +4 PER with Vision

Slot 2) Analysis Mode: Detect Mutants at Range as a Sense, x10 Rapid

Slot 3) Blackout Mode: Radar, -5 PER Penalty to detect

The idea being, of course, the droid must select a sensor mode to use as circumstances dictate. Not all of the senses can be used together, so there is a limitation here. However, putting Enhanced Senses, things which are not that expensive anyway, into a Multi Power just may be cheesy beyond words.

I'm torn, so I'd like some feedback before I go forward with this.

Thanks.

Re: need help building this power

Originally posted by bubblegmkd

I'm building a character that emits an aura that causes those effected to act apon their base impulses ie. if they wanted something they would take it or maybe an innocent bystander gets in the way of an effected hero and they blast with their energy blast, those that have a code against killing might kill...any help with this one is greatly appreciated.

It sounds like Mind Control xxd6, Radius Area of Effect (+1), 0 END (+1/2), No Range (-1/2), One Command Only: Ignore Your Morality and Act on Impulse (-1).

Of course, you are going to need some serious amounts of dice in the Mind Control, because getting moralistic Superheroes to ignore their morality is at least a +30 EGO effect. Ironically, this power is more dangerous to its owner than those it affects. Think about it - this clown will be surrounded by super-powered imulsive hot-heads who now have no reservations about killing folks who piss them off.

This is the main reason I almost never use pre-published materials in my Champs games. There are some character concepts that I like so much I import - like Thunder and Lightning - but I always tweak them to my taste.

D&D, on the other hand... its too much work to do custom stuff. I just have to endure players knowing the basics of some monsters - which is why they run into so many PC-class badguys or things like Ogres with levels in fighter.

Always keep 'em guessing.

The effect I am trying to create is flight using a combination of anti-gravity (AG) and thrust - kinda like Hawkman. Basically, someone is wearing an anti-gravity device and they have a jet back or some other way of producing the thrust for forward momentum. If they get hit or stunned, they will not fall, as the AG belt is what is keeping them up. Obviously, if you take away the AG belt, they can't get airborn.

My initial build on this is to have two seperate flight powers: the first slot is just to float, no forward thrust; the second being thrust only. But I'm wondering if there is a more efficient construct for this.

As far as the under-powered thing goes, IIRC, it said that the Olympians were far below their normal power levels because they had just broken back through to the mortal plane. This leaves plenty of room for them to grow back to their "normal" power levels.

Originally posted by Catacomb

Dude...60-65? He juggled planets. Let me say it again...HE JUGGLED PLANETS!!!

Not until the Silver Age.

I agree that the write-ups are a tad on the dull side - but at least they are a solid inspiration for the kinds of powers and abilities the gods should have. I mean, Zeus' Thunderbolts [7d6 RKA] are nothing to sneeze at!