Chromatic Posted April 14, 2005 Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Longest combat I've ever seen, was a "battle of champions" style tournament at a DunDraCon years and years ago (I haven't been to DDC since 1989, so). Two martial artists, speeds 7 or 8, 11 turns. The fight started with a lot of high ocv, low damage type maneuvers, but eventually turned to evasion and find weaknesses. During the last few phases, the loser had effectively 1 or 2 pd versus the attacks due to multiple find weakness successes. (good thing he had reduction) It was pretty bloody on both sides, the victor was at 2 or 3 body and the loser was dying. The fight took almost 5 hours to play through as well. Ironically, I don't think that END was much of an issue, at least not on the part of the character I was playing. However both combatants snuck in recoveries during combat where they opportunity presented itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 14, 2005 Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? I remember our longest battles in my prior campaign included some 5 turn ones' date=' specifically/especially during the matches for the Sorcerer Supreme position.[/quote'] The longest battle I recall in your campaign was the semi-recent one at Origins. But there was a bit of manuevering around. And even that one went maybe two rounds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 14, 2005 Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Longest combat I've ever seen, was a "battle of champions" style tournament at a DunDraCon years and years ago (I haven't been to DDC since 1989, so). Two martial artists, speeds 7 or 8, 11 turns. The fight started with a lot of high ocv, low damage type maneuvers, but eventually turned to evasion and find weaknesses. During the last few phases, the loser had effectively 1 or 2 pd versus the attacks due to multiple find weakness successes. (good thing he had reduction) It was pretty bloody on both sides, the victor was at 2 or 3 body and the loser was dying. The fight took almost 5 hours to play through as well. Woo. Long time, I'd been in similar combats with some of my martial artists, but they'd whip through the phases pretty quick. Then again I think it was generally either Nighthawk or Calico vs. one of Sam's villians so we'd be pretty quick. I remember the one time we tried basing Post-12 on Recovery like it was in Fantasy Hero (at the time), but we had all these bricks running around with 20-35 recovery. I think we went eight rounds with just the bricks left before I aborted the experiment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted April 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? The longest battle I recall in your campaign was the semi-recent one at Origins. But there was a bit of manuevering around. And even that one went maybe two rounds? I never did write the audit trail for the tracker software, but I seem to remember that was around 2 turns, yes. If you really think about it, it would be terrifying for the nearby civilians and 24 seconds is a LONG time then. However, I recall we had a battle that went just over or at 3 turns, I think I notated it somewhere, but it will be hard to find...will have to browse at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamrok Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? To set lengths of combat you have to factor in more than just End use. It's very similar to how a GM sets the power level of the bad guys. Take into consideration how much damage the heros can take' date=' and how big a chunk of that total is going to be done with each successful hit. Then figure out how often the attack might be successful given the ocv/dcv involved. Now you have an idea of the total number of phases that Hero is going to last in combat. I know this very well from personal experience playing for the most part a "glass jawed normal guy". In his typical form, Laughton only has 22 stun (similarly to Nexus who spent a great deal of the recent past combats knocked out). Unless Laughton is lucky, or I pull out a trick from his bag of options, I know if he gets hit by someone other than a thug, he's gonna be stunned, and then soon after (like next phase) out.[/quote'] Just to set the record straight - Nexus has 50 stun and 50% damage reduction. This is enough for him to be stunned on the first hit and unconscious on the second. If he only had 22 stun he'd have virtually no chance of remaining conscious after being hit by any villain we've faced recently. When I originally built him, I figured that 20 defenses plus 50 stun would keep him from being one shotted. That turned out to be a false assumption, as he was repeatedly one-shotted over the next few session. The addition of damage reduction was necessary for the character to function as conceived. Laughton never seems to be around when the damage is getting dealt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatic Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Laughton never seems to be around when the damage is getting dealt. That triple digit Int comes in handy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamrok Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? That triple digit Int comes in handy... I don't think the triple digit intelligence is the distinguishing factor in this particular case... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted April 15, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Metagamers! A big problem with Nexus that I didn't think of at first was that he attracts as much attention as the Troll. At first I figured some more attention to "the new guy" since there'd be a blanket assumption he'd fill the Troll's role until villains knew better. Then I realized that the way Nexus was played and with his presence, there was no way he wouldn't be subjected to some big hits at probably the same time you (um, Lamrok "you") sent the revision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamrok Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Metagamers! A big problem with Nexus that I didn't think of at first was that he attracts as much attention as the Troll. At first I figured some more attention to "the new guy" since there'd be a blanket assumption he'd fill the Troll's role until villains knew better. Then I realized that the way Nexus was played and with his presence, there was no way he wouldn't be subjected to some big hits at probably the same time you (um, Lamrok "you") sent the revision. Nexus talks a good game, but he only has a 20 presence. Perhaps there's some reason to grow in that direction... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 15, 2005 Report Share Posted April 15, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? I never did write the audit trail for the tracker software, but I seem to remember that was around 2 turns, yes. If you really think about it, it would be terrifying for the nearby civilians and 24 seconds is a LONG time then. However, I recall we had a battle that went just over or at 3 turns, I think I notated it somewhere, but it will be hard to find...will have to browse at some point. Ah, I think Origins was when I put up some actuall defenses so would see how long the battles would last... They go much quicker if you sleep through them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted April 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Nexus talks a good game' date=' but he only has a 20 presence. Perhaps there's some reason to grow in that direction...[/quote'] I think the talk and the cape have something to do with it. In fact, it's the only cape in the group unless I'm misremembering Spectrum's outfit. Then again, capes can be dangerous... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? I think the talk and the cape have something to do with it. In fact, it's the only cape in the group unless I'm misremembering Spectrum's outfit. Then again, capes can be dangerous... No cape for Spectrum. Maybe as she gets more advanced in the magical arts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatic Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? No cape for Spectrum. Maybe as she gets more advanced in the magical arts. Yeah, but then we'd have to help her with that Rikti mission.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Yeah' date=' but then we'd have to help her with that Rikti mission....[/quote'] In that universe, I'm pretty sure she has the ability to have a cape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted April 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? The Justice Squad has hijacked the END thread! Another job well done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? The Justice Squad has hijacked the END thread! Another job well done! Where's my rep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted April 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Where's my rep? Well, the thread is only a merely colorful and not meaningful opponent so it's just a fraction... (only my players know just what I mean when I say fraction!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? Well, the thread is only a merely colorful and not meaningful opponent so it's just a fraction... (only my players know just what I mean when I say fraction!) Hmm, time to take on some other threads then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamrok Posted April 16, 2005 Report Share Posted April 16, 2005 Re: Should END be more? Was 2nd Edition essentially right? I think the talk and the cape have something to do with it. In fact, it's the only cape in the group unless I'm misremembering Spectrum's outfit. Then again, capes can be dangerous... If you are a Master of Dimensons, you have to wear a cape. Failing to do so is a direct violation of the Interdimensional Compact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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