Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

[Hierax]

Hieraxian Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant) (1st Draft):Printable Adobe Acrobat (.PDF) File:     http://www.hierax.com/hero/fantasy/grey/monster/giant-frost.pdfEditable Hero Designer Character (.HDC) File:     http://www.hierax.com/hero/fantasy/grey/monster/giant-frost.hdcFrost Giant (450 Points)

Val	Char	Cost
45	STR	35
9	DEX	-3
45	CON	70
25	BODY	30
9	INT	-1
9	EGO	-2
45	PRE	35
10	COM	0
14	PD	5
14	ED	5
2	SPD	1
18	REC	0
90	END	0
92	STUN	21

7" RUN22" SWIM04" LEAP-5Characteristics Cost: 193

Cost	Power	END
5	Thick Icey Skin: Damage Resistance (5 PD/5 ED)
30	Twice As Big: Physical Damage Reduction, Resistant, 50%
30	Twice As Big: Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 50%
4	Long of Arm: Stretching 1", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (7 Active Points); Always Direct (-1/4), No Noncombat Stretching (-1/4), No Velocity Damage (-1/4)
28	Hurl Rocks: Killing Attack - Ranged 3d6+1 (50 Active Points); OIF (Focus - Rocks of Opportunity; -1/2), Limited Range (200 yards/meters 100") (-1/4)	5
7	Rock Catching: Missile Deflection (Thrown Objects), Missile Reflection (25 Active Points); Activation Roll 9- (-1 1/2), Limited Power (Only vs. Large Roughly Rock/Boulder Shaped Objects) (-1)
10	Heavy: Knockback Resistance -5"
36	Immunity to Cold (increase to 100% Damage Reduction, Resistant ED): Custom Power (90 Active Points); Limited Power - Only vs. Cold Power loses about two-thirds of its effectiveness (-1 1/2)
12	Resistance to Cold (increase to 75% Damage Reduction, Resistant ED): Custom Power (30 Active Points); Limited Power - Only vs. Cold Power loses about two-thirds of its effectiveness (-1 1/2)
2	Life Support (Safe in Intense Cold)
1	Life Support (Longevity 250 Years)
10	Enchanted Creature: Mental Defense (12 points total)

Powers Cost: 175

Cost	Skill
40	+5 with All Combat
4	WF: Common Melee Weapons, Common Missile Weapons, Thrown Rocks
2	KS: Lair and Surrounding Environment 11-
0	Language: Frost Giant (completely fluent) (3 Active Points)
3	Language: Jotun (Generic Giantish) (completely fluent)
2	PS: Warrior 11-
2	PS: Sailor 11-
2	Navigation 11-
2	Survival (Arctic/Subarctic, Mountain) 8-
6	TF: Equines, Large Rowed Boats, Large Wind-Powered Boats, Rafts, Small Rowed Boats, Small Wind-Powered Boats

Skills Cost: 63

Cost	Talent
10	Follow-Through Attack
4	Environmental Movement (no penalties on)
5	Rapid Healing

