buzz

Right. The lower price is the reason I'm asking.

Aside: it would be really helpful if the item descriptions in the store were more... descriptive. At least give me a page count, whether it's color or B&W, and the binding — that should be the basic info included.

(That said, the 5e version was never a color hardcover. ?)

6th Ed. My apologies for not being clear: 

I'd like to know if the $29.99 Star Hero Book + PDF deal current listed in the store is the original color hardcover or a softcover, B&W reprint. Would anyone be able to enlighten me? Any help is much appreciated.

I was seeing this same issue and tried Chris' solution — renaming the TK file to .ZIP and extracting.

It worked, creating a folder as he said. I poked around some of the other files and noticed there are others (e.g., Teleport) that suffer the same problem.

I think it would be helpful to remedy this issue for the pack so future buyers don't have this problem, and maybe even see about turning those .hdc files into .hdp files (which are much more useful).

Re: 6th Edition Character Sheet

Thanks guys! Really glad you like 'em. I worked really hard to make them just right.

Mildly necromantic, but I need to give kudos to teh bunneh as well. These are exactly what HERO sheets ought to look like, especially for convention games.

I'll grant that some more complicated builds are going to need more space, but the sentiment is in the right place. Save the math for your Hero Designer files.

Re: CHAMPIONS REVISED -- If We Do It, What Would You Like To See?

I'm not cash-strapped, but admit that, having already bought Champions and Champions 25th, I'd be hard pressed to easily justify buying that content a third time, even with a bonus appendix. I'd probably buy it for collecting's sake, but I'm not sold on it yet. I'd have to see the end product.

Re: CHAMPIONS REVISED -- If We Do It, What Would You Like To See?

Here are some ideas with specific emphasis on new players and gms...

I believe all that's planned is some additional material at the end of the existing book. It's not a rewrite, unless I'm misunderstanding things.

Re: Measurement in HERO

All of the "in game" measurements are in both imperial (ie "1 inch...") and metric (ie "... equals 2 metres"). What's that all about?

Others have said as much, but hey...

In HERO-speak, "inch" is synonymous with "hex." I assume it's handy to use the term "inch," because then you can use the common shorthand, i.e., a quotation mark ("). It's a little easier to write 10" than 10 hexes, I guess.

HERO doesn't actually use imperial measurement for anything in-game, though.

Re: CHAMPIONS REVISED -- If We Do It, What Would You Like To See?

OK' date=' now you're getting right back to the very heart of my original post: given the constraints I specified on what we can do in terms of adding things to the book, what [i']could[/i] be added to the book that would make it an attractive purchase for you?

I would love to see an appendix that basically takes all of the existing info the reader has just digested and provides an extended example of how to implement it.

"Darren, Steve, Ben, Tina, and Buzz have decided to start a Champions campaign. Darren offers to GM, and suggests the group start with standard, 350 point supers. Millennium City is bandied about as a setting for the campaign, but then Tina offers up the idea of paying in a superpowered version of their home city, [insert name here]. Steve likes the idea of not competing for space with the Champions. So, they grab their books and start making characters..."

Basically, a crash course on using a HERO genre book to build a campaign, design adventures, build PCs, etc.

Re: HERO in the courtroom!

So who made their PS: Lawyer skill roll by more in the Skill vs. Skill contest?

 

One presumes such wonderful complimentary skill rolls as Persuasion and Oratory having been used ...

The prosecution, though the defense had major penalties due to a) a lack of of a credible defense, and 2) the primary attorney's "Distinctive Features: Used car salesman from Durham" disad.

Re: HERO in the courtroom!

How come I couldn't do that in school? I woulda had a scholarship to Yale!

That came up, too. It's also a comment I've heard a few times before w/r/t the labor-intensity of many mainstream RPGs, i.e., "You worked harder twinking out that elf ranger than you did on your senior thesis."

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

Your replies continue to basically be "you're wrong and I don't want to talk about it".

I don't think that's even close to what I've been saying, but if that's how you see it, I won't belabor the issue.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

If you're basically going to just say "you're wrong and I don't want to talk about it" I don't see that we have much basis for a discussion.

I'm not sure I understand your defensiveness; I apologize if I somehow prompted that sort of response. When I said I didn't want to get bogged down, it's because we seemed about to start counting the appearance of phrases in the book and other such minutiae, and I figured that'd be silly and a waste of everyone's time. I did not mean, "You're wrong and I'm right! You suck!"

I was simply trying to make a point about "it's an optional rule" and the frequency of conditionals in the HERO system. That's all. MitchellS also noted that it was an optional rule. However, I think he correctly pointed out that we can nonetheless discuss it, since it's the sum total of specific rules on this subject in a published HERO book.

Well, the jury room at least. I've been on federal jury duty the last four days and had been bringing my copy of 5ER to read on the train and during downtime. The following ensued.

Juror: "Wow. That's a really big book. What is it?"

Me: "It's a rulebook for a game."

Other Juror: "What kind of game?"

Me: "A roleplaying game, like Dungeons & Dragons."

Juror: "Like, on the computer?"

Me: "No, you play it in person, with a board and little figures."

Other Juror: "That WHOLE BOOK is rules?"

Me: "Yeah. No surprise it was written by a lawyer, right? Hehe."

