Cardinal

Re: Quote of the Week from my gaming group...

talk about a taccf of the first order...

taccf???

Re: New Protectors Rising! (Bay City Campaign idea)

Good stuff and a great idea for a campaign. I LOVE to serve and protect and the protectors. Anything that brings them back is money.

Re: Commisioned Art

Well' date=' I don't know how soon, or possibly if (at this time), I can go ahead with my idea. However, seeing how Egyptoid was able to publish his USA-50 project go me thinking about how tribe and myself could put together a book based upon our co-creation Uberworld. Naturally we'd have to update the characters to 6th Ed, and get new artwork. That's what this thread is about. Most people know I use Fabrica a lot, but obviously I can't use that stuff, but still it would make a good starting point for an artist. Thanks everyone for their input.[/quote']

 

If you are planning on publishing the work, you should make that clear to the artist. My understanding (at least from what Storn has written), the $45 level price is for personal use. If you want the rights to print the picture as part of work, there is a different pricing scheme. It comes down to what rights you are purchasing.

Re: I need a Chinese Super Team.

Given that you are having challenges with teh power level with out breaking out your munchkin fu, why don't you start creating team ups. with six immortals remaining, it is time for a pair followed by a foursome to face off with the heroes.

Re: Encounter Balance

As a very VERY general rule, similar point totals and similar combat abilities (damage classes, CVs, SPDs, etc.) will generate fairly evenly-matched opponents.

 

One thing that I look at when I'm not sure if a character is a suitable opponent for my campaign is to compare him to an established PC (or a hypothetical construct that represents the average abilities of several PCs) and ask: "Given a level playing field, how often will these two characters hit each other, and how many hits can each of them take before they go down?" This will give you a rough idea of both how long the fight between the two characters will last, and who 'should' win. Of course, dice rolls are random, and even the most rudimentary of tactical decisions can significantly influence a fight one way or the other, but it'll at least give you a chance to spot extreme mis-matches.

 

Basically, a villain whose defenses can shrug off an average roll from the PCs' main attacks, or who has a +4 CV advantage over the PCs, is going to be extremely difficult for them to defeat, and should either be weakened or used as a 'boss-fight' encounter.

 

As a rule of thumb, agents/minions/unpowered thugs should probably be easily defeated in 1-2 hits, standard opponents should be able to withstand 4-8 hits, and major villains should be able to take 10 or more hits. Keep in mind, the longer a fight lasts, the more opportunities there are for characters to Recover lost Stun, or regain consciousness, so long fights tend to get longer. If you're going to screw up, it's better to err on the side of low defenses and brief combats. After all, players love winning, and you can always have another squad of agents respond to the sound of fighting if they get too cocky.

 

You don't have to run the numbers for every villain you design, or pick from a published product. Once you have a few game sessions under your belt, you should be able to work out what levels of offense and defense work for your group. Then you just need to scan a writeup looking for oddball stuff like 6D6 NNDs that target DECV, or martial artists with 12 DCV and Defensive Strike, and make sure there's a way your PCs *can* fight them.

In the vein of this post, I threw together a quick spreadsheet for another thread. The concept is that in order to determine a rough metric of effectiveness you need to look at the average damage a character will dish per turn and the average damage they will get hit with. Each is based on the average damage past defenses * the probability of getting hit.

As noted, this is thrown out the window when you get to things like NNDs, drains, etc. but it should give you a rough sense of how long someone can survive.

Re: Medusa of Psi in Practice

I need to point out a few errors on your post in regard to how these situations would play out:

 

Except:

25 Ego +15 Mental Defense = 40, which equals 8d6 roll to break free

30 Ego +15 Mental Defense = 45, which equals 9d6 roll to break free

20 Ego +10 Mental Defense = 30, which equals 6d6 roll to break free

 

 

 

Except that, even if your original numbers had been correct, when you roll the Ego, a roll of 6 on d6 produces a 2 Body instead of 1- so any one of these charactes would be able to overcome the defense of the Mental Paralysis with high enough rolls even before pushing their Ego.

 

I realize that you did mention average rolls but basing a character never getting out of an entangle on average rolls is loading the dice to make your point- fact is, how often does someone roll all 3's and 4's on any roll?

