I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

[chromed1]

a group of us (4) just started using the hero system... two of us have used it before, but 12 to 15 years ago.

 

To make the transition we picked a world we were all familiar with. Skyrim ©

 

The transition is very smooth.... except. Soul stones... or more specifically filling them.

 

I am unsure how to make a soul trap spell. It doesn't do any damage or have any other combat effect other than the obvious. (I am I wrong in assuming most people are familiar with the concept?)

 

I hesitate to make it a transform as that is against BODY and that not always the best indicator. or am i over thinking this?

 

Please share your opinion.

[Christopher]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

For those unfamiliar:

Soul Stones power all Magic Items.

You can fill them by casting an entrapment spell on a being before killing it. The more powerfull the being, the more powerfull the soulstone. The soulstone is afaik destroyed on use (either creating an artifact or recharging it).

 

 

What you perhaps should answer first: How are Soulstones used in your game?

I could see them used somewhat like a battery - in wich case they are an endurance reserve that get's one "fill" when the being is socked into it.

 

"Marking" the target could simply be the games way of letting you to choose if you want to fill a stone. Unless the spell cost any significant amount of mana or is somehow hard to cast, I would say that when you have a stone you can simply "choose" to use it, or not. You don't need a spell, because you can do the descission on the spot right then.

 

If you really think you need a spell: How about a cosmetic transform. Sure the being might disagree, but it is mostly "painting" a target for the soulstone. (like you paint a target for a missiles strike with laser pointer). You still ahve to kill it, for the spell to take any effect (at wich points the character lost his "right" to life anyway).

On the other hand you might want to choose something that isn't soo eay to use on the PC's.

[gojira]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

(I am I wrong in assuming most people are familiar with the concept?)

 

Yes, a bit. Christopher explained a bit through.

 

Let me state my understanding, before I go any further. Soulstones are required to cast spells. In that way, they're like a magic wand or a scroll, where you need the item to cast. So that's a standard build

 

Spell, requires Soul Stone (OAF), -1.

 

OAF is an Obvious Accessible Focus. In other words is a thing you carry around that you need to use the power in question. Most gemstones are small, so perhaps OAF isn't quite right. Are Soul Stones small? Hard to take away in combat? Could you for example carry a dozen in an ordinary pocket? If so,

 

Spell, requires IIF, -1/4

 

IIF is In-obvious Inaccessible Focus. It's still a thing, but it's hard to spot in combat, and equally hard to take away even if you know it's present.

 

So that's the basics. I'd build on that. Since Soul Stones seem easy to acquire, I would not worry about reducing the point cost based on the fact that they must be acquired first.

 

Also, Soul Stones seem like they might be disposable or one time use. That's harder, and I'd have to think about and also know how they're actually used, exactly. But the fact that they're easy to acquire tends to override a lot of "use once" limitations. Arrows aren't really that much cheaper just because you use them up; they actually get a bonus because you can "recover" the charge (arrow) some of the time.

[BhelliomRahl]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

Let me state my understanding' date=' before I go any further. Soulstones are required to cast spells. In that way, they're like a magic wand or a scroll, where you need the item to cast.[/quote']

 

Soul Stones are not required to cast spells in Skyrim. Spells are powered by a person's personel mana(magic pool). Soul Gems are used for enchanting items and also for recharging magic items which use charges (Mainly only offensive Enchantments use charges).

 

A Soul stone is a Crystal. When the Soul Trap spell is cast on a creature/monster and that target is killed while under the effect their soul is trapped within the crystal if it large enough. The more powerful the soul the large/better quality crystal is needed. A key point is that human & Sentiant Races (Playable Races in Game) souls cannot be trapped, you require a Black Soul Gem which is a corrupted gem (The process for creating these is little known).

Another key point is that the soul is trapped and then consumed. It is not allowed to pass on, although this a minor point.

 

As Christopher suggested I would build the Crystal as a Endurance Reserve. Each crystal is Endurance Reserve with a Single Charge.

Example:

Endurance Reserve - 50pts; Charge 1 (Never Recovers (-4)), REC 50pts (Limited Recovery - Only in proximity of creature effected by Soul Traps Death, (-2)) Note: Gem Shatters when power drawn upon regardless of amount used.

Real Cost: 11pts.

 

Spell - Soul Trap:

The Spell Soul Trap has no combat effect. Its sole benefit is the creation of Soul Gems. Depending on how spell casting is done. I would recommand that you build the spell as a Transform - Cosmetic. Effect Unmarked Target to Soul Marked Target. I don't think it can be resisted (although I do not think Dragons are effected). The creation of the spell is more for the knowing the Endurance Cost and cost of the spell if required.