Talents Cost: 19

Cost	Equipment	END
24	Axe, Battle (x3 Size): Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 6d6 (6d6+1 w/STR), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (135 Active Points); Independent (-2), STR Minimum 39 (-1), OAF (-1), Required Hands One-And-A-Half-Handed (-1/4), Real Weapon (-1/4)
23	Spear, Long (x3 Size): Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 6d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Ranged (+1/2) (180 Active Points); Independent (-2), 1 Recoverable Charge (-1 1/4), OAF (Focus - Spear; -1), STR Minimum 39 (-1), -1OCV (-1/2), Required Hands Two-Handed (-1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Reduced By Range (Range Based on STR) (-1/4)
17	Hammer, War (x3 Sized): Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 4d6, +1 STUN Multiplier (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (105 Active Points); Independent (-2), STR Minimum 39 (-1), OAF (-1), -1OCV (-1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Required Hands One-And-A-Half-Handed (-1/4)
17	Sword, Broad (x3 Size): Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 4d6 (4d6+1 w/STR), Required Hands One-Handed (+0), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points); Independent (-2), STR Minimum 36 (-1), OAF (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4)
6	Hauberk , Ring or Heavy Leather, Reinforced: (Total: 36 Active Cost, 6 Real Cost) Armor (12 PD/12 ED); Independent (-2), Normal Mass (-1), Location 7-14 Very Limited Type of Attack (-1), OIF (-1/2), Real Armor (-1/4) (Real Cost: 6) [Notes: Loc. 7-14]
11	Cap, Plate and Chain: (Total: 63 Active Cost, 11 Real Cost) Armor (21 PD/21 ED); Independent (-2), Normal Mass (-1), Location 5 Very Limited Type of Attack (-1), OIF (-1/2), Real Armor (-1/4) (Real Cost: 11) [Notes: Loc. 5,]
4	Large Wooden Shield: (Total: 27 Active Cost, 4 Real Cost) HA +3d6 (15 Active Points); Independent (-2), OAF (-1), STR Minimum 15 (-3/4), Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2), Side Effects -OCV per DCV protection, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4) (Real Cost: 2) plus +3 DCV, +3 DCV (+6 Advantages; +12) (12 Active Points); Independent (-2), OAF (-1), Normal Mass (-1), STR Minimum 10 (STR Min. Cannot Add/Subtract Damage; -1), Real Armor (-1/4) (Real Cost: 2) [Notes: Body 18__Def 9]	2

Equipment costs shown above are for reference only, and are not included in Total Cost.

Val	Disadvantages
15	Distinctive Features: Frost Giant Not Concealable, Always Noticed and Causes Major Reaction, Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses, Not Distinctive In Some Cultures
10	Enraged: In Battle (Common), go 8-, recover 14-
25	Physical Limitation - Bigger And Easier to be Seen and be Hit (3x human size = -5 DCV, and +5 to PER Rolls to Percieve) [Notes: N.B. This immense size gives them a base DCV of -2! Very easy to hit to offset (somewhat) the extremely hard to damage.]
5	Physical Limitation: Too Big to Fit, Too Heavy to be Supported (Infrequently, Slightly Impairing)
10	Physical Limitation: Voracious - Must Eat 27x as much as a normal man (Frequently, Slightly Impairing)
10	Psychological Limitation: Hates Heat/Fire, Can't Take the Heat so Stays Out of the Fire! (Uncommon, Strong)
15	Reputation - Greedy Rapacious Plunderers: , 14-
0	Social Limitation: Not Accepted in Most Civilized Societies (Occasionally, Minor, Not Limiting In Some Cultures)
0	Susceptibility: Warm Temperatures, 1d6 damage per Hour (Uncommon)
0	Susceptibility: Anti- and Pro-Giant Effects
20	Vulnerability: 2 x STUN Heat/Fire (Common)
20	Vulnerability: 2 x BODY Heat/Fire (Common)
10	Vulnerability: 1 1/2 x STUN Lightning/Electricity (Common)
10	Vulnerability: 1 1/2 x BODY Lightning/Electricity (Common)

Disadvantage Points: 150

Base Points: 300Experience Required: 0Total Experience Available: 0Experience Unspent: 0Total Character Cost: 450

Height: 5.49 m	Hair: Blue or Yellow
Weight: 2268.00 kg	Eyes: Blue or Yellow

Appearance: Averaging 18' Tall and 5,000 lbs. (~3x man-sized, ranging from 15' to 21' tall, 2250 lbs to 8600 lbs). Ice-hued flesh and hair (blue-white) but some have yellow hair.

