WistfulD

Well, "hunter's bomb" doesn't really make much sense. Having grown up eating traditional Jägerschnitzel (flattened veal in brown gravy), it was a weird shock to discover the frat boys of the world getting sauced on Jägerbombs.

Rest in Peace Randy Hollingsworth... I just found out about his death from Eodin today... Randy was out partner in crime on Traveller Hero, and will be greatly missed... there will be a dedication to him and also Dave Sering who another inspiration to me, Dave was the production manager and Traveller line editor at Judges Guild

I'm sorry to hear that. I've just recently started reading Designers and Dragons, so I've been slowly learning the names and places to all the history behind these games.

Its not that difficult once you decipher the system. And HERO includes a lot of ways to add as much or as little detail that you want to simulate your battles.

 

The bonuses from high speed makes sense. If one vehicle in a dogfight is significantly faster than another, it essentially sets the tone for thr dogfight. Because if the faster vehicle waants to disengage from the fight, the slower vehiclencan essentiallu do nothing to stop them. But at thensame time, to engage in an active dogfight, if one vehicle is significantly faster than another, it is going to have to slowdown at least somewhat to engage the slower vehicle (imagine an F-22 trying to engage a sopwith camel with gunfire while dogfighting)

Which bonuses for high speed? I'm talking about the fact that the vehicle with higher speed doesn't get to roll more to-hits unless they roll really well on dogfighting, where-as high speed person-to-person nets you extra attacks every turn. This seems to make Speed less valuable.

Yeah, that riposte move is a naked advantage designed to be useable with up to a 60 active point melee weapon.

 

This question was why in previous versions of Hero, damage adds from Str, skill levels and Martial arts could only ever augment the attack until it reached double the base DC of the attack being augmented. That was demoted from a standard rule to an optional rule in the 6th edition.

Up to 60 Base Point melee attack, but yes.

Which would make it a 105 Active Point attack. I wonder, does this  violate a (for instance) 60 point Active Point cap? Trigger is one of those advantages (Like charges over 16 or Reduced Endurance) that doesn't actually alter the attack, but if someone had a 60 AP cap, a 4D6 attack, and a naked advantage that added Armor Piercing, I'd definitely call that breaking the cap.

PSL's count as Skills. When Skills are bought as a power, they are classified as Special Powers. Special Powers cannot be placed in Frameworks without GM permission.( CC, p.50)

 

Limitations cannot be applied to Skills that cost less than 3 point's per level.(CC, p.27)  RAW, you could put on a Limitation, if you bought the PSL's at the 3 point level with all your character's attacks.

 

I would omit the (must hit eyes) and the PSL's from the power(and would require it as a GM). It's just part of the special effect of the power and well covered conceptually by the (not vs blind or covered eyes) limitation. 

Of course they're skills! That was the glaringly obvious part I was missing.

Limitations on skills, hmmm. Is that why guns with an RMod are normally built with +1 to hit with a limitation (only to negate range penalties) instead of a PSL?

I guess the not blind/eye cover does, well, cover it. That, plus it deletes the bad form of including multiple limitations that overlap (I think of covering the eyes as an active action, but having their head be out of your frame of fire definitely should count).  

So here is a revision:

Multipower: 60 Active Points, all powers have beam (-¼), OAF(-1) (27 Real Points)

--2f Damaging laser setting RKA (energy) 3D6 (45 Active Points); beam (-¼), OAF(-1) (20 Real Points)

--2f Optical Stunner -- Blast 6D6 (30 Base Points); AVAD (Flash Defense: Vision; +1) (60 Active Points); Alternate Defense (Blind, Covering Eyes; -½), Beam (-¼), OAF (-1) (22 Real Points)

--2f Epilepsy Ray -- Entangle (3D6 Body, 3 Mental Defense; 30 Base Points) ACV:--None, mental attacks get ACV(OMCV instead of OCV), but mind-effecting weapons tend to be mental powers with ACV (OCV instead of OMCV), so it's a wash, (+/-0); Takes No Damage From Attacks (Mental Attacks, also Cured By Standard Treatment for Visually-Induced Epilepsy; +¾), Works Against Con, not Ego, not STR (+¼) (60 Active Points); Alternate Defense (Blind, Covering Eyes; -½), Beam (-¼), OAF (-1) (22 Real Points)

Anything else I am missing?

