Succor Constructs

[Wanderer]

Please review these Succor Constructs:

 

24 Rage-Augmented Might: Succor DEX, CON, BODY, EGO, PRE, SPD, REC, END, STUN, and All Attack and Movement Mutant Powers 4d6 (standard effect: 12 points), Can Add Maximum of 12 Points' Worth to each Characteristic or Power (+0), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Trigger (any affected Power fades below maximum) (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates; +1), all affected Characteristics and Mutant powers simultaneously (+2) (90 Active Points); Self Only (-1/2), Side Effects (gives the character the Disadvantage Enraged In Combat, go 14-, recover 8-, and activates it), Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-1/2), Only In Combat (-1/2), Power Stops Working If Character Recovers From Being Enraged (-1/2), Side Effects (character loses 8 END each Phase), Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (Side Effect does a predefined amount of damage; -1/2), Visible (-1/4) 0

 

7 Rage-Augmented Reslience: Succor CON and STUN 3d6 (standard effect: 9 points), Can Add Maximum of 9 Points' Worth to each Characteristic (+0), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), CON and STUN simultaneously (+1/2) (30 Active Points); Self Only (-1/2), Only In Combat (-1/2), Power Stops Working If Character Recovers From Being Enraged (-1/2), Side Effects (gives the character the Disadvantage Enraged In Combat, go 14-, recover 8-, and activates it), Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-1/2), Linked (Rage-Augmented Might; -1/2), Side Effects (character loses 8 END each Phase), Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-1/2), Visible (-1/4) 0

 

21 Solar Might: Succor DEX, CON, BODY, EGO, PRE, SPD, REC, END, STUN, and All Attack and Movement Mutant Powers 4d6 (standard effect: 12 points), Can Add Maximum of 12 Points' Worth to each Characteristic or Power (+0), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Trigger (being in sunburning direct sunlight or high radiation) (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates, Character does not control activation of personal Trigger; +3/4), all affected Characteristics and Mutant powers simultaneously (+2) (85 Active Points); Only In Sunburning Direct Sunlight or High Radiation (-1 1/2), No Conscious Control (Only Activation cannot be controlled; -1), Self Only (-1/2) 0

 

9 Solar Resilience: Succor CON and STUN 3d6 (standard effect: 9 points), Can Add Maximum of 9 Points' Worth to each Characteristic (+0), CON and STUN simultaneously (+1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Trigger (being in sunburning direct sunlight or high radiation) (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates, Character does not control activation of personal Trigger; +3/4) (41 Active Points); Only In Sunburning Direct Sunlight or High Radiation (-1 1/2), No Conscious Control (Only Activation cannot be controlled; -1), Self Only (-1/2), Linked (Solar Might; -1/2)

 

Use of Trigger is also (and in the first construct, mainly) meant to work around and nullify the "power boost instantly fades if one switches from an Aided Power Framework slot to another" rule, in the (very common) case Attack or Movement Powers are in a Multipower.

[Black Rose]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

I'd like to point out that "Can Add Maximum of X Points' Worth to each Characteristic or Power (+0)" would actually be a Limitation. As you have the powers written, they could add twice that amount; it would just take another use or the Power. I'd say it was worth roughly -1/2; really it's not, but I think it's worth more than -1/4.

 

Also, I'm not sure I buy "Only In Combat (-1/2)" as a -1/2 Limitation; -1/4 I cound believe, since you're rarely going to be in a non-combat situation and being Drained, Suppressed, or Transferred.

 

I probably have more thoughts on this, but I'm tired right now.

 

Ciao

[Dust Raven]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

I'd like to point out that "Can Add Maximum of X Points' Worth to each Characteristic or Power (+0)" would actually be a Limitation. As you have the powers written' date=' they could add twice that amount; it would just take another use or the Power. I'd say it was worth roughly -1/2; really it's not, but I think it's worth more than -1/4.[/quote']

Actually, I feel it's a fair Limitation at +0. Technically, Suppress is a continuous power and you only get one roll, and 12 is rougly average. This really does nothing more than make it non-cumulative with additional uses, and since additional uses don't cost anything more than a single use, it's an appropriate value.

 

Also, I'm not sure I buy "Only In Combat (-1/2)" as a -1/2 Limitation; -1/4 I cound believe, since you're rarely going to be in a non-combat situation and being Drained, Suppressed, or Transferred.

 

Since the power automatically makes the character enraged, it can only occur in combat. That Limitation isn't limiting and isn't worth any points. It's like putting "Only At Targets I Shoot At" on an EB.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

Please review these Succor Constructs:

 

Other than what I've just posted... I don't thing any of these constructs are valid. Basically, you are using a lot of ink to describe nothing more than buying +12 Active Points of several Characteristics and Powers (and +21 on two) with the Limitations Side Effect (goes enraged) or Only In Specific Circumstance. You should never use one power to simulate the exact game effect of another. At least not this blatantly.