:crickets:

Further comments ensued a la, "Are you going to have that all memorized when you're done with it?"

I figured Steve might get a kick out of this.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

If a GM wants a fast and loose power skill' date=' he's not breaking the rules interpreting it that way.[/quote']

I don't believe that MitchellS (the main critic of the rule in this thread) was ever arguing about "breaking" the rules. He's simply comparing what rules there are, optional or no, to what's in M&M. That's all.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

In what ways are VPPs and Desolid optional?

"The GM should carefully consider the impact of these Powers before permitting them in a scenario." (5ER, p.95) Hence my use of the word "essentially."

I don't want to get bogged down in semantics here. I'm just saying, HERO is game with a ton of optional and "at the GM's discretion" rules. Ergo, I could see how a reader of the Power Skill content could blow by the fact that it's a suggested guideline. I.e., it has as much "officialness" as a lot of other content.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

Some GMs are apparently just not comfortable with the idea of fine tuning a system' date=' even when suggestions on how to fine tune it are right there on the page.[/quote']

My point is really just that saying "it's only a guideline" is sort of iffy given that a significant portion of even the core HERO book is qualified as being at the GM's discretion. I.e., I don't think it lays discussion to rest, as the rule in question is still part of a published HERO book offered for fan use.

 

I mean, VPPs and Desolidifcation are essentially optional, too. Doesn't mean we can't discuss them.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

From my perspective' date=' Steve Long appears to clearly lay out his own preference for how to use Power Skill, but is by no means declaring this to be the default "official" rule standard for applying it. All of this stuff seems to fall within "GM option" territory.[/quote']

FWIW, huge swaths of 5ER are phrased this way as well. E.g., the phrases "at the GM's option" and "considerations of game balance, common sense, and dramatic sense" appear almost every other page. Ergo, I can see it being interpreted as much "official" as most HERO rule content.

 

Either way, people are welcome to say they don't like the recommendation, and would like to see others.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

FWIW I've long allowed Power as an "Everysuper Skill" in my games' date=' so all supers have at least an 8- roll (with situational modifiers) with their main abilities for free.[/quote']

I've been thinking about implementing this in my next supers game, too.

 

As far as "you get what you pay for" goes, I can understand it. However, I also really like mechanics that let players draw on a resource in order to do "cool stuff" and affect the "plot." It's certainly in keeping with pulp and supers.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

I use the Luck power, I think it is option 2 under luck (You roll and count body)

 

I then expanded it...

I think starting with Luck is a good way to keep "Hero Points" sort of "system kosher," as it were. You just make a couple dice of Luck an Everyman (or, Everysuper) Power.

Re: "Official" rules? Who cares?

What's all this talk of "official" rules?

Every RPG in the known universe has the ability to have its rules ignored by those playing it. This doesn't really let us talk meaningfully about what the rules actually do, or what their strengths are. Extending your argument to its logical conclusion, codified rules are wholly unnecessary; we should be able to just sit down and verbally negotiate everything. Many freeform RPG'ers and collaborative story-tellers enjoy this, but it's a whole 'nother ball o' wax.

(And, really, if you're going to handwave stuff, why do so within the context of one of the most rules-robust RPGs on the market?)

The point, though, is that good rules help you have more fun than you would have without them. Ergo, it's worthwhile to talk about what kind of fun a given rule enables.

Anyway...

The difference between M&M's Hero Points and HERO's Power Skill is that M&M's HP are non-negotiable. They don't reflect the character attempting to do something unusual with his abilities, they reflect the player wanting to accomplish something cool that's in-genre for their PC. Hero Points are basically dramatic editing. Spending a HP gets the player the effect they want, without question. It's essentially allowing them to take the reins from the GM for a moment.

HERO's Power Skill, otoh, is based on an in-game simulation of the character trying to use their ability in an unfamiliar way. The reasoning is the same for superpowers as it is for PS: Carpentry. I.e., you're pushing the limits of your aptitude, thus risking failure.

IMO, they are totally different. Ergo, why I think HERO really needs an equivalent to M&M's HP. HAPs get some of the way there, but I think they could be improved.

Re: Champions Or Mutants & Masterminds?

However' date=' that said, I would really like to see some sort of more specific techniques, whether metagaming with chips or just extensions of the Power Skill or whatever, to allow this fast-and-loose approach in a more "mechanical"/less "GM permission" way in Champions (and, yes, I think it is a genre-specific issue, not a core book issue).[/quote']

I agree 100%. In general, I think that M&M and HERO are more similar than they are different; M&M is basically a d20 implementation of the HERO model. However, I think the Hero Point and stunting rules in M&M are a great addition.

 

I've been toying with the idea of using Heroic Action Points as described in Pulp HERO to help mimic the way M&M handles things. I.e., you retain the basic Power skill rules, but the player has a resource he can call on to insure the outcome of certain rolls.

Re: Mind link to a vehicle

YOU don't have to have the TF to use a vehicle you paid for in points. However' date=' the vehicle isn't you and cannot pilot itself without either an onboard computer or the proper skills.[/quote']

Right. I was only addressing the TF issue.

Re: Mind link to a vehicle

Well, TUV specifically says you get a free TF for any vehicle you pay points for, so... NYAHH!!!