Unusual Magic Items

[Dr. Hercules]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Also, I don't think I made this clear, there is no compulsion to use the sword. It's properties only work while the sword is drawn, so one could keep it in his backpack if he wanted but the temptation would be there. Plus, it can only betray you while being wielded. It does this by slipping out of your fingers at the last second and/or staying just out of reach, like say if your leg was pinned in a hole that was filling up with water.

 

Your just stuck with it until you find out how to destroy it.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Well, see, all that changes the dynamics. It can be avoided, IF you chose to resist the temptation of drawing it, it could be destroyed via a quest, etc.

 

My earlier objection was that, as originally presented, it was essentially writing the character's future history for the player without his or her consent. "Excuse me, but what if I already knew what was going to happen to my character after he retires?"

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Well, see, all that changes the dynamics. It can be avoided, IF you chose to resist the temptation of drawing it, it could be destroyed via a quest, etc.

 

My earlier objection was that, as originally presented, it was essentially writing the character's future history for the player without his or her consent. "Excuse me, but what if I already knew what was going to happen to my character after he retires?"

 

Who says your character will live long enough to retire (or should I write that into my background so the GM has to modify any in-game result that would kill, or even permanently injure, my character such that my knowledge of what will happen after he retires will be invalidated?). That's not to say I'm in favour of the "once you pick it up, your fate is sealed" magical item, but it could just as easily be an ordinary sword coated with "save or die" contact poison, so one roll determines whether my character lives or dies. His fate is just as sealed, it's just quicker.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

My unspoken, assumed caveat there was "If my character survives the campaign."

 

It wouldn't raise your hackles for a GM to say, after a long campaign with a character you'd put a lot of work into, "Great jobs guys, that was the last session. Here's what your characters do from here on out..."

 

There is give and take. A GM saying something like that, with no input or flexibility for my wishes, is just taking and not giving.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

My unspoken, assumed caveat there was "If my character survives the campaign."

 

It wouldn't raise your hackles for a GM to say, after a long campaign with a character you'd put a lot of work into, "Great jobs guys, that was the last session. Here's what your characters do from here on out..."

 

There is give and take. A GM saying something like that, with no input or flexibility for my wishes, is just taking and not giving.

 

To which I say again, how different is picking up an item that kills your character from picking up an item which locks in his destiny? Both remove control of the character from the player., don't they? A third example might be an item through which an evil entity takes control of, or even possesses, the target character. In all cases, leaving the item alone would have prevented the loss. Perhaps one should have used divination spells. Now, perhaps there might be a saving throw, but that still sets the player's ongoing control of the character on a single roll of the dice.

 

Dead, possessed or locked-in destiny - is the third really far worse than the first two? Why?

 

With a dead or possessed character, my role playing opportunities are pretty restricted. With a character knowing how his destiny is now locked in, I can still assess how my character would react to this change in his circumstances and role play my character. From that perspective, the locked in destiny might be considered the least devastating of the three. Viewpoints will differ. Some players are opposed to anything that might rob creative control from the player (be it possession or locked in destiny) while others despise "save or die" situations. However, I would suggest the player being able to set a clear and certain course for his character, which must be permitted to be achieved over the course of the campaign is simply "Player Railroading" rather than "GM Railroading". We all have goals - sometimes, the rest of the world frustrates their achievement.

[Narf the Mouse]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Save-or-die spells are not "Player disempowerement". They're part of many games. You do remember it's a game, right?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Save-or-die spells are not "Player disempowerement". They're part of many games. You do remember it's a game' date=' right?[/quote']

 

They are, IMO, as much "Player disempowerment" as a magical object which locks in the character's destiny. Those characters are also in a game, remember?

[Folded]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

In my group, there is an unwritten rule. If the player/character has a chance to see it coming and avoid it or fix it after the fact, either through play or through a series of rolls, then save-or-die is okay. If the character is suddenly asked to save-or-die against the lightning bolt out of a clear blue sky, then that is Not Cool. The idea that one act that neither the player nor character has any chance to influence can kill them is a case of bad storytelling on the GM's part.

