GestaltBennie

IIRC. Rod Currie was working on a Canada/Windsor .Hero Plus sourcebook.

Mind you, as far as Canadian supers go, they're much like American ones, but nicer (and more creative, and better looking and much more humble...)

###

I ran into the following while looking up references for a thread on RPG.NET. I once played a character who was the son of Johnny Canuck based on faulty childhood memories of the books; it was interesting to go back and look at the originals in all their Golden Age charm (which, given that they include a lost civilization in the "jungles of Libya" makes fors a rather surreal experience) .

http://mackenziemurdock.tripod.com/dimecomicsvol1no1february1942/

If one doesn't mind using characters who aren't in the public domain as part of their PCs' backstory, there's something to be used here. (Heck. Byrne used theGolden Age character Nelvanna as Snowbird's mother in Alpha Flight, though he didn't explicitly infringe on the copyright.)

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by CrosshairCollie

VIPER watch? Has VIPER finally hired agents smart enough to tell time?

Nope. But when VIPER finishes building its time manipulator, VIPER agents won't need to tell time, because time will become whatever VIPER tells it to be! Mwahahaha!

::ahem::

Scott Bennie

.

I've had a fair number of religious PCs; my longest standing PC had his faith affirmed after a visit to a comic book style Hell. Heck. even my PC in the PBeM that I'm in with Hermit is a practicing Mennonite, though with his chronic swearing, promiscuity, and psychotic episodes it's often hard to see his faith. :-)

Scott Bennie

Re:

Originally posted by HeroTina

we got our office copies Monday and will be sending out review and artist copies tomorrow.

 

T.

Wahoo! :-)

Can't wait to see it.

Scott Bennie

I've seen two episodes of the animated series. I'll give it a few more chances, but thus far seeing the offspring of Batman: The Animated Series and Wolfman/Perez's Teen Titans run reduced to PokeTitans isn't just disappointing, it's heartwrenching.

If others can find something they enjoy in this, great - I know this is supposed to be light fare - but right now the character designs and stock anime visual gags are grating on me.

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by OddHat

The characters are cool, but I have reservations about the power inflation. I'd hate to see Champions end up with White Wolf syndrome, the PCs completely inefectual in the face of unstopable NPCs. I love Takofanes from a conceptal point of view, and I'm actively using Menton; even so, Champions is a game about heroes. The occasional game where a super must sacrifice himself to save the world is fantastic and absolutely in genre; an

But if endless stream of undefeatable foes is not. Yes, it's the GMs job to make sure that his players don't feel like they've wandered into an Aberrant pick up game by mistake (unless that's what they're aiming for) but I worry when henchmen (or women) have 1000+ points outside of a cosmic game.

 

Just a thought...

Most of Viperia's additional points (over 4th ed) go toward a few new tricks; her base ttack is bout 5 points higher than 4th ed. She's been tweaked, not "grossified". The major change to the character is in her background, which I think is light years better (and clearer) than her 4th edition counterpart.

When designing combat oriented characters, the most important questions that a designer needs o ask are: what storylines can you hook the character into, what will the PCs think about fighting this character, and will they produce memorable combats?

In Viperia's case, she's meant to be a character whom VIPER can use as a weapon of last resort (the pissed off agency who decides they need "an ultimate superhuman weapon" *is* a staple of supervillain agencies in the comics that dates at least as far back as the first appesarance of Him/Adam Warlock - if you're thinking of Viperia as a mook you're making a *HUGE* mistake), whose powers will be respected and feared by the players before the fight, and whose combats will be extremely tough and memorable - but not insurmountable. These are the goals that I was concerned about when designing her.. "Will players be offended by the number of point totals on the character sheet" did not - and should not - enter into my thinking.

Bluntly, players who obsess about villain point totals will always obsess over them, players who are insecure about villain power levels will always be insecure about them. I know because I've been there, as a GM I've bent over for players in the past to try to assauge their fears; nothing I did was enough, and all it accomplished was to preclude some potentially interesting stories from the campaign.