[Wanderer]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

On the -1/2 "Only In Combat" Limitation: I got the idea for these Power Constructs from two canon Aid Strength Constructs I got from Ultimate Brick and USPD, namely Rage-Augmented Strength (UtB, pp. 61, and USPD, p. 210: option 3, berserk Strength for both. In each case, Only In Combat is included as a -1/2 limitation, along with Enraged/Berserk Side Effect. I assumed it was a vaild combination.

 

In the example, the Power is a hulk-like cumulative, continous Aid. I wished to do a more across-the-board Aid power boost to most or all of the character's Characteristics and Powers, both activable either at will in combat, with some significant side effects (and which more typical than getting Enraged) (inspiration: battle-rages of characters like Hulk, Woverine, or Thor) or in some power boosting specific circumstance, such as being in an energy-rich input (and here the inspiration was the "being in sunlight" Aid Strength (Solar Strength, USPD p. 190, Nighttime Weakness Option) (inspiration: "solar/cosmic battery" characters like Superman, Vision, Birdman, or Silver Surfer). Moreover, I wished to make an Aid/Succor that work effectively on Characteristics and Powers that were in Multipowers, too. I puzzled on it a lot, and the only solution I came up was using Aid, a Trigger that would re-apply the boost if one switches from a MP slot to another, and Standard effect to keep the boost consistent (I would have liked the make the Aid cumulable, Hulk-like, too, but the conundrum of both making it continous and working around the "MP switch Aid fades" defied me, so I gave up). I was further inspired for a generalized Chars and Powers Aid from the "Supreme Warrior Aura" Aid to Physical Chars and Chi Powers in Ninja Hero, p. 30.

 

I accept the criticism on the only in Combat Limitations, but I was just following the canon example here. And moreover, on further reflection, I'd not say it a useless limitation: without it, one caould theretically activate the Power boost outside of combat (say because one wishes to have more STR, or PRE, or SPD, or Movement Powers, or Attack Powers that are useful outside of combat, such as a Transform), and pay the price of becoming uncontrollably Enraged (in that case the Side Effect would probably read: Enraged At Anything Nearby That Might Otherwise Annoy Me), and start bashing at anyone/anything nearby that the character might remotely identify as "enemy" in normal circumstances, given his Psych Lims, and lacking that, random nearby furniture.

 

As for the more general objection, I don't understand it. One of the most typical uses and purpose of Aid/Succor is to provide an across-the-board power boost to a bunch of Chars and/or Powers, all at once, in a specific circumstance (and besides, in my cognizance, Aid/Succor is the only workable option to apply such a boost to a MP. Buying stand-alone additional dices of Chars and Powers with Limitations simply does not work, in that case). It's the power's purpose. If I use Standard Effect, I sacrifice the possibility of getting a greater amount of AP boost for getting a more reliable amount. Otherwise, it would be like saying HA should not be used, because that's STR is for.

 

As for wasting ink, well, writing down (or printing, with HD) several sheet pages of additional Limited dices to all Characteristics (except INT and Defenses) and all Attack and Movement Powers (Multipowers, remember?) wastes much, much more.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

Re: Only In Combat. Fundemental Rule: A Limitation that doesn't limit the character isn't worth any points. I remember those entries, just looked at the one in TUB. I feel that example violates this rule (I've noticed that several published powers/character have constructs that violate this rule, as well as the spirit of many rules). In any case, the only "canon" is in the rules, not the examples. The examples are just that, examples; some will be good examples and some will be poor examples. In any case, the Limitation "Only In Combat" is redundant with being force to be Berserk/Enraged. Being Beserk/Enraged automatically puts a character "in combat", so since that power only works in combat, taking a limitation for only working in combat is double dipping the same disadvantage. It would be like taking the Focus Lim and also taking "Can Be Taken Away" because, well, it can be taken away.

 

Re: Waste of ink. It still looks like all this does is raise a bunch of things a specific amount under certain circumstances. I suppose it's a matter of personal taste or inrerpetation, but I see it as being no different than buy +12 STR, +10 CON, etc. with Only While Enraged/Berserk. The character then has an Enraged/Berserk Disad (not a Side Effect, though I suppose it could be either). You can do the same thing with Powers in a Multipower, so there is no restrictiont here, and you don't have to worry about funky triggers.

[Wanderer]

Re: Succor Constructs

 

I bow to your arguments, though I still think Only In Combat might have some justification in that the Aid can only be activated when the character is already in combat, vs. say using the extra strength to lift or rip apart something. But it is flimsy enough that it stands on differing sensibiliites to allow it or not.

 

RE: aiding Power Frameworks. Are you joking ? Separate Limited Adds for each and every of the MP slots ? Apart from the huge amount of space on the sheet it would take, it would be massively overpriced. I really don't think it would be feasible, at least for the massive MPs I tend to write down.

 

However, reading the DH #17 Herophile gave yet another possible way to accomplish my goal; there, SL detailed the Proportional Modifier: e.g.

 

Power Gets 25% Additional Character Points' Worth of Effect In Sunburning Direct Sunlight or High Radiation (+1/4)

 

Power Loses 25% of Its Character Points' Worth of Effect At Night (-1/4)