 

[Pictures - e.g., Cover from Hackmaster Annhiliate the Giants sets the dangerous mood perfectly!

scan to replace current http://www.kenzerco.com/images/rpg/hackmaster/giants.jpg ]

Personality: Viking-likeQuote:(D+D-X.32), (RC.179), (GAZ7-tNR);

(AD+D-1e-MM.44-45, G2-GRotFGJ); Tom's and mine old 1st ed. "Valley of Ice" module; Discussion with Gary Welsh on Frost Giants (check e-mail archives).

(AD+D-2e-MM.140, AtGtLoG, Vikings, Giantcraft);

(D+D-3e-MM.98-101);

(HM-HoB-vIII.58-59, AtG);

- (H4e-BFHC.64); (H5e-MMM.43).

- Norse Mythology [need to reread the sagas!]

- Marvel Thor Comics and Marvel Super Heroes Game

- Thor Music - "Thunder on the Tundra" Album.

- Age of Mythology Board Game

- Dominions2 Computer Game.

Background: Frost Giants. In essence are huge Norse Vikings linked to the elemental cold/ice.

 

These Awesome giants are pale-skinned with light yellow or light blue hair. They stand 18' tall, have long full beards, and wear fur skins and iron armor. Frost Giants may hurl rocks up to 200'. They often build castles above the timberline of snow-capped mountains. They will always have either 3d6 polar bears (20%) or 6d6 wolves (80%) as guards. Frost Giants are not affected by Cold-based attacks.

 

0e: HD: 10+1, AC4, Move=Man, Dam 4d6, 18' tall

1e: HD:10+1-4, AC4, Move=Man, Dam 4d6, Rocks 2d10, 15' tall

2e: HD: 14+1-4, AC5, Move=12/15, Dam 2d8+9 weapon, 2d10 rock, 21' tall

3e: HD: 14d8+70, AC+9, Move=40', +9 BAB, Dam 2d8+13 Huge Great Axe or 2d6+9 rock, 120' range for rocks, 15' tall.

Powers/Tactics: Throw Rocks or Ice Balls from a distance, close in and Hack up with Huge Battle Axe (or use other Viking-like weapons such as a WarHammer or Spear).Campaign Use: Variants

- Frost Giant Jarl for a prime example see Grugnar NPC write-up (e.g, STR as Cloud Giant = 55 = Frost Giant NCM).

- Shaman up to 7th Level (up to 70 Active Points of divine spells).

- Berserker (Barbarian/Battle-Rager cf. Hackmaster versions and old Dragon mag versions compared to old 1st ed. house rules version).

- Various Viking types - Huskarl, Hirdsman, Herse, Jarl, Scout, Iron Woodsman, Gode, Skald, Skratti, Gyja, etc...

- Greater Frost Giant (or Niefel Giant): aura of cold (change environment, radius), bigger, armor and weapons made of enchanted ice.

- Black Ice Giants (adaptation of Niefel to World of Greyhawk's Land of Black Ice combined with Clark Ashton Smith ice-themed stories)

- Fire or Musphel Giants (for a non-giant dwarf version): as Niefel but simply replace all Cold/Ice SFX with Heat/Fire SFX.

[Hierax]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

Comments, criticisms, feedback?

[cyst13]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

I don't mean to come all negative in this post. But since frost giants are a standard of fantasy, the stuff that you did correctly goes without saying.

 

As for the quibbles: the power of the giants is far out of proportion to their size. Eighteen feet tall is big, but it's not that big. A 6D6 killing attack is more powerful than a tank shell. If you want these guys to be that powerful, you could just re-describe them as about 30 feet tall. If you look at the illustration you posted, this seems about right. The human in the picture only comes to the giant's knee, and the giant is crouching down.

 

My other quibble is that a hurled rock should do normal damage, not killing. Killing physical damage should be limited to sharp weapons or concentrated impacts (like bullets). Large concussive impacts (like boulders) should be normal damage.

 

One last thing: give some thought to making their attacks AFX one hex. At thirty feet tall, that seems reasonable.