Yet the insurmountable foe *is* boring, Campaigns where PCs are constantly ground into the dust are the worst games you can possibly run. Sometimes the complaint against villain point totals means "don't give my character any anxious moments" (sorry) and sometimes it means "don't bore us and make us feel useless by putting us against insurmountable foes" (legitimate). However. if your game's about superheroes and you're aspiring to say, an Avengers tone, the adversaries have got to be worthy of the heroes and vice versa. You can't feed the Avengers a straight diet of Fabian Stankowiczs and have them feel like real Avengers. Superheroes and supervillains in a comic book have a very symbiotic relationship.

So the problem for the designer with a character like Viperia (which trickles down, like all problems, to the GM) is creating a villain of stature who fits into the genre niche but won't be so tough that they kill the fun of the campaign for most reasonable players.

The best solution I think is to find the right baseline to produce the desired effects in a campaign, and then provide additional advice to the GM to customize. In Viperia's case, I nudged her power level up a wee notch to balance some of the 5th Edition character creation tendencies, but I didn't want to go too far; based on anecdotal evidence I'd heard on 4th edition games, she produced tough fights for experienced heroes but not Total Party Kills, which was about where I wanted her. I also tried to expand on her background and campaigning advice., to make her less bland and easier to use.

When you get the book (if you're so inclined), you'll be able to judge for yourself whether we succeeded in making her a useful character or whether she's a grotesque monstrosity with no place in your game.

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by Blue

Desperation

For those who haven't seen the playtest manuscript, the new Ripper (and Oculon) are rather more impressive (power level wise) than they were in previous editions. Viperia has also been reworked and has been slightly elevated in power and versatility.

Desperation indeed.

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by J4y

I am the viper, I have come to vipe your vindows.

Sorry. You may only quote the *good* GI Joe episodes around here. :-)

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by gewing

Did the half elf get him, or was it the outraged fates?

The fates, and an unfortunate encounter with a roper.

Scott Bennie

From a recent D&D game.

We saw a very short half-elf while in a town. We learned that it was an elf cross-bred with a dwarf.

Bard: "And they call him... Mini-Sidhe!"

The bard died later.

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by OddHat

I find it difficult to hate villains; most of the better written ones I quite like, and the poorly written ones just leave me cold. That said, fighting against Demon, Dark Seraph and Black Paladin is great fun. Tallisman or Morningstar from the new books would be fun as well. Nothing quite like a villain who proudly declaims "I'm Evil with a capital E! I steal candy from babies and pee on parades! Kittens and little bunny rabbits of the world fear my power! BWAHAHAHAHAHA!"

Black Paladin wasdefinitely the villain in the CU that my old PC Thundrax loved to hate. He provided numerous good, hard, close fights, and his personality (ancient, arrogant magical bully) clashed well with Thundrax's (modern teenaged boy scout).

Bulldozer 's designed to be someone female players will enjoy showing up, and has been that way since his creation.

After one session, my PCs *despised* Black Harlequin.

Scott Bennie.

Originally posted by Blue

I dropped (4) 5-man teams into a scenario in my last game. I might as well have been walking the agents into a meat grinder. The agents dropped no one and barely injured anyone. Only my NPC hero was having difficulty with them. It was ugly!

 

And I would have thrown in a few super-powered villains to even things out if my players weren't having so much fun.

 

I've gone to great lengths to come up with good villains for my players, and here the ones they enjoyed the most are the ones they annihilated. I knew viper was good for something.

What exactly was VIPER's problem in the fight? Were they failing to hit, did their weapons fail to penetrate when they did hit, did the heroes eliminate large numbers of agents before they had a chance to attack or some combination of the three?

I'm sure if we analyze the problem, it shouldn't be too hard for VIPER to develop a few tactics to deal with the heroes more effectively next time.

Scott Bennie

VIPER now uses Four-Teams and Eight-Teams, depending on the job.