Does OAF supercede restainable?

What are the rules on Strength Minimums for weapons that don't add damage? Straight - 1/4? -0?

Anything else that should be added for weapons?

+1 OCV and +1 RMod would be (respectively):

+1 OCV (5 Active Points);  OAF (-1) (2 Real Points)

+1 OCV (5 Active Points); OAF (-1) Limitation (Only to Counter Range Penalties; -1/2) (2 Real Points)

or would they also get beam, str min, etc?

P.S. Equipment is hard! No wonder we use cash most of the time!

I like that Sean.  Probably too detailed for me to use in most games, but I do like it.  

At what point in your system would you incur the CV penalty outlined in the rules?  Or would you just ignore them an count on the penalties from your system?

GURPS 3E had a rigorous set of rules for alcohol consumption in their players guide (a late edition colation of optional rules and over-complexity) which could be considered diffinitive (for their own rule set), but too detailed to ever use.

Here in Heroes, we at least have precidence that alcohol is just another power that can be used on/at/by characters.

It depends on the GM running it, but generally you are correct. You cannot get a 30 pt. attack and load 40-50 pts. of DC modifiers on top of it. There's a certain amount of hand waving depending on the DM (for instance, a 5 pt martial art maneuver might be considered 5 pts instead of the actual DC cost), but overall that's the limit.

It's actually a very nice thing to do for players, because it relieves them from having to try to find ways around it (and dedicate even more points to a given power). If you are trying to create the Human Torch, and you want him to be genuinely immune to fire, you know that you only have to take damage negation for 10 DCs of fire damage (Example used specifically because this is the only situation where I'd want to give a character full immunity). Likewise, if you are trying to create a hero with an attack which is "as powerful as exists in this universe," you know how to do it.

You just change the scale of the hexes when their movement gets that high. 10"(80") just divide by 10 for 1"(8") per segment.

This is actually where we're a little intimidated about vehicle combat. All the arc of fires and who is facing who. We'd like to use the dogfight rules, except it really penalizes someone who put a lot into high speed unless they make a phenominal roll. 

If he wants it to be an HA attack, as opposed to just pushing people around, it is the same attack as he has, except with AoE, linked to movement. There's an example in 6E1 about a jetpack that has darkness as an area behind the character (I think in the darkness descriptor area). That should have any other modifiers I can't think of right now.

Well, I'm trying to start with RAW, and GM-fiat/hand-wave on an exception by exception basis, so let me know where the flaws are.

Grailknight: I didn't see where PSLs weren't allowed in a framework, where is the reference for that? You're also saying that the limitations would not apply to the PSLs, not even OAF? Is that the case with any bonus to hit (both not allowed in a framework and no points for limitations)? Straight up +1 OCV? +1 vs range modifier?

"In order for (must hit eyes) to have any point value, it has to actually be limiting"

Well, I wouldn't actually give them a +8, but the point stands. However, if you are requiring them to take a -8 to hit, then it is a limitation, even if you also purchase in the package a bonus to offset it.

Hyper-Man: That's certainly a possibility, although I am in general an adherent to the "don't use CE if another power can create the same effect" school of thought. I am confused, however, by the interaction between the Instant (-1/2) limitation and "The Stunned effect lasts as long as the Change Environment is maintained (1 Turn*)". Doesn't that directly contradict the concept of instant? I would think continuing charges and Uncontrolled would be required.

Sean: It is an actual object. Hyper-man points out that this is a heroic game. Apparently real weapon doesn't apply. Not surprising that I wouldn't know that, we don't normally purchase equipment with points (this is because he is purchasing SWAT-grade black market tech).

