Sammael

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Nice. I'm almost positive I'll eventually end up with this in PDF if nothing else.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Nice thread. It jibes with many of my thoughts. Thanks.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Sounds like great advice and you are technically correct - and that is the best kind of correct! - but you are too late. I'm already working on a superheroic NPC.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. I've definitely been convinced of the need to establish a core point level for most of the heroes and villains, from which a few, exceptional, specimens shall rise from on occasion. Between the 250 point samples so kindly provided by Cassandra, the 400 pointers created by Hyper-Man, and the sketches of assault and massey, I've also been shown how versatile the Champions rules are in creating characters. That there is no one true way, no single point value that'll do the job we ask when creating our alter-egos. My natural preference, by personality, is to throw fistfuls of points at the process and play truly powerful characters. I simply adore power. It's good to be the God-King! But... not this time. I want to do this right. I want to give the Champions Complete rules a real chance to be my game system of choice. That won't happen if I screw it all up right out of the gate! The base points are very likely to be set at the 400 CP level, but the Big Guns are going to be built on more points. 6000 points? Wow. How many pages would that character sheet be? No fear of extreme power creep. At least not in this campaign.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Another great example of a low-powered version of a high-powered character. This can almost qualify as a superpower. Surprisingly enough, though, I enjoyed your Superman more, despite Bat Man's extensive collection of skills and his wicked Utility Belt. As a neophyte, I'm probably wrong, but his skills feel low to me at 13-. Thanks for the great write-ups.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. I'm very impressed with what you've done with 250 points. He's actually stronger (as in having a higher STR) than Hyper-Man's excellent 400 point 6E Man of Steel write-up! If anyone ever needed proof that it could be done, then this is surely such proof.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. This is good and it dovetails nicely with assault's two-pass method of character building. Very good synergy.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. This is a good reminder for me. I've been told earlier that CVs must be within a few points of each other for combats to be fun and to beware of really high PD/EDs. And thanks for your comparison to the DC Adventures/M&M 3rd Edition rules-sets, massey. That was helpful.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. I'm going to copy and paste this stuff. Seems like good guidelines to me. I'll try it.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Well, I can tell you, sir, that I'm working on making an NPC and I've already spent way more time than that and have nothing good to show for it! But I will get there. Eventually. Assuming the world does not end in cataclysm on the 21st.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. As a long-time D&D player, I am very familiar with the 1st level, or starting, character. In fact, that's really what I'm doing here, more or less, considering this is a JLA campaign, despite the fact I'm likely using 400+ CP characters on this, my first attempt to run a Champions campaign. Remember, unlike the 5th edition rules, Champions Complete doesn't have any figured characteristics, so no freebies there.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Well, she did say the points scale was based on 5th edition... I think then that she's not going to agree with my revised scale. Thank you for the 5ER Standard Superheroic value, bigbywolfe. It helps me understand where she's coming from.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Thank you, Cassandra. I don't always "upgrade" either. I never have tried 4th edition D&D and never will. Still, Champions Complete is all I have, unless I wish to stick with DC Adventures. And I'd rather not! So, I've checked out the guidelines provided and here's what I think your scale might look like in Champions Complete values: Standard normal: 25 points (+25 points) - Innocent civilians. Skilled normal: 50 points (+25 points) - Important person. Competent normal: 100 points (+50 points) - Police officers and soldiers. Standard heroic: 175 points (+100 points) - Elite soldiers, federal agents, or international spies. Very Powerful heroic: 275 points (+175 points) - Sidekicks or top operatives for super villains. Standard superheroic: 400 points (+150 points) - Standard superheroes and super villains. Very High-Powered superheroic: 650 points (+300 points) - Legendary superheroes and super villains who either defend the world, or try and take it over, and who are best being used as NPC to keep the players humble. Either I've misread the guidelines or there's a significant difference in the number of character points used in 5th edition and CC. Or both.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Very good, sir! I love that you started with Aquaman. How long did this take you, do you think? Just curious, because you know what you're doing. I will definitely attempt this method myself. It seems a good way to make sure I cover the basics and don't fritter away too many points pursuing specific abilities.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. So, in other words, you use your large, base pool of points to build the concept archetype(s) and the smaller, supplemental pool of points to actually purchase the identifying attributes for the character? I like it. It seems like it should allow me to draft characters more quickly with this approach than simply crafting "Aquaman" from the first point spent.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete It is likely the peeling lamination afflicts an entire print run to a greater or lesser extent. How can I say that? I've bound books like this since 1995 and I've run a laminator for 9 years of that. I've never personally encountered this where it was a spotty phenomenon. It's always affected the entire run. As an aside, this is a growing problem, or at least it is among the binderies around here*. Having said that, it's not the end of the world. The book will still hold together as it should, keeping those great rules in a single bundle of well-thumbed through pages. It's not like the book was going to stay in pristine condition anyways, right? I am sad that the lamination is peeling from my copy, but it hasn't stopped me from reading the rules or enjoying them. * The reasons for this are many and varied, but ultimately it boils down to the world-wide contraction in the industry. It is caught between the struggling global economies and the rise of the e-book and print-on-demand digital print. Long story short, the book as we know it is fading. The new book, the e-book, the print-on-demand digital book is rising. No secret there, but what this also means is that the major vendors who supply the print shops and binderies are also struggling. Many have either completely gone out of business or have shut down some of their facilities. In the face of this, their products have changed as they're making them as cheaply as they can. Hence the problem with peeling lamination. The cheaper heat-activated glue that binds the more expensive lamination to the cheaper (but also more expensive) ink on the cheaper, but more expensive paper isn't doing as good a job as it used to do.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. I can't remember ever not liking Batman or Iron Man. Really, what's not to like? Wealthy and heroic as all get out, they beat up the bad guys using stuff they invent themselves. Growing up, I would have given almost anything to be like them, so I can definitely relate to them; though I'm not so sure they are lower level heroes. The Avengers are comparable to the JLA - aren't they? - and while they are not the most powerful of superheroes, they don't seem to be junior members of their respective teams. But, yeah, it is cool that their civilian personas seem nearly as vulnerable as the rest of us mere mortals are. Do you favor Marvel over DC? They seem to fit your theme, if you ignore my buddy, Thor. I'm guessing you're a fan of both as many of us are (another guess). And speaking of Marvel's style of heroes, I really enjoy the X-Men primarily due to those very qualities. There's something to be said for low-end superheroes. And of course there's something to be said for the more mythic superheroes, too. Thank you for the scale. This kind of information is very helpful to me as I learn the rules. Is the scale you listed for the 6th Edition or 5th Edition rules? The points seem higher in Champions Complete, especially at the higher end of your scale.

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Ah. This seems very practical to me. No wonder I didn't think of it. I'll do this, GrailKnight, but I'm not sure I fully understand you. When you say that real objects are too tough, are you referring to the Breaking Things rules? Do you find that many objects' PD, ED, and Body are too high?

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. Thanks for the links TheQuestionMan. I've encountered a few of them before, but the Champions - M&M link, in particular, looks very interesting!

Re: Justice League-type DC/Champions campaign. Advice, please. So true. But since the comics themselves weren't consistent, it shouldn't really be a serious problem unless you're trying to simulate a specific version of the character.