Scott Bennie

Of the ones unlikely to be reprinted or reworked…

“Strike Force†by Aaron Allston. All of Aaron’s Hero System work is worth having (and pressing into one’s bosom in delight), but this is his best published Champions work. “The Blood and Dr. McQuark†is also an exceptional piece and one I’d recommend to Champions fans.

“Underworld Enemiesâ€, by Chris Avellone. A early work by one of the best (and most twisted minds in the industry). Avellone’s other Dark Champions work (“Widows and Orphans†and “Asylumâ€) are both highly recommended.

“Kingdom of Champions†by Phil Masters. A good look at Britain for a superhero role-play game, though the abbreviated format for many of the characters is a bit of a pain. “Champions of the North†by Jon Mattson, which provides a similar treatment for Canada, is especially beloved by GMs of low point games, but skirts some of the more controversial political issues (Quebec is particularly underrepresented).

“To Serve and Protect†by Scott Heine. A great look at a superhero team, and a nifty adventure to boot.

“Shadows of the City†by Scott Sigler. The best Hero adventures are by people named Scott, and this one, involving a superhuman cultist, is a good one.

“VOICE of Doom†by Steve Perrin, “The Great Supervillain Contest†by Dennis Mallonee, and "ATLAS Unleashed" are all nifty modules to run.

I’m assuming most of the content of Steve’s Dark Champions books, San Angelo, and Normals Unbound will be redone at some point, othewrise I’d also recommend them.

Just a bit of an update.

I'm finishing up my sections and should be turning over my draft to Steve tomorrow. I've been looking through the thread and bolstering my sections based on your feedback. I can't wait to see what the playetesters do with it (aside from correcting my horrible Bennie math) I think it's turning out to be a pretty cool book. Thanks for your help and ideas!

Scott Bennie

I hadn't heard of the Big Red Cheese scheduled for any eps this season.

From what I've heard, "Tabula Rasa" is an Amazo episode, "Only A Dream" is a Dr. Destiny episode. And it's probably safe to bet that "Eclipsed" is their Eclipso episode.

Scott Bennie

"Legacy" and "Apokcolips Now" are two of the best Superman stories ever and worth seeing on their own. Word from Hong Kong (where JL Season 2 is currently airing) has been very favorable to "Twilight", so I'm looking forward to it.

Scott Bennie

A good superhero team should have a healthy dose of dynamism and soap opera. I think if I were to do a new Champions team right now, it'd be:

- Defender

- Quantum NM (lieutenant)

- Solitaire

- Ironclad (whom everyone expects to act like former member Obsidian because they're both big alien bricks, and he's getting really tired of it)

- Nighthawk (every team needs an edgy type, and Nighthawk provides that)

- Sapphire (every group needs "The Kid", a Kitty Pryde type that the big boys can show the ropes, with a bit of tweaking, Sapphire fills the role)

- Kinetik

- Doc Silverback (why not?)

Seeker would be the former member who keeps coming back for a few adventures, then goes back to his own book. He'd also have a bit of rivalry with Nighthawk - people know that one of these days, they're gonna drop the gloves and have at it eventually, but not yet.

Obsidian would be the alien former member and current ally who occasionally guest stars in the book when they go cosmic. Jaguar would be another former member; since he was cured of his lycanthropy, he was mostly fogotten, but still maintains a low-key friendship with Quantum and is occasionally used as a contact by Nighthawk.

I might also make Cavalier a former member who had an explosive relationship with Defender while he was on the team, then quit in disgust. Similarly, I might have it so that Lady Blue once briefly reformed, joined the team, then backslid back into crime, providing a certain amount of angst for Defender. Bitter former members are fun.

Id also have had it that at one time, when Defender got seriously hurt, some kids replaced him and did the whole CNM "Team Defender" gimmick for awhile, and that the kid who was in the pilott's seat during that run is now on his way to becoming his own superhero.

It's all in the soap opera.

Scott Bennie

I like the archetype; it's pretty much the quintessence of the four-color genre. Just as long as the PCs in an upper-medium-to-high powered game have the opportunity to eventually reach his level of power and gameworld respect, I have no problems with it.