I have a character who wants to make an laser rifle with an optical setting (i.e. one that has to be aimed at the eye, but if it hits can reduce a character to immobility). He also wants to build it as a multipower, having the ability to be an AVAD Blast as well as a Mental Entangle (requiring the layering of a Works Against CON, Not EGO on top of a Works Against EGO, Not STR effect). The thing is that he wants it to be specially sighted for aiming at the eyes for these things (maybe the lower power requirement of the optical laser means that it makes a much larger beam than the damaging laser setting), so that the hit bonus is part of the power within the power framework.

Here is what I have:

Multipower: 76 Active Points, all powers have beam (-1/4), OAF(-1), real weapon (-1/4) (30 Real Points)

2f Damaging laser setting RKA (energy) 3D6 (Active Points); beam (-1/4), OAF(-1), real weapon (-1/4) (18 Real Points)

2f Optical Stunner -- Blast 6D6 (30 Base Points); AVAD (Flash Defense: Vision; +1) (60 Active Points); Alternate Defense (Blind, Covering Eyes; -½), Beam (-1/4), Limitation (must hit eyes; -1), OAF (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4) (15 Real Points) plus +8 PSL (To Hit specific location, head only) (16 Active Points); Beam (-1/4), OAF (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4) (6 Real Points)

 2f Epilepsy Ray -- Entangle (3D6 Body, 3 Mental Defense; 30 Base Points) ACV:--None, mental attacks get ACV(OMCV instead of OCV), but mind-effecting weapons tend to be mental powers with ACV (OCV instead of OMCV), so it's a wash, (+/-0); Takes No Damage From Attacks (Mental Attacks, also Cured By Standard Treatment for Visually-Induced Epilepsy; +3/4), Works Against Con, not Ego, not STR (+1/4) (60 Active Points); Alternate Defense (Blind, Covering Eyes; -½), Beam (-1/4), Limitation (must hit head; -1), OAF (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4) (15 Real Points) plus +8 PSL (To Hit specific location, head only) (16 Active Points); Beam (-1/4), OAF (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4) (6 Real Points)

The overall effect isn't overpowered, and the having to hit the head, but then getting a +8 to do so is actually more expensive then having neither requirement nor bonus in place (it does garauntee a x2 stun mod for the blast though). My question is whether I've done it right.

It is owned by a solvent corporation which facilitates it's purchase via print-on-demand. Since nothing has come out since 2010, and even their own forums (which are neolithic compaired to this functional-but-austere setup) seem to be near dead, I think that it'd be safe to say that it isn't really supported.

Like the causing a stun effect thread. The easiest way would be to make a damage effect with the limitation "damage does not actually take place, only used such that bleeding effect as if this damage had occured"

CE can do it, but I'm not surprised it's not well spelled out, given how it's written with a decided 'CE can do (one point of) damage, but we really don't suggest it' vibe.

Thank you for reenforcing our British stereotypes.

I appreciate this is far too rule heavy for many situations, but it is presented as a modelling system for intoxication that covers most bases and shows what you can do with the skill system if you want to.  Note the levels of intoxication are not entirely arbitrary but based on actual measurements of alcohol units used to determine whether you are too drunk to drive on British Roads.

You've definitely got the basic how many to start being impaired part and the how quickly alcohol is metabolized, subject only to caveat that we are using con to replace a much more complex measure including body mass, how much ADH is in ones bloodstream, etc. Mapping the effects of enebriation is a little more subjective, and I would build my own system to have a little more focus on actual cognitive and coordination issues on top of poor decision making and social graces.  

The only thing I'd really add is that throwing up doesn't decrease your drunkenness (yes, you could technically have consumed a drink and yet to have had it cross your stomach lining, but this would be one unit at most).

No agonizing over "bad rolls", esp. compared to those of more lucky players? You clearly play with a party of Buddhas

 Maybe you roll for stats, but they come out of a character total pool, and thus higher stat rolls = less points for skills.

You could also consider that the ongoing momentum of the leap. Perhaps if the leaper wants to land after that very fast leap and then not keep moving forward that 1 hex per 5" of deceleration, they would need to have that much run speed to counteract it. That would disrequire acceleration modifiers to ones jumping, but require someone not to sell back their run speed because they jump all the time.