 

As to the Fate item, it could be interesting, if handled properly. In some ways, anyone playing in Call of Cthulhu has picked up this item regardless, and it can be a fun game. But we go into that game with that knowledge, and DO have a chance to influence at least what specific fate awaits us.

[Dr. Hercules]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Okay. Maybe this one won't be as contrversal as the last one.

 

Ring of the Rock Thrower

 

This magical ring was created by a halfling wizard. Its properties make the wearer an expert in the art of throwing small stones. In fact, the wearer becomes an expert marksman with a rock, and not only is extremely accurate but can perform trickshots, ricocheting off walls, and disarming an opponent. The rock is not usually fatal, but the GM could make it a rare Goliath version that has the deadly blow talent vs giants.

 

In game terms the rock is probably 1d6 normal damage (or 1/2 dg KA). The ring itself has alot of CSL for trickshots, called shots, and to offset range penalties.

[Folded]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

Okay. Maybe this one won't be as contrversal as the last one.

 

Ring of the Rock Thrower

 

This magical ring was created by a halfling wizard. Its properties make the wearer an expert in the art of throwing small stones. In fact, the wearer becomes an expert marksman with a rock, and not only is extremely accurate but can perform trickshots, ricocheting off walls, and disarming an opponent. The rock is not usually fatal, but the GM could make it a rare Goliath version that has the deadly blow talent vs giants.

 

In game terms the rock is probably 1d6 normal damage (or 1/2 dg KA). It has alot of CSL for trickshots, called shots, and to offset range penalties.

 

Now that, I like. Could also provide Martial Maneuvers (Ranged Disarm, Ranged Trip, and the like). I can also see it as being a significant bonus to PRE attacks, based on annoyance value.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

To which I say again' date=' how different is picking up an item that kills your character from picking up an item which locks in his destiny? [/quote']

 

Sorry, I forgot to answer your question. Basically, it's not. They are all equally unacceptable except in games where I know those kinds of things exist and that's part of the point (Call of Cthullu). One of the most warning attached play events is mentally dominating a PC, because it can very easily go very wrong.

 

Nothing I described is player railroading. "My character will retire and start a tavern" is not player railroading. "My character will go off in pursuit of the last dragon" is not either. Nothing speaks to the success of these endeavors, but the GM doesn't get to say "Actually, you're old enemies track you down and kill you."

 

It's not just a game, it's collaborative story telling. Anything that silences someone's voice goes against the entire point. The GM and player work together to create a mutually enjoyable story. Single die roll deaths that can't be reasonably foreseen are simply put, lame, unless that premise is specifically one of the points of the game.

 

There's some famous, old D&D adventure/dungeon (The Temple of Elemental Evil? Something else with the word temple in it?) that is famous for being incredibly trap laden and deadly to PCs. From what I've read about it, it sounds idiotic since what was described couldn't be predicted or figured out by PCs (thought major kudos to those who engaged in lateral thinking and drove a herd of cattle through the place to trigger most everything, and boo to those who decry it). I would only consider that sort of thing fun if I knew what I was in for, and thus my character was built accordingly.

[Folded]

Re: Unusual Magic Items

 

There's some famous' date=' old D&D adventure/dungeon (The Temple of Elemental Evil? Something else with the word temple in it?) that is famous for being incredibly trap laden and deadly to PCs. From what I've read about it, it sounds idiotic since what was described couldn't be predicted or figured out by PCs (thought major kudos to those who engaged in lateral thinking and drove a herd of cattle through the place to trigger most everything, and boo to those who decry it). I would only consider that sort of thing fun if I knew what I was in for, and thus my character was built accordingly.[/quote']

 

Sounds a little like this Something Positive strip (potentially NSFW for language). Actually, that whole arc sounds like a very enjoyable campaign to be in.