 

Even if you averaged a result of 3.5 per die, some of those numbers rolled might be 1 or 6, modifying the number of Body accrued in the roll, for example, to use Mentalla as the victim in question (even basing her on 7d6, instead of the proper 8d6), when the entangle goes off, she rolls 7d6 to break free, with results of 6,6,2,2,2,3,3 = 24 Stun (average roll figures at 3.5/die= 24.5 on 7d6) and 9 Body- meaning it would be hard but yes, Mentalla would be able to get out of the Mental Paralysis effect without using any of her Powers or pushing- with the actual 8d6 she has to roll it becomes even more likely.

 

Dangerous and likely to tie target up for awhile? Sure. Unstoppable? No. And for a 181 active point power, there are a lot more dangerous ways to have built that effect- like 5d6 entangle with 10 Def instead of 6d6/Def 8.

Thanks for the catch on the math. My bad. However, my point was not that Mentalla would never get out. My point was that even against high powered mentalists and mystics (who speciality is mental powers), Medusa's attacks is effectively a "one shot kill" for that combat.

Let's look at that in more detail. While I agree you are not going to end up with all 3 and 4's, but for every 6 you have a chance to offset it with a 1. As such, on average you will end up with 1 Body and 3.5 stun per die. However, Mentalla can roll above average. However, she will have to consistently roll above average in order to get out. That means that she would need (on average) six above average rolls in order to break out. Assuming that 50% of the time she will roll above average body (which as Hugh points over states the case), this means that she will need 12 phases (roughly 2 turns) on average to break out. Two turns is pretty much an entire combat. Dark Seraph and Overbrain are each knocked out for 6 phases on average, or a turn.

... and this is for mentalists / mystics. Goodness help you if it is not your speciality.

If you want a straw man, let's look at one that is not too far fetched. Call it 20 EGO + 0 MD (I think the MD is probably representative but the ego is probably high for an average character). In that case even by rolling a <1% outcome of 8 body on 4D6, the PC will NEVER break out.

It sounds like people's experience (as noted by Matthew and Hugh) is that Medusa is effectively an even more extreme version of the normal "pile on the mentalist" situation. What hooks would you use as a GM in order to play into the comic book toupe that Hugh referenced of you lose round one and figure out a way to win round 2? I suspect, given her powerset, this is likely going to be the very non-heroic sneak attack.

Also, random question, is their a default under the rules about whether a mental entangle disappears if Medusa is knocked out? If not, I would strongly considering adding that to the power. That would do a lot to turning the tables on Psi if she gets taken out (all of a sudden 5 frozen heroes pop back to life).

Thanks to everyone for the feedback. I appreciate the variety of perspectives as I noodle this through.

Re: Single Most Powerful Super Hero EVER!!!

Batman. With sufficient preparation and the occasional bat gadget' date=' he can beat anyone.[/quote']

 

but he is just a normal man

Has anyone here extensively used Medusa from PSI in a game. How does that work out? From a quick review she seems completely unbalanced in play and I wanted to see if that was the reality.

On average her mental paralysis will have 8def / 6 body and is defended by EGO + MD. While I understand she has low def and is comparatively slow, her personality of striking from surprise means that she will likely be able to get the first shot which will effectively be the last shot.

By way of comparison, I've compared this entangle against three mentalist / mystic characters that would be expected to be able to stand up against her without too much issue.

Mentalla 25 EGO, 15 MD (7D6) - 657 pts

Overbrain 30 EGO, 15MD (6D6 Mental Blast) - 905 (skill heavy) pts

Dark Seraph 20 EGO, 10 MD (alt 9D6 Mental blast if allowed by SFX) - 927 pts

The result, without pushing and average rolls, is:

Mentalla would never be able to break out of the mental paralysis

Overbrain 6 phases to break out

Dark Serpah never based on EGO + MD and if an "Agony" sfx were allowed against the entangle 6 phases

An average hero with 20 Ego would never be able to get out.... even with pushing.

I understand that one expects that a 150+AP power is going to be nasty. I'm just worried it is unplayable. I would think that it would be a "more" balanced power if it maxed at about 4 def (so that no normal 10 EGO would be able to get out) and instead had 10d6 for body. This would allow the result of being taken out for a while, but with the chance of getting back in the game.