I might even consider saying that if the person learns the spell their is no mechanics behind it, just state that a creature targeted by this spell is able to have its soul trapped.

 

Enchanting:

I would have a skill PS: Enchanter. I would require no spell but that a person has knowledge of the Enchantment required. Knowledge is gained by being taught or by a successful disenchantment of an item which destroys the item in the process.

Enchanting an Item requires a Enchanter roll with a penalty depending on the level of the effect being enchanted and Focuses of Enchanters Table (re-usable) and a Soul Gem of sufficent power which is destroyed in the process.

 

I would have a look on the Legendsmiths website. http://www.legendsmiths.com.

They have done some rule adaptions for Skyrim using the Hero System. Soul Gems are not there but some of the other stuff is very interesting.

[Christopher]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

Found a SkyrimPedia entry on the Spell:

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Soul_Trap

 

I'll personally would delete the need for the Spell and the need to have a soulgem of "Full Size".

The ability to trap the Soul (Essence might be more correct) seems to be in the Gem itself. Afaik the Spell was always incredibly easy, so that literally anyone could cast them - even warriors with next to Zero Knowledge of Magic. On top of that it was cheap, while having a incredible duration. That implies to me that it was never inteded as a requirement, but simply as a way of the game to "know your intention".

 

Quite often games have to apply limitations not because they make sense or anybody wants them, but because the human/computer interaction does not allow for a more detailed approach.

For example the "Gravity Gun" in Half Life 2 has only very limited uses - about as many as can be comfortably accessed via WASD+Mouse Controll (one "primary" fire and one "secondary fire").

Building the same weapon in Hero you could built it simply as Telekinesis. There is no need to break it down further or even create different fire modes, as P&P games allow for much more detailed control than the limited interface of a computergame ever could.

[gojira]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

OK, if soul stones are needed to power items, thing I think I'd play around with the item. "Requires Soul Stone of Opportunity" or something like that. Enchanted items have a "charge" that is expended (maybe a fuel charge) and Soul Stones are the fuel. Adjust the limitation of the item based on how hard it is go get the fuel.

 

My guess would be it's a -0 Limitation. How much of a limitation for a gasoline engine? Not much, gas is everywhere. Only if players are actually going to run out on a regular basis should there be a limitation.

[Christopher]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

OK, if soul stones are needed to power items, thing I think I'd play around with the item. "Requires Soul Stone of Opportunity" or something like that. Enchanted items have a "charge" that is expended (maybe a fuel charge) and Soul Stones are the fuel. Adjust the limitation of the item based on how hard it is go get the fuel.

 

My guess would be it's a -0 Limitation. How much of a limitation for a gasoline engine? Not much, gas is everywhere. Only if players are actually going to run out on a regular basis should there be a limitation.

Okay I am mostly going by Elder Scrolls 3 Knowledge here, but:

A little bit more tricky. The initial Soulstone used to create (or integrated into?) the item gives you a measure of how big a "battery" that item has. Any power used, regardless if it was automatic (i.e. Weapon damage effect) or something you have to activate (Ring of Levitation) cost some of the battery lifetime. The stronger the effect (wich could ingame only be defined during creation; P&P might not have such a problem) the more power used. Items also recover some "battery power" over time (like a magician does via resting). But this recovery seems to be slower, the bigger the stone (more precisely REC seems to scale lineary with Size, while the max power seems to scale closer to exponentially with size).

So a small Ring with a minimum size Soulstone (say 10 mana) and a very cheap spell will be more often useable/totally refill faster than an item with a big Stone and a "gas guzzling" power. That is where anotehr use comes in: Refilling. Basically you take the essence in one stone and transfer it to an already existign item. The transfer seems to be less than 1:1 (like based on Enchanment Skill), but it is still faster than trying to just wait for it. But (like creating items) teh Soulstone is usually consumed by this (except for Azura's Star).

[gojira]

Re: I need advice on mimic of a spell effect please.

 

All this sounds like just how the game world works.

 

The creation rules for magic got stripped out of 6e (well, the Independent advantage did, anyway). So you you just invent whatever you like for creating items. It's hard to make items, or easy, on the GM's whim. So the idea is to try to duplicate the feel of Skyrim, which you just do however you like.

 

I might use a Burnout roll. Depending on how big the battery is, you get a Burnout with a larger number. So bigger batteries give larger Burnout numbers which are easier to make. Use an item too much and it'll be used up. Probably I'd just make the roll once per combat, not per each use. Tracking End for every piece of equipment sounds like too much work. Computer games don't translate well to table top for this reason.