Good idea.   I'd go with Drain (body) standard effect, instead, and give it more dice.   Each D6 killing (NND DB AoE) is what, 75 points?  Each D6 of Drain (body) AoE would only be 20.  Being only ~1/4 the price makes up for going against the point value of the Body stat instead of the stat itself, and more.   And being a Drain, it goes against Power Defense, which will effectively be NND/DB to most things anyway.

 

Still, shouldn't be worth a lot since the woosh is predictable and easily avoidable.

RKA 1D6 (15 base points) Area of Effect (8m cone; + 1/4), AVAD(NND; +1), Does Body (+1) (48.75 Active Points); No Range (-1/2) = 32.5 Real Points/Die

Drain Body 1D6 (10 base points) Area of Effect (8m cone; + 1/4) (12.5 Active Points); No Range (-1/2) = 8.3 Real Points/Die

So more than 3x as expensive, slightly modified by linked, whether it costs END, etc., but why the RKA would be cheaper as AVAD (power defense; +1/2), which is more comparable. My question is: why not just make it straight up damage (resisted by rPD/rED)? Then it's a straight up 12.5/die for RKA and 8.3/die for Drain Body. 

I think a lot of people would really appreciate that (I know of two guaranteed purchases in my own group).

I have taught many people how to play Hero.  The best advice I have for you is to figure out what your campaign norms are going to be so you can normalize on that.

 

Then ask each player to come up with a character background.  Who are they?  Why do they do what they do?  What is their personal history?  What are they good at and not good at?  Do they have any personality quirks?

 

From there you can then sit down with them and build a basic character.  I have built characters for everyone (based on their descriptions) in my current gaming group except for one person who knows Hero at least as well as I do.  I explain everything as we are building the character.  After we print out a copy of the character we look over the character sheet and I talk them thru what they would have to do in certain circumstances.  For instance if they say "I want to sneak up on that guy over there." and I tell them "Ok make a stealth roll..." they know how to make that roll.  Then we work thru combat.  There are some handy 'one page' combat cheat sheets floating around on the board you can use to help them go thru the 'combat process'.

 

In a Heroic game I generally ignore END costs unless someone has a 'power that has a high END cost' then they have to track their END.

 

I would definitely keep STUN & BODY when it comes to damage.  If you take away Stun as something to track you will have the issue of characters that use normal attacks - martial arts for instance - who basically never hurt anyone.

 

Starting out do not use hit locations or placed shots.

If you get rid of stun, you generally have to do something for these, like convert them to KAs or reduce the protection that applies to them.

Suffice to say, the actual price is not informative of worth or what it can be sold for. I'd be more inclined to believe that someone was born on January 1, 1900 than believe that information.

Full Defense Maneuver (10 points) maybe?

High EGO?

That's focusing on the wrong simplicity in my book. I would have them pick attributes (at least the ones you roll against) in units of five. Just telling them that 5 is low, 10 is human average, 15 is high, maybe heroic-character average, and 20 is just plain high.

The first thing I'd suggest is have them make themselves. Perhaps their ideal selves as 75 pt. characters with 20-25 in complications. Skip increases to speed, DCV, OCV, etc. If they really know martial arts, help them choose maneuvers. If they've really survived crazy car crashes unscathed, give them some pd, but mostly it will be attributes, perks, and skills. You can then use these characters for example situations to teach them game mechanics. Say, run a situation where your player Joe's self-character is pulled over buy a cop and has to make a roll of bluff vs. the cops' PS: Traffic Enforcement to teach skill use.

When you actually start a game, I'd suggest keeping it simple. Either no stun or all stun. No Endurance for normal actions (and endurance reserve only for wizards or super-powers). No power frameworks. This of course works best in certain campaign types. What type of game do you want to run?

The palindromedary is on a liquid diet. It isn't happy about its excretory situation.

Some people (at least one) will.

 

"My hero!"

The capacity for people to do things for role-playing/flavor reasons does not excuse bad game design.

Why does a Presence Attack need to be linked? They're free.

So that the 0 active points it costs gets divided by an additional 1/4 of course.