[Hierax]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

I forgot, to put this Frost Giant write-up into perspective here's a few other giant write-ups and feedback:

 

Hill Giant:

  http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11930

 

Stone Giant:

  http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12431

 

Here's a better view of the HackMaster picture:

 

 

You're right, the giants in the picture are arguably a bigger than I'm describing (mine are an amalgamation of the sources listed which average a slight bit smaller by default), Hackmaster is mainly based on 2nd ed. AD&D and 2e giants are a bit bigger (Frost Giants ~21' or ~3.5x human, assuming a 6' human). My knee in the pose of the lead giant is around 18" and I'm 6' tall so 18"x3.5= would make the human about 5.25' tall. Maybe a bit of artistic license in the picture but its still fairly close enough for an approximation of size it could be ~20' or ~30' I guess depending on the variation in the size of the individual humans and giants. So the size might be slightly off scale but the overall effect of the deadliness of giants is what the picture captures that I really wanted to get across.

 

Damage Scaling: I've never bought into the standard Hero System argument that STR isn't linear, to my mind, the Damage is linear for STR and the lift is less relevant in combat situations; I extend this thinking to weapons as well (I mean if a 3' short sword does 1d6K how much more does a 6' sword do? how about a 12' one? etc...). A humanoid that is 12' tall is about 2x human height and has about 8x mass, if 18' tall like some Frost Giants their mass would be 27x human, I'm not sure exactly how to scale the damage up but I figure that anything that is that massive can have a proportional increase in damage equal to their height relative to a human -- i.e., 2x height = 2x base damage, 3x height = 3x base damage. That is the reasoning behind why I did it. I'm open to other scaling suggestions provided that it keeps the deadly feel of being hit with a gigantic weapon wielded by a man a couple of stories tall! I guess the damage could be a bit lower but boulders for ~2x that of a great two-handed sword it seemed about right at 3d6+1 K when I wrote it up.

 

Killing vs. Normal Damage: I didn't think that a Normal Attack was deadly enough so I chose to use Killing Damage so that armoured adventurers would take BODY Damage; even a 10d6 N attack only does about 10 BODY and with 4 PD and 6 rDEF Armor that won't give me the deadliness that I want to emphasize when dealing with giants -- i.e., don't get hit unless you have magical protections, stay out of the way!

 

Area of Effect: Following Steve's examples in MMM I tried using AoE 1 Hex for Giant's attacks, but it was pointed out to me in another giant thread (links above) that this might be a bit too much, so I decided to save it for the really big giants. I guess with the 30' tall interpretation it would fit. Now that was with throwing boulders and giant-sized fists in mind, but that huge ice chunk squishing the guy certainly is arguably a 1-Hex AoE Attack. Hmmm...

 

I really appreciate the feedback, Cyst, and I'll have to seriously reconsider these things in more detail, but the above was my reasoning going into the write-up.

[Gunrunner]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

One thing to note:

 

You don't need to give your giant a rock-hurling power. He can hurl large rocks because he has a STR 45, not because you gave him a power that allows him to. It's redundant; that's why he has a high STR. You're giving him a power he already has.

[Eosin]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

I would lower the Kill to about 4d6 maybe 4.5 with STR.

 

Area Affect as discussed on other threads turn giants into PC killing machines since they always hit with a freaking bazooka level attack (even if they just use a great sword it is 4d6).

 

Overall - pretty fine.

 

I dislike the superhigh body levels. To impair this guy we are talking 30+ points of body - you need to roll max on 5d6. Nobody in my (fairly standard) game can generate 3d6 much less 5d6. I think that the BODY is consistant with the Bestiary though.

 

They can ride horses? Small row boats?

[Hierax]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

Throwing Things: Yeah, I guess I could just have it be part of STR but it's damn convenient to have a major attack right there on the sheet for ease of use and comparison to other creatures.