I would appreciate feedback from anyone who has actually ever used her.

Thanks

Re: HSMA: A combat test

Isn't there already a maneuver called Grappling Block that fits the bill? My memory is that it is a block that results in a grab.

Re: Black Falcon 3.5

Pizza Man - Are you the artist for the BF pics? They are great. I am not familiar with Deviant Art, is it just a comic book fan / art site?

I'm contemplating what book(s) to purchase and I had a quick question from the assembled masses. How much has changed between Champions Universe: News of the World and the new Champions Universe 6th Ed. I am trying to determine where to prioritize it in my list.

Also, other than the basic 6th Ed rule books, where do people rank:

1. Villains 1

2.Villains 2

3. Villains 3

4. Advanced Player Guide

5. HS Martial Arts

6. Champions Powers

I loved the 5th ed marital arts book. How different is the 6th ed version?

Thanks for feedback from anyone out there.

Re: My character building technique (How to build Hero System Characters)

I tweaked the spreadsheet to address the point made above about Segment 12. In the Expected Damage box, it has a w/12 column that adds one extra phase to the speed.

If we you want to make the math more complicated, you can add an analysis of how long can the character last in a fight. This would bring in Stun and Recovery as well.

Also, note that the DCV and OCV should be reflective of the modifiers that the character would normally face (i.e. ranged combatant should reflect range penalties and levels for their OCV, but add the range penalties to their DCV (because they will be shot at at range)). It gets overly complicated very quickly, but seems to make sense as an approach.

Re: Avatar: The Last Airbender

Very late to the game, but just checking to see if anyone put together a final package on this. I just watched a bunch of episodes with my boys and it is perfect for a game. A couple of thoughts that struck me:

1. Their GM threw out TONS of xp during the adventure. Katara starts being lucky to do a dinky water whip (effectively her only power) and ends the series throwing beat downs on people left and right. Starting characters are relatively low points. Experienced characters are effectively superheroes (see the Fire Lord/Phoenix King flying around with fire blasts).

2. The characters definitely have RSR early on. However, by the end that has been bought off and is not in play.

3. I agree that Missile Deflection is effectively a martial maneuver that is pretty standard (low cost). Lots of the blast to blast, ice walls, etc. are effectively sfx for MD.

4. I think mechanically, I would lean towards a MP for benders (except Avatar who has a VPP). However, I am tempted to use the MP / VPP to provide the base power / skill and allow characters to buy DCs that would increase all of them. This would mirror the fact that the characters start to ramp very quickly once they have a basic skill set in place. Thinking this though this is effectively the same thing as creating each power as a martial maneuver... hmm... more and more, that feels like the right answer (except for the avatar and phoenix king.. hmmm).

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I would love to hear what everyone else has done.

Re: Champions for newcomers. Hooray!

I agree with Tom's suggestion about segmenting the mechanics from the story. Also, you may want to considering starting the guys with sidekick and then add additional rules as they move up the experience curve.

You might want to to start with basic combat maneuvers and KB (given your players's memories) and then start adding items like endurance, advanced maneuvers, etc.

Sounds like fun. Enjoy!

Re: Top 10

#6: Limitation: Compulsion to always use Joy Buzzers

Re: Champions Villains Volume 3: Solo Villains PDF In Store

DT - Give us a review.

Re: What support DNPCs do GMs make for their games?

The Conspiracy Expert

The transvestite hooker informant

Ahhh, the classic transvestite hooker conspiracy expert informant. If I've seen it once, I've seen it a million time. It is almost a cliche. LOL

Re: Looking for suggestions: 600 point 6E Champs, new story arc: Ancient Astronauts

Sounds like a fun campaign. One idea that would sync well with the preface and items 3, 4, and 5 would be to create the versions of "aliens" to be the basis for the various gods that we know from mythology.

This could take one of two forms. Either the gods that we know (i.e. Zeus, Odin, Horus, etc.) are the ancient heroes that battled the aliens. This would mean the aliens would be knock offs of the titans, hel, Cyclops, Fenris, etc.