The "why do you need the PCs if Supes is around?" syndrome is a bit of a problem, (just as it can be to fanatical comic book fans who wonder why there aren't more crossovers in a superhero world). My world has a lot of active NPCs; my solution for my Superman-like character was to have him do a lot of work for the space program and be happier doing it than flying around dirty cties and getting into brawls, so there was a built-in buffer between him and the PCs. Even so, I gave the PCs opportunities to bond with him, and they must have worked, because late in the campaign I ran a session where the first half hour of the game was taken up watching him fight an alien champion ("with the fate of earth in the balance!") via satellite from an alien world. I was worried the players would get bored fast, but they were quite happy to spend that time making comments and cheering him on during the battle. .

Scott Bennie

Re: Re: Re: Afterthought

Originally posted by Lord Liaden

King Cobra's Coil organization from Champions Presents II had a unique martial art based on snake's movements. Scott, will the maneuvers in your art have evocatively serpentine names like that one did?

Yep. The maneuvers all have nice, snaky names.

Scott Bennie

Re: Afterthought

Originally posted by Peregrine

The VIPER ninja wouldn't happen to be practicioners of Mist Viper Taijutsu from UMA, would they?

No.I had in mind a martial art that was more of a combination of grappling and striking techniques, so there's a new one in the book. But Steve's the master of Hero martial arts (as well as the owner of the ccmpany), so what he says goes. :-)

Scott Bennie

Re: If only wishes came true .

Originally posted by TheQuestionMan

From what I've read so far Scott it looks like you got a lot of work ahead of you . You also opened the Herophile/Pandors's box . Are you gong to be able to close it ?

 

I look forward to your updates and teasers . You are going to keep us updated aren't you ?

I don't want to get into specifics (especially since Steve has the final say on what goes in here), but I'm finishing up the agents chapter right now, and I'm counting over thirty types of agents here, from General Combat Specialists to Underworld Specialists to Snake Cultists to VIPER ninja. There's also at least four special squads, each treated like.supervillains with their very own plot hooks

Over the last year or so, Steve and I have been working out the background of VIPER. No one's really complained about it, but given that the concept of evil agencies have their roots in the pulp genre, VIPER's history lacks the appropriate depth and gravitas. Neo-Nazis and labor organizers? Bah! VIPER should have a more epic stature - a more "pulp" feeling. Hopefully the new history and the identity of the Supreme Serpent will provide it and generate lots of cool story hooks.

How's that for a tease?

I'm pretty confident that what Steve and I will provide will knock the socks off the original book.

Scott Bennie

Originally posted by Prometheus

That summarizes why in my campaign she was relegated to a Secret Weapon/Thaw When Needed role. If the heroes ever got too close, the VIPER heirarchy fetched her out of deep freeze, dusted her off, and set her loose of the heroes.

Which was *precisely* the way she was meant to be handled..

Scott Bennie

Re: Faster Combat

Originally posted by BoloOfEarth

I'd like some suggestions on ways to handle mass combat, the VIPER way. Some way to deal with 40-50 agents duking it out with a superhero team, without having to roll 40-50 times every phase, but without fully losing individual agent flavor or weapons variety.

 

I love VIPER, and have used them in every campaign I've run. The 4th Ed VIPER sourcebook was one of the best, IMO. But it's hard to run scores of agents without bogging down the combat slower than normal.

That was the first thing I wrote when I did the initial VIPER draft for CNM two years ago. I consider a good tactics section the biggest thing we missed in the first book.

Scott Bennie

It's the age old problem. Provide more realistic details to a four-color simulation, and you end up making it interesting. Push the genre conventions to its logical conclusions, however, and it breaks.

My feeling is we should try to answer those questions, but not get so wrapped up in the simulation that three years down the road, someone like Mutants and Masterminds will come out with their own organization book and everyone will love it more than VIPER because "VIPER got so bogged down by the petty details that they forgot how much fun it is for superheroes to slug it out with a horde of agents."

My hope is we;'ll find a middle ground, and give the GM enough tools to easily shape the organization the way he wants.

Scott Bennie