 

Lowering Damage: Ok, if I'm going to lower it, I'd like to have some sort of formula or guidelines on it rather than just arbitrarily changing it. How much more damage should a 1.5x, 2x, 3x, etc. size weapon do? I was going with 3x size = 3x damage, if I'm to go with less damage what consistent method would you recommend that I use to replace this so that all creatures written-up (e.g. Ogres 1.5x, Hill Giants 2x, Frost Giants 3x, Storm Giants 4x, etc.) scale properly relative to each other?

 

Horses/Boats: Going with the Viking raider thing there. They're scary enough as is but just imagine an entire (really) longship full of giant vikings raiding the coast or huge Rohir-like riders running you down! Easy enough to ignore if you're not insane enough to actually have giant-sized horses and boats, but a frightening option to have.

 

Size: It could be worse, the norse giants on the "outer planes" that Thor et al. have to fight are even bigger!

 

 

FWIW, Going up against giants is supposed to be a truly frightening prospect because knowing that if you get hit you'll most likely be dead not wounded. Mostly you just outnumber them but lose a whole bunch of men in the process. I certainly wouldn't expect PCs to last long very against giants without some serious ability to avoid being hit and giant-slaying weapons and spells -- e.g., things that effectively Suppress the size-related powers and cut them down to human size (in terms of how hard they are to be killed).

[Nuke]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

I think your write-up sounds fine, one thing about monster write-ups is that it is all relative to your power-level in your campaign.

 

6d6 Tank Shells are highly under-powered by the book. If a normal hero can live until -10 BODY, that means on the average, a tank blow to the chest (21 BOD) just BARELY kills him? Now put him in a kevlar vest, and he actually LIVES from it!

 

I think that's ok because in Champions, you can't just have heroes getting killed all the time, the damage is listed for a balance that let's heroes do heroic things. In Fantasy Hero, things are bloodier and nastier and people die.

 

I'd say tune it to what your campaign is. A great big guy swinging a great big sword would be pretty devastating if he hit!

[Hierax]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

6d6 Tank Shells are highly under-powered by the book. If a normal hero can live until -10 BODY' date=' that means on the average, a tank blow to the chest (21 BOD) just BARELY kills him? Now put him in a kevlar vest, and he actually LIVES from it! ... A great big guy swinging a great big sword would be pretty devastating if he hit![/quote']

Thanks, Nuke! That was exactly my point -- armoured heroes can take a LOT of damage so the attacks uber-deadly attacks (like Giant-sized weapons) need to do a LOT of BODY damage to be able to apply the necessary deadly force to have a non-Champions biased feel. Characters don't survive giant blows by default, they survive them only if they have special powers. That was the feeling I was going for.

[Vanguard00]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

My only critiques have been addresses (regarding damage and rock-throwing) and rebutted (very well, I might add).

 

But let me add a public 'thanks' to Hierax for posting these. I've managed to cull every one thus far for my own campaign (not that I've used 'em yet, but I have 'em ready).

 

Thanks, Hierax.

[Nuke]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

My only critiques have been addresses (regarding damage and rock-throwing) and rebutted (very well, I might add).

 

But let me add a public 'thanks' to Hierax for posting these. I've managed to cull every one thus far for my own campaign (not that I've used 'em yet, but I have 'em ready).

 

Thanks, Hierax.

 

DEfinitely! When you're done, Heirax, you should consider bundling your write-ups into some sort of "Monstrous Compendium"!

[Hierax]

Re: Monster/Race: Frost Giant (Lesser Niefel Giant)

 

Thanks guys!

 

FWIW, The idea with my write-ups is to create Adobe Acrobat files (.pdfs) that can be easily printed double-sided and put into a binder or spiral bound for easy reference.

 

Each write-up is done as an individual file to be more modular -- e.g., you could use the Frost Giant to create a compendium on Giants or on Frost/cold-related creatures depending on what you group the Frost Giant with.

 

Eventually, when I reach a certain critical mass, I'll certainly compile them into a proper bound book, but I've got to get a lot more stuff written-up first-- I just wish I had more free time to get more done.