Alternatively, you can go the route that the aliens were the gods and that each one is reflected in different ways in the various myths. As such, the head of the aliens IS the father god, who was interpreted as Osiris by the Egyptians, Odin by the Norse, Zeus by the Greeks, Jupiter by the Romans, the clever schemer was Loki/Coyote/Set and the young buck was Thor/Hercules/Horus/Lugh, etc. As such, you could build each god with a different power set that would logically cover the range of personifications (the rest being the product of the creative imagination of the humans retelling the stories over the decades). Just pick an archetype, like Storm god, and flip through Wikipedia and combined all the appropriate gods until you have a nice amalgam.

The ancient heroes then could be the “villains” from those old myths (Prometheus jumps out to me as a natural ally).

I think you can get around your dilemma from #1/2 with the assumption that they are carrying something on their ship (which is naturally shaped like a Pyramid) that is necessary for their conquest. My proposal would be that they are bringing a super engine that is necessary to power the EDM portal that will allow them to reopen the gate to their home base / dimension (aka Olympus / Valhalla, etc.).

When they get to earth, they must repower the various gate bases (pyramids and ruins all over the world) at which point they will be able call on the huge host of “gods” waiting in Olympus to finish the invasion. On a personal basis they can still deal with minor EDM type actions.

This would allow the scenarios of running battles on Aztec pyramids, Egyptian Pyramids, Mountains in Greece, underwater in the Med (Atlantis), Fjords, etc. It also allows the chance to jump through a gate and sneak your way through the home of the interdimensional gods to raise allies from the enemies destroyed over history (e.g. titans, demons, etc. that are all just losers that got a bad pr job).

If you go this approach, I think it would be fun to mix and match god archetypes from various myths to bring together: Athena, Vishnu, Horus, Quetzalcoatl, Lugh, Susanoo, etc. it is a perfect opportunity to cherry pick the fun parts of countless cultures and have a wide variety of power levels.

As I said above, it sounds like you have a fun set up and a huge number of unique and interesting directions you can go from here. Good luck. I look forward to hearing your stories as it unfolds.

Re: Hero doesn't have complete control over powers

I did this with a character in the form of a beserk type disad / complication. However, I really like the elegance of pinecone's unluck version. Either way, I would stick to the disad / complication method and work with the GM to provide the right level of color for the campaign that you want.

Re: Classic Champions: Repost and Updates

Great to see the old names trotted out. Keep it up. Out of curiosity, what version of the rules are you running this campaign with... the original 1980s rules or 5/6E?

Re: My character building technique (How to build Hero System Characters)

Attached please find the .zip file. This spreadsheet was a quick and dirty attempt to cover the basic formula I threw up. Nothing too crazy.

Good topic.

Re: My character building technique (How to build Hero System Characters)

I absolutely agree with this approach. However, to get the proper expected value of stun per turn, you need to add one more factor, the relationship between OCV and campaign average DCV.

The formula is EV-STUN = P(Hit)*(Averge Stun - Def). For example, if your OCV is 2 over the average DCV, on average you have a 83% chance of hitting. By contrast, if you have an OCV that is 2 below the average DCV, you have only a 37% chance of hitting. That difference creates a huge difference on the amount you can expect to dish out each phase.

Also, if you are going to do a full rule of X, you also need to consider the relationship between your Def and your DCV. The spreadsheet helps show that.

I put together a spreadsheet that you can use to calculate both factors, but unfortunately, the website is telling me that .xls is an invalid file. If someone can tell me what I need to do, I will post it.

Regards,

Cardinal

Re: Bloodmäter

Good stuff. Thanks for sharing.

Re: Bloodmäter

Was there ever a completion to this adventure? Talk about cliff hangers.

Re: Classic Silver Aged Style Team Rosters

I love the character sheets... very old school. Is that an export template for hero designer?

Also, I like the team you are throwing together. Great vibe. If you want additional inspiration, check out Freedom City for MnM. They have a nice silver age vibe and do a good job of hitting the basics. One nice dynamic is mixing powersets and personalities between heroes to make new familiar but different versions (e.g. Captain Thunder = Captain Marvel Power Set + Hal Jordan History and Personality).

IIRC, you have a character named Slyfox that is a teleporting bowman... child of your archer and MA vixen perhaps?